Russian Invasion of Ukraine

[China]

On 5/24/2022 at 2:34 PM, DogofWar1 said:

Russia's stockpiles are running low too.

 

There are reports they are pulling T-62s out of storage.  You gotta be VERY deep into your deep storage to be pulling out a T-62.

 

 

Like that is a 2nd Gen Main Battle Tank from the 60's.  It's been replaced by the T-64, T-72, T-80, T-90, and the in development but not yet deployed T-14 Armada.

 

Russia's army mainly uses a combination of upgraded T-72s, T-80s, and T-90's, and they recently sent in some heavily modernized T-90's to much fanfare (a video of one being destroyed surfaced shortly thereafter).

 

This would be like the US sending in M-60 Pattons.  Un-upgraded Pattons, not like the newer ones we used into the late 80's like the A2/A3.

 

Now the theory is that Russia is trying to keep some T-72s from its stocks at home in case the conflict expands somehow, but regardless it's a bad BAD look for Russia if this turns out to be true.

 

On 5/24/2022 at 3:39 PM, The Sisko said:

If they're gonna be using T-62s, the Ukrainians can take those out with slingshots.

 

Russia Deploys 50-Year-Old T-62 Tanks To Ukraine

 

Numerous Cold-War era Russian T-62 tanks have been photographed at Melitopol railway station in southeastern Ukraine near the current front lines of the three-month-old conflict in the country. Whether the tanks will be used by Russian forces or turned over to local separatist groups is currently unclear, but their presence can only raise questions about Russia’s depleting armor reserves after months of significant losses. 

 

The new development comes after rumors had spread that the Russians were pulling a number of the T-62s out of long-term storage. According to the International Institute for Strategic Studies, Russians have 10,000 tanks and 8,500 armored vehicles in storage — although that number doesn't take into account their material condition — with about 2,500 of those being T-62s as estimated by a Stratfor analysis. Being that we’ve already seen Russian forces using older T-72A/B variants in Ukraine and that some of the purported 10,000 tanks in storage are likely to be more modern than T-62s, the choice to move these specific vehicles to the front is undoubtedly intriguing.

 

 

Click on the link for more

Edited May 26, 2022 by China

[China]

Butter in anti-theft cases.

 

[visionary]

 

 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

At some point somewhere there will be military action by someone regarding the grain… could destabilize whole regions. 

[China]

1 hour ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

At some point somewhere there will be military action by someone regarding the grain… could destabilize whole regions. 

 

It will.  There will be global famine.  I've posted a couple of articles about it already.  Now Russia wants to blame sanctions (as if they aren't responsible for the repercussions of their own actions):

 

Russia seeks to blame West for food crisis

 

Russian President Vladimir Putin told Italian Prime Minister Mario Draghi that Moscow “is ready to make a significant contribution to overcoming the food crisis through the export of grain and fertilizer on the condition that politically motivated restrictions imposed by the West are lifted,” according to a Kremlin readout of the call.

[China]

Russian Soldiers Send Home 58 Tons of Looted Items from Ukraine — Investigation

 

Russian soldiers fighting in Ukraine have sent home at least 58 metric tons of looted goods since the start of the invasion in late February, according to an investigation published by independent news site Mediazona.

 

The outlet analyzed packages sent from 46 branches of delivery firm SDEK located close to the Ukrainian border in Russia and Belarus, as well as in the annexed Crimea. Parcels allegedly sent by Russian soldiers were often identified by their weight, with each package usually exceeding the size of an average parcel several times over.

 

By analyzing video footage from an SDEK checkpoint in the Russian border town of Valuyki, Mediazona identified that soldiers sent home items including sneakers, canned food, TVs, car tires and even tents. 

 

On April 29, an unidentified Russian officer allegedly shipped an Orlan-10 military drone, likely stolen from his own army. 

 

Mediazona found that the largest number of parcels were sent between late March and early April — right after the Russian troops left their positions in northern Ukraine and near the capital Kyiv. On 4 April alone, soldiers sent 4 tons of parcels believed to be full of looted goods.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[Wildbunny]

2 hours ago, China said:

 

It will.  There will be global famine.  I've posted a couple of articles about it already.  Now Russia wants to blame sanctions (as if they aren't responsible for the repercussions of their own actions):

 

Russia seeks to blame West for food crisis

 

Russian President Vladimir Putin told Italian Prime Minister Mario Draghi that Moscow “is ready to make a significant contribution to overcoming the food crisis through the export of grain and fertilizer on the condition that politically motivated restrictions imposed by the West are lifted,” according to a Kremlin readout of the call.

It will obviously. Problem is it won't be done via UN because of Russian's veto. So it's more than likely everybody will be freelancing due to this and we'll see countries attacking their neighbors to steal their food stocks. Kinda like what Russia is doing in Ukraine right now.

 

I have little faith in anybody doing it peacefully except for NATO that could put a little bit of order in all this mess.

[visionary]

 

 

 

[Riggo-toni]

Putin Ally Ready to Attack Poland: Better 'Take Back Your Weapons' 

 

 

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEHHY-29D-0taS71_KHqZjZ0qGQgEKhAIACoHCAow77zbCjDiq8wBMMiCsgU?uo=CAUiANIBAA&hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen

 

Ramzan Kadyrov, the Chechen leader and an ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin, said that he is ready to attack Poland and that the European country "better take back your weapons."

 

Personally, I find this hilarious. He's so angry that Poland is helping supply Ukraine with leftover weapons from the 1980s, that he wants his guys to invade against a force with modern weaponry that would wipe out his army in a matter of days.

Edited May 27, 2022 by Riggo-toni

[LD0506]

Google Translate/ English to Chechen- "Eat a bag of dicks"

[China]

In Rare Display Of Dissent, Lawmakers In Russia's Far East Urge Putin To Stop Ukraine War

 

In a rare display of political protest in Russia, a group of lawmakers representing the Communist Party in the Far Eastern region of Primorye have called on President Vladimir Putin to stop military operations in Ukraine and withdraw all troops from the country.

Leonid Vasyukevich, a member of the regional Legislative Assembly, read out the statement at a session held by lawmakers on May 27.

 

The statement said that as Russian troops are suffering significant losses in Ukraine, there is no way to get any success by military means.

 

"We understand that if our country does not stop the military operation, there will be more orphans in the country. During the military operation, young men are dying or becoming disabled, while they could be very useful for our country," the statement said.

 

Vasyukevich said that the statement was signed by him and his colleagues Gennady Shulga, Natalya Kochugova, and Aleksandr Sustov.

 

The region's governor, Oleg Kozhemyako, who was at the session, ordered Vasyukevich and Shulga, who vocally supported the statement, to be removed from the premises.

 

"The action defames the Russian Army and our defenders who are fighting against Nazism. You are a traitor," Kozhemyako said, addressing Vasyukevich.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[visionary]

 

[Renegade7]

 

I'm at minimum buying he's sick and it's impacting his ability to "lead" his country.

[China]

12 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I'm at minimum buying he's sick and it's impacting his ability to "lead" his country.

 

How about He's dead and a body double is leading Russia?

 

 

Or maybe he really has gone off the deep end:

 

[Riggo-toni]

Biden will not supply Ukraine with long-range rockets that can hit Russia

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEB9YFWRLIK3Lj3he-L3TVKkqFwgEKg4IACoGCAowl6p7MN-zCTDZ4PsF?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen

Joe Biden has said the US will not supply Ukraine with rockets that can reach into Russia, in an attempt to ease tensions with Moscow over the potential deployment of long-range missiles with a range of about 185 miles.

The White House has been weighing up pleas from Ukraine – which is losing ground in the battle for Donbas – for multiple-launch rocket systems (MLRS) to offset Moscow’s increasingly effective use of long-range artillery, amid Russian warnings that doing so would cross a red line.

“We are not going to send to Ukraine rocket systems that can strike into Russia,” Biden told reporters on Monday after arriving back at the White House after a weekend in Delaware.

 

 

Well, this sucks.  Kiss the Donbas goodbye.

 

 

[Larry]

My personal opinion on this item?  

 

"The US will supply Ukraine with the same types of weaponry that the invading Russian forces are using against Ukraine.  

 

"If Russia doesn't want Ukraine to have medium range artillery?  Then they should not use it against Ukraine.

 

Sorry Vlad.  But this "I hereby announce that it will cross a Red Line if you use the same weapons which I am already using" stunt isn't going to work.  You don't want things to escalate?  Don't escalate them.  (Frankly, I'd really prefer it if things don't escalate.  But it's your choice.)  

[TheGreatBuzz]

Yea, Joe isn't looking too good here to me.  Too worried about upsetting Vlad instead of taking a tougher stance.

[Renegade7]

6 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

Yea, Joe isn't looking too good here to me.  Too worried about upsetting Vlad instead of taking a tougher stance.

 

Gotta be a catch-22, right, Ukraine tries to fire missiles at Moscow that Russia knows they got from us, what would be expected response from Russia?

 

  Idk if they can reach that far, but it should be fair to ask if this is about helping Ukraine defend itself and retake its original territory, how much support should we be giving them to attack how deep into Russia?

[88Comrade2000]

7 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

Yea, Joe isn't looking too good here to me.  Too worried about upsetting Vlad instead of taking a tougher stance.

Joe is weak.  His administration is about to go in flames. Next 2 years will be hell for him.

 

If Russia is able outlast Ukraine until the end of the year; they will get the eastern parts they want.  There will be little support of Ukraine next year. Europe will run back to the teet of Russia. Congress won’t give anymore money for Ukraine.

[DogofWar1]

I think they are still gonna provide HIMARS and MLRS systems, they are just gonna limit the range of the ammunition.  The missiles can range from like 30km all the way up to like 300km or something depending on what they're firing, but like 100km is more than enough for pretty much everywhere along the front while not giving much capability of striking into Russia.

 

[redskins59]

Biden is failing hard in pretty much everything.  I did not mind the Afghanistan decision, but how about allowing Ukraine to win outright?  People are dying there everyday.

Also, if Russia can hit Ukraine fron Russia, why can't Ukraine hit back?

The US and Nato were doing exactly zero until they realized that Ukraine had fighting capabilities.

Edited May 31, 2022 by redskins59

[Larry]

20 minutes ago, redskins59 said:

The US and Nato were doing exactly zero until they realized that Ukraine had fighting capabilities.

 

And I can understand that, too.  

 

When you think Russia is gonna roll over them before you can even deliver anything, then why get involved?  

 

I don't like it.  But if the US always did what I want, we might be seriously messed up, today.  Same reason why I learned a long time ago not so say the first thing that pops up in my head.  

[DogofWar1]

39 minutes ago, redskins59 said:

The US and Nato were doing exactly zero until they realized that Ukraine had fighting capabilities.

Not really true, the US and NATO were providing Ukraine with weapons, it's just the weapons they were providing were based on the expectation of an insurgency, not a major outright shooting war.

 

Small arms, javelin, stingers, NLAWS, etc, all handheld items that are designed to work well in insurgency environments.  Effective in war too, but obviously not sufficient for a big armored shooting war.

 

Of course, basically no one thought there would be a major shooting war.  So after Russia failed so hard there was a sudden shift in what was needed.

 

The other elephant in the room is escalation.

 

Let's be clear.  Russia can and will, under the right (wrong) circumstances use nukes.  And once you break the seal on that it's very dangerous for the whole world.

 

And we now have a new problem we didn't expect, which is that Russia is way weaker than we thought.

 

Our fears had long been what if Russia was successful in Ukraine and then took Moldova, and then, drunk on their success, decided to attack the Baltic states, or Poland.  Then Article V is invoked and there's a direct shooting war between the US and Russia.

 

But now there's a different problem.

 

Russia has failed so hard, and their cupboard militarily is so bare, their only option to strike at NATO in any meaningful way is nukes.

 

And Biden knows this.  As does Blinken, Austin, and their counterparts across the pond.  Britain is not risk averse, but we can see the cracks in the alliance this reality creates with France and Germany.

 

So providing heavy weapons is a delicate thing.  You can't just ship 1000 Abrams and a bunch of missiles that can hit Moscow to someone in a direct shooting war with Russia and not have some concerns about escalation.

 

And let's be clear.  Biden's first duty is to the USA.

 

Yes, helping Ukraine is a very important US interest, but protecting the homeland from ICBMs takes precedence.  It doesn't mean Biden will back down every time Putin and co. rattle the nuclear saber (and they haven't thus far), BUT it also means they shouldn't rush forward stupidly in their actions.  Everything must be measured cautiously, as we have fewer rungs of escalation between where we are now and mushroom clouds above the continental US than we all should be comfortable with.

[DogofWar1]

Also worth mentioning, the US has been very good at getting approved goodies to Ukraine.  There are tons of flights going into Rzeszow daily, see: https://twitter.com/Goodies4Ukraine?s=20&t=ZftxJZo8G0e-4ytMfzBARw

 

 

Now, once the stuff is across the border in Ukraine, that's in the Ukrainians.  They have to get it to the front, and there is some anecdotal evidence that that is a problem in some places, or at least in the Severodonetsk pocket.

 

Understandable though, since trying to get heavy equipment past the Lyman-Popasna line is going to be tough as the gap there should be in range of Russian artillery.

 

[zCommander]

13 hours ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

Yea, Joe isn't looking too good here to me.  Too worried about upsetting Vlad instead of taking a tougher stance.

 

Yeah it is not like Joe is Ronald Reagan who armed the Afghan mujahideen back in the days to fight against the USSR.