The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[skinsarethebest]

54 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

If Lions beat San Fran; I can see Kirk there next year.  Purdy has already said they were looking for Tom Brady to be this year’s starter but that obviously didn’t happen.

I would love Kirk in San Fran.  It would doom them to multiple years of getting no further than the divisional round.

[Renegade7]

4 hours ago, ThatNFLChick said:

 

I feel like this team does not have a clear #1 and it really needs one. Since this draft is so WR heavy, why not? Especially when we're likely losing Curis Samuel (who became our most reliable down the stretch). Get a 1, make Terry the 2 and move Dotson to the slot. 

 

I also think we need another RB to go with Robinson and Rodriguez (I am assuming Gibson will be gone). Maybe we can grab a speedster in FA rather than drafting. 

 

Because this isn't Madden and we can't fix everything in one offseason.

 

I respect this need, I don't believe we're being realistic trying to address it this offseason unless we do it via free agency.

 

If our 1st pick is QB, saying the next one has to be WR should be considered jus as much drafting for need as saying it has to be a specific oline position.

 

Maybe I'm overthinking this, but this insistence on getting a true #1 this offseason jus feels so cart before the horse I can't process it same as some of the rest of yall.

[philibusters]

3 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

If Lions beat San Fran; I can see Kirk there next year.  Purdy has already said they were looking for Tom Brady to be this year’s starter but that obviously didn’t happen.

 

I don't see that happening.  Purdy has played well and San Fran is 24th in cap space available.  Cousins probably looking at anything between 30 and 40 million a year.  Purdy's cap hit for next year is 1 million.  

 

Perhaps Kirk Cousins is an upgrade, perhaps he is a lateral for Purdy.   I don't think the 49'ers are willing to pay the price of say 35 million a year to find out.

[Coopskin44]

          We have 1 offensive linemen a guard that’s it.You don’t win in this league without a good offensive line.This position needs to be addressed before WR.

[Renegade7]

3 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

If Lions beat San Fran; I can see Kirk there next year.  Purdy has already said they were looking for Tom Brady to be this year’s starter but that obviously didn’t happen.

 

49ers better off trading for Fields.

3 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Trade him to KC. Let him experience some glory before he ages out. By the time we are ready to challenge for championships; he’ll be old and on the decline.

 

KC can't afford that contract, that's why can't name a single WR in that team right and they only have Kelce and Pickachu as household names on offense to go with Mahomes.

 

We should not be like the Wizards and do a rebuild by derthing ourselves of the limited talent we have.  We won't be competitive and it will impact the development of our younger players, imo.

[DWinzit]

Ben Johnson's offense often begins from under center.

 

When passing it requires quick diagnoses on shorter drop backs

 

Who of the top 2 tiers of QB's have the most experience in playing under center?  I think this is Williams biggest knock playing mostly from shotgun.

 

Which from that group process and release the quickest?

[Warhead36]

50 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Ben Johnson's offense often begins from under center.

 

When passing it requires quick diagnoses on shorter drop backs

 

Who of the top 2 tiers of QB's have the most experience in playing under center?  I think this is Williams biggest knock playing mostly from shotgun.

 

Which from that group process and release the quickest?

They all play from shotgun almost exclusively nowadays in college.

[ThatNFLChick]

1 hour ago, DWinzit said:

Ben Johnson's offense often begins from under center.

 

When passing it requires quick diagnoses on shorter drop backs

 

Who of the top 2 tiers of QB's have the most experience in playing under center?  I think this is Williams biggest knock playing mostly from shotgun.

 

Which from that group process and release the quickest?

 

None of them have much experience playing from under center. Williams did it at Oklahoma some, Daniels did it at Arizona State some, Maye was under center 4 times this season but it will be a learning curve for all of them. I don't think any of them have a real edge there.

[skinny21]

14 hours ago, The Consigliere said:

McLaurin will be 29 for the opening kickoff of 2024. How is that not aging?!?! Oh and his target Separation # was 70th among WR's last year. Can't blame that on Howell. I would assume he was dinged and played all year with some kind of nagging injury, because 70th is horrific, otoh, all the reports from you guys watching every game was that none of the WR's were getting any separation. So that's in keeping with what people were seeing. 

 

Dotson, I have no idea what he'll be, good first year, awful second year. We'll see. I'm not 100% out on Dotson, but you can't ignore just how bad '23 was. He was 59th in target seperation in '23. 

If target separation is how close a defender was when the receiver caught the ball… couldn’t that actually be (potentially) heavily affected by the qb?

Seems to me scheme (spacing, predictability, etc), route running (which covers a lot of factors of course), and the qb (timing, processing, reading the D) could all play a significant role?  Not to mention pass pro giving time for routes to develop…

 

 I’m not blaming Howell or absolving Terry, I’m just pondering what factors can actually play into that number.  I actually used the separation numbers in a defense of Howell, but always wondered why two guys (Terry and Jahan) seen as good route runners couldn’t get open.  I landed mostly on defenses knowing we had to get the ball out early (due to pass pro issues), leading to our receivers not getting many chances on longer developing routes, though that was purely speculative on my part.

 

Edit:  to be clear, I totally agree with trying to take advantage of a deep wr class (even if I think the top priority is improving protection for whoever our qb will be)

Edited January 23 by skinny21

[bearrock]

2 hours ago, DWinzit said:

Ben Johnson's offense often begins from under center.

 

When passing it requires quick diagnoses on shorter drop backs

 

Who of the top 2 tiers of QB's have the most experience in playing under center?  I think this is Williams biggest knock playing mostly from shotgun.

 

Which from that group process and release the quickest?

 

The point would not be to get a QB who is currently most ready for any particular offensive system or even ready for the NFL for that matter.  Almost every rookie QB is ill prepared for the NFL.  The onus is on the organization and the coaching staff to create an environment and scheme that caters to what the rookie QB does well to serve as a bridge during development.  

[Thinking Skins]

18 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

He also did something that some here do when they have a bias against a player, they fudge their numbers down.  He talked about how some touted Maye for his size, and then said he's 220 pounds when he's actually 230.

 

But overall to each their own.  I can't recall too many QB prospects universally loved over the years.  Heck I can even recall some knocks on Joe Burrow from some.  So its cool for whomever of course to feel which ever way they do.

 

But as to some of Mueller's other points.

 

A.  he suggested its a no brainer to take a QB.  @Thinking Skins  your predisposed bias is showing a little   if you are pumping up that broadcast, cherry picking the hits on one QB while also making the case that maybe this is a "meh" draft for QB in the same post. 

 

Mueller said the opposite.  He said this is a great year to have the 2nd pick.  It's a great QB draft and a great time for that reason to have the 2nd pick.  He just wasn't high on Maye but was high on Caleb, Daniels, McCarthy.  He went that some years picking high doesn't matter as much because the QB crop isn't hot.  But this draft is the right one to go QB.  

 

B.  you got to act like you aren't picking at #2 again for a long time. He said "There is no better time than now" to take one.  And you take a Qb even if you like a position player better.  You need a QB to win.

 

C.  Compared Dan Quinn to Pete Carroll as a leader of men.   SB coaches like him don't grow on trees.  He wouldn't have a pause about hiring him but if you are drafting a QB its better to get an offense type

 

D.  Ben Johnson -- best designed offense in the league.   He has more answers to help a QB than most other places

 

E.  Keim asked him if he likes another candidate, he mentioned Brian Callahan from Cincy.

 

 

 

I have Daniels above McCarthy but am OK taking him in the top 10.  McCarthy if i recall was the first QB I ironically touted on the draft thread at the start of the college season if I recall correctly.

I think you misread my post. I was saying he disliked Maye. That was all I was saying about him. The rest is my thoughts. I have thoughts about this draft class because I like all of the top 3 guys but I'm not in love with any of them. I honestly think I want Daniels above top because of his work ethic and how much he improved at LSU and the fact that he played at LSU, compared to the PAC12 with no defense and the ACC. I've got nothing against Maye and Williams (and really Daniels) but I'm just not IN LOVE with any of them. That's why I'm constantly telling my friends and family that this year's class makes me feel like 2011. I wonder what Peters feels though because he is the one that matters though. I'm a nobody with an opinion.

 

Sure I'm writing some analytics for fun to see things, and some are favorable to Williams, some are favorable to Maye, others are favorable to Daniels. But its just for my free time and to keep conversations flowing. People say you can't base things on play by play, but I've found some cool data sets that have parsed the college football stats from 2012 to 2023 (minus 2020 because of COVID) and I'm having fun with it, and learning a lot about the players. 

[Skinsinparadise]

51 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

I think you misread my post. I was saying he disliked Maye. That was all I was saying about him. The rest is my thoughts. I have thoughts about this draft class because I like all of the top 3 guys but I'm not in love with any of them. I honestly think I want Daniels above top because of his work ethic and how much he improved at LSU and the fact that he played at LSU, compared to the PAC12 with no defense and the ACC. I've got nothing against Maye and Williams (and really Daniels) but I'm just not IN LOVE with any of them. That's why I'm constantly telling my friends and family that this year's class makes me feel like 2011. I wonder what Peters feels though because he is the one that matters though. I'm a nobody with an opinion.

 

Sure I'm writing some analytics for fun to see things, and some are favorable to Williams, some are favorable to Maye, others are favorable to Daniels. But its just for my free time and to keep conversations flowing. People say you can't base things on play by play, but I've found some cool data sets that have parsed the college football stats from 2012 to 2023 (minus 2020 because of COVID) and I'm having fun with it, and learning a lot about the players. 

 

I didn't misread it.  I didn't mean to imply you said that Mueller said pass on QB.   But the way you explained the point felt a bit misleading -- you launched off him not liking Maye and then said this might not be the draft to take a QB.  For those who haven't listened to the podcast, you'd think maybe Mueller had the same impression?  But it was completetly the opposite. 

 

He loved the draft for QBs, he thought it was a uniquely good draft for the position and they needed to take a QB.  None of that made your post about what Mueller talked about even though it was the largest point he made about QBs in that podcast.

 

Your take of not digging the draft for QB is going against the grain.  No a single mock draft type of much more on point leak from personnel people see this as a "meh" draft for QB.  Not saying scouts are right and you are wrong.  Will see.  But its an outlier position.   And it not that far off of your other posts over the years liking some of the QBs deeper in the draft or UDFA like Mullens or Mond, etc.   So wonder if its you got a new favorite non-first rounder?

 

As for 2011, Christian Ponder was mostly seen as a 2nd rounder, he was a shock top of the half first round pick.  lol, I am old enough to recall Sheehan goofing on Ponder when he was a college QB.  Gabbert had a meh senior season and wasn't brimming with upside.  Jake Locker with his 54% career completion percentage in college was super raw.  As apples apples to oranges as it gets to that class in theory.

 

Edited January 23 by Skinsinparadise

[HigSkin]

Really not sure how you could know who to pick without knowing who the head coach will be but....

 

 

Edited January 23 by HigSkin

[Warhead36]

Way way way too early for mocks.

[ThatNFLChick]

A somewhat troubling trend I have noticed with Maye is that he seems to play worse at the end of the season?

 

In 2022, in 3 of his last 5 games he had below 60% completion percentage and lost 4 of his last 5. 

 

In 2023, in 4 of his last 7 games he had below 60% completion percentage and lost 4 of his last 7.

 

Williams 2023 ending wasn't much better but his 2022 was so it doesn't seem to be a pattern with him 

[Warhead36]

4 minutes ago, ThatNFLChick said:

A somewhat troubling trend I have noticed with Maye is that he seems to play worse at the end of the season?

 

In 2022, in 3 of his last 5 games he had below 60% completion percentage and lost 4 of his last 5. 

 

In 2023, in 4 of his last 7 games he had below 60% completion percentage and lost 4 of his last 7.

 

Williams 2023 ending wasn't much better but his 2022 was so it doesn't seem to be a pattern with him 

Did they play better teams late in the year?

 

And I don't use wins and losses to evaluate QBs. Otherwise Stetson Bennett would be the #1 pick.

[Thinking Skins]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I didn't misread it.  I didn't mean to imply you said that Mueller said pass on QB.   But the way you explained the point felt a bit misleading -- you launched off him not liking Maye and then said this might not be the draft to take a QB.  For those who haven't listened to the podcast, you'd think maybe Mueller had the same impression?  But it was completetly the opposite. 

 

He loved the draft for QBs, he thought it was a uniquely good draft for the position and they needed to take a QB.  Not of that made your post about what Mueller talked about even though it was the largest point he made about QBs in that podcast.

 

Your take of not digging the draft for QB is going against the grain.  No a single mock draft type of much more on point leak from personnel people see this as a "meh" draft for QB.  Not saying scouts are right and you are wrong.  Will see.  But its an outlier position.   And it not that far off of your other posts over the years liking some of the QBs deeper in the draft or UDFA like Mullens or Mond, etc.   So wonder if its you got a new favorite non-first rounder?

 

As for 2011, Christian Ponder was mostly seen as a 2nd rounder, he was a shock top of the half first round pick.  lol, I am old enough to recall Sheehan goofing on Ponder when he was a college QB.  Gabbert had a meh senior season and wasn't brimming with upside.  Jake Locker with his 54% career completion percentage in college was super raw.  As apples apples to oranges as it gets to that class in theory.

 

 

 

All this is true. I apologize if I confused the two opinions, which was not not my intent. 

 

As you know I do tend to favor QB steals over high round QBs, but that's not what's favoring this analysis. Right now I'm looking more into their play and just their resumes. We can talk about Howell. I thought Howell would be a first round QB, but I was in love with him before we got him. he dropped to the fifth so he fits the low round category but that shouldn't count. When I was doing my analytics I thought he'd be a top pick and I was hyping him. I had no idea he'd drop. But at the time people were hyping Willis, Corral and others and I was saying that I don't like their resumes. I like a longer list of games on my resume, so I hyped Howell and Ridder and to a lesser extent Zappe but not as much because of his arm. Then there was Pickett who I had a question mark on. People were calling him Burrow but I was like nah. He was nowhere near as dominant as Burrow. So I didn't like him. Result. I liked 2 guys Howell and Ridder and Ridder only cause he could run, but not really run like a dual threat but run more like a Jason Campbell, thats not a great thing. 

 

We go back to the QB class with Wilson, Lance, Fields, Jones and Monds. And yeah I didn't like any of them because I said what have you done in college. People say you can't look at play by play or college stats, but you can look at pure numbers and see if they took enough attempts to learn the basics and do things like set their feet and read defenses and go through reads. That doesn't just happen overnight. So I was low on all these guys based on their low number of starts, except Monds. But because Monds was given such a low grade by scouts why should I give him a high grade. He was a dual threat (Jason Campbell type) who could be mobile while he learned the game. Otherwise I was not a fan of the guys above. And It seems like I'm proving right. Monds is a bust but so are the other guys. Fields may be a hit, but hes not a franchise guy yet.

 

This year we have 3-6 guys who have cool resumes BUT...

Williams is 6'1. I don't like that. We went through 17 games hearing how bad that is for Howell. I'm supposed to ignore that now that we have a new QB? He went to USC where teams don't play a lot of defense. He had a better 2022 than 2023. Why didn't he get better? Does he have character concerns? I'm not saying I don't want them to draft him, I'm just saying I'm not in love with him and that I could see why he'd bust. 

 

Maye never TOOK OVER a game. We were talking about that with Lamar Jackson just this year for being the MVP. Well, if a QB is going to be the number 2 pick, I want that too. Caleb Williams has a few (I believe 2 6-TD games). Now this could just be the bias in the PAC12 vs the ACC though so am I being mean to MAYE because Williams played against no defense? Maye had a lot of deep balls that went into opponents territory and they scored later that drive, so its not like the offense didn't produce. But I wasn't seeing it from Maye. The back of my mind there was the comparison to Daniel Jones. Its not there any more as I've been delving into their college careers, but that was there. Maye, like Williams, didn't get better in his senior season. Why? 

EDIT: While the Daniel Jones comparison is gone, there are comparisons to other big strong arm QBs that didn't work who I want to say why isn't Maye just like them? I don't want to go into them right now because each one has a story why Maye is not like them that is not football related. But on the field, why did these guys fail? 

 

Daniels is the guy I like the most of these three. There is the stuff he did before this year that taints my opinion of him. There is this year which I think is great. Then there is the contact that he takes which I think is problematic. He was 185 before LSU. then he got to 210 at LSU. How big can his body get? We're not looking at somebody who's going to be as big as Anthony Richardson. So I wonder about the contact he takes. I love that he got (so much) better this year. I wouldn't put it up there with Burrow, but it is very good. I think he is still hesitant to throw with anticipation and into tight windows as marked with the 40 TDs and 4 INTS. But if he can do that here, I have no qualms. The stories about him being the first into the building and last out, not to the gym but into the film room to study the tape is also good to know. 

EDIT: The other things about Daniels, is that I was not in love with his pure passing. I'm falling off of that because as he is a runner and as long as he is a hard worker, I think he can get better at the mental side of throwing and learning the game. But I was not impressed with him just sitting in the pocket and throwing for a first down. It seemed like he always had to put himself in harms way which meant that we might need to depend on Sam more than we want to. 

Edited January 23 by Thinking Skins

[NoCalMike]

I think 20 years ago GM's were often having to choose between a traditional pocket QB and an athlete that they felt they could coach into being a QB eventually, but that is no longer the case and if you are picking a QB as high as #2 the standard should no longer be having to choose one skill set over the other as QB's are coming out of college with the ability to do both things naturally.  I don't watch enough college to even assess all the QB's but I keep hearing from a lot of people that there is Caleb....and then everyone else, and I know that there is no QB regardless of potential that comes out of college a finished NFL product, but I don't want to settle for a QB at #2 that the front office and coaches feel is a "project"  If you are taking the leap at QB that high up in the draft it better be because you feel that QB has what it takes to lead a franchise in a season or two.

[The Consigliere]

16 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

What's stupid is idea that somehow finding a top OT is going to do anything for us without a top franchise QB. I never did before (twice, with two upper echelon OTs), and it doesn't for other teams. The Browns had one of the best OTs to ever play the game for 10 years and did nothing. Plenty of other teams have had great OTs but no QB and did nothing.

 

Want to be a perennial contender? Get a top QB. Want to do the same crap and keep ending up either at the bottom or mired in mediocrity? Keep doing what we've been doing.

 

Again, there's a reason that teams keep drafting QBs high. Everyone and their mother within every NFL organization realizes that it's a QB driven league and you need one to be in the mix for a SB every year over a long time. Yes, you can have exceptions like SF, but they are by far the exception and not the rule (though they did luck into what seems like an All Pro level QB in Purdy).

 

But I'm sure all NFL GM, coaches, scouts and others really don't have a clue what they're talking about and you do. You should apply for a job with some NFL team and make bank.

To throw a bone here, I half get the argument they're making, which we learned this past season. If you're OL is a total dumpster fire by design and somewhat by misfortune (Stromberg injury etc), you can wreck a QB (see Carr, Luck, Howell etc), and OL's by their nature are absolutely essential for QB development. The problem is, as we've already mentioned, if you build out part of your OL first, unless you have a horror show season accidentally, you will likely build out the offense well enough to not be able to acquire a franchise QB w/o some major luck. Additionally, as we illustrated with the Samuels/Jansens years and the Trent Williams/Scherff years, where we had All Pro to pro bowl level talent, and adequate cover beyond and still were rock bottom horrible to middling at best and in-between on the down side. You could plug in anybody and we did and it didn't matter. If you don't have the QB, the ugly truth is that you have nothing. 

 

So while it sucks to do what we did with Howell, or the Texans with Carr (although a retirement with Boselli was a big part of that), it can be unavoidable. The good news is that we have adequate cover at LT with Leno, we have a quality guard in Cosmi, and we have what is likely a totally usable interior OL in Stromberg once healthy. The issue is that we have 2-3 OL's we need to add as starters, and need to fully reboot our backups (because if guys couldn't start over the horror show options we were rolling out last year, they are not adequate depth). The FA class isn't ideal, but we should be willing to pull lineman off for cover, at least for depth, and with 6 top 102-103 picks overall, we have plenty of ammo to hit the position on day 2 and the start of day 3. While you can't simply fire away at one position in the draft, interior OL's carry a nice hit rate in that day 1, day 2, early day 3 zone, and would address our needs, and because of positional depth, we should be able to find at least 1 or 2 lineman worth drafting between round 2 and early round 4. I hope if we can find an interior OL or RT worth going after in the 25-36 zone, we trade up if necessary, or sit back and grab them, and if we see an interesting project in the current tier available in round 3 or 4, we take them too.

But the 2nd pick? It's QB, period. Full Stop. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Nick, PFF guy who is a fan of this team spent some time watching Maye.  I crossed out the one expletive he had in a post.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OtisDriftwood25]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

Nick, PFF guy who is a fan of this team spent some time watching Maye.  I crossed out the one expletive he had in a post.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I’d be interested to look up his previous years. People really liked Zach Wilson, Mac Jones, Justin Fields and more. If he has a good track record I could get on board.

[The Consigliere]

13 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Even if McLaurin declines a bit, he's still a good player and you need reliable vets for a rookie QB to throw to. 

 

I mean we have over $90 mil in cap space, its not like we need to shed his salary.

No, and I'm fine with it. He's overpaid a little, paid as the 12th best WR in the league (more because of his contract came up 2 years ago then anything) when he's more in that 20th-25th zone historically with top 15 upside. But whatever, its not a long deal and we can walk after '25 which is fine. We can deal him or keep him. If he has the same target separation issues he had this past season, I'd deal him this summer or anytime in the next two years, but you're right. It doesn't really matter much. But if we could get something worthwhile for him? Sure, I'd deal him in a second. 

[ThatNFLChick]

22 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Did they play better teams late in the year?

 

And I don't use wins and losses to evaluate QBs. Otherwise Stetson Bennett would be the #1 pick.

 

No, the competition didn't get better late in the season.

 

I don't think wins and losses are the end all-be all but they definitely are part of the evaluation for me (along with how they played against tough competition, did they progress or regress from both season to season and also during the season, did they elevate the players around them, game winning drives, are they clutch, etc). 

[Conn]

8 hours ago, skinsarethebest said:

I would love Kirk in San Fran.  It would doom them to multiple years of getting no further than the divisional round.

This is extremely silly. Some weird form of homerism or anti-homerism at work. Kirk (pre-Achilles at least, we’ll see how he recovers) would thrive in SF, Kyle thirsts for a QB who can operate his system to the level Kirk would be capable of. Kyle would control his QB with an XBox controller if he could. Kirk isn’t a HOF talent and has never been elite off-book but he’s been excellent for years now, and especially the last two years in a great scheme with great WR talent has led plenty of clutch comebacks, etc. 

 

Purdy has an appeal and a mystery about him because he has stretches of flawless operation of Kyle’s system at such a young age with a non-existent contract. But Kirk would destroy for Kyle Shanahan. There’s a reason Kyle at one point wanted to trade the #2 overall pick for him (and pay him!). And Kirk has only gotten better with age. He’s not an elite creator, but he’s improved at that as he’s aged as well. But within a system like Kyle’s the 49ers would have been even more unbeatable the last 3-4 years. 
 

It’s extremely biased to claim otherwise if you’ve actually watched him play and don’t just cling to narratives like “he’s not clutch” or “he can’t win night games or beat winning teams”. 

Edited January 23 by Conn

[Skinsinparadise]

14 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

 

All this is true. I apologize if I confused the two opinions, which was not not my intent. 

 

 

Thanks no need to apologize.  I am just saying we all got our biases.  And if you are listening to Mueller and summarizing his points yet omitting what I thought was his main point which is you got to take a QB and this is the right draft to do it -- that bias showed some.  But that's cool.

 

16 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

 

As you know I do tend to favor QB steals over high round QBs, but that's not what's favoring this analysis. Right now I'm looking more into their play and just their resumes. We can talk about Howell. I thought Howell would be a first round QB, but I was in love with him before we got him. he dropped to the fifth so he fits the low round category but that shouldn't count. When I was doing my analytics I thought he'd be a top pick and I was hyping him. I had no idea he'd drop. But at the time people were hyping Willis, Corral and others and I was saying that I don't like their resumes. I like a longer list of games on my resume, so I hyped Howell and Ridder and to a lesser extent Zappe but not as much because of his arm. Then there was Pickett who I had a question mark on. People were calling him Burrow but I was like nah. He was nowhere near as dominant as Burrow. So I didn't like him. Result. I liked 2 guys Howell and Ridder and Ridder only cause he could run, but not really run like a dual threat but run more like a Jason Campbell, thats not a great thing. 

 

 

I had all of them except Zappe who I had later in the 2nd round when we did our top 100 lists.  I said then I can see any of them making it and any of them busting for different reasons. 

 

It definitely wasn't considered a strong QB class and its playing out that way,

 

22 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

We go back to the QB class with Wilson, Lance, Fields, Jones and Monds. And yeah I didn't like any of them because I said what have you done in college. People say you can't look at play by play or college stats, but you can look at pure numbers and see if they took enough attempts to learn the basics and do things like set their feet and read defenses and go through reads. That doesn't just happen overnight. So I was low on all these guys based on their low number of starts, except Monds. But because Monds was given such a low grade by scouts why should I give him a high grade. He was a dual threat (Jason Campbell type) who could be mobile while he learned the game. Otherwise I was not a fan of the guys above. And It seems like I'm proving right. Monds is a bust but so are the other guys. Fields may be a hit, but hes not a franchise guy yet.

4 INTS. But if he can do that here, I have no qualms. The stories about him being the first into the building and last out, not to the gym but into the film room to study the tape is also good to know. 

 

OK some of them has monster stats.  So you are running the Parcells school of thought of wanting starts.  If so you should love Bo Nix he has plenty of starts with good stats.

 

Zach Wilson, Lance, Fields, Jones -- don't have the hype from scouts that Maye and Daniels have.   Apples to oranges.