Welcome to Washington Jamin Davis LB Kentucky

[Stefanskins]

11 hours ago, Mr. Sinister said:

Wonder what Kyle Smith is up to these days 

Atlanta's first round pick is a rookie pro bowler and their third pick has started every game and 99% of snaps for their o-line...one of their fifth round picks has started the last ten games...not a bad first draft...

[method man]

3 hours ago, Stefanskins said:

Atlanta's first round pick is a rookie pro bowler and their third pick has started every game and 99% of snaps for their o-line...one of their fifth round picks has started the last ten games...not a bad first draft...

 

Don't spin it man. Kyle Pitts was a no brainer pick, Jaylen Mayfield is the weak link in their OL and the guy teams were targeting (49 PFF grade) and Ogundeji hasn't done much during his time as a starter with 1 sack (53 PFF grade). As disappointing as our draft was, it is at least on par with the Falcons' draft

[CTskin]

5 hours ago, Stefanskins said:

Atlanta's first round pick is a rookie pro bowler and their third pick has started every game and 99% of snaps for their o-line...one of their fifth round picks has started the last ten games...not a bad first draft...

I had to write and delete this many times to avoid a ban… the track record for rookie TEs is atrocious, I still believe in pitts even though he didn’t flash like people hoped. This was the must-make pick for the fanbase and Kyle made it even though, as we already see, there was much better talent available.

 

the rest of the draft was trash. I don’t see any way of giving it a respectable mark.

 

that said, I hated the jamin pick from the start and we’re not looking any better.

Edited January 7, 2022 by CTskin

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I get all of the disappointment with his play this year, but I think it’s way too early to say he’s a bust. 
 

I think the above tweet about Mayo playing ahead of him against Philly isn’t exactly fair. The guy was coming off Covid and a recent concussion. The staff was probably being careful with him and rightfully so. 
 

Jamin has some elite tools. I still think he can be a dynamic starter on a productive LB group. I’m not giving up on him yet.

 

And for the people who miss Kyle Smith so much, is he not responsible somewhat for the below average roster that we now have? Where’s his list of All Pros that play for us? I’ll wait. 
 

He drafted Kyle Pitts fourth this year. What a ****ing genius. 😆

Edited January 7, 2022 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy

[method man]

1 hour ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I get all of the disappointment with his play this year, but I think it’s way too early to say he’s a bust. 
 

I think the above tweet about Mayo playing ahead of him against Philly isn’t exactly fair. The guy was coming off Covid and a recent concussion. The staff was probably being careful with him and rightfully so. 
 

Jamin has some elite tools. I still think he can be a dynamic starter on a productive LB group. I’m not giving up on him yet.

 

And for the people who miss Kyle Smith so much, is he not responsible somewhat for the below average roster that we now have? Where’s his list of All Pros that play for us? I’ll wait. 
 

He drafted Kyle Pitts fourth this year. What a ****ing genius. 😆

The issue is that they missed the evaluation on Jamin that he is a MLB. Even if he is a good WLB, that is absolutely not worth a first round pick. No one takes 4-3 OLBs in the first round anymore

The takeaway here is don’t use day 1 or day 2 picks on high RAS guys with a spotty football track record. They are either not ready to contribute (like Davis) or they are not built for the physicality (like St Juste or Gibson). Take “football players”

[SoCalSkins]

Jamin is a bust. His contract is guaranteed so you make the best of it on the outside or special teams. He’s not a cancer. Just a bust. We have had plenty of those. Is what it is.

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

8 minutes ago, method man said:

The issue is that they missed the evaluation on Jamin that he is a MLB. Even if he is a good WLB, that is absolutely not worth a first round pick. No one takes 4-3 OLBs in the first round anymore

I’m not disagreeing with that. But the tone in this thread has been over the top in my opinion. Reach and bust are two different things. 
 

And to compare a reach at 19 to Kyle Smith picking Pitts who everyone thought was the best football player in the draft at 4 as some kind of apples to apples barometer is just silly.
 

But there’s a lot of silly in these threads these days. Except the Heinicke Hive thread. That one is filled with reasonable and well thought out football discussion. 😆

 

 

Edited January 7, 2022 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy

[Stefanskins]

5 hours ago, method man said:

 

Don't spin it man. Kyle Pitts was a no brainer pick, Jaylen Mayfield is the weak link in their OL and the guy teams were targeting (49 PFF grade) and Ogundeji hasn't done much during his time as a starter with 1 sack (53 PFF grade). As disappointing as our draft was, it is at least on par with the Falcons' draft

1rst round - Davis - 8 games started - 2 QB hits/ 1 sack /1 Pass Defended /1 Int /68 total tackles
2nd round - Cosmi - 8 games started - Week 1 starter w/ only 3 penalties - seems like he could be good with a lil' luck on the injury proneness
3rd round - Benjamin St-Juste - 9 game appearances/3 starts - 3 passes defended 26 total tackles
3rd round - Dyami Brown - 12 receptions 148 yards 0 TDs
 4th round - John Bates - 19 rec 244 yds 1 TD - However, I love his blocking ability/nice hands (11 first down catches) - good pick
5th round - Darrick Forrest - 4 tackles
6th round - Camaron Cheeseman - special teams LS - he played in all 16 games although our kicking game was worse than I ever remembered it. Not his fault though, I'd imagine.
7th round - William Bradley-King - 1 assisted tackle
7th round - Shaka Toney - 6 combined tackles w/ 1 sack - but with 5 QB hurries
8th round - Dax Milne - 9 receptions 83 yards

 

compared to:

 

1rst round - Kyle Pitts - 66 rec/1018 yrds/only 1 td but 43! first downs <- just this right here is almost better than our whole draft
2nd round - Richie Grant - 0 games started/15 games appeared/1 pass defended/1 forced fumble/1 fumble recovery/35 tackles 
3rd round - Jalen Mayfield - 16 games started (availability is the best ability) 7 penalties (6 fs 1 holding) - compared to our 2nd round Cosmi - same penalty rate but played all 16 games 
4th round - Darren Hall - 2 passes defended/1 sack/25 tackles
4th round -  Drew Dalman - appeared in all 16 games - so that's a plus...maybe
5th round - Ta'Quon Graham - 12 games/4 games started/11 tackles/2 qb hits - more than our 5th rounder and our two 7th rounders combined
5th round - Adetokunbo Ogundeji - 15 games/10 games started/28 tackles/1 fr/1pd/2qbh
6th round - Avery Williams - 14 games/1 start/19 punt returns - 141 yds - 7.4 avg/20 kick returns - 405 yrds - 20.3 avg/...along with 21 tackles/3 QB hits/1 forced fumble/2 fumble recoveries/ 1 pass defended
7th round - played in 10 games and 57% of special teams snaps/1 reception

 

not a bad first draft...

[method man]

1 minute ago, Stefanskins said:

1rst round - Davis - 8 games started - 2 QB hits/ 1 sack /1 Pass Defended /1 Int /68 total tackles
2nd round - Cosmi - 8 games started - Week 1 starter w/ only 3 penalties - seems like he could be good with a lil' luck on the injury proneness
3rd round - Benjamin St-Juste - 9 game appearances/3 starts - 3 passes defended 26 total tackles
3rd round - Dyami Brown - 12 receptions 148 yards 0 TDs
 4th round - John Bates - 19 rec 244 yds 1 TD - However, I love his blocking ability/nice hands (11 first down catches) - good pick
5th round - Darrick Forrest - 4 tackles
6th round - Camaron Cheeseman - special teams LS - he played in all 16 games although our kicking game was worse than I ever remembered it. Not his fault though, I'd imagine.
7th round - William Bradley-King - 1 assisted tackle
7th round - Shaka Toney - 6 combined tackles w/ 1 sack - but with 5 QB hurries
8th round - Dax Milne - 9 receptions 83 yards

 

compared to:

 

1rst round - Kyle Pitts - 66 rec/1018 yrds/only 1 td but 43! first downs <- just this right here is almost better than our whole draft
2nd round - Richie Grant - 0 games started/15 games appeared/1 pass defended/1 forced fumble/1 fumble recovery/35 tackles 
3rd round - Jalen Mayfield - 16 games started (availability is the best ability) 7 penalties (6 fs 1 holding) - compared to our 2nd round Cosmi - same penalty rate but played all 16 games 
4th round - Darren Hall - 2 passes defended/1 sack/25 tackles
4th round -  Drew Dalman - appeared in all 16 games - so that's a plus...maybe
5th round - Ta'Quon Graham - 12 games/4 games started/11 tackles/2 qb hits - more than our 5th rounder and our two 7th rounders combined
5th round - Adetokunbo Ogundeji - 15 games/10 games started/28 tackles/1 fr/1pd/2qbh
6th round - Avery Williams - 14 games/1 start/19 punt returns - 141 yds - 7.4 avg/20 kick returns - 405 yrds - 20.3 avg/...along with 21 tackles/3 QB hits/1 forced fumble/2 fumble recoveries/ 1 pass defended
7th round - played in 10 games and 57% of special teams snaps/1 reception

 

not a bad first draft...

I don’t really care about players getting playing time because they were forced into it and the team didn’t have anyone better. This would be like claiming Troy Apke was a good player last year just because he got a bunch of starts. It does not surprise me that a bunch of their defensive draft picks got playing time because their defense has been notoriously bad and talent light for years

 

It’s unfair to ding Shaka Toney for example and say he didn’t get a ton of starts this season because he was blocked by Young and Sweat.

[Burgundy Yoda]

Jamin has a long way to go, but our 2021 draft class is a weak one. Probably a bottom 5 draft in the NFL. Not impressed by the the two GMs Rivera picked. 

Edited January 7, 2022 by Burgundy Yoda

[philibusters]

16 out of 17 games into the season, how would people grade our picks last year.

 

I have:

 

Jamin Davis: C-

Samuel Cosmi:  A-

Benjamin St. Juste:  B-

Dyami Brown:  D+

John Bates: B+

Darrick Forrest:  D+

Cameron Cheeseman: B

William Bradley King: C-

Shaka Tony:  B

Dax Milne: C+

 

If you average that our so that A=4, A-=3.7,B+=3.3. and so on it averages out to 2.27 GPA or basically a C+ average.

[DWinzit]

9 hours ago, method man said:

The issue is that they missed the evaluation on Jamin that he is a MLB. Even if he is a good WLB, that is absolutely not worth a first round pick. No one takes 4-3 OLBs in the first round anymore

The takeaway here is don’t use day 1 or day 2 picks on high RAS guys with a spotty football track record. They are either not ready to contribute (like Davis) or they are not built for the physicality (like St Juste or Gibson). Take “football players”

The other takeaway is do not go into a draft with such a strong need that you feel you must take a particular position in the first. The Davis should not have been a big shocker to anyone based on Rivera's LB discussions. We went into the draft with Bostic and Mayo as our MLB's, terrible. 

9 hours ago, Stefanskins said:

 

not a bad first draft...

Or, Atlanta's roster depth was so cruddy and due to injuries all their draft picks had to play. Really liked their Ogundeji 5th rd pick

(I have no idea of their injury situation this year)

 

[Koolblue13]

I think Davis will end up being a very good LBer in a year or two, but it was a terrible pick at 19. Especially because JOK would have been perfect at the Buffalo nickle we started running when we finally realized Collins can't play safety. 

 

RonCo decided pre-draft that they wanted a MLB and that's all they were gonna do. That's the bust.

[HigSkin]

I believe Davis will end up having a much better 2nd year.  Heard RR talking about it on The Junkies weekly and he said both Holcomb and Davis played so much better moving them outside because they are twitchy players.  Allowed them more freedom to see and attack, having someone like Mayo dealing with the middle/play calling.  I really don't know why they waited so long to make the move to the outside but is what it is.

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, philibusters said:

16 out of 17 games into the season, how would people grade our picks last year.

 

I have:

 

Jamin Davis: C-

Samuel Cosmi:  A-

Benjamin St. Juste:  B-

Dyami Brown:  D+

John Bates: B+

Darrick Forrest:  D+

Cameron Cheeseman: B

William Bradley King: C-

Shaka Tony:  B

Dax Milne: C+

 

If you average that our so that A=4, A-=3.7,B+=3.3. and so on it averages out to 2.27 GPA or basically a C+ average.

I mean, all draft picks are not created equal, so it's tough to tell.  You expect more from guys in the first round than the 7th.

 

There is no question Jamin Davis has had a disappointing rookie year.  I do think it's a failure of evaluation, however, because I think they thought he could play MLB and now they feel like he's better at the outside.  So, I think there was some start and stop there. Now, I'm not one of those folks who declare a guy a bust after 16 games. I think there is a real potential he can be a really, really good player.  He needs to have a huge off-season, have a defined role, and also they need to get a solid MLB in there that he can play off of.  But year 1 was disappointing.  

 

I think they did well with Cheeseman, WBK, Tony and Milne, getting something from the back part of the draft.  I also think Cosmi, if he can stay on the field, was a good pick.  

 

I think Dyami Brown was thrust into a role he wasn't nearly ready for.  He was supposed to be the 4th or 5th option behind McLaurin, Samuel, Hump, and Thomas (in some order).  Samuel has been hurt all year and Thomas has been hurt most of the year, and all of a sudden, your 4th guy becomes something else, and he was never ready for that. So, I think there's a chance he can either grow into the role, or if Samuel and Thomas come back, and he shifts back to the role he was intended for, it could be ok. 

 

I think the grade is actually lower overall because of the lack of development of Davis.  I'd probably give it a C, or maybe a C-.   Cosmi looks like a starter for a long time, Bates was a really good find.  But when your first round pick can't start ahead of David Mayo, that's a problem.  It might change, but it hasn't yet.  

[Voice_of_Reason]

On 1/7/2022 at 8:50 AM, HigSkin said:

I believe Davis will end up having a much better 2nd year.  Heard RR talking about it on The Junkies weekly and he said both Holcomb and Davis played so much better moving them outside because they are twitchy players.  Allowed them more freedom to see and attack, having someone like Mayo dealing with the middle/play calling.  I really don't know why they waited so long to make the move to the outside but is what it is.

Yeah, There were 3 big complete whiff's in the defensive personnel/scheme this year which are head scratchers:

 

- Trying Davis at MLB when it really appeared his natural position was outside.  But they had him work inside all off-season.  I think they wanted him to learn from John Bostic.  It just never really worked.  Then Bostic went down, and at first, they wanted him and Holcomb to trade off inside.  It took a while to get everybody lined up where they should be.  Now, they NEED to go find a true starting MLB.  Not in the draft, in FA.  And I think they should sign 2.  And not bring Bostic back, no matter how good a leader he is.  He's Ron's version of Reed Dhoughty.  Great guy, try hard, physically limited and only an average player at best.

 

- WJIII in as a zone DB replacing Darby who excelled at Zone. It took most of the year for WJIII to really figure out what the hell he was doing, and it threw everything off.

 

- Compounding the WJIII issue is they had Landon Collins playing SS, instead of LB, and put Kurl on the bench. This was insanity.  Because with Collings and WJIII, one can't cover, and the other had no idea what he was doing and was expecting help, and it was just a mess of all messes.  So when they switched Collins to LB (or Buffalo Nickel, or whatever they want to call it), and had Fuller, McCain, Kurl and WJIII, everything just worked a whole lot better.  

 

I REALLY think that Ron and Jack thought with Collins back, McCain who can play CB and Safety, Fuller who can play inside and outside, they had all this flexibility, and they could mix and match.  But what it did was completely broke the chemistry the defense had last year, put people out of position, and created mass chaos.  That's on the coaches.  I think I get what they were trying to do.  but the execution was bad.  

 

When they simplified it, everything seemed to work much better.

[Sacks 'n' Stuff]

You suck.

[Riggo#44]

Well, this is going well...

 

 

[757SeanTaylor21]

I dont get why he's such the target by Ron and jack....like u got sweat not doing anything. Jackson and juste blowing coverages. But yeah blast the raw linebacker yall drafted in his second year after the first year yoh had him as a different lb role

[bh32]

Ron is the one who drafted Davis,so he should be blaming himself...

[spjunkies]

3 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

I dont get why he's such the target by Ron and jack....like u got sweat not doing anything. Jackson and juste blowing coverages. But yeah blast the raw linebacker yall drafted in his second year after the first year yoh had him as a different lb role

 

I'm with you. My only defense for our interesting coaching staff is maybe they think the public criticism will help motivate the lad.

[Warhead36]

7 minutes ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

I dont get why he's such the target by Ron and jack....like u got sweat not doing anything. Jackson and juste blowing coverages. But yeah blast the raw linebacker yall drafted in his second year after the first year yoh had him as a different lb role

I mean other guys have been criticized too. I think McCain was scapegoated for the Swift 3rd and 15 play.

[KDawg]

Davis doesn't suck. He's just playing like a guy who is raw and probably shouldn't have been taken so early.

 

He's actually coming along nicely. He is a great rusher (I'd like to see him as a rush end at times) and has good blitz timing. He tackles fairly well and has good speed. He cannot cover slot receivers man to man... that's appalling. 

 

I think he's got a solid future in the league, maybe not as a down to down box backer, though he's getting better at that. I think he is a pass rusher through and through, though.

 

 

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Davis doesn't suck. He's just playing like a guy who is raw and probably shouldn't have been taken so early.

 

He's actually coming along nicely. He is a great rusher (I'd like to see him as a rush end at times) and has good blitz timing. He tackles fairly well and has good speed. He cannot cover slot receivers man to man... that's appalling. 

 

I think he's got a solid future in the league, maybe not as a down to down box backer, though he's getting better at that. I think he is a pass rusher through and through, though.

 

 

Yeah if he were like a 3rd or 4th rounder we'd be looking at him like someone who is coming along slowly. But when you're taken top 20, the expectation is to be an immediate contributor.

 

Its more a failure on the coaches/FO than on Davis.

[UK_HOG]

5 minutes ago, spjunkies said:

 

I'm with you. My only defense for our interesting coaching staff is maybe they think the public criticism will help motivate the lad.

Del Rio should never have called him out at a press conference.  If he felt Davis needed calling out it should have been done in private not thrown under the bus.  Has calling someone out in public ever had the desired effect?  Davis has been disappointing so far but this staff are not going to solve the problem.