Welcome to Washington Jamin Davis LB Kentucky

[dyst]

People have been disappointed about our LB play for years even before this current crop. 

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, dyst said:

People have been disappointed about our LB play for years even before this current crop. 

WHAT?! They were?! Who was it?

 

Oh. Wait. I’m people. It’s me.

[Anselmheifer]

7 minutes ago, KDawg said:

WHAT?! They were?! Who was it?

 

Oh. Wait. I’m people. It’s me.

How do you feel about the current LB situation?

 

I love the Jamin selection but don’t think it’s enough. We basically swapped out KPL for Jamin Davis and the rest of the LB’s don’t feel upgraded. 

 

I think we will be fine in nickel if we roll with Jamin and Cole, but I still worry about the 25% of the time we are in base defense and Boston is on the field. And, God help us if we roll with Jamin and Bostic in the nickel package. 

[Llevron]

It is pretty cool watching him move around these linemen trying to block him on the second level and they cant even touch him. I never realized LBs had to have those kinds of quick feet. Like the one tweet said, he moves like an RB. Kinda cool. 

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

How do you feel about the current LB situation?

 

I love the Jamin selection but don’t think it’s enough. We basically swapped out KPL for Jamin Davis and the rest of the LB’s don’t feel upgraded. 

 

I think we will be fine in nickel if we roll with Jamin and Cole, but I still worry about the 25% of the time we are in base defense and Boston is on the field. And, God help us if we roll with Jamin and Bostic in the nickel package. 

Much better. Jamin alone fixes a lot of the issues. Holcomb has improved every year. Hudson developing.

 

I’d like another piece but.. beggars can’t be choosers. We’re better. That’s the important part.

[CurseReversed]

15 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

ill, the conversations were rarely about football. Rivera leaves X’s and O’s to his assistants, who often meet with prospective picks several times in March and April. He wants to know what motivates the players, what they care about and how they might fit the culture of his franchise.

“I want to give them an opportunity to let their guard down and show you who they really are,” Rivera said. “If you give a player the opportunity, they will tell you who they are.”

 

In these interviews, he has come to love players such as Luke Kuechly and Shaq Thompson, who became top linebackers for him with Carolina. It’s how he became enamored with Davis this year, admiring his intelligence and backstory of growing up as a military child, and he insisted the team keep the 19th pick to take Davis instead of trading to another spot.

 

These interviews also are where other players fall off his list, such as the philosophy major whose answers made Rivera wonder how much he cared about the game.

“How important is football to you?” Rivera asked.

“It’s up there,” the player replied.

Rivera told the front office to pick someone else that year.

 

Many of those who have been around Rivera say he likes to build relationships. “He treats people like people,” a Washington assistant said last year while speaking privately about the coach. Several times during news conferences last fall, he lamented the pandemic restrictions that kept him from face-to-face meetings with the reporters who cover the team. He likes personal conversations. He is especially happy when he learns a player is from a military family or is the son of a teacher or a coach, believing they have a different understanding of learning and responsibility than many others. But mostly it’s a bond he is seeking, a way to connect.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/05/02/ron-rivera-draft-picks-bonds/

Great description here.     There are so many subtle things you can learn about a player when you can hear them talk and answer questions.   Its hard to explain, but just as a casual fan, I felt like I received major insight into Jarmin's personality after just listening to his pro day interview. There were tones of confidence, command and discipline in everything he said.  He see,s to have that humble leader personality, just like McLaurin, but with a little more command to it.

 

I cant wait to see what Rivera is capable of building with a whole team of guys like this.  It is and exciting prospect overall and Davis is an exciting QB of the defense prospect.   The Trey Lance of our defense.       

Edited May 3, 2021 by CurseReversed

[dyst]

33 minutes ago, KDawg said:

WHAT?! They were?! Who was it?

 

Oh. Wait. I’m people. It’s me.

I can’t even remember the names of LBs that have passed through here. Fletcher was like the only good one. Really shows how badly managed this team was.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

Even with the addition of William Jackson over Darby, I felt our D was likely to regress from the Top 3-ish it was last year.  Eventually teams (division rivals mostly) were going to install packages to attack specific weaknesses we had.  We could already see well coached teams (that weren't hurt) could abuse our defense at will.  Rams and Bucs last season.

 

Jamin Davis helps keep our D elite, otherwise, I think we'd find ourselves falling back more towards Top 10 than Top 3.

[Skinsinparadise]

No shocker about envisioning him as a three down LB.    He has room to grow for sure.  But he's talented against the pass, run, and as a blitzer.  His LB coach was ironically Manusky who was on Sheehan this morning.  Manusky loves him as a guy -- high character.  He thinks he will fit in well with the group they have and hyped among other things he will add to the pass rush. 

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Dark Acre]

3 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

No shocker about envisioning him as a three down LB.    He has room to grow for sure.  But he's talented against the pass, run, and as a blitzer.  His LB coach was ironically Manusky who was on Sheehan this morning.  Manusky loves him as a guy -- high character.  He thinks he will fit in well with the group they have and hyped among other things he will add to the pass rush. 

 

 

 

I dunno about that.  The last Washington player who never left the field was Sammy Baugh, and that was back in the horse-and-buggy days.

[Wyndorf25]

On 4/30/2021 at 9:48 AM, FrFan said:

 

https://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-football/article251029934.html

He will thrill you, don't worry

 

I'm not only fine with the Jamin Davis pick, I'm pretty psyched about it upon further thought. I break it down like this...

 

-LB is maybe the biggest need heading into the draft (according to Rivera and THAT does carry weight). Hitting on a pick at this position would impact this defense and team about as much as any other except QB. Darrisaw may be a fine player also, but Cosmi in the 2nd may be as well.

-Parsons was already gone so it doesn't really matter debating it, but high character may have been the deciding factor between the two anyway if Rivera had his choice.

-JOK is probably too small to be an every-down LBer and moving him to Safety just gives you yet another player like Collins and Curl.

-Zaven Collins is probably too heavy to be trusted to cover consistently at LB.

 

So, Davis is probably the best fit for THIS defense and THIS coach at a position of need. Time will tell if Davis can truly take this defense from great to elite, but I could see it happening if he pans out.

 

Imagine if playing behind this D-line and pass-rushers, Davis becomes DROY? Two consecutive DROY awards! Whoa.

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by Wyndorf25

[Malapropismic Depository]

On 4/30/2021 at 9:48 AM, FrFan said:

 

 

 

Maybe not a reach, but clearly he dropped, from his projected #18 slot.

So the looming question obviously, is what caused his fall in the draft ?

Has to have you concerned.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

There you go. Has to be the culprit, why he dropped in the draft.

He can't be depended on, for 4th Down defensive plays

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Hit me one of the other points Manusky made about Jamin Davis is that he will have an easier time in the pros in some ways than he did in college.   He talked about how college is in some ways is a tougher game for linebackers because of the heavy reliance of RPOs/running QBs that exist in college suggesting that linebackers have to pause initially to diagnose and RPO/RO/designed run, etc.  Also referenced the hashes/field/boundary set up in college makes things more difficult for LBs at times.

 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Hit me one of the other points Manusky made about Jamin Davis is that he will have an easier time in the pros in some ways than he did in college.   He talked about how college is in some ways is a tougher game for linebackers because of the heavy reliance of RPOs/running QBs that exist in college suggesting that linebackers have to pause initially to diagnose and RPO/RO/designed run, etc.  Also referenced the hashes/field/boundary set up in college makes things more difficult for LBs at times.

 

In terms of making them wait a tic, I could see that.  But NFL offenses are good at disguising their point of attack too and they include a fair bit of misdirective noise as well, plus NFL route concepts are more complicated and the route runners are far better.

 

[duffy]

On 5/3/2021 at 9:40 AM, dyst said:

I can’t even remember the names of LBs that have passed through here. Fletcher was like the only good one. Really shows how badly managed this team was.

Oh yeah, "Flecther" was one of the good ones. 

I remember being super pumped in '02 for the Armstead, Arrington, Trotter combo. It didn't turn out too well though lol. 

I think we had Pierce that year, too. 

Edited May 5, 2021 by duffy

[Skinsinparadise]

7 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

In terms of making them wait a tic, I could see that.  But NFL offenses are good at disguising their point of attack too and they include a fair bit of misdirective noise as well, plus NFL route concepts are more complicated and the route runners are far better.

 

 

Manusky's calling card was playing LB and coaching LB in the NFL (definitiely better LB coach than D coordinator) including doing both for the WFT.  He seemed pretty confident about this point as to how he coached him and the Kentucky LBs up for what he would do for the WFT LBs among other teams.  He said the wait is longer.  And the field side/boundary side discrepancy between college and the pros adds another dimension that isn't as tough in the NFL. 

 

He understood the point he made might come off counter intuituive about college and the pros but he's a dude that has the vantage point of coaching the position both ways and knowing how they specifically coached up Jamin versus the way he did Holcomb for example. 

Edited May 4, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Manusky's calling card was playing LB and coaching LB in the NFL (definitiely better LB coach than D coordinator) including doing both for the WFT.  He seemed pretty confident about this point as to how he coached him and the Kentucky LBs up for what he would do for the WFT LBs among other teams. 

I agree with Manusky. But Steve is right, too. NFL offenses have plenty of misdirection but it’s not shown the same way. However, RPOs are a major issue for teams in college due to the vast number of collegiate teams in existence and the varying schedules making it hard to really pin down each team’s philosophies. It’s also a shorter lived dynamic. Players rotate quickly, so it’s harder to really flesh tendencies.

 

The pros are more settled. Yes, there is turnover. But a Del Rio D is a Del Rio D with some new wrinkles. Same goes for offenses. You kinda know the flavor. There’s 32 teams and each team has a vast quantity of information on each of them in a folder. 
 

It’s going to be easier for Jamin in the NFL long term. But the first year or two is going to be a major learning process. That doesn’t mean he can’t ball out while he does it, though.

[Darrell Green Fan]

I remain thrilled at the pick but as bad as our linebackers are I would have liked to see another drafted. One injury and they are right back where they were.  

[Skinsinparadise]

30 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I agree with Manusky. But Steve is right, too. NFL offenses have plenty of misdirection but it’s not shown the same way. However, RPOs are a major issue for teams in college due to the vast number of collegiate teams in existence and the varying schedules making it hard to really pin down each team’s philosophies. It’s also a shorter lived dynamic. Players rotate quickly, so it’s harder to really flesh tendencies.

 

 

I am not arguing Steve's point.   Just doubling down on Manusky's point which suggests overall that the hesitation demands to be tick longer in college or sounds like that's at least how he teaches the spot in college versus the pros.   I haven't obviously coached in college or the pros   so I am not saying its fact or not.  But I am presuming Manusky recalls how differently he coached the spot in the pros and college (maybe he was unique?) considering it hasn't been that long ago when he did both. 

 

Manusky was far from going complete pollyanna on Jamin in his full take.  But yeah he thought the wild offenses that you get in college is a challange at that spot.  He referred to the unique unbalanced formations you see in college -- 4 by 1's, etc.  The wider field side is a pain to deal with.  In the pros even most running QBs aren't running constantly that you got from some QBs in college. 

 

He would know because he wasn't being theoritical about it but delving into his own coaching that position both in the pros and college.   He said RPOs/RO aren't just a component of the game in college but its omnipresent -- the Qbs run a lot more.   So that factors in the way they are coached. 

 

Manusky's overall take on Jamin is that he's a really good kid, very coachable, fast learner.  He really loved the person, went back to that a couple of times.   Sees him as a Mike or Will.  He improved every week last season.  Studies -- knows what's coming.  Can play Man to Man versus TEs or RBs.   Good pressure LB up the middle.   Good sight lines.  Could play in space.   Suggested he doesn't always play to his speed but did at times.  Needs to improve his striking ability and separating -- I presume he means shedding by seperating?  He was very confident he would be a good player in the pros.   He puts the time in to get better.  

 

They delved into Holcomb next and he thought he coud be really good but needs to strike harder when he tackles to wrap his guy down.

Edited May 4, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

Agree completely with all of the above. I have coached LBs at college (D3 and an assistant LB coach) so while it’s not the same level I saw the bind. 
 

Never coached it in the pros though

 

Hey, WFT, I’m available. Call me.
 

Also, strong agree with Holcomb. If he can be more aggressive at the point of attack and playing downhill the dude is a dude.

Edited May 4, 2021 by KDawg

[TheGreek1973]

Don't know how good this guy going to be but no one can deny we have some serious speed now on both sides of the ball.

[Darrell Green Fan]

35 minutes ago, TheGreek1973 said:

Don't know how good this guy going to be but no one can deny we have some serious speed now on both sides of the ball.

 

Yeah that continues to be my take. The team speed on this team the previous few years was a major problem.  Now they have it on both sides of the ball.  But damn Jabril Cox would have been nice.  

[HTTRDynasty]

Helps explain why he had so little experience (1 year) in college.  Had to grow into his body first:

 

But he arrived all of 195 or so pounds and had to bide his time. Kentucky’s linebacking corps was deep, and Davis’s first couple of seasons, following a redshirt year, were as a special-teamer and a backup linebacker.

 

Jon Sumrall, the former Kentucky linebacker hired in 2019 to coach the position for the Wildcats, said Davis was the team’s most improved player in the spring that year, but a nagging hamstring injury during the summer hindered his start to the season. In the final stretch of the year, Davis’s production began to match his potential. He recorded at least six tackles in each of the team’s final four games. He also had an interception and a sack.

 

“That’s really when I was like, ‘All right, it’s about to happen,’ ” said Sumrall, who was recently promoted to Kentucky’s defensive coordinator.

 

Though Davis entered the 2020 season with only one start at linebacker, he had completed a physical transformation, from that 195-pound teenager years earlier to a 234-pound man. He pushed himself to become more vocal on the field — to be that “general,” as he described Ray Lewis — and often arrived an hour early to Sumrall’s meetings to learn the intricacies of the defense or watch video of opponents.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/04/09/jamin-davis-nfl-draft-prospect-linebacker/.

 

 

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

He would know because he wasn't being theoritical about it but delving into his own coaching that position both in the pros and college.   He said RPOs/RO aren't just a component of the game in college but its omnipresent -- the Qbs run a lot more.   So that factors in the way they are coached. 

 

In one sense, I think defense as a whole can be harder to coach and play in CFB than in the NFL.  Just so much less time in the week for the defenses to prepare against a much more varied slate of opposing offenses.  It hurts them much more than it hurts the offenses.  Probably why you see the defensive decline is so pronounced in CFB and the good offenses consistently beat the good defenses, despite the fact that top defensive talent has become so concentrated on blue-blood teams.

 

It seems like NFL teams can pretty much coach their stack LBs to use that triangle vision technique that Jaylon Smith talks about in this video for any opponent:

 

 

It whittles the field down nicely for them so they can play faster.  Sounds like Manusky is saying they can't do that for their CFB LBs because the keys are too diverse and spread out.  But also, the runners are going to be more dangerous in one on one situations in the hole in the NFL because league's RB personnel is the distillation the very best ball carriers from the college level.

[Captain James]

5 hours ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

Yeah that continues to be my take. The team speed on this team the previous few years was a major problem.  Now they have it on both sides of the ball.  But damn Jabril Cox would have been nice.  

Let go of the Cox, man