Starting QB 2019???

[DWinzit]

9 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

There is not a QB worthy of trading up for other than Murray. Besides, Haskins and Jones could slide to 15.

 

I'd love it if Jones slides and the Giants are forced to trade up from 17 to get Jones 

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Arguably, Arizona wants to wait until right before the draft before they declare their intentions.  They'd look like fools if Murray somehow gets hurt or something weird happens related to him and they already got rid of Rosen so are left with nothing.  The conservative approach is to ride it to close to the end.  I wouldn't in their shoes though ride it through the draft because you start losing leverage once you make your move and more importantly other teams make their own moves on QBs in the draft.  In their shoes, I'd probably wait until a day or so before the draft to pull the trigger.

 

I can't see a team doing it another way for just the reason given. Trade Rosen away and Murray gets injured, your screwed.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, bowhunter said:

Good point. That could also explain why the Redskins have been so active in showing their interest in Grier. Pro day, team visit, dinner, seen holding hands at Timmys sleepover, etc. 

 

Yeah if I am the Redskins I am doing my due diligence regardless if they love Rosen because you don't know if you can land him.   Most seem to be indicating that the Redskins are willing to give up the most for Rosen.  If that's true and I am the Redskins at some point I'd start leaking how am falling for a QB in the draft in order to make the Cards perhaps a little antsy.  Regardless I'd leak like heck that the FO loves Daniel Jones to make the Giants take him at 6 (if its true that he's their guy) or make them trade up ahead of the Redskins at 15.  

44 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

There is not a QB worthy of trading up for other than Murray. Besides, Haskins and Jones could slide to 15.

 

I'd love it if Jones slides and the Giants are forced to trade up from 17 to get Jones 

 

 

Me, too

[kingdaddy]

11 hours ago, markmills67 said:

Our 2nd and Keenum for Cardinals 3rd and Rosen

We will hthen have 1 and 3 3's in first 3 rounds. 

Thoughts?. 

 

HTTR 

Yes, I'd do that deal. Cards 3rd rounder is like a late 2nd.

[RWJ]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yeah if I am the Redskins I am doing my due diligence regardless if they love Rosen because you don't know if you can land him.   Most seem to be indicating that the Redskins are willing to give up the most for Rosen.  If that's true and I am the Redskins at some point I'd start leaking how am falling for a QB in the draft in order to make the Cards perhaps a little antsy.  Regardless I'd leak like heck that the FO loves Daniel Jones to make the Giants take him at 6 (if its true that he's their guy) or make them trade up ahead of the Redskins at 15.  

 

Me, too

But it might be a moot point if the Skins trade for Rosen.  There would have to be another team that loves Jones and would want to move to #15 if we trade our 2nd and change for Rosen.  

[LetMeSeeYourWarFace21]

11 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

 

If we draft Haskins with Drew Locke still on the board, I would be ****ing furious................

 

Locke>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Haskins, and it aint remotely close.....

[hogdirty]

9 minutes ago, LetMeSeeYourWarFace21 said:

 

 

No one gaf, but all I know is if we draft Haskins with Drew Locke still on the board, I would be ****ing furious................Locke<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Haskins, and it aint remotely close.....

 

Your post is kind of confusing but i agree Locke<Haskins.  If the Skins like Haskins they shouldn't hesitate to move up and get him.  The only appealing thing I notice about Locke may be his arm.  

[Skinsinparadise]

44 minutes ago, RWJ said:

But it might be a moot point if the Skins trade for Rosen.  There would have to be another team that loves Jones and would want to move to #15 if we trade our 2nd and change for Rosen.  

 

Sure, I am talking though if the Rosen thing drags onto draft day as some think might happen

[skinny21]

17 minutes ago, hogdirty said:

 

Your post is kind of confusing but i agree Locke<Haskins.  If the Skins like Haskins they shouldn't hesitate to move up and get him.  The only appealing thing I notice about Locke may be his arm.  

Don’t think you two are on the same page... 😄

[NickyJ]

28 minutes ago, LetMeSeeYourWarFace21 said:

 

 

No one gaf, but all I know is if we draft Haskins with Drew Locke still on the board, I would be ****ing furious................

 

Locke<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Haskins, and it aint remotely close.....

For future reference, the way the "<" is read is that the pointy end is what has a smaller value, and the open end is the higher value. Sooooooo you kind of said at the end that Locke is way worse than Haskins and it isn't even close.

[LetMeSeeYourWarFace21]

16 minutes ago, NickyJ said:

For future reference, the way the "<" is read is that the pointy end is what has a smaller value, and the open end is the higher value. Sooooooo you kind of said at the end that Locke is way worse than Haskins and it isn't even close.

 

🤬 Dammit, I've been screwing up those greater than/less than signs forever. I usually google it first before using it. Got ahead of my self. But my point still stands, Haskins is wack. Thanks for the heads up.....

 

Locke>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Haskins

[kingdaddy]

Throwing this out there to some of you draft junkies who actually do homework and study film on guys: Does Rosen have Aaron Rodgers ability as far as the accuracy, intelligence and ability to extend plays while throwing from under duress? From what I've read from some, he has that kind or confidence in himself given the tools around him. I know that's a strong comparison but I'm wondering if he has the Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers kind of moxie along with the physical gifts. Supposedly he's a very accurate mid-range passer and a bit of a gunslinger? I see more of an Eli in him from the little I've seen in him?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

 

 

[mistertim]

2 hours ago, LetMeSeeYourWarFace21 said:

 

 

If we draft Haskins with Drew Locke still on the board, I would be ****ing furious................

 

Locke>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Haskins, and it aint remotely close.....

 

I do like Haskins' short and intermediate accuracy/touch and his ability to read defenses, but IMO those abilities pale in comparison to Locke's contributions to epistemology and his influence on the Enlightenment. 

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, LetMeSeeYourWarFace21 said:

 

🤬 Dammit, I've been screwing up those greater than/less than signs forever. I usually google it first before using it. Got ahead of my self. But my point still stands, Haskins is wack. Thanks for the heads up.....

 

Locke>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Haskins

Don’t know if this will help (I have similar hang ups), but...

 

<This side of the character>  is bigger than  >this side of the character<

[Califan007 The Constipated]

1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

I do like Haskins' short and intermediate accuracy/touch and his ability to read defenses, but IMO those abilities pale in comparison to Locke's contributions to epistemology and his influence on the Enlightenment. 

 

I'm wildly impressed by his dedication to the island, myself....

[CjSuAvE22]

Lets be terrible for two years then draft Lawrence problem solved...

[Koala]

Wow since the last time i checked this thread, there's been some pretty wild and inexplicable changes in the outlook of this years draft class. Since nothing has happened in the last few weeks of note, except that we are in the runup to the draft (also known as lying season, historically cuz the only news that comes out is usuallyba smokescreen)...I'm gonna say I think some people need to chill out and go back to March and pre combine reports to get themselves aligned right.

 

Dwayne Haskins, is, and remains the most sought after QB, given that the Cardinals appear to be in full retard mode and are locked on the baseball player.  Everything that you are hearing about Haskins suddenly somehow falling to being somehow close to even-possibly-the-same-realm as Drew Lock, is simply the result of multiple teams (giants, redskins, jaguars, dolphins, and more) attempting to cool the market for Haskins, which has heated up to a prohibitive degree for all of those teams.  

 

I dont know anybody that watches college football, that does not do an immediate spit take when Drew Lock somehow becomes a more attractive prospect than Dwayne Haskins.  The only people saying that are taking their cues from rumors that were started when lying season began.

 

If we can get D. Haskins without giving up an arm and a tit, we will.

 

Otherwise we will settle for j. rosen through trade.

 

Drew Lock is not even in the conversation because he is a distant third choice...behind drafting Haskins, or trading for Rosen. Drew Lock...is not going to be drafted...before Dwayne Haskins.  In any universe.

[The Consigliere]

On 4/7/2019 at 8:50 PM, Veryoldschool said:

 

If he is so talented then why would the Cardinals abandon him?  Don't bother saying Rosen is tremendous but Murray or whoever is super tremendous so they just have to up to upgrade from tremendous to super tremendous because that just doesn't fly.  I've seen way too many busts to believe the Cardinals or any other competent franchise would drop a tremendous guy in the hope of getting a super tremendous guy in the draft.

 

Andy Reid must have made some bucks on the side explaining to the Cardinals how to super arouse Dan Snyder's erogenous zones as only Andy knows how.

Let me help:

 

Redskins new HC's since I started following the team as a six year old in 1981:

 

Gibbs I: Kept Pro Bowl caliber Joe Theismann

Petitbone: Replaced Rypien with Gannon and Conklin

Turner: Replaced Rypien/Gannon/Conklin with Friesz/Shuler/Frerotte

Schotty: Replaced Brad Johnson w/Banks and Kent Graham

Spurrier: Replaced Banks/Graham with Gatorskins and Patrick Ramsey

Gibbs II: Replaced Gatorskins and Ramsey with Boonell and Campbell

Zorn: Hired to be OC, given no power, had to deal w/in house talent.

Shanny: Replaced Campbell with McNabb/Grossman/RGIII

Gruden: Replaced RGIII with Cousins/Alex Smith

 

The only time new HC's stick with the QB in place is when they have a HOF or proven stud vet in place, otherwise they jettison the QB's and bring in their own guys that better fit their system and so they can succeed or fail w/their guys, rather than someone else's. This is true of basically what 90-95% of coaching hires. As Redskins fans we've seen new HC's do this every single time someone new took over other than Pardee/Gibbs forty years ago when they had a pro bowl caliber QB in Theismann, and with Zorn who wasn't even hired to be the HC, and so had no major say in QB decisions. Every other coach either replaced the choices of the previous regime (Norv Turner, Schotty, Spurrier, Gibbs I, Shanny and Gruden) or were named Petitbone/Zorn and had zero power to make major QB decisions with draft capital/FA $$$ and it's not a coincidence that both those guys lasted a combined 3 seasons. 

 

The new Arizona coaching staff is installing a system that's a terrible match for Rosen's skill set, and they want to succeed or fail on their terms, just like pretty much every coaching staff always does. There's nothing new about it, and it doesn't say squat about the talent or lack there of w/regards to Rosen other than that he's currently not a HOF or proven veteran stud (not exactly surprising considering his situation in Arizona last year). 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 4/7/2019 at 10:09 PM, Nerm said:

 

Favre wore out his welcome with the Falcons after one year.  They suckered the Packers into giving up a first for him.

 

Brutal tale there. From what I recall, the Falcons GM/F.O. were well aware of what they had in Favre, but idiot Glanville had no clue and no patience to develop him and forced them to trade him. 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Agree with this thought below.  I get any skepticism about an aggressive move for a QB.   Is Dan an absolute dummy when it comes to the QB position?  I got no doubt that his instincts are atrocious to the degree where he should do what George did on Seinfeld and just go with the opposite.   Forget all the dumb moves that were done under his tenure at QB -- think about the ones that he didn't accomplish but wanted to:  Brady Quinn, Mark Sanchez, and beating the Bears to Jay Cutler.  Though Cutler wasn't awful.

 

I mention Dan because the QB position is where he seems to like to put his stamp.  Hopefully, that's not the case now.  And if Jay or Kyle or O'Connell are running the ship then I wouldn't let Dan's past idiotic moves deter them from making another trade.

 

The team that has been equally atrocious over the years at the QB position -- the Browns seemed gun shy after those mishaps and passed over Wentz, Mahomes, Watson, etc.  Then took another stab at it and got it right.  Eventually IMO this team can get it right too IMO.  Heck even Dan eventually can luck into some dumb luck if he takes enough stabs at this. 

 

https://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/whether-its-alex-smith-or-rg3-redskins-cant-let-bad-qb-luck-impact-possible-rosen-pursuit

Aggression wins in the NFL. 

For decades, that rule primarily held to the football field, but lately, that rule applies to the front office, too. 

Look at the NFL’s best franchises and how they attack success. 

The Patriots make trades and in-season moves that others find questionable. The Rams seemingly push all in each offseason. The Bears made a huge trade for Khalil Mack last year, and it paid big dividends. Howie Roseman runs the Eagles with a healthy balance of daring and cunning. 

Simply put, the NFL has become a league where the path to the playoffs no longer comes strictly from conservative roster building. 

For the Redskins, that means the team can’t be hesitant in making a major quarterback move this offseason just because previous quarterback decisions backfired. 

Trading for Josh Rosen, whether it happens or not, should be judged solely on the merits of his talent versus the cost to acquire him. Not recent history. 

The trade for Alex Smith cannot be a factor in the decision-making to go after Josh Rosen. 

The trade for Robert Griffin III cannot be a factor in the decision-making to go after Josh Rosen. 

The trade for Donovan McNabb cannot be a factor in the decision-making to go after Josh Rosen.  

Why? 

Rosen is a different player, the roster situation is completely different and the trade compensation will look different, too. 

It would be overly simplistic to ignore any lessons from the previous trades, though. 

The team gave up too much for Griffin, even if it did look like a great move in the fall of 2012. 

The team did not have to give Alex Smith a lucrative contract extension last year, even if he looked like a long-term answer at QB for the Redskins in the fall of 2018. 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

11 hours ago, kingdaddy said:

Throwing this out there to some of you draft junkies who actually do homework and study film on guys: Does Rosen have Aaron Rodgers ability as far as the accuracy, intelligence and ability to extend plays while throwing from under duress? From what I've read from some, he has that kind or confidence in himself given the tools around him. I know that's a strong comparison but I'm wondering if he has the Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers kind of moxie along with the physical gifts. Supposedly he's a very accurate mid-range passer and a bit of a gunslinger? I see more of an Eli in him from the little I've seen in him?

 

I've watched a lot of Rosen.  Naturally, I am no film expert though.  So here's my layman's take:

 

I think Rosen's accuracy is streaky.  I think his accuracy is good but not great.  His fluid and consistent arm motion gives the vibe that he would be deadly accurate but IMO it isn't so.   Just look at his completion perception in college -- its decent but not great. It's barely over 60%.   IMO much like Kirk his sweet spot as for accuracy is the middle of the field in between the numbers.  His touch on short throws is inconsistent.  His deep ball is also inconsistent IMO. 

 

I like Rosen more than most as to his ability to move in the pocket.   Josh isn't fast but IMO he's tough in the pocket and is willing to take a hit and can dodge pressure (even though he takes his share of hits) with nifty footwork.   As for extending plays, I don't think he's that hot when it comes to throwing on the move.  But he can buy time by hanging in the pocket.  He has plenty of moxie and is more than just being a bit of a gun slinger.  He IMO is a mega gunslinger for better or worse. 

 

I admire his toughness in the pocket but hate how careless he is with the football.  You can't average about a fumble every game.  That has to change IMO. 

 

 

On another Rosen note, I listened to Keim this morning.  More or less he said there is a limit to what the Redskins are willing to pay for him.   Between that. and these tweets below from him, the impression I get is the only way they give up a first for Rosen is someone in that FO (Bruce or Dan?) overriding others on it.  The idea that some in their FO have concerns about him -- IMO that's good.  I like Rosen but I have concerns too.  I don't think the dude is slam dunk.

 

 

 

 

 

[Andre The Giant]

23 hours ago, BayouBrave86 said:

Rosen will be a Skin soon. It’s pretty much a done deal. 

 

Any idea on the timing?

[Idaho fan]

Sounds like the Cards aren't talking to anyone... Gotta think they will make a deal at some point if they are taking Murray.  Rosen's stock will only go down if he is a backup next year.  I think it will come down to draft day - Cards are waiting to see if a team is willing to give them the kings ransom to move up to the #1 spot.

 

As for Rosen - seems like a good dude.  He has been criticized in the past by some as not being a really hard worker... but sounds like that wasn't accurate last season and so far this year even with speculation of the trade he is first in the building.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001025604/article/josh-rosen-reports-for-start-of-cardinals-workouts

[bakedtater1]

39 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

 

Any idea on the timing?

I'm thinking.on 4/20 so a majority of the fan base here will be more chill about it 

[bakedtater1]

I see the skins getting rosen for nothing more than a second this year and maybe a third next year.. maybe our 15 and we get there 2nd(and dj back..lol)... If they can't get rosen for that they'll drat Haskins at 15..orrrr lock, Jones or Grier.... Drafting a quarterback in the first round is always such a touchy situation... So I hope they get Rosen and keep that 15 pic.. a lot are saying that there's only one maybe two receivers worth that 15 pic..the skins get Rosen and the very best wr in the draft at 15 makes me happy.

[kingdaddy]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I've watched a lot of Rosen.  Naturally, I am no film expert though.  So here's my layman's take:

 

I think Rosen's accuracy is streaky.  I think his accuracy is good but not great.  His fluid and consistent arm motion gives the vibe that he would be deadly accurate but IMO it isn't so.   Just look at his completion perception in college -- its decent but not great. It's barely over 60%.   IMO much like Kirk his sweet spot as for accuracy is the middle of the field in between the numbers.  His touch on short throws is inconsistent.  His deep ball is also inconsistent IMO. 

 

I like Rosen more than most as to his ability to move in the pocket.   Josh isn't fast but IMO he's tough in the pocket and is willing to take a hit and can dodge pressure (even though he takes his share of hits) with nifty footwork.   As for extending plays, I don't think he's that hot when it comes to throwing on the move.  But he can buy time by hanging in the pocket.  He has plenty of moxie and is more than just being a bit of a gun slinger.  He IMO is a mega gunslinger for better or worse. 

 

I admire his toughness in the pocket but hate how careless he is with the football.  You can't average about a fumble every game.  That has to change IMO. 

 

 

On another Rosen note, I listened to Keim this morning.  More or less he said there is a limit to what the Redskins are willing to pay for him.   Between that. and these tweets below from him, the impression I get is the only way they give up a first for Rosen is someone in that FO (Bruce or Dan?) overriding others on it.  The idea that some in their FO have concerns about him -- IMO that's good.  I like Rosen but I have concerns too.  I don't think the dude is slam dunk.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. Mega-gunslinger...hmmm. Gruden must be salivating over that.