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Welcome to the Washington Redskins Derrius Guice RB LSU


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8 hours ago, KillBill26 said:

I feel a knee jerk reaction to the guice injury is the worst thing the skins could do.  If they can get a solid back like Coleman for decent value, then go for it.  But I hope they don't overpay just to fill the gap that guice has left for 2018. Our run game took a big hit today no doubt.  We aren't a rb away from a title, so while my first preference would be to stay with what we currently have and see what Perine / Bibbs / Marshall have in them, I would prefer they choose to sign a darkwa or Murray without giving up assets over overpaying for a rb out of panic.     

 

Yeah I read that.  I've listened to everything I can about Alex and tried to get a balanced view of him.  The most negative guy on him is this guy Spector, so I try to take him with a grain of salt, the most positive guy about him is that dude who wrote the article (this is his 2nd puff piece about Alex and heard him on the radio do the same drill) so I try to take him with a grain of salt, too.  Now when you actually dive into the numbers it paints just about the opposite picture aside from the idea that Alex ran a lot that year. 

 

I looked up the stats after reason that and maybe I am missing something, here it is

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/kan/2015.htm#all_rushing_and_receiving

http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/rushing/sort/rushingYards/year/2015

 

Chiefs defense was 3rd in the league that year in points, 7th in yards

 

As for Alex being a downfield passer and carrying the load he threw for less than 3500 yards.  They were 30th in the league in passing yards, 30th in passing yards per game going just over 200 yards per game in the air -- so it wasn't Alex just chucking it around the field -- quite the opposite.

 

Their lack of a running game translated to them being #1 in the league in TDs from Rbs and 3rd in the league in YPA.  6th in league for total yards.  If that's a weak running game, wow.

 

They had two RBs who had over 5 yards a carry.  Ware played 11 games averaged 5.7 per carry.  As a team they averaged 4.7 a carry.  So if that's the dude's version of our rock bottom of a running game from last year, then I'd agree with him we will be fine.  If Perine and Kelley average 4.7 YPA and that number is amped by Alex's carries and they all lead the league in touchdowns combined on the ground -- then sign me up for his version of pain. 

 

Alex that season just like almost every other for him was an efficient QB.   And I am intrigued with his legs.   But Alex carry the team on his back -- throwing the ball all over the place without a running game to support him -- that would be intriguing and different.  And of course am rooting for it to happen -- tough for me to just count on it happening.   But what a feat that would be for Jay because he would be the first to really make that happen.  And I do have faith in Jay. 

 

But yeah if we have their version of 2015 -- a defense that is 3rd in the league in points and our version of a weak running game is being top 5 in a number of categories -- sign me up, I'd agree we'd be going to the playoffs even if Alex throws for just 3400 or so yards like he did that season.

 

 

 

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I think what makes this so sad is that if you ever met him before he is one of the most down-to-earth people you'll ever meet. He is just humble and he has no attitude issues at all. Again, I remember seeing him at the Draft Day party earlier this year. I was standing on the side of the VIP tent they set up on the field. Eventually a crowd gathers and Guice comes towards them and starts signing autographs. Security broke it up after a few minutes, but to see that man just sympathize with the fans and sign for as many as he could, that really struck a positive note with me. 

 

A few days ago I was watching WUSA 9 and they had Darren Haynes on from training camp, and he was talking to Guice. He flat out said, "This guy spent 45 minutes after practice signing for fans." And when he was asked about it, Guice said that the fans were very important to the game. 

 

Listen, it is extremely hard to see a player or athlete like Guice be this...this...open towards the fans and this embracing. He honestly cares about them a lot, he invited them all to watch The Avengers movie earlier this year. He just has a great heart, and love for the fans and love for the game of football. He is just a good person in general and it really sucks to see this happen to someone of his caliber. 

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23 minutes ago, Rex Tomb said:

What do you think a decent offer would be? I'm thinking a 4th rounder - maybe a 3rd rounder if the Falcons won't budge.

I actually think they really like him but with Freeman signing his big deal last year and Coleman being in his contract year I think they might be motivated.

 

I was thinking 4th as well, I know this sounds crazy but realistically we aren't paying J Norman $14.5M next year so I think this is his last year here and if that's the case maybe a swap would be better than losing a pick, maybe we get a little something with it.

 

Its risky but I would rather put it on our D line than go through another season with Kelley and Perrine.

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Caps are always a good fall back if the season goes off the rails.

 

I think we will roll RB by committee.  CT seems not quite 100% meaning Marshall may be a lock to start the season. Bibbs does intrigue me but think he is destined for PS/Indy, unless Perine fumbles away his chance.

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Ok, this completely sucks. But let's get a few things out of the way.

 

1. No!  this previous injury had nothing to do with him falling in the draft. He had fully healed by the end of the season. Please look at the Bowl game against Notre Dame. He had been fully cleared and showed no signs of any issues. Media is just reaching trying to justify their believing the off the field issues and making him drop in the draft. First article I see is something about Redskins rookie RB with questionable history is injured. I can't find it again unfortunately but when I do I will post here. Also, let's look at who reported it. Ian ****ing rappaport. Has he ever been right with the Redskins? Also, he was one leading the charge about Guice being a problem. It's a load of crap. 

 

2. No!! The Redskins should not over-react and trade for or sign some aging RB FA! There are enough horses in the house. Yes, they are not great work horse backs. But in then end the offense is at least decent without it. Will be time to see what Alex can actually do. 

 

3. Some said this is good news for Perrine. Maybe. But I think it's better news for Bibbs or Marshall. Both of who I believe are at least as good if not better than any RB we have not named Guice or Thompson.

 

4. No, the season is not a complete loss. Let's remember that more than Guice, the DLine has been infused with major talent. One of the true bright spots in the preseason game was Settle. I do not want to see Iaonnidis miss games but I have to believe there is enough depth now that his loss can be overcome. Yes, I realize he and Settle play different positions, but it gives them flexibility. You do not have to put Payne at NT. I have dreamed of a front 3 when we do line up in 3-4 (not starting the conversation here), of Allen, Settle and Payne. I know people do not like Hood., But I believe he can play DE at a high level in a back-up role. We will likely see if Iao misses significant time. 

 

5. Last but not least - anyone who really had a true problem with Guice and his lollipop - please get a life!!  Marshawn Lynch used to have his coaches hand feed him Skittles along with keeping his own stash on the sidelines!  If Guice having a lollipop in his mouth is unprofessional, I promise you do not want to know some of the other habits many other players have. Just need to get over yourself. 

 

Ok, rant over. If you made it this far, I am not sure if I appreciate it or feel bad for you. :cheers:

 

 

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9 hours ago, Bacon said:

Guice was the thing I was looking forward to most of all about this season. Certainly not Alex Smith, who has never won a damn thing with far more talented and better-coached teams than any we've had in decades. 


On some days, I deeply regret my Skins fandom. It doesn't seem like there's any light at the end of the nearly 30-year tunnel that Snyder built. 

 

You know how the best Magic is most amazing when revealed, because you didn't see it coming.

 

Now go back to last year when the Eagles lost their starting QB....many Eagle fans who had been through a drought of epic proportion were ready to just give up. Over many years, the team was competitive at times, but just couldn't get over the hump, so close, too bad, no trophy jokes continued. 

 

The day the Redskins signed Doug Williams I bragged they were going to the Super Bowl, my Philly friend laughed at me, all my friends who were fans pretty much were like, Dude what in the Hell are you talking about....I bet my Philly friend a hundred bucks on it,,,well the rest is history. 

 

When I discussed with my buddy how good his team was and that they could overcome the Wentz injury, He said well in the NFL anything can happen and people are not aware of Foles and that he just Wins. I didn't go for the hundred bet, because I am a believer in Winners, I have coached winners, players nobody else wanted. I saw the gleam in their eyes, the competitive juices. They don't give up, they don't give in, they fight until they win, or they lose and keep fighting. 

Foles was a winner, I could see the possibility. 

 

Alex is a winner. His numbers aren't great, they are good, solid...yet He wins. To say that Andy Reids teams are better coached is beyond debatable. He took better teams in Philly to the NFCC games and left with no SB rings. My Philly friend and I had discussed that it was his coaching that cost the team. 

 

I was really down on Jay for a few things the last three years, until last year...He took a team to 7-9 that should have finished like the folded NY Giants did, with similar injuries but yet a SB winning QB...and clearly what a most would call a better roster. Jays a winner. 

 

The Redskins have built the DL, years in the making, they alone could flip the script for a Defense that gives the O opportunities.  

 

If one player was all your, our, anybodies hope, think back to the fleeting magic of 2012. This team if healthy, and WE as fans should not just write off CT, Reed and Payne, that projection to me is disgusting, removes hope in all it's glory. 

 

Root for the Redskins, I mean if you are a Fan, that's what WE should do. #rideordie as Guice said. 

 

Sometimes teams are built in the strangest ways, through adversity. 

 

 

Don't sleep on this team, Guices teammates aren't sleeping on each other. 

22 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

Now we’re gonna be 7-9 or 8-8 instead of 10-6 in be in massive limbo with an aging QB and a HC who hasn’t done much in 5 years.

 

Can you tell me which way the market is going to move between now and Christmas, I am looking to retire based on your visions. 

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2 minutes ago, SWFLSkins said:

 

You know how the best Magic is most amazing when revealed, because you didn't see it coming.

 

Now go back to last year when the Eagles lost their starting QB....many Eagle fans who had been through a drought of epic proportion were ready to just give up. Over many years, the team was competitive at times, but just couldn't get over the hump, so close, too bad, no trophy jokes continued. 

 

The day the Redskins signed Doug Williams I bragged they were going to the Super Bowl, my Philly friend laughed at me, all my friends who were fans pretty much were like, Dude what in the Hell are you talking about....I bet my Philly friend a hundred bucks on it,,,well the rest is history. 

 

When I discussed with my buddy how good his team was and that they could overcome the Wentz injury, He said well in the NFL anything can happen and people are not aware of Foles and that he just Wins. I didn't go for the hundred bet, because I am a believer in Winners, I have coached winners, players nobody else wanted. I saw the gleam in their eyes, the competitive juices. They don't give up, they don't give in, they fight until they win, or they lose and keep fighting. 

Foles was a winner, I could see the possibility. 

 

Alex is a winner. His numbers aren't great, they are good, solid...yet He wins. To say that Andy Reids teams are better coached is beyond debatable. He took better teams in Philly to the NFCC games and left with no SB rings. My Philly friend and I had discussed that it was his coaching that cost the team. 

 

I was really down on Jay for a few things the last three years, until last year...He took a team to 7-9 that should have finished like the folded NY Giants did, with similar injuries but yet a SB winning QB...and clearly what a most would call a better roster. Jays a winner. 

 

The Redskins have built the DL, years in the making, they alone could flip the script for a Defense that gives the O opportunities.  

 

If one player was all your, our, anybodies hope, think back to the fleeting magic of 2012. This team if healthy, and WE as fans should not just write off CT, Reed and Payne, that projection to me is disgusting, removes hope in all it's glory. 

 

Root for the Redskins, I mean if you are a Fan, that's what WE should do. #rideordie as Guice said. 

 

Sometimes teams are built in the strangest ways, through adversity. 

 

 

Don't sleep on this team, Guices teammates aren't sleeping on each other. 

 

Can you tell me which way the market is going to move between now and Christmas, I am looking to retire based on your visions. 

Denial isn’t just a river in Egypt

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2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Most of the national media already saw them as hands down the worst team in the division with Guice.  

 

What strength does this team have right now where you can say with confidence they have over any team in the division?

I feel national media predictions are useless, as they are just last year's standings regurgitated.  They might overreact to a shiny new toy like Barkley, but very rarely do they accurately predict a team making the playoffs that didn't the prior year.  And that happens a lot in today's nfl.

 

As far as an advantage against division opponents, I feel our front 7 is definitely better than the Giants and cowboys.  Hard to say it will be better than the eagles, they are pretty solid.  But I think our front 7 has the potential to be top 5 in the league, which is a huge asset against the run offenses we will be facing. 

 

Another advantage I think we have isn't in regards to a particular unit, but in looking at every teams weakest unit.  Our weakest unit is stronger than most others weakest unit.  Our o line is solid, wr have depth, tes have weapons, but unfortunately our rbs are now weak.  But I would rather have an elite o line and weak rbs, than a weak o line and stud rb.  Case in point, I think Minny is going to have a very hard time running the ball this year bc their o line is in shambles.  But cook is a stud, but he can only do so much.

 

On the defensive side, I love our front 7 and I think our cbs will be at least average as a unit.  If Nicholson stays healthy, I think our safeties will also be average at worst.

 

So compare to other teams units:. Giants QB is awful.  Cowboys wr, d line, and secondary units are weak.  I wouldn't say the eagles lb unit is as weak as our rbs, but they are the SB champs.  They are the team to beat, but will also have all the pressure and a target on their back to repeat.  The Packers, falcons, Steelers, etc all have a weak unit or two on their team.  They just have their strong units step up to compensate.  The skins need to do the same, and a strong front 7, along with balance across the rest of the roster, can compensate for our weak rb unit.

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I commend those of you who are still optimistic about this season.  I’m sure many consider it an overreaction, but I find myself on the verge of rooting to end up with a top 5 pick so we can let Preston walk next offseason and draft Ed Oliver or Nick Bosa (who are absolute MONSTERS). Then draft a LG in round 2. We have no major contributors leaving next offseason other than P. Smith, and maybe Crowder (who we could easily re-sign if we let Smith walk), so this team could legitimately be ready to compete for a chip next year if we get impact players in the draft. 

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9 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

I commend those of you who are still optimistic about this season.  I’m sure many consider it an overreaction, but I find myself on the verge of rooting to end up with a top 5 pick so we can let Preston walk next offseason and draft Ed Oliver or Nick Bosa (who are absolute MONSTERS). Then draft a LG in round 2. We have no major contributors leaving next offseason other than P. Smith, and maybe Crowder (who we could easily re-sign if we let Smith walk), so this team could legitimately be ready to compete for a chip next year if we get impact players in the draft. 

I agree with you that there will be some studs at the top of next years draft.  Real difference makers.  I would love to add one of those guys and get a solid lg at the top of round 2.  The reason I don't want a disastrous season is the fallout.  If we are picking in the top 5, then Alex smith will have storm clouds over his head and he will constantly hear about the trade being a failure.  The skins will not be establishing a culture of winning like I'd like them too, and it's not that I'm satisfied with .500 seasons, but I think they are much better for the teams psyche than 4-12.  You feel you are a step or two away at .500, at 4-12 you feel the need to rebuild.  Which leads to jay gruden probably getting canned, and all the optimism I've had about building a team the right way, with an offensive scheme that has proven to work, all goes out the window as we will start from scratch again.  Then do we hire a new coach with a new scheme and now don't have the personnel to fit? Or do we hire a lesser coaching candidate for scheme continuity?  Neither situation is ideal.

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1 minute ago, KillBill26 said:

I agree with you that there will be some studs at the top of next years draft.  Real difference makers.  I would love to add one of those guys and get a solid lg at the top of round 2.  The reason I don't want a disastrous season is the fallout.  If we are picking in the top 5, then Alex smith will have storm clouds over his head and he will constantly hear about the trade being a failure.  The skins will not be establishing a culture of winning like I'd like them too, and it's not that I'm satisfied with .500 seasons, but I think they are much better for the teams psyche than 4-12.  You feel you are a step or two away at a500, at 4-12 you feel the need to rebuild.  Which leads to jay gruden probably getting canned, and all the optimism I've had about building a team the right way, with an offensive scheme that has proven to work, all goes out the window as we will start from scratch again.  Then do we hire a new coach with a new scheme and now don't have the personnel to fit. Or do we hire a lesser coaching candidate for scheme continuity.  Neither situation is ideal.

 

Yeah, I know man. I think Alex would be fine - he’s been through worse - but my one reservation is if they let Gruden go because of it. That would be counterproductive. I think the only way it could happen without us having the fallout you described above is if several other key players (Reed, Smith, etc) get long-term injuries and our season gets derailed. But I would never wish injury on anyone, so I’m not about to root for that. 

 

I’m just naturally a realist before I’m an optimist, and I was already stretching my realism by thinking we had a legitimate chance to compete with the big boys this year with a healthy Guice. Now?  Realistically, that chance has decreased significantly. I think the ability to add a top 5 pick in the first two rounds of next year’s draft (and getting Guice back) would catapult us into true contenders. I’d have to hope Snyder could see that and let Gruden stay for one more year. If he needs a fall guy for a disastrous 2018, let it be Bruce. 

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6 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 I think the ability to add a top 5 pick in the first two rounds of next year’s draft (and getting Guice back) would catapult us into true contenders. I’d have to hope Snyder could see that and let Gruden stay for one more year. If he needs a fall guy for a disastrous 2018, let it be Bruce. 

 

You make great points.  I think the benefit of adding those difference makers is probably greater than the losing culture a 4-12 season would bring.  It's only one season, and we have seen a lot of teams go from bottom of the barrel to playoff team almost overnight.  And sometimes you do need a top 5 pick to catapult you into that next tier.  And I always thought our prime window began in 2019 at the earliest, and 2018 wouldn't have a deep run anyway, so I could get on board with that IF gruden still stays.  As you said, I would hope Snyder could see that. But it is Snyder we are talking about.  Who knows.  

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1 hour ago, SWFLSkins said:

 

Quoting large blocks of text isn't just a helpful consideration, it's in the TOS. 

You changed ur pic thing...I loved the previous..this one as well but the other more..just my two cents from the new south west north west...100+ degree temps the last few days here..alot different than south east heat.... sorry, as I'm sure you could tell by now this response has nothing to do with your quote lol

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I don't mean to get all religious and all... But guice hit it right on the nose.. whatever that tweet was he put out lol God obviously meant for it not to be his time.. I'm just as upset and pissed off as the next guy but meh gotta move on..and as many who don't wanna hear it but next man up is true as it gets unfortunately....

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2 hours ago, KillBill26 said:

 I think our front 7 has the potential to be top 5 in the league, which is a huge asset against the run offenses we will be facing. 

 

 

If it goes down that way it would be one heck of a turnaround.  I think top 5 is a bit wild.  But appreciate the optimism and understand it to an extent.  Yeah count me in if we have a top 5 front 7 which I think would almost for sure lead to a top 10 defense, we will be in the playoffs.  But I don't see it.  But I do think we are building a bad unit into something good -- I just don't see it as a special top 5 unit, at least not yet.  Maybe top 15 and on the rise?  That would be a major improvement.  But its possible -- you never know.

 

2 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said:

I commend those of you who are still optimistic about this season.  I’m sure many consider it an overreaction, but I find myself on the verge of rooting to end up with a top 5 pick so we can let Preston walk next offseason and draft Ed Oliver or Nick Bosa (who are absolute MONSTERS). Then draft a LG in round 2. We have no major contributors leaving next offseason other than P. Smith, and maybe Crowder (who we could easily re-sign if we let Smith walk), so this team could legitimately be ready to compete for a chip next year if we get impact players in the draft. 

 

I am in the same place. 

 

Bringing this to  the Smith trade.   My beef with the Alex smith trade was simple.  At 34 years old, I think there is at least a 50-50 chance that we got a 2-3 year window with Alex and I don't think the roster is set up for the kill with a veteran QB.  I also think the strength of the roster is its depth (sadly for me sans RB) and weakness is lack of elite players.  This coming draft having a top pick could really speed things along.  Love the top end of this draft.  Bosa and Olliver though I think are likely going 1 and 2.  So while I can totally see a bad season now -- hard for me to image it being that bad where we are picking 1 or 2. But picking 5-8 to me doesn't seem far fetched and in this draft you can get a gem.

 

1 hour ago, HTTRDynasty said:

I’d have to hope Snyder could see that and let Gruden stay for one more year. If he needs a fall guy for a disastrous 2018, let it be Bruce. 

 

That's my position, too.

 

2 hours ago, KillBill26 said:

 The reason I don't want a disastrous season is the fallout.  If we are picking in the top 5, then Alex smith will have storm clouds over his head and he will constantly hear about the trade being a failure.  The skins will not be establishing a culture of winning like I'd like them too, and it's not that I'm satisfied with .500 seasons, but I think they are much better for the teams psyche than 4-12.  You feel you are a step or two away at .500, at 4-12 you feel the need to rebuild.  Which leads to jay gruden probably getting canned, and all the optimism I've had about building a team the right way, with an offensive scheme that has proven to work, all goes out the window as we will start from scratch again.  Then do we hire a new coach with a new scheme and now don't have the personnel to fit? Or do we hire a lesser coaching candidate for scheme continuity?  Neither situation is ideal.

 

The fallout concerns me too.  On one hand I want Jay to stay.  On the other hand, as much as I like their college scouting and draft approach -- I don't care for their pro personnel operation headed by Bruce.  So though I like Jay a lot would I trade Jay out if that also took out Bruce -- to get rid of Bruce?  I'd probably opt to keep Jay even if Bruce stays.  I like Jay more than I dislike Bruce.   

 

I agree with Brewer's column from while back which is they are overcompensating from the Vinny era by being too conservative in FA.  Lets take the current predicament.  They could have taken a RB in FA, Crowell, McKinnon, D. Lewis.  But nope.  Heck the Titans have a young stud RB but signed Lewis anyway.  I think the team takes a leap forward both in competence and class if Bruce is reassigned.   But agree a step back if they let go of Jay.    

 

And like HTTRDynasty said, I also appreciate the optimism.  And I get those that are frustrated with the pessimism. So sorry for the venting.  I am a pessimist as for what I think about Bruce-Dan and management.  But I am relatively optimistic about the team including not being the sky is falling type after injuries.  I actually predicated good seasons for the last 2 years.  Before this injury I said multiple times, the team goes 11-5 if Thompson or Reed stay healthy but could be as low as 7-9 if not.  But without Guice, i've at the moment become a rare pessimist about the season -- unless they make a trade for a RB.  I'd see the ceiling at 9-7, the floor at 5-11.  If I had to pick a record right now, I'd say 6-10.   Last year I said 10-6.  I might feel better in a few days. :mellow: And change that feeling.

 

I get the logic of hey they went 7-9 with all the injuries and the hard schedule so everything has to be better than that right?  My take is nope.  I think Alex especially without Guice is a slight downgrade from Kirk.   The one team that shared the pain with us as for having a terrible running game now has a Ferrari parked in their parking lot where we are back to the beat up old truck we had last year.  Elliot is back for Dallas.  I just don't see how we are competitive within the division and when you add the tough schedule and our propensity for injuries -- I do think we got the makings of a season that just comes crashing down.  But heck maybe my switch from optimism about the team to pessimism is a good sign -- as SWFLskins said sometimes the turning point happens when things look bleakest -- i agree with that -- sometimes though it also doesn't -- will see. 

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7 minutes ago, bakedtater1 said:

You changed ur pic thing...I loved the previous..this one as well but the other more..just my two cents from the new south west north west...100+ degree temps the last few days here..alot different than south east heat.... sorry, as I'm sure you could tell by now this response has nothing to do with your quote lol

 

Neither did his post, lol,,,,the change in Avi's is purely based on me still sipping the kool-aid of the 2018 Redskins. 

 

 

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Just get well Guice and hopefully in 2019, you can start over again.

 

Losing Guice for the season while devasting, is still no excuse for a poor run game in 2019.  The other players have to step it up. If we need to sign or trade for someone; then we do it.

 

Injuries are part of the game, you have to be prepared to have good replacements; in case of injuries.  So, if the Redskins let's Guice's injury ruin the run game in 2018; those people need to be shown out the door.

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You guys need to calm the F down!!! Worse case scenario we win 4 games and end up with a top 10 pick. It sucks losing Guice for the year but the silver lining might be landing another stud next season. I don't know if anyone is noticing but we are starting to stockpile 1st round talent all over the place. Then again another losing season would really blow

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58 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

Just get well Guice and hopefully in 2019, you can start over again.

 

Losing Guice for the season while devasting, is still no excuse for a poor run game in 2019.  The other players have to step it up. If we need to sign or trade for someone; then we do it.

 

Injuries are part of the game, you have to be prepared to have good replacements; in case of injuries.  So, if the Redskins let's Guice's injury ruin the run game in 2018; those people need to be shown out the door.

 

 

You've seen what our running games has been in the past, right? And you're right, they are not that good, the past has shown that. So, we need to get other guys. And we did, but now he's gone, and we're stuck with the dudes that averaged 3.6 yards a carry, and were completely ineffective in short yardage situations. How bad is it? I'll tell you how bad. Our leading TD rusher, with a whopping 4, was let go and is now playing QB for the Vikes. Let that sink in for a NY minute.

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