Burgold Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, skinsmania123 said: Well what is your thoughts on the draft and RB's? Do you think we should be drafting a RB in the second round? Our RB's have been pretty big guys to pair with CT and have unfortunately demonstrated a propensity to fumble and not get tough yards, not to mention falling down often, but not always, after first contact. This seems to be a common thing for Skin's RB's in general over the years. Could good coaching fix this or is it where we are drafting them and an ability to really assess their talent level? I mean I really liked SM but his over the top endorsement of Matt Jones, as one example of the battering ram type was unwarranted IMO. He is still massively supportive of Jones who has not really shown much since he was drafted in 2015. I'm actually for a running back in the first or second round. I figure coaching can improve a player anywhere from 10 - 30% or adversely harm them 10 - 15% That said, the physical tools provide a floor and the floor of our receivers are pretty low right now. Perrine should hopefully round into a good power back, but he seems to lack both shiftiness and speed. He can get stronger. They can groom him to find his holes a bit better or at least know the play better, but they can't increase his speed by much. They can't change his acceleration by much. Kelley, unfortunately, lacks speed, shiftiness, and power. He just does everything okay. I figure the team doesn't believe in Bibbs because of how vocal they have been about the need to fix the running game. So, I want someone who has the potential for greatness. I feel right now that our backs max out at pretty good. (But we really should have this convo in the draft thread) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsTillIDie Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Hankins / Poston are probably holding out for a contract similar to the one Timmy Jernigan got in November, 4 years, $48 million with $26 million guaranteed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: The 10 million a year is speculation. That would be more than he got last year. You never know we will see. I don't think its relevant what the run D was ranked when Allen was healthy. It's the main point that many of us are making. Your D line isn't all going to be healthy all year, and you rotate heavily at that position. If you can lose one D lineman and your run defense falls off a cliff than IMO you don't have a good D line or at best you have a very thin one. IMO the D line isn't the position to be thin. i do think the stats are relevant but to me it's because it shows the need for depth. And when you have a chance to add someone that can clearly fill a major need - need to stretch the wallet some. Not a huge Colin Cowherd fan - actually I think the guy is pretty much and idiot - but I do agree with one of his analogy's. When you live in AZ, you pay more for AC. When you live in Canada, you pay more for heat. You pay for what yo need. It's the difference between nice to have and have to have. Bruce and the FO have been treating talent in the middle of Dline as a nice to have when in fact it's a have to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedlamVR Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Yeah but when Allen it wasn’t that we lost one player .. at the same / similar time lion hurt his hand we lost Foster and Nickerson ( the entire middle of the defense was shredded ) ... now if signing Hankins solves everything, then awesome ( and I am keen to bring him in ) but are you not just making the same one guy makes a difference argument ? Bringing Hankins in makes a ton of sense ... and while people say free agency and the draft have no influence on each other they do ... if they cannot bring someone like Hankins in in free agency then we kind of have to address the issue in the draft ... and I just get the feeling they want to draft RB in one of the first two rounds .. and my feeling is 13 is too early ( maybe only a handful of picks) for either of the DT Vea or Payne ...but if you go addressing needs in the draft then you begin to over reach ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfan212689 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Wrong thread sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, bedlamVR said: Yeah but when Allen it wasn’t that we lost one player .. at the same / similar time lion hurt his hand we lost Foster and Nickerson ( the entire middle of the defense was shredded ) ... now if signing Hankins solves everything, then awesome ( and I am keen to bring him in ) but are you not just making the same one guy makes a difference argument ? Bringing Hankins in makes a ton of sense ... and while people say free agency and the draft have no influence on each other they do ... if they cannot bring someone like Hankins in in free agency then we kind of have to address the issue in the draft ... and I just get the feeling they want to draft RB in one of the first two rounds .. and my feeling is 13 is too early ( maybe only a handful of picks) for either of the DT Vea or Payne ...but if you go addressing needs in the draft then you begin to over reach ... Who saying Hankins will solve everything? Not a single person I have seen. Everyone to a person who wants him is because he is a key piece to the puzzle that fills one particular glaring need. And that piece is worth paying for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoggingGod Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Hankins is likely seeing his options before signing. If the Redskins couldn’t immediately sign him then why should they get ridiculed for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 21 minutes ago, SkinsTillIDie said: Hankins / Poston are probably holding out for a contract similar to the one Timmy Jernigan got in November, 4 years, $48 million with $26 million guaranteed. Said similar, would think he's after 12/13mil per year. Can't see him getting that here. Note sure I'd stray over 10. Would go for Williams instead and draft another DL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 18 minutes ago, JoggingGod said: Hankins is likely seeing his options before signing. If the Redskins couldn’t immediately sign him then why should they get ridiculed for it? Not sure who is ridiculing them for it. From Hankins side of things, why not start asking for the moon and see if a team budges? It's negotiation 101. I am not going to fault the FO for not landing Hankins or any specific player. But if FA comes and goes and they don't really add a single impact D lineman (at least reputation wise), I am going to be cynical about how it will unfold -- just like about every recent off season. The season when they finally vindicate themselves on the D line with hey you thought we were "meh" as for addressing the D line but check out Reyes, he was a beast -- or McClain or whomever. Then I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. And I am talking purely D line. Also drafting a D lineman back to back drafts would sing a similar song. IMO that position deserves an overemphasis. And the closest we had to that was last year when surprisingly Jonathan Allen fell to us. Look at the Rams for example, they already have a scary D line. They are chasing Suh. Eagles, Vikings, etc keep loading up. I among others would love to see a similar approach from them. It could still happen. As for Hankins, I agree I don't fault them for not signing him. But if they really dig him like Finlay-Keim suggest but get out bid for him by the Lions. Then it comes off same old same old for that position. Granted maybe they have an interesting Plan B in that event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovetoaster Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Cameron WolfeVerified account @CameronWolfe 5m5 minutes ago More Former Titans NT Sylvester Williams is signing with the Lions, per source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 I am posting almost the full article, I typically don't but a lot of nuggets here from Finlay. http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/free-agency-update-what-happens-next-redskins-defensive-line Since visiting the Redskins on Monday, Hankins also took a trip to see the Lions. McPhee, who was offered a contract by the Redskins, has since taken a trip to visit the Falcons. Williams also reportedly has interest from Detroit. Keep in mind too, Washington expressed interest in nose tackle Bennie Logan last offseason, and the 6-foot-2, 309 lb., former Chief is again on the market. A visit from Logan would surprise nobody, though it hasn't been reported yet. Mother Nature might also be an impediment for the Redskins. A March snowstorm shut the D.C. region down on Wednesday, which could have limited potential free agent visits. What's clear is between Hankins, McPhee and Williams this week, in addition to Muhammad Wilkerson and Benson Mayowa last week, the Redskins are obviously looking to upgrade their defensive line. Combine that with a contract restructure for incumbent Terrell McClain, and Washington has the flexibility to improve on last season's NFL-worst run defense. That doesn't mean, however, the Redskins will absolutely sign one of the above mentioned players. And it doesn't mean outside linebacker Junior Gallete won't return to the Redskins either. Many fans wonder if a McPhee signing means the Redskins would move on from Galette. It might, but that's no sure thing. Washington went into the 2017 season with five outside linebackers: Ryan Kerrigan, Preston Smith, Galette, Ryan Anderson and Chris Carter. Right now, the 'Skins only have Kerrigan, Smith and Anderson under contract. The team needs to add at least one OLB, but likely two. McPhee also carries about 20 extra pounds on his frame than Galette, giving the former Bear and Raven more flexibility to play against the run. Galette is a speed, leverage and moves player, focused on getting to the quarterback. He's capable against the run, but in the same way a sports car shouldn't carry a snow plow, Galette should be used to pressure QBs. Point being: McPhee and Galette could both make sense for the Redskins, if the team can work out the cash. Money usually matters the most in free agency, and it's clear the Redskins haven't made the type of offers that any of these players felt compelled to immediately sign. Deals could still happen though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, lovetoaster said: Cameron WolfeVerified account @CameronWolfe 5m5 minutes ago More Former Titans NT Sylvester Williams is signing with the Lions, per source. I liked him along with Hankins...Well that signing is either good news or bad news..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobandweave Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Anyone thinking this was a good/decent run defense to start last season needs to think about who they were playing to start the year. I did the research on this topic and posted it in this thread a ways back. I am too lazy to repost but if you want to see the metrics they are here. Week 1 we played the Eagles, they didn't rush for much on this team but instead bombed away on us with the pass. Lets not pretend the Eagles were a good rushing team last year the entire season. They turned it around as the season marched on but were pretty horrible to start the year not just against us. Week 3 they stomped a Texas sized mudhole into the Raiders. Again lets not be pretending that they were a good rushing team last year either ending the season as the 25th worst in the league. Week 5 they played the 49ers, another crappy rushing team. Then they started playing good rushing teams and got molly whopped the rest of the year. Our numbers to start the season were influenced by the opponents they faced more than anything else. Not saying that healthy players couldn't have helped some, but this was never a good defense at stopping the opposing RB going into the 2017 season or the 2016 season or any of the other seasons in recent memory. And they aren't going to be good in 2018 the way this offseason has gone. It won't suddenly become that unless they make significant changes in personnel. The fact is that since Bruce joined this team this organization has only ever drafted one guy - a long gone Seventh round pick in 2011 - in his entire tenure here at DL. That screams Bruce is a moron and needs fired. I know some are searching for a belief that Bruce Allen isn't repeating the same mistakes he made last year by not giving this team a good rush stuffing linemen but call it what it is. Bruce's a moron. There is a clear case of complete dereliction of duties at running this team still going. Bruce should be fired. Letting Hankins walk out the door and not signing him hopefully is the final nail in his stupid leadership over this team. If he ignores this another year the reasons for firing him vastly outweigh any good that could come to Daniel Snyder in stadium talk deals later. He is that big of a screw up and this issue is really that big of a deal. So let's not start blaming injuries for this issue and lets not give Bruce Allen any excuses. Bruce made this bed. He needs to lie in it. It's inexcusable to go another season ignoring the largest glaring hole on the defense. It takes more than lip service to fix that weakness. All he wants to do is pretend it will go away and it won't or he wants to hire some scrubs who are cheap and say he addressed the issue and that won't work either. Until he shows he has learned and makes this right Bruce Allen is the issue, and he should be fired for being the problem and not part of the solution. No excuses. Fix it Bruce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC9 Posted March 21, 2018 Author Share Posted March 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said: I liked him along with Hankins...Well that signing is either good news or bad news..... It's only bad if they sign both. Not sure what their situation against the cap is, though. Cue the "thank you for picking up on that," post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWFLSkins Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 To me an interesting twist in Finlay's article is what if they sign McPhee and Galette? That would be interesting for me. But that would put the pressure in my book as for going for a run stuffing nose in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sknsnation Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, DC9 said: It's only bad if they sign both. Not sure what their situation against the cap is, though. Cue the "thank you for picking up on that," post. DC9, https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/detroit-lions Over the cap says, we have more than Detroit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdlives Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Before Williams and Jean-Francois they were 15mil under. Not a lot of wiggle room, especially if Hankins wants 10. For the record, 3 for 30 is probably market value. Creativity can make that workable for us. I’m thinking we offered 1 for 6-8mil. I think Poston is trying to sell 3-5 for 48-50mil. Jernigan got similar. Someone else got 5 and 50, name escapes me, but comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, DC9 said: It's only bad if they sign both. Not sure what their situation against the cap is, though. Cue the "thank you for picking up on that," post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildbunny Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 18 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: I am posting almost the full article, I typically don't but a lot of nuggets here from Finlay. http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/redskins/free-agency-update-what-happens-next-redskins-defensive-line Hey! Looks like I beat you to this for 3 minutes As it was posted first in BHRBN!! Check BHRBN guys, that's where it is posted first! (well, most of the time... lol if I'm not sleeping :P) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 3 hours ago, bedlamVR said: I was turned into a newt ---- i mean i got better ... No thread is complete without a Monty Python reference! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 3 hours ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said: what's the freaking point of sticking with the 3-4 and lining up in the nickel most of the downs. We line up in nickel most of the time because NFL offenses are in 3+ receiver sets most of the time. Its a matchup league. Last year NFL offenses were in 3 WRs, 1 TE and 1 RB over 60% of snaps. Factor in 4 WR, short yardage and goal line and you are in base defense on around 10% of snaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsTillIDie Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 39 minutes ago, bobandweave said: The fact is that since Bruce joined this team this organization has only ever drafted one guy - a long gone Seventh round pick in 2011 - in his entire tenure here at DL. That screams Bruce is a moron and needs fired. I know some are searching for a belief that Bruce Allen isn't repeating the same mistakes he made last year by not giving this team a good rush stuffing linemen but call it what it is. Bruce's a moron. There is a clear case of complete dereliction of duties at running this team still going. Bruce should be fired. You're forgetting drafting Jonathan Allen in the 1st last year and Matt Ionnidis in the 5th the year before. Moreover, last year, the front office signed two free agents and used their 1st rounder to address the defensive line. All the moves didn't work out, but they were group decisions. The front office went to the coaching staff and asked would you rather have one higher priced defensive linemen or two middle priced defensive linemen. The coaching staff wanted 2. Is that primarily on Allen? Scott Campbell? Jay Gruden? Jim Tomsula? After all, it was Jim Tomsula who convinced Gruden and co that he didn't need a traditional nose tackle to run his line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markmills67 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 Do we know the actual cap hit for Scandrick yet?. And what cap space have we got left after you take out the $8m or so for draft picks and in season cover?. HTTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmandoug1 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 There can be only one Highlander! Logan or Hankins....... for the right price of course. ? I'm also starting to think BJ Hill..... but I will look for the detractors over in the draft thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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