Common Kirk....I just don't know....

[BleedBNG]

1 minute ago, carex said:

 

for som reason I thought he ended up on the PS

 

Your right, though... 13 carries does not establish a running game.

[Koolblue13]

2 hours ago, William Barbour said:

 

Gruden called a great game. Players have to perform. 

Bull****. Yes. Players do have to perform and players are what lost the game, but don't tell me Grudens play calling was better than Schwartz. It wasn't even close. I think Manu did "alright" against Doug and if we had better safeties we'd have completely shut them down, but Schwartz came in and turned our supposedly high flying offense off. We came in expecting fireworks, going to Pryor long to start our season? But a very strong Eagles front 7 run by the best DC in football (that ****ing Snyder insulted years ago) had a plan. He knew where we were weak and blew it up. There's a lot in football that comes down to chance and the bounce of the ball, but these guys all know each other and do nothing but prepare. 

 

The offenses exicution (which is firmly now on our all controlling, recently extended (which we all liked at the time) HC and his opponent out coaching him, is what won the game.

[carex]

15 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Bull****. Yes. Players do have to perform and players are what lost the game, but don't tell me Grudens play calling was better than Schwartz. It wasn't even close. I think Manu did "alright" against Doug and if we had better safeties we'd have completely shut them down, but Schwartz came in and turned our supposedly high flying offense off. We came in expecting fireworks, going to Pryor long to start our season? But a very strong Eagles front 7 run by the best DC in football (that ****ing Snyder insulted years ago) had a plan. He knew where we were weak and blew it up. There's a lot in football that comes down to chance and the bounce of the ball, but these guys all know each other and do nothing but prepare. 

 

The offenses exicution (which is firmly now on our all controlling, recently extended (which we all liked at the time) HC and his opponent out coaching him, is what won the game.

 

we were expecting fireworks?  I sure as hell wasn't.  I mean all offseason we hear about how it takes time for WRs and QBs to gel.  So why expect that?  But I don't think the WRs were forcing Kirk to throw high all game which was the biggest issue with the passing game I saw

[William Barbour]

9 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Bull****. Yes. Players do have to perform and players are what lost the game, but don't tell me Grudens play calling was better than Schwartz. It wasn't even close. I think Manu did "alright" against Doug and if we had better safeties we'd have completely shut them down, but Schwartz came in and turned our supposedly high flying offense off. We came in expecting fireworks, going to Pryor long to start our season? But a very strong Eagles front 7 run by the best DC in football (that ****ing Snyder insulted years ago) had a plan. He knew where we were weak and blew it up. There's a lot in football that comes down to chance and the bounce of the ball, but these guys all know each other and do nothing but prepare. 

 

The offenses exicution (which is firmly now on our all controlling, recently extended (which we all liked at the time) HC and his opponent out coaching him, is what won the game.

 

-And if Kirk hits Crowder for the easy 5 yard TD pass,

 

-or doesn't overthrow him because he threw it to early on the first pass,

 

-or hits Reed when he's wide open over the middle,

 

-or maybe Grant doesn't take the screen to the sideline and runs straight into the endzone.

 

Are we still having this discussion?

 

Wentz big plays came from a scramble broken play where he broke out of 2 players sacks. His other big play was also a scramble where he directed the TE to go up field. Basically back yard football. 

 

Besides that, they ran a swing screen that resulted in a fumble, and 3 more WR screens on 3rd down that got blown up because defense read  them all day. 

 

Gruden called a good game and had good clock management. They players gave to throw, catch, run the ball

 

 

[Koolblue13]

20 minutes ago, carex said:

 

we were expecting fireworks?  I sure as hell wasn't. 

Our top FA, our top Pick, our only strength from last year? Our pass game. We had a phonominal pass game. Record setting QB. Maybe fireworks is the wrong term, but we were expecting a very good offense.

17 minutes ago, William Barbour said:

 

Gruden called a good game and had good clock management. They players gave to throw, catch, run the ball

 

 

Like I said, players didn't exicute. We still abandoned the run, didn't use our depth, only threw a few screens and we usually do a lot. Too many development plays, instead of quick strikes. 

 

Passing game should have been spread wide, with lots of options, presnap reads and quick hits. 

[carex]

3 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Our top FA, our top Pick, our only strength from last year? Our pass game. We had a phonominal pass game. Record setting QB. Maybe fireworks is the wrong term, but we were expecting a very good offense.

Like I said, players didn't exicute. We still abandoned the run, didn't use our depth, only threw a few screens and we usually do a lot. Too many development plays, instead of quick strikes. 

 

Passing game should have been spread wide, with lots of options, presnap reads and quick hits. 

 

Skins haven't felt explosive to me in a long long time.  Even With Desean and Garcon it always felt like one bad play on a drive and everything would fall apart.

 

Doctson was on the field he just didn't catch any, Quick and Grant caught passes.  The depth we didn't use was at RB and TE so I'm not sure how much they would have helped spreading wide   And do you consider bubble screens different than regular screens.  Cause I swear we usually suck at them

[MartinC]

9 minutes ago, carex said:

 

Skins haven't felt explosive to me in a long long time.  Even With Desean and Garcon it always felt like one bad play on a drive and everything would fall apart.

 

Doctson was on the field he just didn't catch any, Quick and Grant caught passes.  The depth we didn't use was at RB and TE so I'm not sure how much they would have helped spreading wide   And do you consider bubble screens different than regular screens.  Cause I swear we usually suck at them

 

We were 6th in the league overall in explosive plays last season and first in the league for explosive pass plays (over 25 yards).

 

https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/team-big-play-statistics/2016/

 

Desean Jackson is one of the all time great deep threats - he is not someone you easily replace. And yes a bubble screen is different to a tunnel screen or a RB screen. A bubble screen is designed to get the ball quickly to the receiver, it's a quick play and it ususally tries to attack the edge of the defense and outflank it. A tunnel screen is slower developing, it lets defenders get into coverage threatening them deep and the 'tunnel' is created between the box defenders and deeper secondary.

 

We are actually a very good screen offense IMO - it's something we should do more. Teams know Cousins struggles against pressure so expect to see more and more of it until we make teams pay. Screens are a good way to slow a rush down.

[RandyHolt]

3 hours ago, BleedBNG said:

I'm going to throw this out here 'cause I just don't know... should we start Mack Brown at RB...

 

I had thought about the same thing. I like Perine the shiny new toy but he seems cut from the same mold as Kelley. When an OL can't block, it's worth a try to get a back faster to the hole in there, heck just try a different back period.  Perine didn't get a snap.

 

Mack seems quicker than Kelley and Perine and has done well in the limited times we have seen him. 

 

CT is up there with Grant as a guy Jay loves. But I don't want CT pounding the rock in the requisite runs I think Jay calls to keep defenses honest. 

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, carex said:

 

Skins haven't felt explosive to me in a long long time.  Even With Desean and Garcon it always felt like one bad play on a drive and everything would fall apart.

 

Doctson was on the field he just didn't catch any, Quick and Grant caught passes.  The depth we didn't use was at RB and TE so I'm not sure how much they would have helped spreading wide   And do you consider bubble screens different than regular screens.  Cause I swear we usually suck at them

The announcer even said it. We run a lot of screens. It's a big part of our game.

 

Yes spreading it out would help. They have a great front 7 and garbage secondary. Get those players on the field more and attack um.

[wit33]

Give Thompson more early down reps, allowing Kirk to have an extra security blanket in the passing game. Forget blocking these exotic looks, abuse Thompson and Reed underneath and hit Pryor up top once a quarter.

 

****Teams want to threaten blitzing 6, with backers in the a and b gaps, Skins counter with motioning out Thompson to the outside. How amazing!! 

 

I feel like the offense needs a back up to Thompson, not two power guys. Allowing for the team to have more confidence in using one of the better weapons more. 

 

I dont think Kirk will ever be a guy who stands tall in the pocket, takes hits and consistently makes down the field throws or outside the hashes consistently. Not being harsh, as I feel Brees and Brady to a lesser degree are similar, but both of their offenses seem to focus on complimenting their strengths and weaknesses. 

[Veryoldschool]

2018, the year the chickens come home to roast for the Kirk Bashers.  They'll get to watch Danny's next big thing play.  Rest assured the next big thing won't wear #10 but like the other guy he'll come out of some spread program and run like greased lightening. Danny will sell a lot of jerseys.  The next big thing will struggle and the unbalanced team will suck.

 

Kirk fortunes improve because he is going have his choice of 6-8 franchises to go to and wil be free to sign for whatever he wants including perhaps a low ball offer from a great franchise.  My money says if available he will take a low ball offer from a quality franchise rather than the most money from a poorly run franchise like Washington.  Cousins will choose wisely because that is what thoughtful, highly intelligent, disciplined people like Cousins do.  It will workout for him, the well run franchise and their fortunate fans.

[Llevron]

Kirk Cousins plays better when people are ****ting on him. I'm trying to do y'all a favor lol. Smoot is trying to do y'all a favor! 

 

He was mad as hell when he yelled "You Like That"

[zCommander]

5 hours ago, mistertim said:

Agree with this in general. Gruden is not a bad play caller (though he gets away from the run a bit too easily IMO). He gets guys open on almost every play. 

 

The OL was sucking at run blocking on Sunday. Gruden had to stick to the air. I would love to see a 40/60 balance in every game though. 

[DM72]

34 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

2018, the year the chickens come home to roast for the Kirk Bashers.  They'll get to watch Danny's next big thing play.  Rest assured the next big thing won't wear #10 but like the other guy he'll come out of some spread program and run like greased lightening. Danny will sell a lot of jerseys.  The next big thing will struggle and the unbalanced team will suck.

 

Kirk fortunes improve because he is going have his choice of 6-8 franchises to go to and wil be free to sign for whatever he wants including perhaps a low ball offer from a great franchise.  My money says if available he will take a low ball offer from a quality franchise rather than the most money from a poorly run franchise like Washington.  Cousins will choose wisely because that is what thoughtful, highly intelligent, disciplined people like Cousins do.  It will workout for him, the well run franchise and their fortunate fans.

 

OK, Kirk.

[TheCoach22]

1 hour ago, Veryoldschool said:

...  My money says if available he will take a low ball offer from a quality franchise rather than the most money from a poorly run franchise like Washington.  Cousins will choose wisely because that is what thoughtful, highly intelligent, disciplined people like Cousins do.  It will workout for him, the well run franchise and their fortunate fans.

Yes, but why is this only between the 20s? For a thoughtful, highly intelligent and disciplined person he sure gets careless and stupid in the RZ. Probably 75% of the reason we are almost 30 pages into this discussion.

[mrfixit28]

Cousins is not worth top QB money. That should be fairly obvious. Gruden and the powers that be know though that he is their best chance at staying employed.

We should not have let Garcon go. This is going to be a long season. I don't see any end to this.

We have no run game. AT ALL. 

Our QB is not a game changing playmaker.

We have no true threat at WR. Crowder is a 3rd WR at best. Pryor is not looking like a WR1 at all. 

Reed is hobbled (as usual). 

In 2016, we definitely should have traded our 1st and Cousins to the Browns. Its all hindsight, but I would much rather be sitting without Josh Docston or Cousins and with Carson Wentz.

Redskins pretty much whiffed on the entire 2016 draft when our "savior" Scott was still here.

I try not to glean anything from preseason, but it looks like its holding true. Cousins is going to regret being greedy and this team will regress.

Some team will sign him, but it should not be the Redskins. I am tired of knowing the outcome of a comeback before it even starts. Hes far far from clutch.

 

I know its 1 game, but this is a team we should have beat easily and I am incredibly tired of saying that.

 

 

[PartyPosse]

2 hours ago, mrfixit28 said:

Redskins pretty much whiffed on the entire 2016 draft when our "savior" Scott was still here.

Totally. I mean it's been a whole year. More than enough time to determine a draft to be a complete bust.

[Riggo'sRangers]

7 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

Cousins will choose wisely because that is what thoughtful, highly intelligent, disciplined people like Cousins do.  It will workout for him, the well run franchise and their fortunate fans.

God will be the one ultimately making this decision.  Kirk is just a vessel.  Unfortunately, I don't believe God is a big Redskins fan.  I believe God is a huge Patriots fan considering the amount of good fortune he hath laid upon their table.  HTTR

 

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/09/nfl-redskins-kirk-cousins-god-contract

[carex]

7 hours ago, zskins said:

 

The OL was sucking at run blocking on Sunday. Gruden had to stick to the air. I would love to see a 40/60 balance in every game though. 

 

I'm sorry I don't think there were enough plays to judge that but if there were I'd say you're wrong.  Of the RBs rushes the Redskins were held to negative 1 yrds three times most of the other runs were for 4-6 yrds

[OVCChairman]

10 hours ago, William Barbour said:

 

 

 

Gruden called a good game and had good clock management. They players gave to throw, catch, run the ball

 

 

Gruden also called a 5 step drop the play after Trent came out of the game.  He also called 3 consecutive pass plays when we were in the shadow of our own goalpost.  I know Pryor had a drop, but not a single run?  I also don't think Gruden utilized the screen well enough.  I did miss portions of the game so I'm not sure if we called any screens or not, but when your O-line is getting blown up, an RB leak or screen can go a long way to helping that.  Gruden has always struggled with playcalling, and he didn't do himself any favors this past weekend.  A lot of blame to go around, but Gruden has a part of that.  

[daveakl]

24 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

Gruden also called a 5 step drop the play after Trent came out of the game.  

That's false. They lined the TE up beside the LT and ran the ball to that side.

[OVCChairman]

Just now, daveakl said:

That's false. They lined the TE up beside the LT and ran the ball to that side.

pretty sure he called a deep out, maybe not the play RIGHT after, but while Ty was in the game, i remember screaming "why would you call that" when it happened

 

[daveakl]

1 minute ago, OVCChairman said:

pretty sure he called a deep out, maybe not the play RIGHT after, but while Ty was in the game, i remember screaming "why would you call that" when it happened

 

You kind of can't just abandon plays just because TW went out. TN isn't a bad replacement anyway.

(Remember last year when he played great and there were people arguing to move TW to LG?)

29 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

He also called 3 consecutive pass plays when we were in the shadow of our own goalpost.  I know Pryor had a drop, but not a single run?  

The fact that Pryor dropped a pass kind of destroys the idea that he made bad play calls. If Pryor catches it then we are out of the shadow of our goal posts and moving down the field. 

[OVCChairman]

Just now, daveakl said:

You kind of can't just abandon plays just because TW went out. TN isn't a bad replacement anyway.

(Remember last year when he played great and there were people arguing to move TW to LG?)

I agree, but you walk TN into a game cold against a line like that, you need to get him some rhythm before you put Kirk 5 to 7 steps back against a D-line that was already beating us up.  I don't agree with the playcall to throw there.  The run pay i dont have a problem with but run a quick drop, get the ball out, and let TN get in the game before you let Cox eat his lunch.  

[daveakl]

31 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

I also don't think Gruden utilized the screen well enough.  I did miss portions of the game so I'm not sure if we called any screens or not, but when your O-line is getting blown up, an RB leak or screen can go a long way to helping that.

They ran a few screens (two of them got blown up and KC had to throw the ball in the turf) and they also ran some quick passes to wr's that were isolated 1v1 on their side of the field.

 

There were 3 or 4 runs that RK was caught from behind at the los. Some of that was the  backside blocker not holding his block long enough but it also was RK being slow. We need a faster RB.

 

We are going to disagree here but the playcalling was fine. High passes, crappy running and blocking, dropped passes where bigger problems.