2018 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread

[Why am I Mr. Pink?]

I give the Browns credit. They kept what they are doing at no. 1 a secret so far. Usually we know by now, especially with franchise QBs to be had. Still 2 days to go though. 

 

edit - http://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2018/story/_/id/23301572/baker-mayfield-definitely-conversation-cleveland-browns-no-1-pick

 

this seems like pure misdirection by Browns or a sports writer writing a loosely sourced "what if" draft article.   

[HigSkin]

 

[Skinsinparadise]

24 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Assuming you meant Antonio Brown, not the Congressman from MD?  

 

But yeah I can see some Antonio Brown in him. The first time I noticed Miller was when I was watching tape of Riley Ferguson. My attention kept getting drawn away from Ferguson and to the guy he kept throwing to and I was like "who the hell is this guy who's making all these catches?" then I started watching actual film of Miller and I was super impressed. I think he can be a stud. And apparently he's a super hard worker and high character guy. Very detail oriented and driven.

 

Yep, though I hear the Congressman could play, too.   I've seen some clips of Miller but haven't really watched him closely.   But yeah the scouts that McGinn talked to about Miller were gushing. 

[repo_4]

33 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I'd take Phillips over Payne every single day of the week at any position in the draft. About the same weight but taller. Plays the same position with the same sorts of responsibilities (0/1 tech mostly, taking on double teams as well as penetrating and pressuring up the middle) and unlike Payne actually has crazy production from the position: last season had 98 tackles, 17 TFL, and 7.5 sacks...all from a NT position. Also measured better than Payne at pretty much everything in the Combine besides 40 yard dash. 

100%. I would encourage anyone who has not done so already to watch tape of Phillips. I have liked him for a while now. There is no comparison between him and Payne. Phillips is a monster.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

I wouldn't be surprised if Phillips ends up going in Round 1 to someone like Atlanta or Detroit.

 

Really curious to see where Hurst ends up going. I know he's not a NT, but he'd be an amazing addition to the line, even if to rotate with Ionidis and be our 3rd DE. In reality though, if we brought in Hurst and he were healthy, he'd probably beat out Ionidis for the other starting end spot opposite Allen.

 

I'd take a flyer on him with any of our picks after #44

[skinny21]

2 hours ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

Weird ... how none of us are even mentioning DJ Moore. Local kid, balled out for the Terps, consensus first WR off the board and crickets from the Terps faithful. 

I think it’s more a matter of the conversation is (mostly) focused on our needs and the 1st round pick (little early for Moore there).  

 

I’m super interested in Moore and Gallup, intrigued by Washington, and I’m hoping we might find a guy that can play in the slot somewhere around the 5th.  I’m not thrilled with the idea of a receiver in the 1st (even after a trade back) or 2nd though.  

 

Again though, my focus is on the DL, RB and interior oline, followed by a well rounded TE that can help with run blocking, and a corner that can help us move on from Norman next year.  

 

Receiver, OLB, ILB, S, and QB are certainly all positions we could use depth (this year or next), and eventual starters though.  Preston Smith, Crowder, McPhee, McCoy, Spaight and Everett are all potentially gone next year.  Nicholson’s health is a question mark, Brown’s contract goes way up, Anderson is a question mark, Alex Smith ain’t getting younger, etc.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

3 hours ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

Weird ... how none of us are even mentioning DJ Moore. Local kid, balled out for the Terps, consensus first WR off the board and crickets from the Terps faithful. 

DJ's a stud.

 

Personally, I'd seriously consider taking him at 13...or in a trade down scenario.

 

 

 

 

 

[The Consigliere]

2 hours ago, mistertim said:

@The ConsigliereI was looking around for their Pro Day numbers as well but from what I read all they did were position drills.

 

 

Haha. That J.P. Finlay quote on Payne. "He's an Alabama D lineman. Those guys are so good for a reason."

 

So basically "He's from Bama so he's worth a first round pick regardless of what the stats or film says".  *facepalm*

 

Let me pile on (Busts and disappointments (considering draft slotting) in bold): 

 

2009: 

1.06 Andre Smith OT: Bust

 

2010:

1.08: Rolando McClain LB: Adequate player, bust for draft slotting.

1.20 Kareem Jackson DB: Bust

 

2011:

1.03 Marcell Dareus: DT: Very Good Player. Hit

1.06 Julio Jones WR: Elite player. Hit

1.25: James Carpenter OT: Looks like he's currently a bust, not sure abut his past.

1.28: Mark Ingram RB: Probably accurate to say he didn't become exactly what they wanted, but he was worth the draft capital.

 

2012:

1.03: Trent Richardson RB: Bust

1.07: Mark Barron: S: Bust (eventually found his way in the right system to be a starter though)

1.17: Dre Kirkpatrick: DB: Disappointment (didn't become a stud, but has started for the bulk of his career)

1.25: Dont'a Hightower LB: Stud

 

2013:

1.09: Dee Milliner DB: Bust

1.10: Chance Warmack: OG: Disappointment

1.11: DJ Fluker: OG: Disappointment

 

2014:

1.17: CJ Mosley: Disappointing (he's average more or less)

1.21: Ha Ha Clinton Dix DB: Hit

 

2015:

1.04: Amari Cooper WR: Competent with upside, disappointing so far though.

 

2016:

1.18: Ryan Kelly C: Solid but injury prone

 

2017: 

1.16: Marlon Humphrey: So far he's good. 

1.17: Jonathan Allen DT: Looked great in short sample size. 

 

Day 2 busts include:

 

2012: Courtney Upshaw LB

2013: Eddie Lacy (Ate himself out of league)

2015: TJ Yeldon

 

2016:

Cyrus Jones: Injured

 

2017:

Cam Robinson: Major drop from December 2016 to the draft to now seems justified. 

Ryan Anderson: early returns on negative. 

 

There definitely seems to be an Alabama Tax that isn't particually worth paying a lot of the time. Some years it's been worthwhile (2011, 2016 and 2017 come to mind for the most part but other years have been pretty bad), and the first round in particular has been very hit and miss other than 2011. 

[Redskin21502]

1 hour ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I'm keeping my eyes on the Browns. They have a lot of ammo to move back up into the mid-1st. 

 

Cleveland would pick #1, #12, #13, #22 and #33 (5 picks)

Washington would pick at #35, #44, #51, #61 (4 picks)

 

 

 

I'd love to move down with the Browns and have 3 top 44 or 51 picks to fill those holes at DL, RB and LG

 

and the Browns could take 5 QBs with those 5 picks

[zoony]

The scenario that i dont think the blogosphere and skins fans are talking about is what if one of the top 4 QBs slides and is there at 13...

[Redskin21502]

3 hours ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

Weird ... how none of us are even mentioning DJ Moore. Local kid, balled out for the Terps, consensus first WR off the board and crickets from the Terps faithful. 

 

rest assured I'll be driving the Ty Johnson bandwagon next year but I am a little biased with him

[JamesMadisonSkins]

24 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

 

Again though, my focus is on the DL, RB and interior oline, followed by a well rounded TE that can help with run blocking, and a corner that can help us move on from Norman next year.  

 

I'm excited to see what Sprinkle brings this year. I'm still not sure we draft a TE this year. Unless we play to cut Davis outright, we will only carry 3 TE this year (didn't want to keep 4 last year but didn't want to lose Sprinkle). So I think the year to draft a TE is probably 2019 ... or sign one (they're relatively cheap) in FA next year to replace Davis or Reed if we part with them.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Here's my 2-round, which I think is more accurate/preferable to the one from earlier. I really like the Browns draft ... a lot.

 

Round 1	Team	Pick	Trades
Pick 1	Cleveland	Sam Darnold, QB USC
Pick 2	NY Giants	Saquan Barkley, RB Penn State
Pick 3	NY Jets	Josh Allen, QB Wyoming
Pick 4	*Buffalo	Josh Rosen, QB Buffalo	*BUF sends 1(12), 1(22), 2(21) to CLE for 1(4)
Pick 5	Denver	Baker Mayfield, QB Oklahoma
Pick 6	Indianapolis	Bradley Chubb, DE NC State
Pick 7	Tampa Bay	Derwin James, S Florida State
Pick 8	Chicago	Quenton Nelson, G Notre Dame
Pick 9	*Cleveland (2)	Tremaine Edmunds, OLB Virginia Tech	*CLE sends 1(22), 2(3) to San Francisco for 1(9)
Pick 10	Oakland	Roquan Smith, ILB Georgia
Pick 11	Miami	Vita Vea, NT Washington
Pick 12	*Cleveland (3)	Denzel Ward, CB Ohio State
Pick 13	Washington	Minkah Fitzpatrick, S Alabama
Pick 14	Green Bay	Leighton Vander Esch, ILB Boise State
Pick 15	Arizona	Lamar Jackson, QB Louisville
Pick 16	Baltimore	Mike McGlinchey, OT Notre Dame
Pick 17	LA Chargers	Connor Williams, OT Texas
Pick 18	*Tennessee	Marcus Davenport, Edge UTSA	*TEN sends 1(25), 3(25) to SEA for 1(18)
Pick 19	Dallas	Calvin Ridley, WR Alabama
Pick 20	Detroit	Derrius Guice, RB LSU
Pick 21	Cincinnati	Isaiah Wynn, G/T Georgia
Pick 22	*San Francisco	Rashaan Evans, ILB Alabama
Pick 23	New England	Harold Landry, OLB Boston College
Pick 24	Carolina	Will Hernandez, G UTEP
Pick 25	*Seattle	Josh Jackson, CB Iowa
Pick 26	Atlanta	Taven Bryan, DT Florida
Pick 27	New Orleans	D.J. Moore, WR Maryland
Pick 28	Pittsburgh	Ronnie Harrison, FS Alabama
Pick 29	Jacksonville	Courtland Sutton, WR SMU
Pick 30	Minnesota	James Daniels, G/C Iowa
Pick 31	New England (2)	Mason Rudolph, QB Oklahoma State
Pick 32	Philadelphia	Hayden Hurst, TE South Carolina
Round 2	Team
Pick 1	Cleveland	Kolton Miller, OT UCLA
Pick 2	NY Giants	Billy Price, C/G Ohio State
Pick 3	*San Francisco	James Washington, WR Oklahoma State
Pick 4	Indianapolis	Sony Michel, RB Georgia
Pick 5	Indianapolis (2)	Jaire Alexander, CB LSU
Pick 6	Tampa Bay	Ronald Jones, RB Georgia
Pick 7	Chicago	Da'Ron Payne, NT Alabama
Pick 8	Denver	Isaiah Oliver, CB Colorado
Pick 9	New England	Brian O'Neill, OT Pittsburgh
Pick 10	Miami	Mike Gesicki, TE Penn State
Pick 11	Oakland	Orlando Brown, OT Oklahoma
Pick 12	Washington	Nick Chubb, RB Georgia
Pick 13	Green Bay	Mike Hughes, CB UCF
Pick 14	Cincinnati	Josh Sweat, Edge Florida State
Pick 15	Arizona	Chukwuma Okorafor, OT W. Michigan
Pick 16	LA Chargers	Justin Reid, FS Stanford
Pick 17	Indianapolis (3)	Austin Corbett, G/T Nevada
Pick 18	Dallas	Dallas Geodert, TE SDSU
Pick 19	Detroit	Braden Smith, G Auburn
Pick 20	Baltimore	Mark Andrews, TE Arkansas
Pick 21	*Cleveland (2)	Harrison Phillips, DT Stanford
Pick 22	Kansas City	Lorenzo Carter, OLB Georgia
Pick 23	Buffalo (2)	Frank Ragnow, G/C Arkansas
Pick 24	Carolina	Christian Kirk, WR Texas A&M
Pick 25	Tennessee	Donte Jackson, CB LSU
Pick 26	Atlanta	D.J. Clark, WR LSU
Pick 27	San Francisco (2)	Carlton Davis, CB Auburn
Pick 28	Pittsburgh	Malik Jefferson, ILB Texas
Pick 29	Jacksonville	Jerome Baker, ILB Ohio State
Pick 30	Minnesota	Uchenna Owosu, LB Southern California
Pick 31	New England	Maurice Hurst, DT Michigan
Pick 32	Cleveland (3)	Anthony Miller, WR Memphis

[JSSkinz]

Doug was definitely more filtered in today's presser that at the combine, seemed like he was told to keep it vanilla.

 

 

[JamesMadisonSkins]

I think the biggest question, for me, is if we do go Fitzpatrick in Round 1 as BPA ... what do you do at pick #44 if you have to pick between an RB or DT? Chubb or Phillips? I think it's a deeper draft for DT than RBs, at least the way it lays out for our picks. If we go Chubb at 44, we can probably get some quality interior DL at our pick in the 4th or even somewhere in the 5th. But if we go DT in the 2nd, I'm not as confident that a game-breaking RB is there at our pick in the 4th round.

 

Sheperd, Norton, Hill, Settle, Fotukasi, Hall ... just a few guys I think we could draft in the 4th or 5th round and have make some decent impacts this year as NT.

AND, even though I've argued against it, there is always the Johnathan Hankins route, post-draft, if we are in bad shape still.

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I'm excited to see what Sprinkle brings this year. I'm still not sure we draft a TE this year. Unless we play to cut Davis outright, we will only carry 3 TE this year (didn't want to keep 4 last year but didn't want to lose Sprinkle). So I think the year to draft a TE is probably 2019 ... or sign one (they're relatively cheap) in FA next year to replace Davis or Reed if we part with them.

Yeah, 4 TEs is a bit of a luxury.  I do think we’re in a unique situation though because there’s a legit chance we move on from both Reed and Davis next year.  Hoping Sprinkle can make it as a #1 or 2 seems risky, waiting to draft one next year is risky, and hoping we can find anything better than a decent TE in FA next year is risky.  

 

So, 4 TEs is not ideal, but I think they should look to draft an inline TE that has some pass catching potential/prowess.  See how the rookie and Sprinkle develop and go from there.  Not only is it succession planning, but you’re upping your chances of fielding a decent run blocking TE... which I think is pretty crucial to our fortunes.  

[Est.1974]

7 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I think the biggest question, for me, is if we do go Fitzpatrick in Round 1 as BPA ... what do you do at pick #44 if you have to pick between an RB or DT?

 

In your scenario above, we trade back up for Payne.

[Koolblue13]

8 minutes ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

In your scenario above, we trade back up for Payne.

That's my dream scenario. 

[zoony]

27 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

Doug was definitely was more filtered in today's presser that at the combine, seemed like he was told to keep it vanilla.

 

 

 

I think Doug is an incredibly smart guy.  I think that he is probably a good facilitator and executive.  I just think he needs the help of an experienced GM / personnel guy

[JSSkinz]

48 minutes ago, zoony said:

 

I think Doug is an incredibly smart guy.  I think that he is probably a good facilitator and executive.  I just think he needs the help of an experienced GM / personnel guy

I've always been a HUGE fan of Doug and only a small portion of that is based on what he did when he played.

 

I think he's there for a specific reason and its to vet these kids.  He's so easy going and non-confrontational that I believe people probably open up to him a bit more than other personality types.  

 

I see him as the VP of gut feeling, character, coachability, goodwill, father figure, etc. and there's definitely value in that.

 

But to your point, yes I agree.

 

 

[Est.1974]

I do think Justin Reid or Josh Jackson are serious options. At this stage I have no idea where the first two days of the draft are heading for us. A few names I'm looking out for later in the draft...

 

Tyrell Crosby OL

Marcell Ateman WR

John Kelly RB

Dane Cruickshank DB

Tony Brown DB

Joseph Noteboom OL

Kendrick Norton DL

Steve Ishmael WR

Ike Boettger OL

[The Consigliere]

54 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I'm excited to see what Sprinkle brings this year. I'm still not sure we draft a TE this year. Unless we play to cut Davis outright, we will only carry 3 TE this year (didn't want to keep 4 last year but didn't want to lose Sprinkle). So I think the year to draft a TE is probably 2019 ... or sign one (they're relatively cheap) in FA next year to replace Davis or Reed if we part with them.

 

Well, skinny's request w/regards to TE is addressed with Sprinkle. His strengths were his ability to be a weapon in the red zone and his in line blocking. He's not a great athlete, but he's reasonably fast for a guy of his size, and has good hands. The big issue I had with him and with how we handled that draft was that the '17 TE class was probably the most talented ever in terms of pass catchers. I think 2010 is close, maybe as good at the top end but 2017 was deeper.

 

1.David Njoku: Megafreak athlete, monstrous talent with the ball in his hands.

2. OJ Howard: Freak athlete as well, good in line blocker too. Odd production numbers but plenty of signs he was a monster.

3. Evan Engram: really a WR with smallish size for a TE, but amazingly productive. Not a great blocker.

4. Gerald Everett: Poor Man's Jordan Reed according to some scouts, and perhaps a bit of a tired description going into the draft. Athletic freak with TE size.

5. Jonnu Smith: Huge TE with very good athletic #'s. 

6. Adam Shaheen: Big size TE with unusual basketball athleticism, red zone ability and some blocking upside.

7. George Kittle: Freak Athlete, highly productive, lots of upside. 

8. Bucky Hodges: WR body, tremendous athleticism, poor man's engram, fell out of favor and has bounced around.

9. Jake Butt: Thought of as a 2nd rounder to 3rd rounder before he tore his ACL in his last game for Michigan. More like Sprinkle then the rest of these guys.

 

You could divide these guys into the athletic freaks who are 80% pass catchers, with limitations or a total lack of blocking chops: 

Engram and Hodges fit here.

 

Howard, Smith, and Shaheen were all solid options as in line TE's with pass catching chops.

 

Kittle, Everett, Njoku, and Butt if memory serves weren't as respected as blockers, but we're not regarded as horrific liabilities.

 

I cannot understand how we could look at Jordan Reed, and Paul: the former a threat to retire literally any day now going back two years, and Paul whose contract was up soon, and not go after one of these guys. I get if they looked at Engram and Hodges and thought: Ehhh, we can only use them as pass catchers, so pass. But that leaves another 7 guys they could have gotten. Of those Howard, Engram, Njoku and and Shaheen went in the 1st or early 2nd, which left us with Jonnu Smith, George Kittle and Jake Butt. But we took a pass on all three. I'm pretty disappointed we did as Sprinkle wouldn't fit ahead of any of these guys, plus he had the Belk arrest character flag. Kittle's already blowing up with SF, and Jonnu was probably going to take over at TE before he was seriously injured in the playoffs on special teams duty (should be okay by the regular season, not so sure about training camp, which meant that Delaine Walker wasn't cut, whereas if he was healthy, Walker stood a decent chance of being a salary cap casualty. 

 

This draft, for me, if we want a pass catcher, we get Goedert, if we want to go huge ceiling, lower floor, we can go with Gesicki, if we want more standard production, go with consensus #1 TE from a year ago for this class in Mark Andrews. Hurst is a non-starter for me as he's too old, especially when you factor in how long a learning curve TE is for most TE's who come into the league (especailly when they're asked to pull some in line blocking duties), and the fact that breakout age is a huge predictor for future success for players, and dominating when you're older than everyone usually is borderline almost meaningless. 

[skins2victory]

2 hours ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I think the biggest question, for me, is if we do go Fitzpatrick in Round 1 as BPA ... what do you do at pick #44 if you have to pick between an RB or DT? Chubb or Phillips? I think it's a deeper draft for DT than RBs, at least the way it lays out for our picks. If we go Chubb at 44, we can probably get some quality interior DL at our pick in the 4th or even somewhere in the 5th. But if we go DT in the 2nd, I'm not as confident that a game-breaking RB is there at our pick in the 4th round.

 

Sheperd, Norton, Hill, Settle, Fotukasi, Hall ... just a few guys I think we could draft in the 4th or 5th round and have make some decent impacts this year as NT.

AND, even though I've argued against it, there is always the Johnathan Hankins route, post-draft, if we are in bad shape still.

I will say that it would be great to get another RB in this draft. But, the D-line is more important IMO. We simply cannot let teams run it down our throats all year long again. I cannot stomach another Thanksgiving were Zeke gets at least 5 yards every time they hand him the ball. Again I do believe the RB position needs another body, but I feel a lot of people are dismissing the fact that last year the O-line was in complete shambles. The injuries to the O-line had a big impact on the poor production in the run game. I personally am not giving up on Perine just yet. I feel year 2 in the system with a healthy O-line could go along way in better production from him. So long story short, give me Phillips all day with that 2 pick!

[mistertim]

2 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

That's my dream scenario. 

 

And my nightmare.

[Skinsinparadise]

2 hours ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

I think the biggest question, for me, is if we do go Fitzpatrick in Round 1 as BPA ... what do you do at pick #44 if you have to pick between an RB or DT? Chubb or Phillips? I think it's a deeper draft for DT than RBs, at least the way it lays out for our picks. If we go Chubb at 44, we can probably get some quality interior DL at our pick in the 4th or even somewhere in the 5th. But if we go DT in the 2nd, I'm not as confident that a game-breaking RB is there at our pick in the 4th round.

 

Sheperd, Norton, Hill, Settle, Fotukasi, Hall ... just a few guys I think we could draft in the 4th or 5th round and have make some decent impacts this year as NT.

AND, even though I've argued against it, there is always the Johnathan Hankins route, post-draft, if we are in bad shape still.

 

 

My thought process has been similar to yours as to the draft throughout most of the off season.    Should be fun to see what plays out.  

 

To me this point looks obvious

T. Edwards

R. Smith

M. Fitzpatrick

D. James

D. Ward

 

At least one of them will drop to 13.  The math takes you there.  I'd love any one of those guys with Fitzpatrick being my favorite but they are all close to me -- I think all studs for different reasons.   And if there is any surprise going in the top 12 -- the hot one is the LT from Notre Dame going top 12, then at least two of the guys above are going to be available.

 

Personally, if they took Vea or Payne over those 5 players, they'd be nuts unless it happened in a trade down.  And I think they'd hesitate to trade down when one of those players drop.

 

My point is I think the odds are good that there will be no DT or RB in round one.  And the question becomes what do you do at 44.    At that spot, you never know you might get a real surprise faller and if they go BPA -- they might end up with no RB or DT in the first two rounds.   The fact that they are leaving these gaping holes in FA to me I wouldn't let factor in my decision making process.  So even though I've been shouting RB.  I might think again if lets say its R. Penny left versus B. Price or lets say Mike Hughes or whatever. 

 

To me the wild card if if they love either Guice and or Payne or Josh Jackson (running with different guys beat guys have said they dig) then maybe they aim to trade down regardless of who falls to 13.  For me of those 5, Ward landing at 13 is the one I'd be most likely to shrug off and trade down, regardless.  Though, Ward is a stud IMO, too.  But I am not as jazzed about him as the other 4.