The 2017 FA Thread - OP Updated with Signings (Sundberg, Galette, VD, Hood re-signed) *** Terrell McClain, Stacy McGee, DJ Swearinger, Terrelle Pryor, Chris Carter, Brian Quick, ZACH BROWN(!!)***

[Morneblade]

9 hours ago, Rattlesnake88 said:

Blind homerism and being optimistic with our free agency are not equals. And that's what I think. You even said you liked some of the moves. Can people who agree with that believe the team has a chance to get even better after the draft without being blind? Since when has pessimism done anyone any good? Are negative opinions supposed to be antidotes to something out of our control anyway? 

 

Again. Not knocking anyone for being skeptical by some of the offseason moves, it's valid. But calling people homers because they are excited for the positives is just Scrooge mcduck worthy. 

 

Except that he called himself a "homer" first, he's the one that brought that "card" into play. You also might want to go over some of his posts and the logic he uses, which has already been pointed out by another poster.

 

The only thing I wanted was a reason why he thought we were better with those 2 pickups. Something he was either unable or unwilling to supply.

[clskinsfan]

Here are some examples of the ability Mcclain brings. He is very good at getting inside pressure and splitting double teams. And the guy is relentless. You will not see him taking plays off like Baker. I know I have been getting blasted for liking his signing. But the guy can play. His only knock has been his injury history.

 

 

 

 

 

[TheShredder]

The FA signings can't be judged until there's a sample size.  There's strong argument for the play grades going to the stats that RJF and Baker put up on a bad defense.  The defense was sorry and it needed a face lift...so, they did some Out-Patient surgery in FA.  Paramount is the coordinator change and coaching.  They were very much out coached on D.  From game 1, where Norman didn't man up with Brown, that was telling. 

 

Now, shift gears with some guys on the DL.  Add a player at Safety (which should be huge).  Then your targeting a NT in the draft and leaving a need at ILB.  Arguably there's a new defense coming to play.  Got to see them play together after putting in the work from a coaches corner. 

 

How will the Skins do next year?  Well, Dallas had the easiest schedule and lost most there OL.  With pass rushers on the corners and a clog in the middle, it's not going to be that easy to put points up.  Wouldn't be surprised to see a sophomore slump from their QB.  If he doesn't have time to throw, he's not going to perform well.  Giants had a decent schedule as well...their defense really played better then expected and there offense struggled without a second WR target. Manning isn't lighting in a bottle anymore (if ever).  NY actually plays the Skins poorly as of late.  Eagles are a few years in the making...not this year for sure, but they'll be better. NFC EAST is always up for grabs. 

 

Last year the Skins played a tough schedule as it were, looking forward from Pre-season...some of the teams really fell off.  Skins didn't. The defense truly kept them out of the playoffs. Coaching changes alone could add 1-2 wins in 2017!!!  There are a couple of wild cards in favor with Gallette being a huge one.  Should the Skins put up some serious pass rush, that's at least getting them over the hump.  Minimizing the runs up the gut and getting off the field on 3rd down has got a lot to do with play calling and giving the right players a chance to succeed.  

[Conn]

Has JP Finlay ever broken a story? He's a beat guy but he's not breaking news that I ever remember.

[CommanderDOOM]

Were Mcgee and McClain the best interior linemen on their old teams? 

[Morneblade]

1 minute ago, TheShredSkinz said:

Were Mcgee and McClain the best interior linemen on their old teams? 

 

No and Yes. McClain was, McGee was not.

[Morneblade]

6 hours ago, clskinsfan said:

Here are some examples of the ability Mcclain brings. He is very good at getting inside pressure and splitting double teams. And the guy is relentless. You will not see him taking plays off like Baker. I know I have been getting blasted for liking his signing. But the guy can play. His only knock has been his injury history.

 

 

 

You have not been getting blasted for liking the signing. In a vacuum, most of us actually like the signing, thinking he would replace RJF at DE, even though he's a 4-3 DT, not a 3-4 DE (and there is a difference).

 

That was fine. Having him basically as a replacement for Baker was not so fine. Baker, with everything that comes with him, was by every source I looked at, is a better player than McClain. Significantly so. Add that he has been much more consistent, and not oft injured like McClain has been, it's not even close.

 

Now, this is how this would be looked at as a favorable signing, outside of a vacuum. Sign McClain, Sign Baker. Oh, and get a damn NT. Then, we can say we really upgraded.

 

What we did is akin to signing Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, thinking he's going to replace Breeland, and then cutting Josh Norman.

[Skinsinparadise]

I was just going over PFF grades on the team from last season and the newly acquired players.  And I take their grades with a grain of salt but for those interested.

 

As for the MLB discussion, they have Mason Foster graded as a stud at MLB (really high grade) and they have Compton rated poorly especially against the run. 

 

I think its funny that Cooley is often at war with the PFF grades.  He doesn't care for PFF.   They see the new DTs in the opposite way.  Cooley more or less said McClain isn't a world beater but is above average.  According to him Baker is a better pass rusher but McClain is a better run stuffer.  He rated McClain as slightly worse than Baker but he is a similar caliber player.  He more or less thinks McGee is going to be a low impact player or maybe even a bust.    PFF grades both guys the opposite way.  McGee to them is above average and McClain got a bad grade.  PFF also gave poor grades to Hood and Ioannidis but liked Lanier in his limited snaps. 

 

Swearinger got a killer good grade, both in the run game and passing game.  He got a better grade than anyone in our secondary.  Josh Norman is the only other in the secondary with a good grade.  

 

According to them the worst starters on defense were Ziggy Hood and Will Compton.  The two best graded current starters on defense would be Swearinger, Mason Foster.  Just a little behind those two would be Norman, Cravens, Kerrigan.

[dchogs]

15 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

What we did is akin to signing Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, and then cutting Josh Norman.

c'mon... baker is good and all, but let's not say he's at the level of norman.  that's insanity. 

 

I don't disagree with your overall point, though.  i do not consider our DL upgraded.  at best, we've tread water.

[Morneblade]

3 minutes ago, dchogs said:

c'mon... baker is good and all, but let's not say he's at the level of norman.  that's insanity. 

 

I don't disagree with your overall point, though.  i do not consider our DL upgraded.  at best, we've tread water.

 

It wasn't to show that Baker was all world. It was to show that you have a player, (Baker) that is rated higher than the guy being brought in (McClain), but is still a upgrade over the "other" guy he could replace (RJF), but ends up replacing the "better" guy (Baker).

 

Sorry for the confusion.

[bobandweave]

@Skinsinparadise

 

Cooley ranked the two Dlinemen as a C+ and a C- players and combined a C- because neither are better then Baker. Not sure I would agree that either was said to be "above average" like you took away. He ****ted on both players and the approach we showed the line. I can't blame him one bit, Both aren't good and we only are continuing a tradition of overpaying average to below average players in FA to address this need. We've been doing that for years and it's never worked out for us, what makes anyone think it will this time regardless of what singular plays you can find online? 

 

The problem with Free Agency is that Good players get paid like Elite guys, Average players get paid like they are good. And below average players get paid like average guys (these two again this year). 

 

The correct approach to Free Agency is not to overpay guys and when your going to have to overpay then you either sign your own players or target the absolute elite and overpay them. We didn't sign our own guys, and we didn't sign anyone elite. We only overpaid for JAGs and no one should feel good about that. 

 

As for PFF, I personally respect the view of Evan Silva senior editor of rotoworld more then them. He didn't even rank one of the two DL in his top 100. The other was way down in the 70's. Not good, and not money well spent.

[Conn]

Jelani Jenkins signed for almost nothing with the Raiders, and they're still in pursuit of Brown (who just got a new agent). Damn.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, bobandweave said:

@Skinsinparadise

 

Cooley ranked the two Dlinemen as a C+ and a C- players and combined a C- because neither are better then Baker. Not sure I would agree that either was said to be "above average" like you took away. He ****ted on both players and the approach we showed the line. I can't blame him one bit, Both aren't good and we only are continuing a tradition of overpaying average to below average players in FA to address this need. We've been doing that for years and it's never worked out for us, what makes anyone think it will this time regardless of what singular plays you can find online? 

 

 

I listened to Cooley's rap on the DTs twice so I have a good handle on it. I summarized it on this thread before and I'll give the cliff notes version again. He liked McClain.  He thinks he hustles and brings good effort.  He likes him more as a run-stopper than pass rusher.  He graded him as a C plus player.  He thought he was above average.  He graded Baker as a B minus.   He really ripped McGee, said he's a 2 down player and he needs to win on his first three steps otherwise he makes no impact.  He gave him a C minus.  But his description brought me back to his Reyes description from the previous year where he ripped him but still gave room for it working out -- but you can tell he didn't think it would work out.  He gave the Redskins a D for the FA work on the D line because in his mind they needed to sign a B plus player who can win one on one match ups. And they didn't get that guy.

 

The only thing Cooley might not agree with some of McClain's critics is that he is a big downgrade from Baker.  He seems to see McClain as a slight downgrade.  His overall point though was the status quo already stunk so the drill in FA wasn't to trade off what they had with something similar or worse.  They needed a big time player in the soup and that player still isn't on the roster.  Knowing that Cooley usually liked RJF on the D line perhaps more than any other guy on the roster when it came to film study last year.  I'd hazard a guess that he'd likely see RJF/Baker > McClain/McGee.    But Cooley's overall point wasn't tit for tat comparisons, it was they needed a tier one D lineman and they haven't signed a guy like that.

[Voice_of_Reason]

My God.  We're still litigating the Baker vs. whoever move in this thread?  

 

Is this a thread worthy topic on its own?  I don't think a new fact has been brought up in ages.  

[MEANDWARF]

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

My God.  We're still litigating the Baker vs. whoever move in this thread?  

 

Is this a thread worthy topic on its own?  I don't think a new fact has been brought up in ages.  

Apparently letting Baker really struck a nerve within this fan-base. I mean the defense was not that great, so major changes was needed. I will miss Garcon more(until we found out he's was being a jerk in the end).  

[Morneblade]

4 minutes ago, MEANDWARF said:

Apparently letting Baker really struck a nerve within this fan-base. I mean the defense was not that great, so major changes was needed. I will miss Garcon more(until we found out he's was being a jerk in the end).  

 

Um, no. Downgrading a already bad defense touched a nerve.

[Koolblue13]

I wish one of you guys would start a Baker vs McReplacements thread and keep it out of here.

[Morneblade]

9 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I wish one of you guys would start a Baker vs McReplacements thread and keep it out of here.

 

I'm not gonna do it. Last time I started a thread I was trying to merge all the Calvin Johnson threads (yes, it was THAT long ago) and I got reamed out by Blondie for trying to get "my name in lights". Still having flashbacks from that.

 

But I agree, it's over and done with.

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

I'm not gonna do it. Last time I started a thread I was trying to merge all the Calvin Johnson threads (yes, it was THAT long ago) and I got reamed out by Blondie for trying to get "my name in lights". Still having flashbacks from that.

 

But I agree, it's over and done with.

I've been thinking about a TE thread, since I don't like any of ours. I use to get nervous about it, but I'm not sure why.

 

All you have to do is type "mods if this doesn't deserve to be a thread, feel free to close it", so they know they have permission to moderate the board. They love that.

 

Oh, and start it with "guys", so it sounds like you're whining and scared, cause that'll help. 

[bedlamVR]

Did i miss it or were the details of the Quick contract ever released - does anyone know over how many years what the deal actually was ? 

[MEANDWARF]

13 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

I wish one of you guys would start a Baker vs McReplacements thread and keep it out of here.

Agreed it is time to move on. Regret responding to the Baker post.

[clskinsfan]

2 hours ago, bedlamVR said:

Did i miss it or were the details of the Quick contract ever released - does anyone know over how many years what the deal actually was ? 

 

It is showing up on the Cap sites as a one year deal. But I cant find the money side of it.

[MEANDWARF]

14 hours ago, Morneblade said:

 

I'm not gonna do it. Last time I started a thread I was trying to merge all the Calvin Johnson threads (yes, it was THAT long ago) and I got reamed out by Blondie for trying to get "my name in lights". Still having flashbacks from that.

 

But I agree, it's over and done with.

Isn't that what we all thrive to do?

[Skinsfan1311]

15 hours ago, Morneblade said:

 

I'm not gonna do it. Last time I started a thread I was trying to merge all the Calvin Johnson threads (yes, it was THAT long ago) and I got reamed out by Blondie for trying to get "my name in lights". Still having flashbacks from that.

 

But I agree, it's over and done with.

 

You think  you got reamed?  You should've seen her reaction, when I started a thread ranting about her boy, Rock Cartwright,  after he fumbled away a game. 

 

 

[SkinsPassion4Life]

Brian Quick signed a 1 year, 855k contract....great value signing