NIKKI8 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 If Raheem is retained... I'll be sad. I think that not only will he be retained but he will also have something added to his title, maybe assistant head coach defense or something like that. Just a feeling on my part though. Going to be a long year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jones Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 It is not talent alone. Though true, it is not about talent alone, one could argue that as a general rule it is. You can point to specific coaches or specific teams, but generally it is about the acquisition of talent. You give our coaching staff or many other coaching staffs in the NFL talent and they win games and go to the playoffs. You can also point to many great coaches that failed because of a lack of talent. So, I will add "generally speaking" to my original comment. Edit: To steal a post somewhere earlier, Fangio was ranked a high of 7th once with a low of 31 (twice) and didn't have a top five defense until he was given talent. On example yes, but I bet common among coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Though true, it is not about talent alone, one could argue that as a general rule it is. You can point to specific coaches or specific teams, but generally it is about the acquisition of talent. You give our coaching staff or many other coaching staffs in the NFL talent and they win games and go to the playoffs. You can also point to many great coaches that failed because of a lack of talent. So, I will add "generally speaking" to my original comment. The Ravens win year in and year out even though losing coordinator after coordinator. We even had the pleasure of hiring their defensive coordinator once. Talent trumps coaching 9 times out of 10. There is always an odd case like the 49ers where they had talent, but their coaching wasn't on point. If anyone doesn't realize, our biggest problem is talent. We aren't non competitive because of coaching. And we can't fix coaching and talent in one offseason. Baby steps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowhunter Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Is it bad talent or bad coaching that leaves our secondary confused and out of position? I'd lay that blame on coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdlives Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Fangio is WAY overrated on this board. Our defense will be young and mostly unknown going into next season. Move on. Fangio wouldn't have turned them into stars. San Fran was ripe for coaching with a great roster when he came in. We aren't there. Get over it. Hopefully our fans move on from thinking we are Super Bowl bound, and get excited about the concept of rebuilding from scratch. Enjoy youth and players we can hopefully hang our hats on for years. You can't have it both ways. Agreed on Fangio, but coaching is still important. Players need to be developed, taught and motivated. Play calling needs to be shrewd and clever. It's a combination of the two that creates the proper chemistry. We can start drafting talent, but their development will be stunted or worse if we have coaches that can't coach or develop talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacon Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Fangio is WAY overrated on this board. Our defense will be young and mostly unknown going into next season. Move on. Fangio wouldn't have turned them into stars. San Fran was ripe for coaching with a great roster when he came in. We aren't there. Get over it. Hopefully our fans move on from thinking we are Super Bowl bound, and get excited about the concept of rebuilding from scratch. Enjoy youth and players we can hopefully hang our hats on for years. You can't have it both ways. And this is a consolation for a poor DC hire how, exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Is it bad talent or bad coaching that leaves our secondary confused and out of position? I'd lay that blame on coaching. Yes it's bad talent and youth. I mean our best corner wasn't even a senior when we drafted him. Agreed on Fangio, but coaching is still important. Players need to be developed, taught and motivated. Agreed, but its the old chicken and the egg. We had bad talent on defense plus injuries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Think of every universally hailed coach across all sports. Then think of the players they coached. Were they great coaches? Sure (some more than others), but they were not alone. Its pretty simple what the problem is here. Weve tried every kind of coach, and signed every kind of player. What we hadn't done was sign and appoint someone that actually had business running personnel. Even if we're working with nothing but beans and franks, when you have a guy like Scot cooking, you know it'll taste better than someone elses NY strip... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 And this is a consolation for a poor DC hire how, exactly? Because we do a lot of coaching hires and every year we turn back and say, oh yeah we have no talent. It's groundhog day. We can continue it if you like. After 2 decades ya might say, wait lets draft some talent and then look for coaching. We do the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VRIEL1 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 This may be left field, but how about Charlie Weis as a QB coach? http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000366364/article/charlie-weis-thinks-dropback-quarterbacks-have-been-exposed "You're playing 11-on-10 football (without one)," Weis added. "If the quarterback is never going to carry the ball and is not a threat to the defense, and they don't have to worry about him, they're plus one as far as numbers go. I think by having the quarterback being able to be one of the guys that carries the ball, puts much more stress on the defense. "I think the true dropback quarterbacks have been exposed. And that's one of the reasons why I changed what we're doing." Has he ever held a job with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Dianna Marie Russini @NBCdianna 6m6 minutes ago Several sources say there is no truth to the claim that Vic Fangio didn't take the job in Washington because of Raheem Morris #Redskins Emmanual Benton @Manny_PPI 8m8 minutes ago Well, then RT @mikecwright: Heard Fangio wanted to bring Donatell to Redskins, but they wanted to keep Raheem Morris... hence Chicago. Dianna Marie Russini @NBCdianna 3m3 minutes ago Told candidates for the Redskins DC job were all told they can bring in any assistants they prefer. Nobody has job security on defense John Keim @john_keim 1m1 minute ago “@NBCdianna: Told candidates for the Redskins DC job were all told they can bring in any assistants they wanted.” ditto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormy Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Bears also got Adam Gase as their OC. Their coaching trio of Fox/Gase/Vangio is miles ahead of ours, yet it took em only 1 offseason. Exactly. Let the experts here explain to you why we have to play the waiting game with bottom of the barrel overseers like Gruden, Morris, Barry a couple of more years though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogofWar1 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Mike Jones @MikeJonesWaPo 11m11 minutes ago Redskins brass did want to keep Raheem Morris, but that wasn't sticking point for Fangio. Dueling reports, but weighs towards Jay's version of events. As for Chicago, they've quickly assembled a very high level coaching staff. Fox, Gase, Fangio, and Donatell are all solid. They won't make Chicago a SB contender on their own, but if they draft some decent talent they will go very far very quickly. The coaching staff will not limit their ceiling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knowledge316 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Bruce being Bruce. Must have Bucs associations to work for the BucSkins. Who was the guy during the season arguing about being patient and not giving up on Bruce after five games in year one? LOL Bruce is the #2 problem with this organization (#1 Danny boy). Bruce isn't going anywhere anytime soon since Danny is just a buffoon who has yet to learn a damn thing as an NFL owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovetoaster Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 That's the ESPN Bears reporter's tweet, so he's not some random insider. Chris Russell on air right now suggesting its accurate. But you never know. I don't see how it can be proved or disproved. I don't have any information, but I don't believe the report. And it perplexes me that Russell was on the air suggesting its accurate because he was on the air earlier today saying that he thought it was better than 50/50 that Morris is gone. I am almost certain that he said his gut feeling was that it is 60/40 that Raheem is leaving. So saying this new report is accurate is contradictory. If the Redskins want him to stay that bad, why did he say that he thinks he is gone? Not doubting what you heard, Skinsinparadise, but it is just contradictory to something he said earlier today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 This may be left field, but how about Charlie Weis as a QB coach? http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000366364/article/charlie-weis-thinks-dropback-quarterbacks-have-been-exposed "You're playing 11-on-10 football (without one)," Weis added. "If the quarterback is never going to carry the ball and is not a threat to the defense, and they don't have to worry about him, they're plus one as far as numbers go. I think by having the quarterback being able to be one of the guys that carries the ball, puts much more stress on the defense. "I think the true dropback quarterbacks have been exposed. And that's one of the reasons why I changed what we're doing." I think Weis is a bad scheme fit coming from an Erhardt-Perkins system and Jay being a WCO. But, its interesting to read dropback QBs as being exposed though. Its usually the opposite blanker statement I hear applied to QBs. I've always wonder why when a dropback QB has a bad game people say they had a bad game but when a "read-option/scrambler" has a bad game its a referendum on read-option or scrambling QBs as a group? I guess interpreation is in the eye of the beholder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilco_holland Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 One week you hire Scot, ES is positive! Made the best FO move of the NFL. Finally we have a true football GM. two weeks later we sign Barry, ES goes into meltdown again. Bruce sucks, Jay Sucks. I would be looking to the off-season like this: 1. Hired a football GM who will help us long term build a great roster. Insane good move. 2. We fired Haz. A man who was under a lot of pressure. We just needed a fresh face. Good move. 3. Jay hires Barry who he feels good about. Not the best move but I will give him a chance. If we have a good draft, FA and restructere scouting then I think this is one of the better offseasons. There will be a long term base for succes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HapHaszard Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Dianna Marie Russini @NBCdianna 4h4 hours ago Redskins fans were pulling their hair out waiting for a DC to be chosen, so which team's fans have it the worst right now? Dianna Marie Russini @NBCdianna 5h5 hours ago 49ers and Raiders still in hunt for DC. Raiders have their secondary coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HapHaszard Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Jason La Canfora @JasonLaCanfora 6h6 hours ago Skins could still end up changing secondary coaches from what I gather. hardly guaranteed Raheem Morris stays in that role Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Jason La Canfora @JasonLaCanfora 6h6 hours ago Skins could still end up changing secondary coaches from what I gather. hardly guaranteed Raheem Morris stays in that role So if this happens, will all the speculation about Morris being the reason why Vic didn't sign here go away? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AM626 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 So if this happens, will all the speculation about Morris being the reason why Vic didn't sign here go away? Yes it probably will, but it won't happen since Raheem is here to stay and is obviously one of the reasons Vic didn't sign here, or wasn't offered the job to be more specific. Bruce & Jay knew Vic was a package deal with Donatell and offering the job would mean canning or demoting Raheem which they weren't willing to do, besides they already hired Barry before the interview with Fangio. Keep in mind Raheem Morris hired Joe Barry after the whole Lions debacle, so you think Joe Barry doesn't owe him one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sekhmet187 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Yes it probably will, but it won't happen since Raheem is here to stay and is obviously one of the reasons Vic didn't sign here, or wasn't offered the job to be more specific. Bruce & Jay knew Vic was a package deal with Donatell and offering the job would mean canning or demoting Raheem which they weren't willing to do, besides they already hired Barry before the interview with Fangio. Keep in mind Raheem Morris hired Joe Barry after the whole Lions debacle, so you think Joe Barry doesn't owe him one? So you really believe that? I get that some fans are very eager to believe any bad report or news that reflects badly on Bruce Allen or Daniel Snyder around here, but why on Earth would they interview a guy and try to hire him but then say "sorry, we like you but we can't get rid of a position coach to bring you n here good luck elsewhere"? I don't buy it at all, not even a little bit and it just strikes me as a story that has legs because of conflicting reports and people willing to believe Allen wouldn't hire a guy because he wants to keep someone less important. My guess is that Fangio slept on it and did the math that in Chicago he has job security and in Washington he'd be under a coach that might get canned next season. Who would you pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HapHaszard Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 John Keim @john_keim 17m17 minutes ago Redskins wake-up call: Assistant coaches: Not a lot of reason for wake-up calls in the offseason, bu... http://es.pn/185rEnu #Redskins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HapHaszard Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 ProFootballTalk @ProFootballTalk 38s38 seconds ago Ed Donatell joins Vic Fangio on Bears staff http://wp.me/p14QSB-9GY5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterPinstripe Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Yes it probably will, but it won't happen since Raheem is here to stay and is obviously one of the reasons Vic didn't sign here, or wasn't offered the job to be more specific. Bruce & Jay knew Vic was a package deal with Donatell and offering the job would mean canning or demoting Raheem which they weren't willing to do, besides they already hired Barry before the interview with Fangio. Keep in mind Raheem Morris hired Joe Barry after the whole Lions debacle, so you think Joe Barry doesn't owe him one? Except that multiple people have reported that not only is that not the case, but that Raheem may still be fired and someone else could be brought in. People are constantly looking for any reason at all to jump on Bruce and Gruden, will quickly believe anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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