Officially worse then Zorn/Spurrier. I am totally defeated as a fan

[Conn]

I've said it before.

 

This team will never ever win a title again. It's cursed.

 

Dead serious

Believing in curses is worse than the Skins coaching.

[MONTEY]

Vikings game did it for me. As in no longer giving them a doubt. This team as a whole is flawed. On all sides of the ball no matter the coach, QB, owner. I will allways wonder about about this season of regression for all to see. And pray that this wiil be the last peice of crap that this organization produces. If it means fireing the Shanahans then yes do it. I am so damn embarresed it's allmost unbearable.

[Destino]

The Redskins passing game went from good to horrible. The defense is still terrible. Special teams went from not good enough to spectacularly bad. All 4 years into a rebuild when the team is supposed to be hitting its stride. The team didn't take a step back, they stumbled right off of a damn cliff.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Believing in curses is worse than the Skins coaching.

I don't literally believe in a curse but I do believe that some cities/franchises are just snakebitten and stuck in suck.

 

Cleveland, Buffalo, and Washington (who lucked in Gibbs for a decade plus)

[moondog]

I do disagree with the part about not knowing what it takes to fix this. Snyder continues to be the problem. The Redskins are a dysfunctional organization with this clown in charge surrounded by his posse of yes men and ass kissers. I will articulate more clearly in a thread later this week

 

 

I look forward to this thread. I'm assuming it has to do with Snyder still being buddies with his key players, which undermines the coach to a certain extent. 

[Rodriggo]

I really didn't think they could but they've managed to turn gold into ****.

 

They finally manage to find a once in a lifetime talent and in a season and a half have broken him mind, body, and soul.

 

Now it's about finding a great coach again, year after that a receiver, then a corner, then another HC again, it never ends........it never ends.

[shakinaiken]

Gibbs 2 with Vinny > old ego and Bruce

 

I feel like Michael Scott when he realized Toby returned to the office. sigh... i'm so downtrodden. i need another hobby

[worldpost]

I just deleted a long winded post.. If you say Zorn and Spurrier is a better coach that Shanahan, you really need to step away from football and take up the NBA ....

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

I look forward to this thread. I'm assuming it has to do with Snyder still being buddies with his key players, which undermines the coach to a certain extent.

Shanny is here largely because he's Dan's buddy (or was).

[SkinsHokieFan]

I just deleted a long winded post.. If you say Zorn and Spurrier is a better coach that Shanahan, you really need to step away from football and take up the NBA ....

 

Never said they are better coaches.

 

This feeling right now is just worse 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I didn't think we would be this bad this year, but I guess I'm not as shocked as everyone else seems to be. We beat zero elite teams last year (minus the Ravens miracle), our rookie QB was coming off of an ACL, and we drafted two late round safeties to fix our secondary. One is out, the other is struggling.

Defenses took away our PA pistol plays, and our OL isn't good enough to block anything other than a 3 step drop. I'd love to go vertical more, but Griff holds the ball too long and the protection breaks down.

Our run D looks fine at times, but we can't cover a blind dog on roller skates on the outside, and our LBs suck in coverage.

We rode the hot hand last year, and in retrospect, probably played waaaay over our heads down the stretch. The same problems this year were there last year, if you were being completely honest with yourselves.

I am not surprised that we got manhandled by the 49ers, they are a super solid football team.

Griff is taking a beating back there, and our WRs are easy to shut down. We really missed JReed out there tonight, and we've missed Hank the last couple of weeks. Yes...Hankerson.

Last year was the perfect storm of awesome, this year is the perfect storm of vomit. I just think we are really handcuffed on both sides of the ball, and I hope whatever direction we go will be the right one.

However, I will never stop loving my Skins. Ever. I still believe in Griff. He's a smart guy, he'll get this thing figured out.

Hail.

[88Comrade2000]

I've said it before.

 

This team will never ever win a title again. It's cursed.

 

Dead serious

No, it will win a title again when pro football becomes flag football as it's slowly becoming,

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

I just deleted a long winded post.. If you say Zorn and Spurrier is a better coach that Shanahan, you really need to step away from football and take up the NBA ....

Jim Zorn had a more effective passing offense with Jason Campbell and a historically bad OL than Shanny has with one of the greatest QB prospects ever.

I think if you replaced RGIII with prime Elway or Young he'd still **** all over himself. Shanny sucks as a HC.

[worldpost]

Never said they are better coaches.

 

This feeling right now is just worse 

I apologize.. I misread your post..   I have seen others saying Zorn and Spurrier were better coaches, which boggle my mind.

[Ghost of]

I know it seems bad, Ish, but keep in mind that in spite of this "professional" leadership, Haslett, whose woes were well-documented by KDawg (and Boswell actually responds in the comments section of his own article with KDawg stats, it seems) shows how bad Haslett has been in his career.  And THAT is the person that Shanahan chose to not only lead a transition to a system that didn't need to be adopted, but has KEPT FOR FOUR YEARS.  Even after last year, I would have fired Haslett, because apparently a lot of the good stuff that happened was on-field adjustments by Fletcher and others.  We had multiple chances to hire credible 3-4 coordinators and didn't.  

 

Then the Keith Burns hire.  Why is SLowik in the league?  Why did Snyder allow Shanahan full control, when that arrangement has almost ALWAYS led to disaster on a team?  Why did he not force his hand to fire HAslett a couple years ago?  Why was Rocca kept around? 

 

This is why I have hope---because only a moron would keep Haslett for as long as he has and I've noticed that SHanahan does NOT hold coaches accountable, only players.  I don't think people FIGHT for Shanahan either, they may fight for each other but not for him.  

 

It's going to get better.  I fully believe that you or I could have made better hiring decisions at coordinator.

[SkinsHokieFan]

 

 

It's going to get better.  I fully believe that you or I could have made better hiring decisions at coordinator.

 

I agree, but that is my even bigger concern.

 

Such obvious things are overlooked by lifetime football men, who have succeeded and won Superbowls.

 

Will anyone actually come in here and make the right decisions? 

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I'm pretty much out of ideas. I've spent 8 years here coming up with all kinds of half-assed plans and, during the last four years, some of those plans actually seemed to finally be in place. And we stink.

 

Tonight's game really felt like a litmus test. The 49ers have talent up and down the roster and the Skins do not. The 49ers know who they are and what they want to do on both sides of the ball. The Skins do not. It's just a breakdown of everything.

 

I'm not even sure what needs to be addressed first. I guess the dumpster fire of a secondary. But we also run a 3-4 without any middle linebackers, which strikes me as a problem.

 

I'm not as down on the o-line as most. But it's not great. I'm also not really sure what it is even supposed to be. We don't seem to have any philosophy.

 

We also have a severe lack of playmakers. I mean, Morris is a nice back and Garcon is pretty good, but I don't think teams are afraid that anyone is going to run away from them.

 

Oh, and special teams are just a mess. A total mess.

 

I don't think I want to start over with a new staff even though I'm pretty much done with this one. I think they came up with a magic trick last year that took three months to solve. Well, it's solved and they have no plan B.

 

But, what do we do? Bring in a new D-coordinator and put in a 4-3? Try to run Stanford's "sophisticated Neanderthal" offense with this undersized o-line? Try to run Baylor's offense which means more quick screens for everyone and almost certain death for RGIII? Try to steal Bill O'Brien with the mission of turning RGIII into Tom Brady?

 

Do we really subject on our new QB to a fun offseason of brand new everything? If there is some kind of tension between him and Shanahan, would Danny be creating a monster if he lets RGIII "win?"

 

I'm spent. I'll be on board with anything right now, I think.

[Ghost of]

I do disagree with the part about not knowing what it takes to fix this. Snyder continues to be the problem. The Redskins are a dysfunctional organization with this clown in charge surrounded by his posse of yes men and ass kissers. I will articulate more clearly in a thread later this week

 

People are still aiming at Snyder? Really?  I mean, if you make the link from Snyder and Shanny being buddies or the like, I can understand but ultimately you can't tell me that Snyder didn't want to fire Haslett years ago---he didn't because he's "not interfering."  If he exerted pressure to select Griffin that still doesn't tell me THAT is why the onfield product is so terrible.

 

Here is a key issue.  I have a friend who knows a lot of football players (in the NFL) and knows Denver well.  Many of the faults you see here are ones he tells me Shanahan displayed in Denver. Hell, when Shanahan was hired, some of us were skeptical that he'd be a GREAT hire because of the fact he for some reason has terrible defenses.  At some point, you'd LUCK INTO a good defense.  I believe Shanahan really IS the source of most of the problems, even if he is also a source of some positive changes. 

 

I'm not going to buy into a "blame Snyder" line of thinking unless we link that to the hiring of Shanahan in the first place, because it smacks of an easily convenient scapegoating of an unpopular figure.  Meanwhile, the facts on the field speak for themselves.  Hell, Dallas is a better team and Jerry Jones is the acknowledged GM.  They still get better results and make better hires than we do.  They have had issues but at least they've been competitive.

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

I agree, but that is my even bigger concern.

Such obvious things are overlooked by lifetime football men, who have succeeded and won Superbowls.

Will anyone actually come in here and make the right decisions?

Yes, because Shanahan has never been a qualified NFL HC. He's really a Norv-esque coach except with a fake hardass persona and 2 SB rings from going to a team on the cusp. He sucks at the actual strategic management of the game.

The military guys on the board can correct me on the right terms, but Shanny is like a field commander promoted to theater strategic command - he was a good tactician but as a strategic general he is and always has been waaaaaaaaay over his head - he simply doesn't have the skillset.

[zoony]

People are still aiming at Snyder? Really?  I mean, if you make the link from Snyder and Shanny being buddies or the like, I can understand but ultimately you can't tell me that Snyder didn't want to fire Haslett years ago---he didn't because he's "not interfering."  If he exerted pressure to select Griffin that still doesn't tell me THAT is why the onfield product is so terrible.

 

Here is a key issue.  I have a friend who knows a lot of football players (in the NFL) and knows Denver well.  Many of the faults you see here are ones he tells me Shanahan displayed in Denver. Hell, when Shanahan was hired, some of us were skeptical that he'd be a GREAT hire because of the fact he for some reason has terrible defenses.  At some point, you'd LUCK INTO a good defense.  I believe Shanahan really IS the source of most of the problems, even if he is also a source of some positive changes. 

 

I'm not going to buy into a "blame Snyder" line of thinking unless we link that to the hiring of Shanahan in the first place, because it smacks of an easily convenient scapegoating of an unpopular figure.  Meanwhile, the facts on the field speak for themselves.  Hell, Dallas is a better team and Jerry Jones is the acknowledged GM.  They still get better results and make better hires than we do.  They have had issues but at least they've been competitive.

You're missing the forest for the trees. Look for that thread

[Ghost of]

I agree, but that is my even bigger concern.

 

Such obvious things are overlooked by lifetime football men, who have succeeded and won Superbowls.

 

Will anyone actually come in here and make the right decisions? 

 

Sure they will.  Look at Cleveland.  How long did it take Lombardi to move immediately past Holmgren and trade a bum RB bust and replace the QB?  When has Shanahan, besides with his players, shown the need to move past a mistake with coaching? WHen has a Shanahan team been really disciplined and not earned large numbers of penalties (though sometimes watching I get the impression the refs are biased against MIke personally)?  When has Shanahan shown, AT ANY POINT HERE, good clock management or even replay challenge judgment?

 

I think the problem is that Mike, somewhat like Joe Gibbs, is past his prime.  In the NFL, it is really no longer about having that old, experienced coach.  It's about striking gold with a good young or middle-aged hire.  Sure, it'll blow up in your face occasionally but the retread thing has got to go.  Because you see guys who make strange decisions because we literally do not inhabit the same decision-making universe they do, they've let ego, pride or insistence on PLAYER accountability (but never coaches) cloud them.  Ask yourself why Josh Morgan, who made some plays out there was deactivated...was it really because he can't make a play at wideout or did his poor special teams play earn him a trip to the doghouse?  What is it with Shanahan and certain players? Maybe HIS WAY or the highway is one reason the team is in the mess it's in?   

 

I think you see bad decisions in any organization, but the consistent FAILURE To make the right and EASY decision (D Coordinator) is a product of getting a coach with TOO much of a track record of success and is given authority that successful teams DO NOT GRANT to coaches anymore.

 

The real bad decision was letting Mike be GM too, and letting him insist on bringing failures as coaches here AND RETAIN THEM For years.  If Shanahan insisted on that, I would have never hired him.  Snyder is responsible, in that sense, since there really ARE times when he needs to step in (or avoid hiring someone) to get the team in a better position.  I think there is an overemphasis on NOT meddling that has actually hindered the team.

[nuposse87]

Mike should be fired tomorrow morning. Haslett as well. Promote Raheem Morris to interim headcoach/D-Coordinator and let him and Kyle finish off the season. There is literally no point in letting Haslett or Shanny stick around. If we're going to get blown out at home, might as well look at other guys. I'm kinda happy this is happening. Never thought Shanny was legit anyways. Better to purge ourselves of that parasite sooner the later. 

[Rufus T Firefly]

[Ghost of]

Yes, because Shanahan has never been a qualified NFL HC. He's really a Norv-esque coach except with a fake hardass persona and 2 SB rings from going to a team on the cusp. He sucks at the actual strategic management of the game.

The military guys on the board can correct me on the right terms, but Shanny is like a field commander promoted to theater strategic command - he was a good tactician but as a strategic general he is and always has been waaaaaaaaay over his head - he simply doesn't have the skillset.

 

I think Shanahan is an example that sometimes institutional cultures (meaning coaching, NFL and college ranks more broadly) inhibit innovation in management within organizations, including the various means by which people can be made successful and NOT placed in positions of authority (or vested with overarching decision-making power) where they will hurt themselves and the org.

 

In this case, Shanahan may actually be a decent GM, I am not terribly disappointed with his picks, he's made some good ones and NOT selecting Gabbert or being desperate for a QB until the right draft may have been a great move for us.  Shanahan is made for some sort of hybrid OC-personnel role but giving him total authority was not only a mistake in hindsight but was something many of us pointed out is NOT SUCCESSFUL in today's game.

 

Compounding that sin is his utterly atrocious decisions regarding defense, not only here but in Denver.  What I do not understand is that moving to a 3-4 was already "behind the times" and there had been some signifiicant struggles with doing so for other teams, though it does seem to increase turnovers.  Like Nardelli at Home Depot, he decided it was more important to make HIS mark on an organization, rather than allow the successful aspects to flourish and then refining or restructuring those that do not.  

 

At some point, a person becomes invested in an image of their own competence and expertise and they cannot even be hired in their appropriate role, nor can they be successfully countermanded (except via firing) because to do so would be too great a blow to the ego. Does anyone think Mike would hand over GM duties and still fully invest himself in coaching?

 

Does anyone watch games the last 4 years and say to themselves: Wow, this guy is great at time management!!

 

From watching the last 4 seasons I can say that, barring a few exceptional moments, we were superior in clock management under Gibbs than we are now.

[Cooleyfan1993]

I don't literally believe in a curse but I do believe that some cities/franchises are just snakebitten and stuck in suck.

 

Cleveland, Buffalo, and Washington (who lucked in Gibbs for a decade plus)

 

ok...or how about, all 3 teams have had bad QBs? weeden/campbell/whoever else for the browns, whoever the worthless bills QBs have been, grossman, beck, mcnabb for skins. as well as bad coaching. it has nothing to do with a team being "snakebitten" or "stuck in suck".