Welcome to the Commanders Emmanuel Forbes CB Mississippi State

[stoshuaj]

“love the length beyond his frame (?, wth does this even mean)

 

reminds me of a poor man's deion sanders.

 

Darrell Green

 

 Plays much bigger than his size.

 

Washington w/ Forbes, BSJ, Kendall Fuller, Kamren Curl & Darrick Forrest has the potential for an elite secondary

 

the way he moves kind of reminds me of deion

 

Were gonna be thrilled we got him when hes giving us short fields and taking balls to the house next year

 

he has champ bailey written all over him.”

Oh ES, never change 

[Conn]

Fair, there are always homers and optimists. But I feel Forbes was the most instantly distrusted 1st rounder we’ve had around here in a while. Almost everyone wanted Gonzalez and was confused as hell 

 

Jamin Davis was pretty bad as well but at least was an NFL sized player 

[RWJ]

There are some players on this team given the right HC and coaches that coaches will bring the best of what each player has out of them.  Some/few might contribute.  

[petey hodge]

that endzone play against the cowboys today...

[method man]

6 hours ago, Conn said:

Fair, there are always homers and optimists. But I feel Forbes was the most instantly distrusted 1st rounder we’ve had around here in a while. Almost everyone wanted Gonzalez and was confused as hell 

 

Jamin Davis was pretty bad as well but at least was an NFL sized player 

I think that the depth and instant success of many in the CB class has pushed many to write Forbes off quickly. Ultimately, he finishes with the same PFF rating as Deonte Banks and showed improvement in the 2nd half of the year vs the 1st half. 
 

I am optimistic he can get to #2 corner level production with an offseason of work on his technique and with a good secondary coach/scheme.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

6 hours ago, Conn said:

Fair, there are always homers and optimists. But I feel Forbes was the most instantly distrusted 1st rounder we’ve had around here in a while. Almost everyone wanted Gonzalez and was confused as hell 

 

Jamin Davis was pretty bad as well but at least was an NFL sized player 

Not just distrusted, but least hyped.  I actually liked Davis, and was hopeful for him - he at least looked the part.  
 

I was on a golf trip in OC the first night of the draft and we went to a bar to eat and watch.  Most people in the bar were like “who?” when we made the selection for Forbes.  Then they show the tape and see the highlights of a baby deer and it only led to more looks of “huh, what, why?”.

Edited January 8 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[philibusters]

On 1/8/2024 at 5:58 AM, method man said:

I think that the depth and instant success of many in the CB class has pushed many to write Forbes off quickly. Ultimately, he finishes with the same PFF rating as Deonte Banks and showed improvement in the 2nd half of the year vs the 1st half. 
 

I am optimistic he can get to #2 corner level production with an offseason of work on his technique and with a good secondary coach/scheme.

 

He finished one point lower than Deonte Banks.  He finished 2 points higher than Derek Stingley finished last year asa a rookie (Stingley was the #3 overall pick in the 2022 draft and made a huge leap in year 2 and is now considered a good young player).  Forbes struggled, but his struggles were not unprecedented for top 10 corners picks.  Some corners take a step forward after year 1 struggles and some don't.  Let us hope Forbes is one of the ones who takes a step forward.

[The Hangman- C_Hanburger]

12 minutes ago, philibusters said:

 

He finished one point lower than Deonte Banks.  He finished 2 points higher than Derek Stingley finished last year asa a rookie (Stingley was the #3 overall pick in the 2022 draft and made a huge leap in year 2 and is now considered a good young player).  Forbes struggled, but his struggles were not unprecedented for top 10 corners picks.  Some corners take a step forward after year 1 struggles and some don't.  Let us hope Forbes is one of the ones who takes a step forward.

Lets see how much muscle/weight he can put on in the off season without slowing him down. The new coach wouldn't have put a rookie on top receivers out of the gate. He needs to ditch the "fly" routine though...Lets face it..the WHOLE D sucked and the coaches did NOTHING to adjust. Fresh Start..see what he looks like in May....

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I’m still thinking that Forbes and Quan will be good players for us. 

[Rogue Jedi]

I haven't quite given up on him yet either. The skillset is there, he just needs to translate it from the film room and coaching. 

 

Trevon Diggs is another good CB that put it together in year 2.

[RWJ]

Hopefully some real coaches can get the most out of these players.  We shall see.  

[Est.1974]

Can someone feed him up in the off-season.

[Warhead36]

I can live with him getting killed by guys like Brown, Diggs, and Moore. That's gonna happen to any CB 1 on 1 man coverage with no pass rush and honestly doesn't bother me all that much.

 

But he was lauded for his ball skills and his ball skills sucked. Straight up sucked. Looked awkward and clumsy every time the ball was in the air. He had one pick all year and it was a gift from Russel Wilson and even then he was stumbling and bumbling and nearly fumbled the ball away.

 

I was expecting D Hall like ball skills. Nowhere close, not even in the same universe.

[The Consigliere]

Not easy playing in a division with AJ Brown, Lamb and Devonta Smith. All that being said, I think these three things are my gut instinctual sense since day 1:

 

1. They were idiots and went for a system/trait pick instead of a talent pick. Much like 2022, and 2021, instead of peeling the best talent off the board, they went after fit and trait, and butchered the picks horribly in 2 of 3 years, and moderately in the Dotson year. The passing on Gonzalez piece was particularly oafish and made his struggles standout so much more. It had the feel of late period Al Davis picks where he went off the board, and you knew it wasn't because he was a genius, but unfortunately, instead, utterly clueless. If you go that far off the board, you have to hit and when you miss terribly, it just looks truly awful. 

 

2. In fairness to Forbes, he did have a grade in that 20-45 zone, so it's not really that he was a massive reach, just more that he was an idiotic pick when you have a top 5ish talent whose fallen in your lap, you pass on him, and then it makes you look stupid if on top of that he underperforms. The good news is that as others have said his play improved over time, and by the end he was looking a bit more like he should have, a solid enough CB prospect with the upside to be startable, but not a linch pin anything. 

 

3. This needs to be noted, the projection lines typically with draftees that suck in year 1 is generally speaking horrible. There are always exceptions, but most players that are disasters year 1 are disasters, period. That's the cautionary bit here. Its a good sign that he went from unplayable, total failure, to playabale during the second half of the season but its never a good sign when a prospect face plants in year 1, the regression tree analysis for any prospect positional cohort that addresses year 1 disasters always shows a very small, very limited amount of prospects that actually develop into something great or something average. It happens, but when you feed the data of a terrible rookie year into analysis like that, your player is gonna be a pretty big outlier if they become actively useful and quality, and still an outlier if they become a league average starter. So for now anyway, bust is probably the most likely outcome. 

[Warhead36]

3 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

This needs to be noted, the projection lines typically with draftees that suck in year 1 is generally speaking horrible. There are always exceptions, but most players that are disasters year 1 are disasters, period.

Yep that's the issue here as well. The great players in the NFL are pretty much good right away and then eventually grow into studs. Its very rare for a guy to just completely suck early on and then develop into anything decent. There are always exceptions of course but even look at our team. Josh Doctson sucked right away and ended up always sucking. On the flip side, Terry McLaurin looked the part right away and developed into a Pro Bowl caliber WR.

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I’m still thinking that Forbes and Quan will be good players for us. 

 

Quan is the Sam Cosmi second rounder who is clearly better and more ready than the first rounder from the Commanders' class. But I think Forbes will be good too.  Jamin was a disaster as a rookie, and he's ended up becoming a solid player.  I think Forbes will be better.  He was better than Jamin as a rookie, and better in college too.

 

Quan has Probowl upside, and I think he makes a leap next year and then gets really good by year three.

 

Our fans were too quick to give up on this draft class.  Can't write a draft class off after one year.  I think the two DBs, CRod, and one of the two OLs end up becoming good players.

[illone]

Forbes has a shot in camp, but reinforcements will be acquired in case he ****s the bed. Wont shock me he gets cut, his confidence is the key and might be shot from this disastrous season.

 

Hopefully he is putting in the work this off-season right alongside Howell and some other guys. Will be interesting to see how the new coaches view him...

[method man]

4 hours ago, The Hangman- C_Hanburger said:

Lets see how much muscle/weight he can put on in the off season without slowing him down. The new coach wouldn't have put a rookie on top receivers out of the gate. He needs to ditch the "fly" routine though...Lets face it..the WHOLE D sucked and the coaches did NOTHING to adjust. Fresh Start..see what he looks like in May....

 

As Keim likes to say, the weight isn't the major issue. The issue is that he played with bad technique, especially in the first half of the season. He needs to focus on cleaning that up first and foremost. To his credit, his technique seemed to improve incrementally in the second half of the season. He needs to really focus on that this offseason...a real pass rush next year will also help him look better.

 

Again, my take is go sign a proven starting corner (Peters's find Lenoir will be available in FA I believe) and let Forbes and St Juste fight it out for the other starting corner spot. I bet at least one of the two bounces back next year. It also helps we play the NFC South and AFC North next year. Both divisions currently lack a #2 receiver worth a damn (outside of the Bengals who are probably losing Higgins)

[Warhead36]

I liked what I saw from Martin. I think he's got a place in this league as a nickel/safety hybrid type. Its gonna be on the new DC to figure out creative ways to use him. But the talent is there.

[Darrell Green Fan]

4 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

I can live with him getting killed by guys like Brown, Diggs, and Moore. That's gonna happen to any CB 1 on 1 man coverage with no pass rush and honestly doesn't bother me all that much.

 

But he was lauded for his ball skills and his ball skills sucked. Straight up sucked. Looked awkward and clumsy every time the ball was in the air. He had one pick all year and it was a gift from Russel Wilson and even then he was stumbling and bumbling and nearly fumbled the ball away.

 

I was expecting D Hall like ball skills. Nowhere close, not even in the same universe.

This is where I am as well  His weight never really bothered me too much, but as you said like D Brown when given the opportunity to make a play he never seemed to come away with the ball.  I'm not overly optimistic that he can be much more than a depth piece.  

[method man]

2 hours ago, illone said:

Forbes has a shot in camp, but reinforcements will be acquired in case he ****s the bed. Wont shock me he gets cut, his confidence is the key and might be shot from this disastrous season.

 

Hopefully he is putting in the work this off-season right alongside Howell and some other guys. Will be interesting to see how the new coaches view him...

He is not getting cut. He is guaranteed his contract for 4 years. Worst case, he is a depth piece who is kept around until his contract runs out

[Command The 414]

As bad as he was in 23’ (and he was bad) I still wanna see what he might be able to do w/a new DC and DB coaches… 

[illone]

2 hours ago, method man said:

He is not getting cut. He is guaranteed his contract for 4 years. Worst case, he is a depth piece who is kept around until his contract runs out

 

 

Im here for it. I made a similar argument for Howell the other day, so what you're saying makes sense.  The best outcome is he wipes last year from his memory and comes in with a renewed energy, but I dont think you can go into next year assuming that to be the case. Either way Im rooting for the kid. It would be a large setback to have invested a 1st round pick in a guy that isn't able to produce on the field.

[mh86]

1 hour ago, Command The 414 said:

As bad as he was in 23’ (and he was bad) I still wanna see what he might be able to do w/a new DC and DB coaches… 

Same. I’m not very optimistic about it, but it’s possible that a new scheme and new coaching could help. watching some of the angles he took that turned into big time receptions combined with his poor tackling gives me serious doubts. Unless he turns out to be a solid starting corner, we will always remember it as a wasted pick.

Edited January 18 by mh86

[Wyvern]

I thought Forbes tackling seemed very poor, some complete whiffs and a few soft tackles that his opponent easily broke through. But, Forbes has that 1st round draft-pick's contract, so I suspect he'll be on the roster for a season or two, with Washington coaches trying to develop his skill set as much as possible.  But with that scrawny frame, and from what I saw from his Mississippi State games, he's going to have problems with RBs, TEs, and the burlier WRs headed around to his side.  I also think he's going to rack up some unnecessary taunting fouls; he came close a few times this season, and when he really didn't have much to taunt about.

 

I did like how Quan played -- seems like he'll turn out okay for Washington. 

 

 

Edited January 18 by Wyvern