The (New) Offensive Line Thread

[method man]

The OLs are Leno, Paul, Stromberg, Cosmi, Wylie, Lucas, Daniels, Gates and Charles with Larsen on PUP

[Darrell Green Fan]

5 hours ago, method man said:

The OLs are Leno, Paul, Stromberg, Cosmi, Wylie, Lucas, Daniels, Gates and Charles with Larsen on PUP

I don't know how anyone can be excited at this group, they don't have one player we can call really good. I get RR's desire for position flexibility but that can come at a cost. What's the saying "jack of all master of none" when it comes to contractors?  Why can't we find players that are really good at guard or tackle and then have a few swing players?  Instead we appear to have an entire OL made up of players with no defined position. They apparently will start a RT who is better at OG.  

Edited April 30, 2023 by Darrell Green Fan

[DWinzit]

It seems apparent Norwell is a goner. If that is true, LG is the only true position in question. It will be a big battle to find the winner...maybe Paul.

 

[Warhead36]

1 hour ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

I don't know how anyone can be excited at this group, they don't have one player we can call really good. I get RR's desire for position flexibility but that can come at a cost. What's the saying "jack of all master of none" when it comes to contractors?  Why can't we find players that are really good at guard or tackle and then have a few swing players?  Instead we appear to have an entire OL made up of players with no defined position. They apparently will start a RT who is better at OG.  

Agreed. I don't mind backups having position flex but I want my starters to be rock solid at their positions. 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

I wonder if they might consider moving Roullier to guard. I know cutting him saves us some cap space but I don’t see why they would cut him this year (if he’s healthy). 
 

I think Roullier is an underrated player and I’d like to see him on the roster this season.

Edited May 1, 2023 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy

[MrJL]

37 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I wonder if they might consider moving Roullier to guard. I know cutting him saves us some cap space but I don’t see why they would cut him this year (if he’s healthy). 
 

I think Roullier is an undefeated player and I’d like to see him on the roster this season.

 

I would like that too

[Koolblue13]

Leno, Gates, Roullier, Whyle, Lucas is our best starting 5 OL

[kingdaddy]

58 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I wonder if they might consider moving Roullier to guard. I know cutting him saves us some cap space but I don’t see why they would cut him this year (if he’s healthy). 
 

I think Roullier is an undefeated player and I’d like to see him on the roster this season.

If Roullier is one of our best linemen then we can't afford to cut him. We need him with a rookie QB taking over. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

19 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Leno, Gates, Roullier, Whyle, Lucas is our best starting 5 OL

 

I agree with this but will it happen?  Seems there is a whole lot of talk about Wylie at RT and Cosmi at OG.   

 

I don't understand the talk about cutting productive players.  The cap is still in decent shape, they don't need to do anything drastic and do not look to be making any splash signings at this point, and again this staff is on the clock so why wouldn't they keep players who can still help them?

 

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Darrell Green Fan

[MartinC]

On 5/1/2023 at 3:03 PM, Darrell Green Fan said:

 

I agree with this but will it happen?  Seems there is a whole lot of talk about Wylie at RT and Cosmi at OG.   

 

I don't understand the talk about cutting productive players.  The cap is still in decent shape, they don't need to do anything drastic and do not look to be making any splash signings at this point, and again this staff is on the clock so why wouldn't they keep players who can still help them?

 

 

 

We’ve only got just over $2M of cap space and need more than that just to sign our rookies - plus we will need circa $5M on top of the rookies to cover injuries etc. We have to make some moves. It’s seems to be the consensus among the beat guys that Roulier and Norwell are being cut.

[Morneblade]

The more and more I think about this, the more and more I'm not happy. Everyone knows Ron seems to favor "position flex" over seemingly everything else. I think that creates a OL that is not very good. I'm fine with that for reserves, but I'd much rather have experts, not swiss army knives as starters. And now that the draft is over I'm having more questions with the offense in general.

 

I look at the OL and see a smaller, mobile bunch, but power running backs. They seem completely incompatible. If I wanted a sledgehammer, I'd have 330 pounders blowing people off the ball, with big back that run over the secondary. Or, I'd go with a lighter line, run a zone read with explosive, 1 cut backs that can take it to the house on any play.

 

I really don't understand how this is going to work.

 

I don't watch football like I used to, and I'm not as up to date on Offensive trends as I have been in the past. So, there might be a lot that I'm missing. If so, PLEASE enlighten me.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

We need to stop complaining about anything and everything. Especially when data doesn't back up the complaints.

 

The best guard in the league had position flex entering the league. OT/OG prospect Zach Martin. He's now 6 time All-Pro at Guard and likely going to the HoF. When injuries hit he's the emergency OT, which has happened a few times.

 

Brandon Scherff was another. He made multiple pro bowls.

 

Eagles love drafting Centers with Guard flex. Both of their starting Guards were drafted as Centers. Dickerson made the pro bowl last year because his flexibility let them optimize their starting lineup.

 

Position flex is great, we want position flex.

[mojo]

On 4/30/2023 at 5:44 PM, Darrell Green Fan said:

I don't know how anyone can be excited at this group, they don't have one player we can call really good. I get RR's desire for position flexibility but that can come at a cost. What's the saying "jack of all master of none" when it comes to contractors?  Why can't we find players that are really good at guard or tackle and then have a few swing players?  Instead we appear to have an entire OL made up of players with no defined position. They apparently will start a RT who is better at OG.  

[UK Skins]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

The more and more I think about this, the more and more I'm not happy. Everyone knows Ron seems to favor "position flex" over seemingly everything else. I think that creates a OL that is not very good. I'm fine with that for reserves, but I'd much rather have experts, not swiss army knives as starters. And now that the draft is over I'm having more questions with the offense in general.

 

 

Love this post Morneblade. I see the UDFA tackle is now being called a tweener, and Daniels certainly sounds like a guard, not a tackle. None of the FAs sound like tackles (yeah I know one of them played tackle in the Superbowl but come on). It's almost as if our management think they are cleverer than they really are. Let's sign a bunch of guard-sized people and hope one of them can actually play tackle. They did the same with Cosmi last year.

 

We're going to end up with a bunch of under-sized linemen who get destroyed by our NFC East opponents.

[skinzplay]

I predict that Brooks will see real regular season action before Daniels, who will be conveniently be BubbaTyer'd.

[Warhead36]

I do like that our OL seems to be more mobile and athletic. That fits what EB wants to do. Just not sure our backs fit that style, other than maybe Gibson but he's really more of a RB/WR hybrid type and should be used more in that fashion.

[Est.1974]

In the circumstances I reckon we’ve done a good job of upgrading the OL group. Next year we’ll add a stud LT, either in FA or via the draft.

[Morneblade]

2 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

I do like that our OL seems to be more mobile and athletic. That fits what EB wants to do. Just not sure our backs fit that style, other than maybe Gibson but he's really more of a RB/WR hybrid type and should be used more in that fashion.

 

And I get that. I don't really like it, I'm much more of a big, physical OL (yes, I'm a dinosaur). But I do get it. But I don't think we have RB's that match that. And the one RB we drafted definitely does not. I also get you can't turn over a roster in 1 year, but why draft a bruiser that isn't fast, or quick? Like I said, I don't see how that's going to work well. Why didn't we try for that in the 3rd round? Even later, and not blow a pick to move up to get ANOTHER DE? I really don't understand.

 

But, I don't know if that is a new trend or not. I haven't followed the NFL like I used to the last several years, and I know I'm not up to snuff on new offensive trends

[Morneblade]

5 hours ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

We need to stop complaining about anything and everything. Especially when data doesn't back up the complaints.

 

The best guard in the league had position flex entering the league. OT/OG prospect Zach Martin. He's now 6 time All-Pro at Guard and likely going to the HoF. When injuries hit he's the emergency OT, which has happened a few times.

 

Brandon Scherff was another. He made multiple pro bowls.

 

Eagles love drafting Centers with Guard flex. Both of their starting Guards were drafted as Centers. Dickerson made the pro bowl last year because his flexibility let them optimize their starting lineup.

 

Position flex is great, we want position flex.

 

This isn't the case. You talk about Martin and Scherff. Both were looked at as playing G in the NFL.

 

Trent Williams was a RT that could play LT. And is still doing it really well.

However, literally none of these guys were "position flex". College tackles that that projected to Guards because they lacked traits. Or a RT that was physically gifted enough to play LT.

Drafting players because "they can play here, here, and here" get you a guy that won't do any of them well. Which is what we have right now, and it's a OL that was ranked 24th in the league. Not good. Did we upgrade? Not in FA. I like Stromberg, but I think we could have got him later. In a era where literally everywhere else is full of specialists, having a bunch of generalists for your OL makes no sense.

[MrJL]

14 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

This isn't the case. You talk about Martin and Scherff. Both were looked at as playing G in the NFL.

 

Trent Williams was a RT that could play LT. And is still doing it really well.

However, literally none of these guys were "position flex". College tackles that that projected to Guards because they lacked traits. Or a RT that was physically gifted enough to play LT.

Drafting players because "they can play here, here, and here" get you a guy that won't do any of them well. Which is what we have right now, and it's a OL that was ranked 24th in the league. Not good. Did we upgrade? Not in FA. I like Stromberg, but I think we could have got him later. In a era where literally everywhere else is full of specialists, having a bunch of generalists for your OL makes no sense.

 

OL are already different from the other positions, because they're some of the few who stay in every play.  You start getting specialists for the OL eventually you'll have a shotgun center, an under center center, a pass defending LT, a run blocker LT

[RabidFan]

Daniels played both tackle spots in college but is kind of undersized for the pro game.  He's damn athletic and the vids show him pulling well so why couldn't we compete him at LG to start then move to LT in a year or two when sizes up?  Just a thought.

[bird_1972]

6 minutes ago, RabidFan said:

Daniels played both tackle spots in college but is kind of undersized for the pro game.  He's damn athletic and the vids show him pulling well so why couldn't we compete him at LG to start then move to LT in a year or two when sizes up?  Just a thought.

 

Undersized how? Weight, height, or both?

[Cool Hwhip]

47 minutes ago, RabidFan said:

Daniels played both tackle spots in college but is kind of undersized for the pro game.  He's damn athletic and the vids show him pulling well so why couldn't we compete him at LG to start then move to LT in a year or two when sizes up?  Just a thought.

Be a lot of moving pieces with our OL. I am intrigued to see how it all goes tbh.

[tmandoug1]

8 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

In the circumstances I reckon we’ve done a good job of upgrading the OL group. Next year we’ll add a stud LT, either in FA or via the draft.

It's always next year.....

[Est.1974]

5 hours ago, tmandoug1 said:

It's always next year.....

Leno had a solid year last season. Probably got one more in him. If we establish some stability across the rest of the line now, that stud piece is all that’s to add. Haven’t looked at FA for next season either but I’m sure we’ll be investing more under new ownership.