The Official ES (or E...C) 2022 Free Agency Thread Signed G Andrew Norwell, Obada, Trai Turner...Goodbye Scherff, Kyle Allen, Tim Settle

[Simmsy]

5 hours ago, sebestian said:

I think it is because they went to 4 straight super bowls and lost all of them.  I am in Toronto, and we get their sports station on the am dial 550.  Their fans are insufferable and the dis are overtly entitled for a team that sucked for a while.  Sometimes I feel bad for them because it is not their fault, Buffalo is like an armpit.  Been their to watch hockey games mostly.  Their fans are such arrogant pos.

 

I guess the tampering period means that you should give up if the your player agrees with another team.  Do we know if the agent is the one that contacted Washington said Mckissic will come back at this number.  I mean, he wanted to play here.  Brandon Scherff wanted to play elsewhere.  He did not break the bank and we offered a ton of money before the second tag.  Are we crying about that.  

 

Buffalo now thinks that they are the best team in the league which makes this fanbase over the top insufferable, and if Beane does not get it, well I am not sure what to say.  Washington always said they would let  the players that are fa test fa and set the market and if we wanted to match, we would.

 

Why are we wasting time with a team that doesn't deserve it.

 

Hail

 

It seems like everytime I turn around, the bills mafia (they don't deserve caps) is crying about something. I'm having more fun watching them get knocked out of the playoffs, lets keep them out of the SB.

 

1 hour ago, skinny21 said:

@SimmsyI had a similar take on Wentz - I leaned a bit negative, but have swung the other way.  Colts (and Eagles before them) did well in the smear campaign.

 

I save a lot of games that we win and go watch them later when I'm jonesing for some football. One of my favorites is when we beat the Eagles with Haskins, such a great game. I had so much fun watching Wentz get destroyed, it just feels a bit weird...

[Est.1974]

3 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

I find it odd that Wagner hasn’t signed anywhere and I wonder what the hold up is. I figured he’d be gone in the first 48 hours. 

Broncos are creating cap space on contract restructures.

 

My best guess is that Wilson is trying hard to recruit Wagner to Denver.

[justice98]

3 hours ago, Anselmheifer said:

I find it odd that Wagner hasn’t signed anywhere and I wonder what the hold up is. I figured he’d be gone in the first 48 hours. 

 

Maybe he's the one taking his time, letting it play out.  No rush really.  

[justice98]

2 hours ago, BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 said:

Still no where near enough weapons on this team to be a serious threat to win double digit games. Ron and co better pray they nail the draft. 

 

Almost seems like they're banking on Samuel basically being their big free agent signing on offense....again.

 

Bring back everyone else at the skill positions, add in Wentz, plus Samuel and you've got a team that can do some damage on the scoreboard.  I'm not sure I totally agree, but I can see that logic if that's what Ron is thinking.

 

Dyami Brown is really the X-factor.  If Samuel is healthy, you kinda know what to expect.  I dont think anybody knows whether Brown just sucks or he just had a tough rookie year but he'll get it together.  

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

2 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Almost seems like they're banking on Samuel basically being their big free agent signing on offense....again.

 

Bring back everyone else at the skill positions, add in Wentz, plus Samuel and you've got a team that can do some damage on the scoreboard.  I'm not sure I totally agree, but I can see that logic if that's what Ron is thinking.

 

Dyami Brown is really the X-factor.  If Samuel is healthy, you kinda know what to expect.  I dont think anybody knows whether Brown just sucks or he just had a tough rookie year but he'll get it together.  

I just want them to be as desperate to win as I am. Ron couldn’t even say for sure in his most recent presser that Samuel is healthy at this very moment. Dyami Brown’s underlying numbers point to him being a bust when compared to past rookie wideouts. Relying on that smacks of wanting to be on the hot seat imo. 
 

But then again, the one personality critique I’ve had of Ron has been his arrogance and this is the latest example. 
 

He better be right. 
 

I like Wentz more than most. I think he’s the most talented QB they’ve had in my 29 years of life. But I’d still move heaven and earth to get him more weapons to make it as easy as possible. 

[Warhead36]

I treat Curtis Samuel like Jordan Reed. Pretend he doesn't exist. Pretend he isn't even on your roster and you're just working with -10 Mil in salary cap or whatever his hit is. ANYTHING we get out of him is a bonus. 

 

We need another WR.

[JSSkinz]

1 hour ago, clskinsfan said:

I simply stated that franchise QB's dont get tossed by teams in back to back seasons. It just doesnt happen. So there is clearly something there. Now can Ron get more out Wentz than those two teams? Who knows. But we are going to find out.

This is a fair statement, something is off for Carson that put him where he is today.  I just wonder is it simply a loss in confidence by him after his injury in 2017 along with the fact he thought he was the QB1 in Philly and he watched an entire city who he thought supported him all the sudden want the backup as the full time starter.

 

Or is it the narrative the Colts are pushing which is basically that he's a terrible human being.  This all coming from an owner who is a known junkie and had a woman OD and die in a home with his name on the deed.

[No Nonsense]

6 hours ago, sebestian said:

I think it is because they went to 4 straight super bowls and lost all of them.  I am in Toronto, and we get their sports station on the am dial 550.  Their fans are insufferable and the dis are overtly entitled for a team that sucked for a while.  Sometimes I feel bad for them because it is not their fault, Buffalo is like an armpit.  Been their to watch hockey games mostly.  Their fans are such arrogant pos.

 

Buffalo now thinks that they are the best team in the league which makes this fanbase over the top insufferable, and if Beane does not get it, well I am not sure what to say.  Washington always said they would let  the players that are fa test fa and set the market and if we wanted to match, we would.

 

Why are we wasting time with a team that doesn't deserve it.

 

Hail

I have lived in WNY my entire life and you’re not kidding. When they win, Buffalo’s fanbase is insufferable to say the least. If they ever won it all, you’ll NEVER hear the end of it. 

[Renegade7]

13 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I treat Curtis Samuel like Jordan Reed. Pretend he doesn't exist. Pretend he isn't even on your roster and you're just working with -10 Mil in salary cap or whatever his hit is. ANYTHING we get out of him is a bonus. 

 

We need another WR.

 

In hindsight, we shoulda cut Reed earlier

 

I get this approach with Samuels, but with the size of his cap hit, nah, if this is how feel about him we should cut him now.

 

I'm willing to give him one more year to prove he's not the second coming of Paul Richardson.  After that, I don't care, I'm done.

[MrJL]

2 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

In hindsight, we shoulda cut Reed earlier

 

I get this approach with Samuels, but with the size of his cap hit, nah, if this is how feel about him we should cut him now.

 

I'm willing to give him one more year to prove he's not the second coming of Paul Richardson.  After that, I don't care, I'm done.

 

I mean that's pretty reasonable.  Considering he's only been here for 1 year and has a three year contract.

 

[RWJ]

I hope Antonio knows something we don't.   

 

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

3 hours ago, OMacAttack said:

We probably don't get active till after the draft when our comp picks won't be affected.

This is factually incorrect.  Comp picks for this year have already been determined.  Comp picks for a season is determined by the FA for the previous year.

 

What we do the entirety of tge 2022 league year (before and after the draft) will effect the 2023 draft comp picks . 
 

Thus ends the lesson.  

[wit33]

1 hour ago, clskinsfan said:

Where did I claim to be more in the know than Ron? I simply stated that franchise QB's dont get tossed by teams in back to back seasons. It just doesnt happen. So there is clearly something there. Now can Ron get more out Wentz than those two teams? Who knows. But we are going to find out. 

Not that franchise QBs are going get tossed around will ever become the norm, but it appears a trend QBs “we” once thought would never be traded will be from time to time. This is even more true for QBs 8-20 or whatever. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

2 hours ago, DWinzit said:

I am on the optimistic side for the offense. If they had resigned RSJ and Lucas I'd say they really just need an RB2, QB2 or 3 and WR2 or 3. 

 

These voids can be filled through the FA bargain bin on one year deals and mid round draft. Still hoping Lucas is brought back to settle the swing. 

 

The D definitely needs a LB, FS, CB and DT depth

I’m going to continue to say what the D needs more than anything is for Sweat and Young to get their heads out of their collective asses and live up to their potential.  
 

They do need a MLB because they don’t have one on the roster.  
 

Otherwise, they should have all the pieces to be a very good defense.  

47 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I treat Curtis Samuel like Jordan Reed. Pretend he doesn't exist. Pretend he isn't even on your roster and you're just working with -10 Mil in salary cap or whatever his hit is. ANYTHING we get out of him is a bonus. 

 

We need another WR.

I think that’s unfair after one year for a guy who has been healthy up until this point.  
 

A lot of players have a freak season where they are not healthy. 
 

The problem is if it is repetitive.  This year is a big year ti determine that.

 

Which is nit saying we shouldn’t add a WR, but I wouldn’t say we needed a splash WR.  Also, you can’t spend a lot of money on the position because they have to pay Terry and they have already paid Samuel. 

[Est.1974]

23 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

This is factually incorrect.  Comp picks for this year have already been determined.  Comp picks for a season is determined by the FA for the previous year.

 

What we do the entirety of tge 2022 league year (before and after the draft) will effect the 2023 draft comp picks . 
 

Thus ends the lesson.  

The comp pick qualifying period ends early May right after the draft I believe. After that FA signings don’t impact the 2023 allocation of picks. I think so anyway.

[sebestian]

This is why Gibbs is still relevant and his mind will always be an asset to this team. 
 

To have a man like that be wiling to assist , and for Ron not to be so arrogant to not seek guidance from a master shows what type of character both men have. 

source. espn.com  via bleacher report

How Joe Gibbs, film study and analytics led the Washington Commanders to Carson Wentz
 

ASHBURN, Va. -- The Washington Commanders' quarterback search has lasted more than 30 years, interrupted by brief periods of solid play and the hope that maybe, just maybe, Quarterback X would end the quest. It never happened.

The Commanders embarked on yet another search this offseason, which led them to Carson Wentz and another period of hope. The search included a meeting with former Washington coach Joe Gibbs, a deep dive on analytics, a film session at the NFL scouting combine and calls with Wentz's former coaches.
 

Washington's search was not like those in other years, because coach Ron Rivera liked his roster enough to give up salary-cap space and draft picks to find the right guy.

It was a more aggressive mindset than last offseason, when Washington made an offer to Detroit for Matthew Stafford but could not afford to be as aggressive as the Los Angeles Rams. The Commanders considered trading up in the draft last year to select Justin Fields but felt the price was too prohibitive.

But this offseason, Rivera made it clear to the NFL world that the Commanders were open for business.
 

They mapped out a strategy and made a trade with the Colts -- the teams swapped second-round draft picks in 2022 and Washington also gave up a third this year and a conditional third in 2023 -- to get the No. 2 overall pick from the 2016 NFL draft.

Wentz will be Washington's 33rd starting quarterback since the franchise last won the Super Bowl after the 1991 season. Here's how the Commanders landed him:

The Joe Gibbs meeting

Washington's scouts studied the current group of college quarterbacks during the season. The Commanders knew, even when they went on a four-game winning streak, that quarterback would be an offseason priority. But with the No. 11 pick in the first round, and with questions about the quality of this class, the team focused on finding a veteran.

 

In January, Rivera flew to Charlotte, North Carolina, to visit with Gibbs, who led Washington to three Super Bowl victories in the 1980s and early '90s. He won with a different quarterback each time. Rivera spent half a day with Gibbs, with up to two hours devoted to one topic: finding a quarterback.

Gibbs told him how he'd put up a wish list, numbering each quarterback in order of desire. Gibbs told him how he'd go down the list one at a time until they found their guy. They talked about what Gibbs looked for in a quarterback. Gibbs relayed how he loved Joe Theismann's leadership, but his next two Super Bowl quarterbacks were bigger -- Doug Williams and Mark Rypien.

"One thing we talked about was size, so they had that ability to look over the top," Rivera said. "If he's shorter, you have to make sure they have great movement skills."
 

After that meeting Rivera put down the traits they wanted: size, athletic traits, arm talent and quick-twitch throws. Then they looked to see who checked the most boxes. While size was important, they didn't want to overlook someone who wasn't at the desired height of 6-foot-3. But if a QB didn't have the height, he had to show good pocket movement and the ability to find and create passing lanes.

That led them to a list of eight quarterbacks, including Houston's Deshaun Watson.

The first two were obvious: Aaron Rodgers and Russell Wilson. The Commanders prepped for various scenarios. If they got one of those two, how would their cap look and what moves would they have to make -- now and in the future? If they acquired a less expensive quarterback, how could they shape the roster?

But Rodgers and Wilson weren't viable options. Rodgers wasn't going to be traded and Seattle rejected Washington's offer of three first-round picks. Watson's legal issues, among other factors, made him a no-go. The Commanders also watched film of many other quarterbacks just in case.

At one point they even wondered: Would Andrew Luck, the retired former Colt, want to play again? That went nowhere. But whether it was realistic or a Lloyd Christmas "So you're telling me there's a chance" scenario, they wanted to make sure every "i" was dotted.

At some point before the combine, they called Indianapolis about Wentz and were told he wasn't available.

Then, at the combine, after talking to other teams, they learned Wentz was in play.

Combine study

While they sat in a suite inside Lucas Oil Stadium, Washington's staff did another deep dive on Wentz, spending "a couple hours," Rivera said, watching multiple games and looking at the various throws he made. It wasn't the first time they had studied him, but it became perhaps the most intense session.

 

"I wouldn't say one game [stood out] as much as the throws that were impressive," Rivera said. "There were some impressive vertical throws, throwing from the far hash to outside the numbers, then some of his tight-window throws on slants and outs."

They already had performed a deep dive on his analytics. Their internal analytics showed Wentz in the top 10 in numerous categories since he was drafted by the Eagles six years ago. According to ESPN Stats & Information research, he ranks 19th in Total QBR in that time -- 12th since 2017.

During his career, Wentz ranks 11th with 140 touchdown passes (and eighth since 2017). He's eighth in passing attempts of 20 air yards or more -- a key for a team that wants to throw downfield more -- and tied for 10th in completions.

Numbers don't tell the full story, of course, but this is noteworthy: During Wentz's time in the NFL, Washington's Total QBR ranks 31st and its 98 touchdown passes rank 28th. That, indeed, tells a story as Washington's record over that stretch is 31-50.

But when watching the games, the Commanders focused on Wentz's arm, his quick throws and ability to stretch the field -- not to mention his movement, which remained evident even if it might have diminished since suffering back and knee injuries with the Eagles.

The ability

There are numerous questions about Wentz's game. They range from his desire to extend plays -- sometimes to his team's detriment -- to his inconsistencies with his mechanics, to his turnovers, to a tendency to press in games when his team falls behind.

 

Not everyone believes Wentz is the long-term solution because of those reasons. He's thrown 57 interceptions in 3,008 pass attempts. Among the 10 other quarterbacks with at least 2,800 attempts since Wentz entered the NFL, six have thrown more picks and eight have thrown more touchdowns.

But the ability is obvious. Listed at 6-foot-5 and 237 pounds, Wentz can see over the line and has the arm strength to make every throw. That could be down the field, it could be a slant or a shallow crossing route thrown on time. As ESPN NFL analyst Matt Bowen said, Wentz has the ability to attack defenses at the "second and third level" -- areas that match well with what Commanders offensive coordinator Scott Turner wants.

"No question it's a fit," Bowen said. "He can throw deep in-breakers, skinny posts, challenge vertically down the field. He can make big-time throws. He can extend plays and escape outside the pocket as a runner and make second-reaction plays. That's vital in today's NFL."

Wentz sounds excited to work with Turner: "Just talking with Coach Turner, just his vision for the offense, how he likes to call things and push the ball down the field and the playmakers around you. Just hearing his excitement level with it as well. I think we're both pretty fired up."

The conversations

During the search, Rivera said he received a balanced scouting report on all facets of Wentz. He talked to Doug Pederson and Frank Reich, two of Wentz's former head coaches. Both praised Wentz, extolling his work ethic and saying he wants to please people.

"It was very interesting," Rivera said of what he heard. "When you talk to certain people, talk to some coaches he's had in the past that I know well and listen to what they have to say, it was contradictory to what was happening."

 

Washington also felt its locker room, with low-key veterans, would work well with Wentz. And Rivera noticed that after the trade, one of the Colts' captains, Darius Leonard, tweeted in support of Wentz.

Rivera said the first call he received after the trade was from Reich.

"Frank was tremendous," Rivera said. "After we made the trade, he said, 'You're gonna love this guy ... He's been a good person first and foremost, I want you to know that.' My intention was to reach out to him but he called to congratulate me."

After the trade, Rivera had one more conversation with Gibbs, who happened to be in Washington for an event. Rivera said the first thing he told Gibbs was this:

"We got our guy.'"

Edited March 20, 2022 by sebestian

[OMacAttack]

27 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

This is factually incorrect.  Comp picks for this year have already been determined.  Comp picks for a season is determined by the FA for the previous year.

 

What we do the entirety of tge 2022 league year (before and after the draft) will effect the 2023 draft comp picks . 
 

Thus ends the lesson.  

Since the CBA in 2020 the Monday after the draft at 4pm est qualifying free agents no longer count against the teams signing them in regards to comp picks. 

 

a Compensatory Free Agent (“CFA”) shall be defined as an Unrestricted Free Agent (“UFA”) who: (i) signed with a new Club during the prior free agency signing period (with the 2020 free agency period being the first such “prior free agency signing period” under this appendix) prior to 4:00 p.m., New York time, on the Monday following the NFL Draft for that League Year…”

 

Taken from over the cap they dive deep on comp picks and mostly get it correct. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 minute ago, OMacAttack said:

Since the CBA in 2020 the Monday after the draft at 4pm est qualifying free agents no longer count against the teams signing them in regards to comp picks. 

 

a Compensatory Free Agent (“CFA”) shall be defined as an Unrestricted Free Agent (“UFA”) who: (i) signed with a new Club during the prior free agency signing period (with the 2020 free agency period being the first such “prior free agency signing period” under this appendix) prior to 4:00 p.m., New York time, on the Monday following the NFL Draft for that League Year…”

 

Taken from over the cap they dive deep on comp picks and mostly get it correct. 

Thanks.  I hadn’t heard that.  

[RWJ]

19 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

The comp pick qualifying period ends early May right after the draft I believe. After that FA signings don’t impact the 2023 allocation of picks. I think so anyway.

This is correct.

[VaK9Trainer]

Just wondering where things stand with Leonard Fournette. Has he signed with anyone?  I thought he'd be a good fit here as the Bell Cow RB. 

 

[OMacAttack]

1 minute ago, VaK9Trainer said:

Just wondering where things stand with Leonard Fournette. Has he signed with anyone?  I thought he'd be a good fit here as the Bell Cow RB. 

 

Hasn't signed with anyone.  If I were to bet I'd say he goes back to the Bucs. Would be a nice bruiser though with Gibson.

[RWJ]

I'd like to be able to know what RR and Co. are going to do but at this point they seem to want to only sign released players that will not go against the 3rd/7th round comp picks they will receive in 2023.  Things can change at any time but it sure looks that way.

[FootballZombie]

20 minutes ago, RWJ said:

I'd like to be able to know what RR and Co. are going to do but at this point they seem to want to only sign released players that will not go against the 3rd/7th round comp picks they will receive in 2023.  Things can change at any time but it sure looks that way.

 

While it does logically make sense, we can't build that idea with so little data. We have only signed one outside FA and one can't be a trend.

 

I think the only thing we can say with confidence is there is a clear effort to not get involved with the primary and secondary FA waves.

 

Either that or they have an inhuman ability to plug leaks about who we go after.

 

[goskins10]

1 hour ago, RWJ said:

I'd like to be able to know what RR and Co. are going to do but at this point they seem to want to only sign released players that will not go against the 3rd/7th round comp picks they will receive in 2023.  Things can change at any time but it sure looks that way.

 

Not sure there is as much correlation as you are putting to it. I think it's much more about who they want(ed) with wanted too much money or signed elsewhere. And need to point out there are a lot of what would be considered top FAs out there an no one is signing them. I think this is more a league thing tan a Washington FO thing. The das of all the best talent being scooped up day 1 or 2 appear to be behind us. Does not mean the team will sign someone. But there are options unlike even jsut 5 yrs ago. People like Wagner and T Matthew would have been gone already. But teams are being more careful and players are letting the process work out more to get their best situation. It's not a bad thing in my mind. 

Edited March 20, 2022 by goskins10

[RWJ]

13 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

While it does logically make sense, we can't build that idea with so little data. We have only signed one outside FA and one can't be a trend.

 

I think the only thing we can say with confidence is there is a clear effort to not get involved with the primary and secondary FA waves.

 

Either that or they have an inhuman ability to plug leaks about who we go after.

 

Time will tell no doubt.   Let's see how it plays out.  I think RR and Co.  have that 3rd round comp. pick in 2023 when it's all said and done.  I could be way wrong but..