The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Skinsinparadise]

10 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Galdi’s podcast is out by 5:00am every morning and is fantastic.  
 

If you’re not listening to it, you should be.  

Galdi is good. Keim is good. Sheehan can be insufferable when he’s stuck on an opinion but I find him entertaining still.

 

Logan IMO does the best pregame podcasts. They usually come out on Friday and he goes to town on dissecting the opponent. I know you listen to him so you likely know this.

[Voice_of_Reason]

27 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Galdi is good. Keim is good. Sheehan can be insufferable when he’s stuck on an opinion but I find him entertaining still.

 

Logan IMO does the best pregame podcasts. They usually come out on Friday and he goes to town on dissecting the opponent. I know you listen to him so you likely know this.

I haven’t listened to the Logan pregame pods. I’ll move it up in the order.  
 

My time has been very limited recently with essentially 2 full time jobs + family.  So my pod consumption has dropped to Galdi on the drive in, Bram or Kiem before bed.  But only for about 10-15 minutes until I pass out.  

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

6 hours ago, HigSkin said:

This is facinating data -

 

 

Oh No, attack of the actual Oline Data!! 
Thank You for Sharing @HigSkin

[COWBOY-KILLA-]

Love the way Sam is playing.  He's calm and strong in the pocket. As everyone can see his internal clock needs adjustment with regard to the pressure.  I think it will come with reps. I don't mind he wants to hang in and find that big play.

 

 I wouldn't mind him looking to run a bit more when the opportunity presents itself given the look.  Seems to be only doing it in the utmost worse case scenario.  That should also improve with reps.  I can't remember the last time I was this excited to watch a qb play for us, love what we are seeing from the youngster.  The year to adjust and develop without pressure is bearing fruit as we speak. It won't be all glory but I get the sense it will be incredibly fun.  Huge Sam Fan..

[Califan007 The Constipated]

 

SUNDAY'S BIGGEST SURPRISE

 

Sam Howell shows flashes of being The Guy. The Commanders have been searching for a quarterback for a few years now. Howell is starting to look like the guy who finally can ease all that pain. He found himself down, 21-3, in Denver and played well enough -- throwing for 299 yards and two touchdowns -- to help Washington pull out a 35-33 win. There weren't a ton of people who would've picked Howell to be an early surprise. Right now, he's blossoming under the tutelage of offensive coordinator Eric Bieniemy and leading a team that is 2-0.

 

https://www.nfl.com/news/the-first-read-five-burning-questions-off-week-2-plus-risers-sliders-week-3-s-mo

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

Sam Howell's year learning the ropes must have helped a bit with maturity on the field.

 

1st overall pick is looking a little overwhelmed by the NFL right now.

 

 

Maybe he went to Kirk Cousins' QB camp over the summer lol...

 

 

 

Edited September 19, 2023 by Califan007 The Constipated

[Going Commando]

3 hours ago, COWBOY-KILLA- said:

Love the way Sam is playing.  He's calm and strong in the pocket. As everyone can see his internal clock needs adjustment with regard to the pressure.  I think it will come with reps. I don't mind he wants to hang in and find that big play.

 

 I wouldn't mind him looking to run a bit more when the opportunity presents itself given the look.  Seems to be only doing it in the utmost worse case scenario.  That should also improve with reps.  I can't remember the last time I was this excited to watch a qb play for us, love what we are seeing from the youngster.  The year to adjust and develop without pressure is bearing fruit as we speak. It won't be all glory but I get the sense it will be incredibly fun.  Huge Sam Fan..

 

I don't really want him tucking it and running a lot more.  That is a crutch IMO, and it was the bad pattern he fell into at UNC his final season.  1, 2, run.  I want him staying in the pocket and reading the coverage until he masters the process and just operates on instinct and gestalts.  That is where you get greatness.  QBs who spend their first several seasons running delay their own development as passers.

 

I don't think Sam is ever going to be great at reading and feeling pressure though.  That was one of his most concerning weaknesses as a prospect, and it's not really any different today.  Double edged sword.  On the one hand, Sam plays with no fear.  He's going to keep his eyes down field, and he's going to make big plays.  On the other hand, he's going to be oblivious to pressure and take big hits and a lot of sacks in the pocket.  He's going to take some damage, and his turnovers will more likely be fumbles than interceptions.  But the big vertical plays he makes will be worth the sacks if he can keep healthy and available.  Eventually we will account for him being harder to protect by getting better/bigger athletes at OT.  But I'm actually not expecting a ton of improvement in Sam's internal clock this year because I don't think it's part of his personality as a player.  There is only so much bandwidth for processing info that all but the very greatest QBs possess, and he spends his on reading the coverage.  I'm ok with that.

[KDawg]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

 

I don't really want him tucking it and running a lot more.  That is a crutch IMO, and it was the bad pattern he fell into at UNC his final season.  1, 2, run.  I want him staying in the pocket and reading the coverage until he masters the process and just operates on instinct and gestalts.  That is where you get greatness.  QBs who spend their first several seasons running delay their own development as passers.

 

I don't think Sam is ever going to be great at reading and feeling pressure though.  That was one of his most concerning weaknesses as a prospect, and it's not really any different today.  Double edged sword.  On the one hand, Sam plays with no fear.  He's going to keep his eyes down field, and he's going to make big plays.  On the other hand, he's going to be oblivious to pressure and take big hits and a lot of sacks in the pocket.  He's going to take some damage, and his turnovers will more likely be fumbles than interceptions.  But the big vertical plays he makes will be worth the sacks if he can keep healthy and available.  Eventually we will account for him being harder to protect by getting better/bigger athletes at OT.  But I'm actually not expecting a ton of improvement in Sam's internal clock this year because I don't think it's part of his personality as a player.  There is only so much bandwidth for processing info that all but the very greatest QBs possess, and he spends his on reading the coverage.  I'm ok with that.

For the first time in a long time around here… you and I are on the same page. I don’t mind him running, but that shouldn’t be his go to. He is excellent at keeping his eyes downfield.

 

He can improve internal clock, and will, but that takes time. 

Edited September 19, 2023 by KDawg

[Going Commando]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Fir the first time in a long time around here… you and I are on the same page. I don’t mind him running, but that shouldn’t be his go to. He is excellent at keeping his eyes downfield.

 

He can improve internal clock, and will, but that takes time. 

 

I've made peace with the internal clock issue.  I still remember how much it shocked and soured me when he played VT.  But I'm used to it now, and don't necessarily care if his clock improves via reading pressure much better.  Instead what I want to see is him get faster at moving through his reads of the coverage, and I think he definitely will.  There are a lot of coverages and nuances in the NFL game, and it takes years to see if all.

 

I think as long as he manages his health and stays available, then we'll be OK.  The strip sacks like the one Cooper had don't bother me as much because the contact wasn't anything.  The hit where Bonitto threw him down and his helmet came off are the ones that make me cringe.  We can live to keep fighting with the former, so long as we can minimize the latter.

 

We do need to adjust our play calling and coaching strategy to anticipate for the fact he's gonna take sacks.  For instance, learning to let go of the field goal when the attempt is suddenly 59 yards after a third down sack. And we're gonna need to get a big wall of an OT to play on his blind side.  That's one of the reasons I wanted Dawand Jones so bad, but we'll have other chances at it.  In the meantime, I look to see development from our interior OLs, so that when we do bring a rookie OT onto the line, we don't have a bunch of other guys learning on the job beside him.

[DWinzit]

1 minute ago, Going Commando said:

 

I've made peace with the internal clock issue.  I still remember how much it shocked and soured me when he played VT.  But I'm used to it now, and don't necessarily care if his clock improves via reading pressure much better.  Instead what I want to see is him get faster at moving through his reads of the coverage, and I think he definitely will.  There are a lot of coverages and nuances in the NFL game, and it takes years to see if all.

 

I think as long as he manages his health and stays available, then we'll be OK.  The strip sacks like the one Cooper had don't bother me as much because the contact wasn't anything.  The hit where Bonitto threw him down and his helmet came off are the ones that make me cringe.  We can live to keep fighting with the former, so long as we can minimize the latter.

 

We do need to adjust our play calling and coaching strategy to anticipate for the fact he's gonna take sacks.  For instance, learning to let go of the field goal when the attempt is suddenly 59 yards after a third down sack. And we're gonna need to get a big wall of an OT to play on his blind side.  That's one of the reasons I wanted Dawand Jones so bad, but we'll have other chances at it.  In the meantime, I look to see development from our interior OLs, so that when we do bring a rookie OT onto the line, we don't have a bunch of other guys learning on the job beside him.

The internal clock could improve if Sam is ever able to play behind a decent line. He really hasn't had that opportunity. I agree the play calling and improved OL will do wonders for his progression. 

 

His internal clock/pocket awareness very much reminds me of Cousins. Cousins however has had good OL at times over the years and still has never had great awareness. I am holding to the belief Sam will have better success. He is also more fluid in the pocket than Cousins which we all need to hope helps in keeping him as healthy and available as Cousins has been over the years. 

 

I do believe in certain specific run plays designed to take advantage of his abilities like the occasional bootleg. Other than that, limit the heck of his running and get the man true protection and a top end TE

[kingdaddy]

It's interesting how lucky the Commanders have been to get to start the season with Arizona and Denver as opposed to Buffalo and Philly or Dallas, SF, KC who are also on the schedule. Sam Howell gets the benefit of growing against 2 weaker teams and now his confidence should be pretty high heading into the tougher games. It seems we may have caught a real break there. Let's keep it rolling and step everything up a few notches vs Buffalo this week at home. Sam is ready for this test and EB has a better idea of what he has and how to get the offense into a flow.

Sunday is gonna be rockin.

[Skinsinparadise]

I am still in Denver but leaving soon. When am back I’ll post what it looked like at the game. The live look helps my perspective because I can lock in on a unit or 2 and on offense I was watching mostly Sam and the O line.

 

My cliff notes version of it for now echoes some of the points made here,

 

Sam can make some wicked throws, all three levels, out routes, in routes. I think his go to screen that works feeds better off of delayed routes.

 

And his accuracy is very good and consistent especially when you give him time. Hits receivers in stride except for some of the screens early in that game.  On the draft thread before he came out I cited his pocket presence as my top concern. 
 

Watching that game I can see his peripheral vision is better on the right side which makes sense considering he’s right handed.  For him giving him a stud LT would be a godsend. He needs that blind side help.

 

He’s tough as heck in the pocket and likes to climb the pocket. He’s not skittish even a whit. Which is great. But considering that variable please build him a good O line. I hate the conversations about having a passsble O line and is it bad, below average or just average? How about instead good or great next year? 
 

He will hang on to the ball because he’s fearless. Give him an O line unit which can play to that double edge sword strength and weakness but it’s mostly a strength.

 

I think Howell looked great. But I am worried that they were facing pedestrian at best D lines.  I wonder what happens when they face good ones.

 

To my eyes it looked Denver played it like the Cards did which is rush 4, 7 in coverage and blitz on occasion especially when they got in field goal range. 

[Koolblue13]

Letting 4 guys rush our OL seems to be the obvious thing to do and still they're getting pressure. 

 

Keep 7 in coverage and try and confuse Sam.

 

It's not going to keep working against Sam and I'd bet he and EB will get some rhythm hitters going to beat that. 

[mistertim]

I think there's a difference between Sam sometimes holding on to the ball too long and having poor pocket presence or poor feel for pressure.

 

He definitely does hold onto the ball too long at times, but I don't think he has poor pocket presence or pressure awareness. Nobody is going to mistake him for a guy like Brady who had an almost supernatural feel for the pocket, but we've also seen several times so far throughout preseason and the first two games where Sam felt pressure and was able to escape it and/or step up in the pocket to avoid it.

 

I think the holding on to the ball too long is something that's partially due to inexperience and partially just due to him being fearless and always looking to make plays. The former is something that I think will improve with time and exposure, the latter is just part of who he is and there will always be a bit of that gunslinger/playmaker aspect of him.

[bowhunter]

One play that I think Sam deserves a lot of credit for that I have not seen mentioned was actually on a RPO play that got crashed hard. The DE was on BRob while Sam was still in the process of handing it off. Sam showed a lot of maturity in not trying to pull the ball away and risking a TO. Take the loss and live again to fight another day.

[Skinsinparadise]

It’s early granted but fun nonetheless 

 

 

 

[Koolblue13]

There are throws in here that not every QB makes. Sam is legit. I think the pass to Bates down the side line was my favorite. He starts hitting Terry and crew like this and it's off to the races on any play.

 

[Warhead36]

If he were like two inches taller he'd have a chance at being a top 5-10 QB. Sucks he was blessed with everything except above average height.

[HigSkin]

51 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

There are throws in here that not every QB makes. Sam is legit. I think the pass to Bates down the side line was my favorite. He starts hitting Terry and crew like this and it's off to the races on any play.

 

 

Doc Walker on The Junkies this morning was a good listen.  He said he asked Howell at camp, something he always does with young camp guys - "I'm going to talk about you on radio about how you are performing in camp, are you okay with it?"  He said Sam looked him in the eye and said "bring it" and walked away.  Doc said  the young man has "it" to go along with the talent.

 

 

Edited September 19, 2023 by HigSkin

[Chris 44]

48 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

There are throws in here that not every QB makes. Sam is legit. I think the pass to Bates down the side line was my favorite. He starts hitting Terry and crew like this and it's off to the races on any play.

 

From what I could tell Bates had a good game, not just receiving but he had a couple nice blocks also.

[Koolblue13]

11 minutes ago, Chris 44 said:

From what I could tell Bates had a good game, not just receiving but he had a couple nice blocks also.

Bates is a great TE2.

[Fan since a Fetus]

I wonder if Sam getting together with Drew Brees and discussing throwing lanes and how to see the field with a limited perspective would do any good? 
 

I don’t think you necessarily need a super star qb to be a great solid team. In fact, I think an argument can be made that if you have a guy that’s really really good but at a more affordable rate than the other super star qbs make, you could potentially build a better team around them. 

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

If he were like two inches taller he'd have a chance at being a top 5-10 QB. Sucks he was blessed with everything except above average height.

 

You really think he can't be a top 5 level QB because of his height? Wilson was a legit top 3-5 QB in his prime and Brees is a first ballot HoFer.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

11 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

You really think he can't be a top 5 level QB because of his height? Wilson was a legit top 3-5 QB in his prime and Brees is a first ballot HoFer.

 

Wilson = 3rd round pick

Brees = 2nd round pick

 

Bryce Young and Kyler Murray had elite college production which likely allowed them to overcome height concerns. 

Edited September 19, 2023 by JamesMadisonSkins

[Tress Is The Way]

33 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

You really think he can't be a top 5 level QB because of his height? Wilson was a legit top 3-5 QB in his prime and Brees is a first ballot HoFer.

Why are people acting like 6 foot 1 is short? The average height of an NFL QB is 6ft 2.5 inches... c'mon now it's not like he's Murray short ffs

 

Tua is barely 6 feet, is anyone calling him short?

Drew brees 6 feet

Russ Wilson 5 foot 11

Patrick Mahomes is 6 foot 2.

Joe Theismann is 6 foot, did anyone call him short when he won the mother freaking superbowl?

Billy Kilmer is 6 foot, again need I continue?

 

Gtfo of here with this short crap.

Edited September 19, 2023 by Tress Is The Way

[HigSkin]