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The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

Koolblue13

By Koolblue13
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RWJ

RWJ

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Tundra scout said:

Been following him since he was a QB in high school 

I think Ron Rivera has given him additional weapons that he needs to succeed in Washington.  If our D can play the way they're supposed to and as I mentioned in another thread, barring any major injuries, I think this team makes the playoffs. JMO.  :)  

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Tundra scout

Tundra scout

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, RWJ said:

I think Ron Rivera has given him additional weapons that he needs to succeed in Washington.  If our D can play the way they're supposed to and as I mentioned in another thread, barring any major injuries, I think this team makes the playoffs. JMO.  :)  

Right there with you 

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kingdaddy

kingdaddy

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

lolol Heinicke has 0 trade value. We're better off just keeping him as a backup. 

I disagree....TH can win you games as a backup, not all teams have a guy like this. I'd bet TH is in the upper tier of backup QB's in the NFL...

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AlwaysBeRedskins2Me

AlwaysBeRedskins2Me

Posted
Posted
On 5/10/2022 at 1:34 PM, KDawg said:


Its not insane. ZComm is a big time Heinicke fan and if he is going to go down he’s going down fighting. I respect it.

You really don't think it would be insane to cut Heinecke and go with a completely and utterly unproven rookie qb as your #2 qb? A dude who will need to learn the playbook, system, and adjust to the huge difference in speed of the game?  I think it would be absolutely preposterous to get rid of Taylor. I'm pretty sure Ron and Scott would agree. TH has his limitations as a starting qb in the NFL but he is a durn good backup. One who knows the offense in and out. One who has proven he can win some games at this level. He's not going anywhere anytime soon. I'd bet my life on it.

On 5/10/2022 at 1:06 PM, CjSuAvE22 said:

Why is what hes saying so insane? A 40 year old beat out heinicke for the starting role last year one thats a 20-25 guy when he plays his best football at that.....its not so far fetched a 5th round rookie whom is much younger can as well...

I think it would be ludicrous. He's far more game ready ( NFL wise ) right now than Sam. I'm hoping Wentz has a good season. However, like all players, he's one hit away from being on the sidelines. TH is invaluable as a backup qb.

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RWJ

RWJ

Posted
Posted

If TH only had the arm that Brees had.  He has everything else.  He has heart, courage, smarts, mobility but lacks in arm strength.  Keep an eye on Kelly.  He may surprise.  I think RR keeps 3 QBs on the 53 man roster.  It will be a fight between Kelly and TH.  May the best man win.  I've heard good things about Kelly but we know little about him.  Let's see what he does in the preseason.  

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KDawg

KDawg

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, AlwaysBeRedskins2Me said:

You really don't think it would be insane to cut Heinecke and go with a completely and utterly unproven rookie qb as your #2 qb? A dude who will need to learn the playbook, system, and adjust to the huge difference in speed of the game?  I think it would be absolutely preposterous to get rid of Taylor. I'm pretty sure Ron and Scott would agree. TH has his limitations as a starting qb in the NFL but he is a durn good backup. One who knows the offense in and out. One who has proven he can win some games at this level. He's not going anywhere anytime soon. I'd bet my life on it.

I think it would be ludicrous. He's far more game ready ( NFL wise ) right now than Sam. I'm hoping Wentz has a good season. However, like all players, he's one hit away from being on the sidelines. TH is invaluable as a backup qb.


I don’t have an opinion because it’s too early to tell.

 

But I don’t think we’re cutting Heinicke, if that’s what you’re ultimately asking.

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Califan007 The Constipated

Califan007 The Constipated

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 5/10/2022 at 10:06 AM, CjSuAvE22 said:

Why is what hes saying so insane? A 40 year old beat out heinicke for the starting role last year

 

Yeah, and proceeded to dislocate his hip after throwing 6 passes and was out for the season lol...maybe the coaching staff and decision makers learned from that? Because it's clear some fans haven't.

 

Edited by Califan007 The Constipated
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goskins10

goskins10

Posted
Posted (edited)

I would not be surprised if they kept Taylor or released him. Neither is a mystery. On the plus side, Taylor knows the offence much better than any QB on the roster. He is cheap - I saw someone say he is too expensive for a back-up. LOL  He costs jsut $3M. In NFL terms for a QB, any QB that's not on the PS is peanuts. He plays with guts and the fans and players like him. 

 

But here is the down side - let's look at his numbers before they figured out he had no arm and then after:

 

image.png.49da2f0ded3fcfa7d39028771911ec99.png

 

Once teams figured out Taylor could not push the ball down field his game came apart. So no, he cannot still win you the games he could early last year. 

 

It would not be a shock at all that Sam Howell showed he gave the team a better chance to win games even without as full a knowledge of the playbook. If they keep just 2 QBs this does not seem out of bounds. However, I fully expect them to keep 3 QBs. If they do it's likely that Taylor is one of them. But would it be "insane" for them to release Taylor? When you see the performance above, it's a clear no. Is it likely? No. 

Edited by goskins10
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Califan007 The Constipated

Califan007 The Constipated

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

Once teams figured out Taylor could not push the ball down field his game came apart. So no, he cannot still win you the games he could early last year.

 

Don't agree. Fans were figuring out Heinicke had a weak arm by like week 3. No way in hell it took all the other "football men" in the NFL another 2 months to do the same.

 

There are sooooooo many other factors that most likely played a role in his bad finish...and sometimes it's just that the "magic" runs out, so to speak. Some of his throws were "How the hell did that get caught?"...Some of his plays were "How the **** did he do that?"...teammate confidence in him growing by the week, team being on a roll, innate play-making ability with his legs, defense stepping up, playcalling improving--all helped with the winning. Injuries, COVID, arm probably wearing down as he played his first full season, lack of arm strength to make all the needed throws, playcalling not improving...all played roles in the team seeming to fall apart over the last 4 weeks.

 

 

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goskins10

goskins10

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

Don't agree. Fans were figuring out Heinicke had a weak arm by like week 3. No way in hell it took all the other "football men" in the NFL another 2 months to do the same.

 

There are sooooooo many other factors that most likely played a role in his bad finish...and sometimes it's just that the "magic" runs out, so to speak. Some of his throws were "How the hell did that get caught?"...Some of his plays were "How the **** did he do that?"...teammate confidence in him growing by the week, team being on a roll, innate play-making ability with his legs, defense stepping up, playcalling improving--all helped with the winning. Injuries, COVID, arm probably wearing down as he played his first full season, lack of arm strength to make all the needed throws, playcalling not improving...all played roles in the team seeming to fall apart over the last 4 weeks.

 

 

 

 

Of course there are more details, details I didn't have the time nor energy to highlight. Also, figuring out he has arm issues and then developing and putting a D in place to counters what the team was doing to mitigate his lack of arm strength are two different things. Lastly, I was giving him the benefit of the doubt since the 2 gms just before the last 4 he scored all of 17 pts. It was clear they were catching up to him before that final run. 

 

So the main point - is 100% valid. The main point is Ds have figured Taylor out making his effectiveness, and thus value to the team much less than it was even at the start of last season. That is 100% accurate. 

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Tress Is The Way

Tress Is The Way

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, RWJ said:

I think Ron Rivera has given him additional weapons that he needs to succeed in Washington.  If our D can play the way they're supposed to and as I mentioned in another thread, barring any major injuries, I think this team makes the playoffs. JMO.  :)  

Our biggest hole on D in my humble opinion is our LBs... they are most definitely going to be tested this year. Hopefully Davis can take a step forward and live up to his first round selection. If so I can see us making the playoffs either via winning the division or a wild card.

 

Offense wise we are brimming with talent.. if CW can make the plays, I think our O could possibly be a very big bright spot this year

Edited by ZarG3
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Thinking Skins

Thinking Skins

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, goskins10 said:

I would not be surprised if they kept Taylor or released him. Neither is a mystery. On the plus side, Taylor knows the offence much better than any QB on the roster. He is cheap - I saw someone say he is too expensive for a back-up. LOL  He costs jsut $3M. In NFL terms for a QB, any QB that's not on the PS is peanuts. He plays with guts and the fans and players like him. 

 

But here is the down side - let's look at his numbers before they figured out he had no arm and then after:

 

image.png.49da2f0ded3fcfa7d39028771911ec99.png

 

Once teams figured out Taylor could not push the ball down field his game came apart. So no, he cannot still win you the games he could early last year. 

 

It would not be a shock at all that Sam Howell showed he gave the team a better chance to win games even without as full a knowledge of the playbook. If they keep just 2 QBs this does not seem out of bounds. However, I fully expect them to keep 3 QBs. If they do it's likely that Taylor is one of them. But would it be "insane" for them to release Taylor? When you see the performance above, it's a clear no. Is it likely? No. 

This is only partially true. He also lost our biggest weapons in Thomas and JMC so we were not really having any intermediate or short threats. Plus out WRs were depleted. He did a good job with that he had and I'm not going to criticize him. In fact we saw him play poorly against Dallas that first time and I'm partial because like I said with the injuries but also we got dominated by their defense in that first half. I'll put that on him though. 

 

For the rest of those games, I'm even more hesitant to give too much blame to him because he had COVID and just like I'm not mad at Wentz for his performance coming off COVID, I'm not mad at Taylor. This thing can take a lot out of people, even athletes.  And these guys may have neve never gotten back to form. 

 

That said, he does have limitations like his arm strength and his desire to keep plays alive instead of just throwing it away or taking the short run. Funny thing is those are Wentz's same criticisms (other than arm strength). I honestly think that we're in a good situation of Taylor has to come in here. I just look at what Coly McCoy did last year with Arizona and think we're not going to automatically be counted as losses if he plays. We'll have to adjust the system but depending on injuries we could still have a powerful team (especially if Robinson and Gibson are a good 1 2 punch). 

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BatteredFanSyndrome

BatteredFanSyndrome

Posted
Posted

I get that some of these guys are really in the bag for Heineke and all that...

 

But it couldn't be more obvious that he has the most value here, where he's came up in the system, played in it, etc.  Why some want to believe he could be used as a trade piece is a bit bonkers to me.  There have been plenty of guys that had decent stints coming in for the starter, of whom other teams weren't interested in the next offseason.  Part of what held us back (besides the anchor that is Dan Snyder) from trading for an upper echelon QB is that we didn't have one other teams coveted.  We've heard nothing about anyone calling for Heineke, even after we drafted Howell.  There's a difference between him having value here where he knows the offense and personnel vs. another team investing in and grooming him into their system.

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formerly4skins

formerly4skins

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, KDawg said:


I don’t have an opinion because it’s too early to tell.

 

But I don’t think we’re cutting Heinicke, if that’s what you’re ultimately asking.

I think TH sticks because he's the backup QB you keep on the active gameday roster, in case he has to immediately step in and take snaps. Thats obviously not a spot you really want your 5th rd. QB stepping into. 

 

Howell would be the guy you maybe give the start with a week to prepare or coming out of a bye. 

 

That said...god willing, Wentz stays healthy and we don't see either of these guys outside of preseason. 

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Burgold

Burgold

Posted
Posted

Heinike should stick. He did remarkably well for an undrafted free agent who was unclaimed and sleeping on his sister's couch last week. He's shown he can step up and compete. He doesn't have the arm you want in a starter, but he absolutely has the grit, moxie, and intangibles to be a great back up. Just ask Tom Brady.

 

As for Howell, despite the fact that he was picked in the fifth round I don't think we should think of him as a fifth rounder. He was mocked (yeah, I know we are mocking mocks) as a second and frequently considered one of the best QBs in this QB poor draft.  If we go back a year when he was playing with weapons and a line, quite a few people projected Howell as having first round talent. We shouldn't pigeonhole him because of where he was picked. Once done, the draft is pretty irrelevant. Think of how many udfas make teams or how many have made the HOF. Think of how many number one overall QBs were busts. Howell may not be the guy this year, but he could be the "guy" for the future. He could also be the guy who nets a number one in trade. Lord knows the NFL loves trading number ones for back up QBs. Now that Allen is gone, we may change our philosophy that getting nothing for a talent is a win if we make the player miserable enough.

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