Heinicke Hive: The LEGEND of Taylor Heinicke Thread

[ODU AGGIE]

31 minutes ago, Stone Cold said:

I love how 4 is being underestimated.  Ball out fella.  You can turn an entire franchise around.  And I couldn’t ask for a better human to do it.  Let’s GO!

Hell, yeah!

[petey hodge]

9 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

There is barely any tap on him, and they had a short week. That's not the same as say, having a bye week and 4 years of NFL tape. And not a very good defense, either.

Still though, that's a favorite fan "argument" explaining the only reason why TH had any success in that TB game. 

[ODU AGGIE]

25 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

I love how anything not lavishly praising him is called "hate" or "underestimating"

 

He played well. I want to see more before I start believing he could be the QB of the future. After 2 starts, I don't think that's an unfair position to take. Doesn't mean I'm hating on or underestimating Heinicke. Just being realistic.

Hang in there, MT. We're all on the same side, and I definitely understand where you are coming from.

[Morneblade]

1 minute ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

I have no shame, he could easily not be a franchise QB but I'm not going to be skeptical for no particular reason either. He has shown more good than bad. 

 

No one is denying that. In fact, almost everyone thinks he has been aces.

 

But here is the thing.

 

Literally ANY QB that is on a team, or practice squad in the NFL could have a couple games in which they look real good. Steven Montez could put 2 games together than look like the 2nd coming of Tom Brady. But he will never be able to carry that kind of production over a significant period of time. That is, quite literally what separates the bad, from the good, from the great in the NFL. Tom Brady plays lights out almost all the time, but he'll have a off day here and there. Tyrod Taylor can have average days, some bad days, and a couple of great days. Kinda of a mixed bag, but usually nothing special. Dwayne Haskins can have a great day, and a bunch of really bad ones. Consistency of high level play separates the great from the good. If TH can even be just a "good" QB, and keep the bad days to a minimum, that would be great. But the only way to really see this, is to have a sample size that is more than a couple games.

[tmandoug1]

1 minute ago, Morneblade said:

 

No one is denying that. In fact, almost everyone thinks he has been aces.

 

But here is the thing.

 

Literally ANY QB that is on a team, or practice squad in the NFL could have a couple games in which they look real good. Steven Montez could put 2 games together than look like the 2nd coming of Tom Brady. But he will never be able to carry that kind of production over a significant period of time. That is, quite literally what separates the bad, from the good, from the great in the NFL. Tom Brady plays lights out almost all the time, but he'll have a off day here and there. Tyrod Taylor can have average days, some bad days, and a couple of great days. Kinda of a mixed bag, but usually nothing special. Dwayne Haskins can have a great day, and a bunch of really bad ones. Consistency of high level play separates the great from the good. If TH can even be just a "good" QB, and keep the bad days to a minimum, that would be great. But the only way to really see this, is to have a sample size that is more than a couple games.

I wonder what Drew Bledsoe would say to that? 

[method man]

5 minutes ago, petey hodge said:

Still though, that's a favorite fan "argument" explaining the only reason why TH had any success in that TB game. 

Sheehan loves to use it al the time w him. Jay shut him down on that point on his podcast today

[Die Hard]

22 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

But, as any good scientist would say, the sample size is way to small to confirm anything. Could be nothing more than a outlier. Need more data.

I’ll have a pretty good idea who the best team will be this year by February. It’s science.

 

Where’s the fun in that? Some people like speculating…. and projecting things before they happen 🙂 

 

 

[Morneblade]

33 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:

The point being that so many on here don’t think he has a strong enough arm, he was an undrafted player so he can’t be the “guy” and that he is so brittle that he may break a bone just from breaking the huddle. 

 

No one is saying that. Does he have a injury history? Yes. Do people worry about it? Sure. Mostly because he played like his NFL life was on the line (and it was) against the Bucs and was reckless. And got hurt. He's now under contract and not playing like that. The question is simply, can he keep playing at this level consistently, or is it just a flash in the pan and he ends up looking more like a guy that could not stick to a practice squad.

 

26 minutes ago, ODU AGGIE said:

I get it, and I don't blame the collective "you" for being reluctant to jump on a bandwagon that just might not be going anywhere. I think, and we as a group can only hope, that by season's end we are all on the Heinicke bandwagon -- if not sooner. So, in the meantime -- I'll put up with you, if you will put up with me. Cheers, all!

 

It's all good. Honestly, we've had so many bandwagons to jump on only to have blow up in our faces, we as a fan base are pretty leary at this point.

 

Here is the thing. We really want to be on the bandwagon. I went and bought a TH hoodie last night for petes sake. I love everything about him. And honestly I think the fan base, as a whole feels exactly the same way. They desperately WANT to believe

 

But when you get your heart broken 50 times, and had that bandwagon blow up on you while you in it, it's hard to dive in head first the first time you see it. And unless you have been though it, you wouldn't understand.

 

So, most of us just need more time. Time to see if he can play at a consistent level that is high enough to at the very least win us some game, and keep us in most of them. We have a very tough schedule coming up. No one thinks he's going to run the table on the next 5 teams. But if we win a couple, and offensively put point on the board and move the ball in all of them, even if we loose, that will go a long way. The Chargers game is a good example. He came in and the offense looked much better and if our D had gotten off the field on 3rd down a few more times, he gives us a chance. He keeps playing like that, the bandwagon is going to get crowded quick.

 

 

Edited September 18, 2021 by Morneblade

[Burgundy Yoda]

22 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

No one is denying that. In fact, almost everyone thinks he has been aces.

 

But here is the thing.

 

Literally ANY QB that is on a team, or practice squad in the NFL could have a couple games in which they look real good. Steven Montez could put 2 games together than look like the 2nd coming of Tom Brady. But he will never be able to carry that kind of production over a significant period of time. That is, quite literally what separates the bad, from the good, from the great in the NFL. Tom Brady plays lights out almost all the time, but he'll have a off day here and there. Tyrod Taylor can have average days, some bad days, and a couple of great days. Kinda of a mixed bag, but usually nothing special. Dwayne Haskins can have a great day, and a bunch of really bad ones. Consistency of high level play separates the great from the good. If TH can even be just a "good" QB, and keep the bad days to a minimum, that would be great. But the only way to really see this, is to have a sample size that is more than a couple games.

Okay, you can wait around for that sample size to increase, while I have fun and enjoy watching him play. There's really nothing to debate here, just optimism vs skepticism, there is no right or wrong, just believers and non-believers lol. You can convert to the Church of Heinicke whenever you are ready.

Edited September 18, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

28 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:

The point being that so many on here don’t think he has a strong enough arm, he was an undrafted player so he can’t be the “guy” and that he is so brittle that he may break a bone just from breaking the huddle. 

Hyperbole much?

 

Hyperbole aside, none of that constitutes as anyone hoping he crashes and burns.

 

I just can’t wrap my head around how concerns about aspects of his game equates to hoping he crashes and burns.  As if it’s not entirely possible to believe one thing but hope for another.  

 

 

 

 

[Jabbyrwock]

53 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

But, as any good scientist would say, the sample size is way to small to confirm anything.

 

As a good scientist, I would never admit that my sample size is too small.

 

...besides...everyone knows its how you use your sample that matters.  

[Morneblade]

21 minutes ago, tmandoug1 said:

I wonder what Drew Bledsoe would say to that? 

 

Probably the same thing Alex Smith said about Patrick Mahomes.

21 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

I’ll have a pretty good idea who the best team will be this year by February. It’s science.

 

Where’s the fun in that? Some people like speculating…. and projecting things before they happen 🙂 

 

 

 

I don't see anyone stopping you from that. At the same time, are we allowed to not jump on the bandwagon just yet?

 

4 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

Okay, you can wait around for that sample size to increase, while I have fun and enjoy watching him play. There's really nothing to debate here, just optimism vs skepticism stuff. 

 

Oh, so I can't enjoy watching him play because I'm not on the bandwagon yet?

[zCommander]

46 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

There is barely any tape

on him, and they had a short week. That's not the same as say, having a bye week and 4 years of NFL tape. And not a very good defense, either.

 

You have to be a pretty dumb coach to wait 4 years to figure out how to stop a QB.

I am pretty sure everyone saw what he did against Tampa in the playoffs. 

[Morneblade]

1 minute ago, zskins said:

 

You have to be a pretty dumb coach to wait 4 years to figure out how to stop a QB.

I am pretty sure everyone saw what he did against Tampa in the playoffs. 

 

You have to be a pretty dumb coach to think you can figure out play call tendencies, where a qb likes to go within those play calls, and particular strengths and weaknesses of a player off of one game.

[Peregrine]

32 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

Literally ANY QB that is on a team, or practice squad in the NFL could have a couple games in which they look real good. Steven Montez could put 2 games together than look like the 2nd coming of Tom Brady. 

Ive almost never seen something more false said in my life.

 

Pretending that the NFL is easy for someone that hasnt played, to just roll in and dominate the best players in the world just because they havent seen his super-unique-never-seen-before-throwing-of-footballs is beyond absurd.  How about the highly regarded out of college and future second coming John Beck(2nd round pick)?  What did he do in his few games where nobody had any tape on him?  Thats right, he sucked.  The greatest ever in Brady had 18 TDs and 12 INTs in his first year at QB, Peyton Manning sucked, Brees was terrible for two years, Rodgers learned behind Favre for 3 years and after his first 4 games average 160 YPG.  Nobody had NFL game tape on them, did they?

 

Tell me this, if its SOOOOO ridiculously super easy where I can roll out there and light up the league because nobody has any tape on me, how come nobody has ever done what Taylor Heinicke has done before?  No QB in NFL history has ever completed 93 passes in his first three starts until Heinicke.  

 

Because starting your first games at QB in the NFL is really freaking hard.  Put down the sauce and call it a night.

[zCommander]

4 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

You have to be a pretty dumb coach to think you can figure out play call tendencies, where a qb likes to go within those play calls, and particular strengths and weaknesses of a player off of one game.

 

1.5 game actually. It is a week to week league. If you can't figure out a QB in a week then you are done. I will give you benefit of the doubt then. Let's see how the Bills do against TH. 

[Peregrine]

4 hours ago, mistertim said:

 

So saying "He's looked good in very limited time, but I think we need to see more before we decide that he's the future of the franchise" is trying to "take down" Heinicke? Do you really not think Ron and the other coaches would probably say the exact same thing?

 

True, in the 2 games he has started, he has played well. You don't think it's understandable to want to see more before crowning him?

Ah, so you are one of them.  At least you know!  I think Ron Rivera is like most coaches and doesnt enjoy anything until the offseason, and I also think that a fan shouldnt be pretending to be a big bad NFL head coach and would be happier to maybe focus on their actual life and enjoy it when a player on the team they root for plays well.

 

If you want to live your life like Ron Rivera every minute by all means, but you are going to be miserable and also pointless because hes already doing that job.  Also, I like how you decided to take my words and completely mistrue them to "crowning him" and "an entire line about what someone else might have said that I may or may not have been responding too but completely made up"!  Its okay to relax, some of us already are 😉

[Die Hard]

21 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

At the same time, are we allowed to not jump on the bandwagon just yet?

The innovation diffusion chart. But I think it’s pretty applicable for wider use.

 

Just don’t be a laggard. 😜

 

 

[mistertim]

1 minute ago, Peregrine said:

Ah, so you are one of them.  At least you know!  I think Ron Rivera is like most coaches and doesnt enjoy anything until the offseason, and I also think that a fan shouldnt be pretending to be a big bad NFL head coach and would be happier to maybe focus on their actual life and enjoy it when a player on the team they root for plays well.

 

If you want to live your life like Ron Rivera every minute by all means, but you are going to be miserable and also pointless because hes already doing that job.  Also, I like how you decided to take my words and completely mistrue them to "crowning him" and "an entire line about what someone else might have said that I may or may not have been responding too but completely made up"!  Its okay to relax, some of us already are 😉

 

[Burgundy Yoda]

21 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

Probably the same thing Alex Smith said about Patrick Mahomes.

 

I don't see anyone stopping you from that. At the same time, are we allowed to not jump on the bandwagon just yet?

 

 

Oh, so I can't enjoy watching him play because I'm not on the bandwagon yet?

I don't know, can you? It makes no sense to argue against something so heavily when it cannot be proven or disproven. 

[Malapropismic Depository]

So, in football terms, a Laggard is a Bandwagoner, it would seem

 

[Burgundy Yoda]

5 minutes ago, Die Hard said:

The innovation diffusion chart. But I think it’s pretty applicable for wider use.

 

Just don’t be a laggard. 😜

 

 

Brings me back to my college days looking at this lol. This is early adopters phase I think. ODU Aggie is one of the innovators 😆

Edited September 18, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[Commander Chaaarmnder]

3 minutes ago, Peregrine said:

Ah, so you are one of them.  At least you know!  I think Ron Rivera is like most coaches and doesnt enjoy anything until the offseason, and I also think that a fan shouldnt be pretending to be a big bad NFL head coach and would be happier to maybe focus on their actual life and enjoy it when a player on the team they root for plays well.

 

If you want to live your life like Ron Rivera every minute by all means, but you are going to be miserable and also pointless because hes already doing that job.  Also, I like how you decided to take my words and completely mistrue them to "crowning him" and "an entire line about what someone else might have said that I may or may not have been responding too but completely made up"!  Its okay to relax, some of us already are 😉

Man, I would hate to work alongside you. Such a downer.  
 

Best wishes for a speedy recovery in whatever is irking you. 

 

Wishing you the best, Godspeed,  

 

Hopefully Washington is the wind beneath your Wings

[Die Hard]

3 minutes ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

So, in football terms, a Laggard is a Bandwagoner, it would seem

 

 

[Morneblade]

10 minutes ago, Peregrine said:

Ive almost never seen something more false said in my life.

 

Pretending that the NFL is easy for someone that hasnt played, to just roll in and dominate the best players in the world just because they havent seen his super-unique-never-seen-before-throwing-of-footballs is beyond absurd.  How about the highly regarded out of college and future second coming John Beck(2nd round pick)?  What did he do in his few games where nobody had any tape on him?  Thats right, he sucked.  The greatest ever in Brady had 18 TDs and 12 INTs in his first year at QB, Peyton Manning sucked, Brees was terrible for two years, Rodgers learned behind Favre for 3 years and after his first 4 games average 160 YPG.  Nobody had NFL game tape on them, did they?

 

Tell me this, if its SOOOOO ridiculously super easy where I can roll out there and light up the league because nobody has any tape on me, how come nobody has ever done what Taylor Heinicke has done before?  No QB in NFL history has ever completed 93 passes in his first three starts until Heinicke.  

 

Because starting your first games at QB in the NFL is really freaking hard.  Put down the sauce and call it a night.

 

Well, when you sit there and completely misrepresent what I said, ( IE: LIE) sure, I can say why you would say that. But, Mahomes had 10 TD's and 0 int's in his first 2 games. Dan Marino came out on fire.

 

But getting back to my actual point, not the straw-man you concocted. Bad QB's have played well before in the NFL. Bad QB's however can't do it consistently. Which is why they are bad, or do you not understand that concept?

 

And if tape didn't help defenses game plan a QB, they would not bother with it. Or is getting tape just a complete waste of time?

 

Usually you're not this much of a doorknob, bad day?