2021 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[ShredSkins]

2 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Trey Sermon's Marshawn Lynch impression the last three games has been pretty incredible, begging the question where has this guy been the last two years?  I'd want a good answer to that question before I'd draft him early.  The inspired way he's run during this enormous outburst of productivity made me feel like I was watching Guice again.

 

 

Sermon showed some flashes at OU. but honestly I didn't know he had even transferred to Ohio State till mid season this year. So as an OU fan I can't say I was ever that impressed. Unlike OU's current RB Stephenson, that guy is awesome. 

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, ShredSkins said:

Sermon showed some flashes at OU. but honestly I didn't know he had even transferred to Ohio State till mid season this year. So as an OU fan I can't say I was ever that impressed. Unlike OU's current RB Stephenson, that guy is awesome. 

There’s a plethora of backs.

 

I am all in for Najee in round 1. But if we get to our pick and he’s gone or there are guys graded better (Smith? Lance? I’m including position weight and need in that “question”) I’m okay going back later. Guys like Sermon, the UNC guys, Ibrahim, I mean I could go on and on. There are so many good bellcow type backs. 
 

 

Edited January 5, 2021 by KDawg

[Skinsinparadise]

Just now, KDawg said:

There’s a plethora of backs.

 

I am all in for Najee in round 1. But if we get to our pick and he’s gone or there are guys graded better (Smith? Lance? I’m including position weight and need in that “question”) I’m okay going back later. Guys like Sermon, the UNC guys, Ibrahim, I mean I could go on and on. There are so many good bellcow type backs. 
 

 

 

RB and WR seems deep.  I've been guessing its a LT or QB  (if QB isn't addressrd earlier) depending on who falls.  But I think at 19 or wherever we pick, that pick can sort of make itself when there is some surprise faller. 

 

3 minutes ago, ShredSkins said:

Sermon showed some flashes at OU. but honestly I didn't know he had even transferred to Ohio State till mid season this year. So as an OU fan I can't say I was ever that impressed. Unlike OU's current RB Stephenson, that guy is awesome. 

 

I've talked up Stephenson some.  240 pounds.  A load to take down.  Fun watch. 

[mhd24]

6 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

RB and WR seems deep.  I've been guessing its a LT or QB  (if QB isn't addressrd earlier) depending on who falls.  But I think at 19 or wherever we pick, that pick can sort of make itself when there is some surprise faller. 

 

 

I've talked up Stephenson some.  240 pounds.  A load to take down.  Fun watch. 

 

 

If they don't like Mac Jones (I'm assuming the big 4 are all off the board) or if he's already selected, than I can see WR, LT, or LB being the pick.  CB is a possibility too depending on Darby coming back.  WR is so deep this year.  If we can trade back, that might be the best option honestly.  Get another 3rd and load up.

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

 

 

If they don't like Mac Jones (I'm assuming the big 4 are all off the board) or if he's already selected, than I can see WR, LT, or LB being the pick.  CB is a possibility too depending on Darby coming back.  WR is so deep this year.  If we can trade back, that might be the best option honestly.  Get another 3rd and load up.

I don’t think they go CB in round 1.

 

Moreau can be re-signed if Darby is too costly. I think if they draft a CB it’s later. I think our scouts are really good with defensive backs. 

[mhd24]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

I don’t think they go CB in round 1.

 

Moreau can be re-signed if Darby is too costly. I think if they draft a CB it’s later. I think our scouts are really good with defensive backs. 

Yeah, you're probably right.  I was just assuming that if Farley is there and they love him, it could be the pick.  LB is a the major need of our defense though.  I just think Parsons and Collins will be long gone.  What are your thoughts on the LB from Notre Dame (I'll just abbreviation of JOK)?

[Skinsinparadise]

9 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

 

 

If they don't like Mac Jones (I'm assuming the big 4 are all off the board) or if he's already selected, than I can see WR, LT, or LB being the pick.  CB is a possibility too depending on Darby coming back.  WR is so deep this year.  If we can trade back, that might be the best option honestly.  Get another 3rd and load up.

 

Mac would be the guy I am thinking.  Depends obviously based on what happens in FA/trades before the draft.

 

The way Rivera talked up continuity on the O line and hyped Lucas in the process, it definitely doesn't feel like Rivera will feel desperate at LT.  In the past, I thought LT was the no brainer pick because they are hard to find past round 1.  Now I am not so sure.  I do love Zaven Collins.   But I wonder if there is a surprise fall.  There almost always is.  Lets say Jaylen Waddle?  I get there is a ton of depth at certain spots but if you have one guy graded a mile higher than the next, IMO you pull the trigger.  So they might have sort of a Zen approach at that spot.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, mhd24 said:

Yeah, you're probably right.  I was just assuming that if Farley is there and they love him, it could be the pick.  LB is a the major need of our defense though.  I just think Parsons and Collins will be long gone.  What are your thoughts on the LB from Notre Dame (I'll just abbreviation of JOK)?

I wasn’t in love with him when I watched. But I have to watch him again. He really didn’t stand out to me at all. 
 

I haven’t watched much of the CBs. I despise watching them so I usually save them until last because I can’t ever see wtf they’re doing or should be doing coverage wise. Safeties I can tell a BIT more despite the camera view because I’m looking for range, how close to the ball they are and how and why they hit. But it’s tough to get the picture on them, too. 

Edited January 5, 2021 by KDawg

[SeatCushionGame]

Would someone pontificate on Waddle?   If I remember correctly, he was rated higher than Smith before his injury and Smith's incredible year.  Thanks in advance.

[mhd24]

6 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Mac would be the guy I am thinking.  Depends obviously based on what happens in FA/trades before the draft.

 

The way Rivera talked up continuity on the O line and hyped Lucas in the process, it definitely doesn't feel like Rivera will feel desperate at LT.  In the past, I thought LT was the no brainer pick because they are hard to find past round 1.  Now I am not so sure.  I do love Zaven Collins.   But I wonder if there is a surprise fall.  There almost always is.  Lets say Jaylen Waddle?  I get there is a ton of depth at certain spots but if you have one guy graded a mile higher than the next, IMO you pull the trigger.  So they might have sort of a Zen approach at that spot.

I think if Waddle is there (and he could be considering I think its a lock that Smith, Chase, and Pitts go above him), I can certainly see him being picked.  He'd also greatly improve our PRs.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, mhd24 said:

I think if Waddle is there (and he could be considering I think its a lock that Smith, Chase, and Pitts go above him), I can certainly see him being picked.  He'd also greatly improve our PRs.

Last year we thought it was a lock that Jeudy and Lamb would go ahead of Ruggs...

[method man]

54 minutes ago, thelongestbreath said:

Just Miami and Jacksonville.  I'm not sure either would want to trade the 2-2s unless someone fell to 19

I would also take a 2021 2nd, 2021 3rd/4th and 2022 2nd if there is no one we love

[Going Commando]

28 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

RB and WR seems deep.  I've been guessing its a LT or QB  (if QB isn't addressrd earlier) depending on who falls.  But I think at 19 or wherever we pick, that pick can sort of make itself when there is some surprise faller. 

 

I think RB and WR are in play in the first round given Carolina's draft history when Rivera was there.  I think LB is also likely.  Assuming the first round QBs are gone  by 19, I think we'll pick one of the three Bama skill players, Etienne, Bateman, Zaven Collins, Owusu-Koromoah, Vera-Tucker, Christian Darrisaw, Sam Cosmi, Liam Eichenberg, Rashawn Slater, or Jalen Mayfield.

 

I also think Farley or Surtain could be the pick if they are there, just from a BPA perspective.

 

Of that list, Smith and Collins are my two favorites so far.

[KDawg]

12 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I think RB and WR are in play in the first round given Carolina's draft history when Rivera was there.  I think LB is also likely.  Assuming the first round QBs are gone  by 19, I think we'll pick one of the three Bama skill players, Etienne, Bateman, Zaven Collins, Owusu-Koromoah, Vera-Tucker, Christian Darrisaw, Sam Cosmi, Liam Eichenberg, Rashawn Slater, or Jalen Mayfield.

 

I also think Farley or Surtain could be the pick if they are there, just from a BPA perspective.

 

Of that list, Smith and Collins are my two favorites so far.

Smith/Harris/Collins of that list for me.

 

Etienne, Bateman, Owusu-Koromoah and Mayfield I really don’t like there... but I have to rewatch Owusu. Etienne is too much of the same product we already have. He’s going to be a good back somewhere but I don’t want so much redundancy. 
 

I like Vera-Tucker a lot, but he translates more to a guard in my eye. A damn good one. 
 

I like Surtain from what I’ve seen. 

Edited January 5, 2021 by KDawg

[Going Commando]

34 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Last year we thought it was a lock that Jeudy and Lamb would go ahead of Ruggs...

 

Speed can get you picked early.  That's what makes me think Waddle could go really early.  He looks like the type of athlete who could crush the drills and run like a low 4.3.  Smith is an open field glider who runs away from anyone on a football field, but I don't know if he'll time fast.  Jeremiah said he heard Smith runs low 4.5, maybe dip into high 4.4.  Waddle could definitely get picked ahead of him based on his speed.  A 175 pound receiver who runs a 4.5 is only going to get picked so high.

Edited January 5, 2021 by stevemcqueen1

[CapsSkins]

@KDawg isn't it a Rule of Thumb that you don't go RB in the 1st round unless you think they're a Derrick Henry or Saquon level talent?

[CommDownMan]

1 hour ago, thelongestbreath said:

Just Miami and Jacksonville.  I'm not sure either would want to trade the 2-2s unless someone fell to 19

 

With Miami at 3 and 18 (with an option to trade back at 3 if they like Tua still)...   I don't see them being a likely option either.

 

edit: and Jax also has 21 (ish-clearly playoff TBD).  So both unlikely. 

 

Edited January 5, 2021 by jsharrin55

[KDawg]

3 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Speed can get you picked early.  That's what makes me think Waddle could go really early.  He looks like the type of athlete who could crush the drills and run like a low 4.3.  Smith is an open field glider who runs away from anyone on a football field, but I don't know if he'll time fast.  Jeremiah said he heard Smith runs low 4.5, maybe dip into high 4.4.  Waddle could definitely get picked ahead of him based on his speed.  A 175 pound receiver who runs a 4.5 is only going to get picked so high.

In complete agreement. Despite rankings and ability speed is a major intangible for some teams and not for others. So it really depends on who is drafting. Smith running slow (I think he’ll time “slow”, too, for what it’s worth) means he could fall below Waddle. And he’ll likely wind up behind Chase by 10 picks if his speed isn’t top end. 
 

That’s good for us.

4 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

@KDawg isn't it a Rule of Thumb that you don't go RB in the 1st round unless you think they're a Derrick Henry or Saquon level talent?

It may be. And I understand it. But I see Najee and I see what our offense could be if you have him as the primary ball carrier with Gibson fresh for his attempts and the playmaking ability of Gibson and McKissick in the passing game and I think it really helps out our quarterback, whoever it may be. A bellcow back changes this team.

 

I’d say a better rule of thumb is that you don’t pay a back after their rookie contract big money unless it’s DH2K or a dominating back of a similar ilk.

[CapsSkins]

3 minutes ago, KDawg said:

It may be. And I understand it. But I see Najee and I see what our offense could be if you have him as the primary ball carrier with Gibson fresh for his attempts and the playmaking ability of Gibson and McKissick in the passing game and I think it really helps out our quarterback, whoever it may be. A bellcow back changes this team.

 

I’d say a better rule of thumb is that you don’t pay a back after their rookie contract big money unless it’s DH2K or a dominating back of a similar ilk.

 

I hear you. My point was not about the value of a bellcow back but rather trying to find one in Rd 1 vs lower rounds or FA (or trade I guess).

 

I'd think that, barring generational talents, there are certain positions you'd prioritize in Rd 1 not based on team need but rather based on positional supply/demand in later rounds or FA. But maybe I'm wrong - I'm much better versed in hockey roster building & cap and still learning the football side. Value of picks and cap structures are vastly different between the two sports. 

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, CapsSkins said:

 

I hear you. My point was not about the value of a bellcow back but rather trying to find one in Rd 1 vs lower rounds or FA (or trade I guess).

 

I'd think that, barring generational talents, there are certain positions you'd prioritize in Rd 1 not based on team need but rather based on positional supply/demand in later rounds or FA. But maybe I'm wrong - I'm much better versed in hockey roster building & cap and still learning the football side. Value of picks and cap structures are vastly different between the two sports. 

I think Najee is special. But I don’t pass on a guy like Smith for him I don’t think. So I’m in somewhat agreement with you.

[Skinsinparadise]

36 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

I think RB and WR are in play in the first round given Carolina's draft history when Rivera was there. 

 

Good point.

 

36 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

 I think LB is also likely. 

 

Maybe.  If they want their Shaq Thompson type -- Owusu-Koramoah?  Though they took Shaq in the 2nd and Koramoah is undersized even by Shaq's standards,  Him and Collins i could see in the first.  Maybe Bolton? Ossai?  

 

36 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Of that list, Smith and Collins are my two favorites so far.

 

We loved D. Smith before it was cool to do so.   I'd just be stunned if he falls all the way to our pick.  But maybe if he has a pedestrian combine and there is a big run of qbs, corners and tackles early on which often happens.

 

Who do I think are gone for sure before our pick: (12 players)

Lawrence

Fields 

Wilson

Lance

Parsons

J. Chase. 

Pitts

Surtain

Rosseau

Sewell

K. Paye

Farley

 

Who are likely gone:

D. Smith

Darrisaw

Tough for me to guess which one but either Slater or Cosmi

J. Waddle

C. Barmore

 

Might be at our pick or goes just before it

Mac Jones

one of thre tackles among Leatherwood, Cosmi, Slater

Nick Bolton

N. Harris

T. Etienne

Koramoah

W. Davis

J. Horn

 

I might be forgetting a player or two but its my best shot right now which granted is early.  I know some think Harris is gone by the time we pick.  It's possible but i think he's more likely there because of how some see the position and the depth in the draft. 

Edited January 5, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Koolblue13]

Wonder if we could trade this year and next years 2nds and sneak back into the first again and walk with Harris and Jones.

[CapsSkins]

27 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Wonder if we could trade this year and next years 2nds and sneak back into the first again and walk with Harris and Jones.

 

I'm becoming quite bearish on the idea of drafting a first round QB who isn't mobile. In today's NFL, I just don't see taking that big a swing on guy with that limited a skill set. But wtf do I know

[RichmondRedskin88]

44 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Wonder if we could trade this year and next years 2nds and sneak back into the first again and walk with Harris and Jones.

I already said if we got Mac, Harris, and D Smith we would be legit SB contenders.  I think 2 of the 3 we could definitely make some serious noise. 

Edited January 5, 2021 by RichmondRedskin88

[Riggo#44]

10 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

I'm becoming quite bearish on the idea of drafting a first round QB who isn't mobile. In today's NFL, I just don't see taking that big a swing on guy with that limited a skill set. But wtf do I know

 

I have been saying this for a while--if you look at the top-rated QBs in the league under 35 or so, they're all mobile: Rodgers (over the age, but still very mobile), Mahomes, Wilson, Murray, Burrow, Herbet, Watson, Prescott, Tannehill, Allen, Jackson, Jones, et al. They may not run all the time, but they can all run. It's the direction the league is going--which is why I like Ridder. Jamie Newman is the big unknown in this draft as well.