FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[evmiii]

I agree almost all NFL QB's can effectively break down film in slow motion, one of the things that's seperates the great from the not as great are how quickly and effectively they can do it within a live play.  By all accounts, this is one of DH's strengths.  In my opinion this ability leads to the much desired throwing with anticipation.  Add a strong arm and you can see all the hype.

 

DH has a lot to learn and perfect (play calling, huddle mgt, snaps under center, and the playbook, etc,..), but these are all things that can be taught and learned readily.  The calmness under pressure, size and strength can't be taught.  With our schedule, watching 4 or 5 weeks might be a positive learning experience, but he will be the starter sooner than later.

[mistertim]

56 minutes ago, skinsfan93 said:

What are you talking about? You’re comparing Haskins to Eddie Vedder? The guy hasn’t played a down in the NFL and last I saw his completion percentage last year was 70% in one of the top conferences in the country. 

 

Will Haskins need to improve on technique and his footwork? Of course but you seem to think this is uncorrectable. There’s video of rookie camp already where coaches are working on his footwork and taking snaps under center. He has OTAs and all preseason to work on it. He’s an athlete and played QB since he was 11. As far as understanding the game many talk about how he is not only book smart but football smart. He will be fine!

 

Yes I am absolutely 100% comparing Dwayne Haskins to Eddie Vedder. Dwayne can't carry a note to save his life, and Vedder is awful when you get pressure on him through the A gaps.

 

Seriously though I have no clue why you brought up Eddie Vedder. I was saying that in order to become great at something it helps to have a solid fundamental base first. Sorry if you didn't like my music metaphor. 

 

You said "but you seem to think that is uncorrectable", even though I've literally said twice now recently in this thread that I DO think it is absolutely correctable, but I just don't know how much time it will take. I mean, I said that in the actual post that you're quoting ("It absolutely can be fixed but how long it will take really depends on the QB in question.")

 

My entire point is that he needs to work on his fundamentals, that he has only 1 year of college starting experience, and that he had a stacked team in his one (admittedly dominant) year. I've never said I don't think he can do it. I just question how long it will take given the factors I just mentioned and I hope that the coaching staff and FO will take it slow if need be and give him time before they throw him to the wolves, because that could be much worse than sitting him. 

 

I also hope the fan base is willing to be patient with him. I know I am.

[volsmet]

2 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

 

You said "but you seem to think that is uncorrectable", even though I've literally said twice now recently in this thread that I DO think it is absolutely correctable, but I just don't know how much time it will take. I mean, I said that in the actual post that you're quoting ("It absolutely can be fixed but how long it will take really depends on the QB in question.")

 

 

 

[NickyJ]

1 hour ago, skinsfan93 said:

What about people who don't know how to spell and form correct sentences? What’s that say about YOU as an educated fan? Oh and it’s Deon not Dion 💩

[Thinking Skins]

On that Rypien advice, it's a cool statement but I'd much rather him be in the film room or working on things with coaches than simply at the facilities. Well, on one hand at least when he's there he's not out doing something criminal but I don't want those videos and stuff making him look too be the prefect athlete. He needs to be good at knowing his flaws and working to fix them. And I don't count his 40 time as one of his flaws. 

[Llevron]

That’s clearly what he’s saying lol

[goskins10]

8 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

On that Rypien advice, it's a cool statement but I'd much rather him be in the film room or working on things with coaches than simply at the facilities. Well, on one hand at least when he's there he's not out doing something criminal but I don't want those videos and stuff making him look too be the prefect athlete. He needs to be good at knowing his flaws and working to fix them. And I don't count his 40 time as one of his flaws. 

 

I think you are missing the point completely.  That’s exactly what Ryp is saying. Be there early to start preparing. Stay there late and get that extra film time in or Q&A with coaches.  Get a few guys to come in early or stay late and run routes. Twitter is limited in space.  There would be zero reason for him to tell hey go hang out.  He is saying exactly what you are. 👍

 

 

[mistertim]

9 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

On that Rypien advice, it's a cool statement but I'd much rather him be in the film room or working on things with coaches than simply at the facilities. Well, on one hand at least when he's there he's not out doing something criminal but I don't want those videos and stuff making him look too be the prefect athlete. He needs to be good at knowing his flaws and working to fix them. And I don't count his 40 time as one of his flaws. 

 

Isn't the film room at the facility? 

[Llevron]

This was my bedtime story last night. Not sure if y’all are interested but a few might be. 

 

 

 

 

[Thinking Skins]

8 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

I think you are missing the point completely.  That’s exactly what Ryp is saying. Be there early to start preparing. Stay there late and get that extra film time in or Q&A with coaches.  Get a few guys to come in early or stay late and run routes. Twitter is limited in space.  There would be zero reason for him to tell hey go hang out.  He is saying exactly what you are. 👍

 

 

Rg3  was there, but not watching video and learning to read defenses or how to drop back or how to slide. He was working on his brand, running 40s, and doing promo videos. That's what I don't want. Heck even Campbell didn't work on his slide. 

 

Hankins is a great story right now, but I want his best friend to be Alex Smith because Mahomes talks about how simply watching Smith do things he learned how to carry himself as an NFLqb. It's great that Haskins likes watching film until he starts hanging with the wrong person who gets him into illegal drugs or goofing off. 

[volsmet]

16 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

On that Rypien advice, it's a cool statement but I'd much rather him be in the film room or working on things with coaches than simply at the facilities. 

 

If you can’t break down film at the facilities, we need an upgrade.

[dc1]

On 5/16/2019 at 7:40 PM, ggarriso said:

From the jump I have thought Haskins had piss poor body language - was clearly not truly excited about coming here based on the non scripted footage from draft night.  Obviously the Kevin O video is highly edited but I think the most interesting moment happens around 2:30, its the only time in the video he goes to try to actually make a correction and Haskins turns away from him, does not look him in the eye and is essentially acting dismissive.  I think overall this is a kid who is acting hella entitled for doing absolutely nothing in the NFL, will be interesting to watch it all unfold.

  

 

On 5/17/2019 at 3:10 PM, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

 

There is something about his personality that is hard to figure out, without knowing him well, or personally.

Whether he's just real laid-back, or is he a little lethargic, or is he aloof, or un-passionate, or indifferent, or is he just shy ?

Just for whatever reason, doesn't seem super-engaging.

This and other comments like this is the hight of false concern or passive aggressive malfeasance.

At the very least, you honestly think this is a thing; (here is an early holiday present) It is not.

 

Please stop this.  If you are a skins fan, please appreciate that we got, at draft pick @ 15, what many in the industry think is the best QB in this year's draft.

 

Knowing the above, DH had to wait until the 15th pick to hear his name called.

 

If the best you can do is cherry pick his multiple videos/interviews from draft night so that you can misrepresent his disappointment and subsequent chip on his shoulder as problematic, .. then god help you become a better person.

 

 

DH may be a bust, he may not.

 

But for me, I'm going to enjoy what we have based on college tape untill the 16 pro game tapes tell me otherwise.

  

[volsmet]

3 minutes ago, dc1 said:

 

 

 

Please stop this.  If you are a skins fan, please appreciate that we got, at draft pick @ 15, what many in the industry think is the best QB in this year's draft.

 

  

 

What industry?

[Malapropismic Depository]

5 minutes ago, dc1 said:

 

This and other comments like this is the hight of false concern or passive aggressive malfeasance.

 

 

 

All I said, basically, is he's a hard guy to figure out.

It could be a positive thing, or it could be a negative thing. None of us knows for sure. I wasn't making any definitive assumptions either way, positive or negative.

What I said was absolutely truthful.

[volsmet]

1 minute ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

None of us knows for sure. 

 

[dc1]

22 hours ago, volsmet said:

 

What industry?

Darn it Volsmet.

 

...😒

The industry that thrives on player and pro football projections .

You have been incredibly to prolific in the thread to ask that question.

[volsmet]

3 minutes ago, dc1 said:

Darn it Volsmet.

 

...😒

The industry that thrives on player and pro football projections .

You have been incredibly to prolific in the thread ask that ask that question.

 

Actual football industry v draft expert industry was the distinction I sought to find. 

[Malapropismic Depository]

On 5/16/2019 at 7:40 PM, ggarriso said:

From the jump I have thought Haskins had piss poor body language - was clearly not truly excited about coming here based on the non scripted footage from draft night.  Obviously the Kevin O video is highly edited but I think the most interesting moment happens around 2:30, its the only time in the video he goes to try to actually make a correction and Haskins turns away from him, does not look him in the eye and is essentially acting dismissive.  I think overall this is a kid who is acting extremely entitled for doing absolutely nothing in the NFL, will be interesting to watch it all unfold.

  

 

On 5/16/2019 at 9:21 PM, dc1 said:

I'm 100% sure you do not have the full picture or a complete read of this.

 

This is a true statement, dc1, but to be fair, the reality is that that above statement could be said about an overwhelming majority of fan opinions, to varying degrees and in some cases, very large degrees.

There is a deluge of information that fans are not privvy to about any given team topic, and a torrent of behind the scenes activities that occur and are relevant, that of course, fans do not see, yet it's the nature of all of us fans to still make conclusive statements. If you went through a message board, using the magnifying glass I just spoke of, i'm sure you'd recognize what I'm talking about and agree.

Not picking on anybody, or particular scenario. Just making an observation of something I see frequently.

[dc1]

3 hours ago, Malapropismic Depository said:

 

 

This is a true statement, dc1, but to be fair, the reality is that that above statement could be said about an overwhelming majority of fan opinions, to varying degrees and in some cases, very large degrees.

There is a deluge of information that fans are not privvy to about any given team topic, and a torrent of behind the scenes activities that occur and are relevant, that of course, fans do not see, yet it's the nature of all of us fans to still make conclusive statements. If you went through a message board, using the magnifying glass I just spoke of, i'm sure you'd recognize what I'm talking about and agree.

Not picking on anybody, or particular scenario. Just making an observation of something I see frequently.

You are spot on.  I agree.

 

We are talking about relative probability however.  Outside of Heath Shuler, the Skins have not had a more sure thing at QB from the draft.

 

By the way, in no way is the above lost on me.  

 

While DH's measurables, prior performance and competence exceeds Heaths (coming out of collage),  I ask that you please excuse me for a moment while I look outside for a four leaf clover to ward off another Heath Shuler disappointment.

 

[goskins10]

4 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

Rg3  was there, but not watching video and learning to read defenses or how to drop back or how to slide. He was working on his brand, running 40s, and doing promo videos. That's what I don't want. Heck even Campbell didn't work on his slide. 

 

Hankins is a great story right now, but I want his best friend to be Alex Smith because Mahomes talks about how simply watching Smith do things he learned how to carry himself as an NFLqb. It's great that Haskins likes watching film until he starts hanging with the wrong person who gets him into illegal drugs or goofing off. 

 

Ok, there is clearly a disconnect here. You may not have meant this, but your original comment sounded like you were concerned about Rypien's comment in that he did not go far enough. I am pretty sure I am not the only one who read it that way. It appears you were actually making a general statement about Haskins, not about Rypiens comment and were just using that as a starting point. If so, then fair enough. May have been helpful to state that up front - just a suggestion. 

 

If the above is true, the more confusing thing is why you have these concerns about Haskins. Especially the illegal drugs and goofing off. Seriously, where did that come from? I mean of course we all want him to be great and to stay away from those things but there is zero and I mean zero indication he will go that way. And you reference Robert? Why? You realize Robert never had a problem with drugs. And he did work on film a lot. He also worked on sliding (they even brought in MLB coaches to show him). He was just not good at it. He was a bit of a self centered brat btu he also worked hard and had no off the field issues while in Wash. 

 

It just really sounds like you are borrowing trouble when there is no evidence that he has any more chance than any other player of going that way - and at his level and being a QB, that list is pretty small. He has a much better chance of just plain busting out (easy folks, not saying that I even think he will, just making a point) because his game is not good enough - no matter how much film he watches, than going down some dark path into drugs and illegal activity. Wow, that's just such a huge jump. 

 

If you have specific reasons that suggest we should be concerned, I would be very interested in hearing them. I mean that honestly.  

[Thinking Skins]

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

Ok, there is clearly a disconnect here. You may not have meant this, but your original comment sounded like you were concerned about Rypien's comment in that he did not go far enough. I am pretty sure I am not the only one who read it that way. It appears you were actually making a general statement about Haskins, not about Rypiens comment and were just using that as a starting point. If so, then fair enough. May have been helpful to state that up front - just a suggestion. 

Not sure why there's confusion. I'm saying that I hear statements about guys who are the first guy in and last guy out, almost like its a cliche. I'm just saying that it matters more what he does while he's there, not simply that he's there.

 

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

If the above is true, the more confusing thing is why you have these concerns about Haskins. Especially the illegal drugs and goofing off. Seriously, where did that come from? I mean of course we all want him to be great and to stay away from those things but there is zero and I mean zero indication he will go that way. And you reference Robert? Why? You realize Robert never had a problem with drugs. And he did work on film a lot. He also worked on sliding (they even brought in MLB coaches to show him). He was just not good at it. He was a bit of a self centered brat btu he also worked hard and had no off the field issues while in Wash. 

 

Robert didn't but Trent did. So did the other Trent (Murphy). Montae got arrested. Ruben got arrested. Twice. Like it or not there exists the possibility for him to hang around with "the wrong crowd". And I mention Robert because Robert frustrated me to the nth degree because he was so set on getting back for week 1 that he wasn't studying videos, he was pulling whatever that was in the video with his knee. There were rumors (and all I can treat them as is rumors) about his work ethic and his willingness to see his bad plays. The RG3 statement wasn't to bring up drugs but I do question his work ethic in terms of footwork, dropbacks, and watching film because thats what beat reporters have said coaches say about him. 

 

I referenced Mahomes because he stated that Alex Smith was a great influence to him, just seeing him everyday, what he did, how he did it, the fact that he was there to answer questions and stuff, etc. (https://www.apnews.com/ff4a1b5eba1dd2dfd289d4c0d1d37cb4)

 

“Alex was heaven-sent,” LaTroy Hawkins, Mahomes’ godfather, told the publication. “That was a gift from God right there, for Alex to be so open with a rookie that was brought in, pretty much, to take his job. But that also shows how secure Alex is in who he is as a person outside of football.”

 

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

It just really sounds like you are borrowing trouble when there is no evidence that he has any more chance than any other player of going that way - and at his level and being a QB, that list is pretty small. He has a much better chance of just plain busting out (easy folks, not saying that I even think he will, just making a point) because his game is not good enough - no matter how much film he watches, than going down some dark path into drugs and illegal activity. Wow, that's just such a huge jump. 

 

Who said anything about "more chance", I'm just talking about the risks of every player. Heck he has risks of getting injured and other stuff. But just like a father wants his children to choose good friends because those friends will influence his decisions in areas where I (the father) can't. That's all I'm saying here. I really didn't think it was a big deal other than the obvious that hadn't been stated. What you say is true, but if there's a Fred Davis type player on the team or a Ricky Williams type or even a class clown type and is trying to pull Haskins into that direction, I hope that Haskins is chooising to be a guy more like Smith and chooses Smith as a mentor. And I hope that's why we're keeping Smith around and that Smith can be helpful to him. 

 

The risk of Haskins taking a bad road may not be any greater but the impacts are. If the second string long snapper gets suspended from the league indefinitely for drugs, then so what we can replace him. But if the franchise QB does, then we have to start over again. Now he could suck and all that but what if he doesn't. RG3 didn't suck. He did get hurt, but he also didn't put in the necessary hours in the film room and in improving his fundamentals. Thats why he had a riff with Shanahan. 

 

6 minutes ago, goskins10 said:

 

If you have specific reasons that suggest we should be concerned, I would be very interested in hearing them. I mean that honestly.  

 

I have no specific reasons other than that he's human and thus susceptible to human temptations. Honestly, you and I have conversed many times over the years, this type of stuff isn't my MO. I know almost nothing about Haskins, but these are my fears - that the player we saw in college is who we will see in 5 years and he won't continue to get better. 

[goskins10]

7 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Not sure why there's confusion. I'm saying that I hear statements about guys who are the first guy in and last guy out, almost like its a cliche. I'm just saying that it matters more what he does while he's there, not simply that he's there.

 

The confusion is that your initial comment felt like it was directed AT Rypien not a general statement. It's clear now that was not your intent but it's the way it read. But no matter. It's not a big deal.

 

 

7 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

Edit

 

I have no specific reasons other than that he's human and thus susceptible to human temptations. Honestly, you and I have conversed many times over the years, this type of stuff isn't my MO. I know almost nothing about Haskins, but these are my fears - that the player we saw in college is who we will see in 5 years and he won't continue to get better. 

 

The bold part is the most confusing, not because I think it's inaccurate, but quite the opposite. You are generally pretty grounded. I agree of course it's a possibility but it's just not where I would go first. If he starts to show some signs then Ok I get it. But until then, assume the best. This feels like being concerned without any more foundation than a general fear.  

 

But fair enough. 

[HTTRDynasty]

 

[HTTRDynasty]

It just hit me for some reason that Jay now has a QB who profiles extremely similarly to Jared Goff as a prospect, who just had an MVP caliber season with Sean McVay calling plays for him. 

 

-Both were far from mobile coming out (Goff had negative 114 rushing yards in his college career). 

 

-Both displayed elite short/intermediate accuracy in school

 

-Both were considered “rhythm passers”

 

-Both were very good at climbing the pocket and making subtle moves to avoid pressure within the pocket 

 

-Both were adept at reading defenses and manipulating defenders with their eyes 

 

-Both of their accuracy percentages dropped off at a pretty significant rate when throwing with pressure in their face 

 

 

Have to believe that if Sean could make it work with Goff at QB in his system, Jay can make it work with Haskins.