FAREWELL to the NFL Dwayne Haskins QB Ohio State

[JoeJacobyHOForRIOT]

Haskins really threw 50 td's at OHIO State ? 50 ?!  

 

 

  Still though, Haskins is the best QB on this roster and more importantly has wayyyyyy more upside than Case Keenum. I feel like last night was a preview of what we can expect all year from Keenum. Just a very vanilla, make a  play here, mistake there,  just boring slog of mediocre pre-Kirk Cousins style of football. ie the Grossman-Campbell-Brunnell-Collins-Tony Banks- Mathews -Weurful ect ect era's

 

  Haskins belongs on the field because he is the future, There is nothing for him to gain by sitting and "watching" Its not 1990 anymore , You do more harm letting him sit. Trial by fire, Sink or Swim, on the job training. The future is NOW !

[MartinC]

43 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Absolutely not.  I've put forth a web of reasoning behind this and none of it is S&G.  Here's another one: say we have something similar to last year where the calls for benching Alex grows because it seems like we are winning inspite of him not because of him, but we are winning.  Do we jus gut it out the whole year because we might make it to 9-7 even when Haskins is "ready" because we arent technically eliminated yet?  What is more important, this season or Haskins in general?  Priority should be developing Haskins by any means neccesary.

 

If we are winning it's hard to see a QB switch being made. Let's be real the tipping point of when Haskins is 'ready' is not an objective thing, its very much a subjective opinion. I don't get the sense Haskins is impatient about starting or has an ego about it (perhaps in the way we might have seen from a previous rookie(s) for example).

 

And I 100% agree with you that Haskins long term development is far more important than this seasons record. We ain't winning the Super Bowl this season! That's why I am very relaxed indeed about him sitting this whole season if thats the coaches judgement on the best way to develop him. I really do think they would start Haskins if they thought he was ready and I expect to see him at some point this season one way or another. Week 6 is my current bet.

 

But if the team is winning with or despite Keenum then I am totally fine with Haskins taking a red shirt year. Long term that may well be the best thing that could happen to him.

[Malapropismic Depository]

2 minutes ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Haskins really threw 50 td's at OHIO State ? 50 ?!  

 

  Still though, Haskins is the best QB on this roster and more importantly has wayyyyyy more upside than Case Keenum. I feel like last night was a preview of what we can expect all year from Keenum. Just a very vanilla, make a  play here, mistake there,  just boring slog of mediocre pre-Kirk Cousins style of football. ie the Grossman-Campbell-Brunnell-Collins-Tony Banks- Mathews -Weurful ect ect era's

 

  Haskins belongs on the field because he is the future, There is nothing for him to gain by sitting and "watching" Its not 1990 anymore , You do more harm letting him sit. Trial by fire, Sink or Swim, on the job training. The future is NOW !

 

The team's #1 goal this season is to get to the playoffs, which is likely more important to the coaches than to see what we have in Haskins.

More than likely, Keenum will give us the best chance for the playoffs.

Speeding up Haskins' development, I think is secondary to making the playoffs.

[Spaceman Spiff]

8 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Agreed, at this point I'm looking forward to week 1 getting here so we can see what we really dealing with.

 

The decision has already been made, it will be more interesting seeing who sticks to their stance once the bullets really starting flying.  My stance isnt going to change to cater the offense to where hes at so he can get as much experience as he can, but me talking about isnt going to change anything I jus enjoy bouncing it off of yall. 

 

Even my own Dad disagrees with me, but we both get where we coming from.

 

I think part of the thing that doesn't get talked about much here is where Jay falls in all of this.  Or maybe it's been discussed a bunch and I haven't seen it.  But whatever.   He's been coach here for awhile now and it's time to win some games.  He's not on the hot seat but he's certainly a candidate to be.  IIRC his contract is ending soon, too.

 

So Jay's really gotta win some games this year.  If Jay were in year 1 of a new contract and this was his first season, I think there'd have been a greater chance of seeing Haskins from the start.  

 

Case is serviceable.  I dunno if we can win games with him but I think from Jay's perspective he gotta stack the deck in his favor the best that he can this year.  And if that means putting a rookie QBs development on the backburner so he can keep his job/get a new contract...well, that's what it's gotta be.

[Malapropismic Depository]

Most teams that pick a QB so high in the draft, and start him immediately in a trial by fire, are typically bad teams with nothing to lose, really.

Our situation is unique from those situations because our roster has overall playoff-calibre talent.

So, rushing a rookie QB's development, which typically comes with a price to pay, is likely to greatly compromise that.

[ExoDus84]

25 minutes ago, JoeJacobyHOForRIOT said:

Haskins belongs on the field because he is the future, There is nothing for him to gain by sitting and "watching" Its not 1990 anymore , You do more harm letting him sit. Trial by fire, Sink or Swim, on the job training. The future is NOW !

 

Haskins was third on the depth chart for the entirety of training camp/OTA's. The coaches watched him and felt like that's where he belonged. The beat writers who cover training camp consistently said that while Haskins had his moments, he was still the least efficient quarterback in camp.

 

Haskins has more talent and upside than Colt/Keenum, but he's obviously not as polished or ready as the other two guys we have. He won't start the season, and shouldn't until the coaches feel he's ready to handle it.

[Malapropismic Depository]

Some people say "Future is Now".

But we all know "Paloffs is Now".

Keenum is more likely to get us to the playoffs.

So Keenum is now.

 

And I'd rather win with an un-sexy QB, than lose with a sexy one.

[DJHJR86]

2 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Just to reiterate, your plan would play out:

 

1 - Draft a QB in the first round

2 - Set him up for failure in his rookie year

3 - When he fails, draft another QB in the first round next year

 

That would be a demonstration of systemic incompetence.  No young QB would succeed for an organization like that.

 

I'm running out of interest in arguing against this terrible idea that's not going to happen.  Either you eventually see how terrible the idea is or I can't help you.

 

This is the real reason for everyone who is arguing to start him week one.  Good on you for being honest and self-aware enough to admit it.  But it'd be bad for both him and the team and it's not going to happen.

 

Do you honestly think I want to draft another QB based off of one year of Haskins struggling?  I said, by your fantasy about how if Haskins was benched it would somehow ruin his career, that we should draft another QB anyway because he's obviously not mentally tough enough to handle the position.  In reality, I don't think Haskins is as soft as you perceive him to be.  Regardless, if and when they start Haskins, he isn't getting benched for poor performance.  

[DJHJR86]

48 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

You've got to earn the job to earn respect.  I know it's still a touchy subject around here, but remember 2015?  When Robert was annointed the starter begrudgingly by Jay in the offseason.  Camp comes around and it's clear as day that Kirk is the best QB on the roster.  Jay and Scot had to plead their case to Dan that they were going with Kirk, because they had to or risk losing the locker room.

 

The entire premise of starting Haskins week 1, for me anyway, rests on the fact that as of right now, if there is minimal separation between him and Keenum with regards to who has looked better all offseason, then what is the point in waiting for Keenum to inevitably play himself out of the position instead of getting Haskins the much needed experience?  

[Chachie]

I'm not in favor of starting Haskins behind the current offensive line. It's not about who has the most experience, talent, playbook knowledge, etc. I honestly think Dwayne's arm and his youth/upside make him an even split with the experience of Case and Colt.

 

We drafted him for his pedigree and his future. He'll get killed this season w/o Trent Williams. Absolutely ruined. Say goodbye to Dwayne Haskins if he has to learn the game behind this miserable pass protection.

[NickyJ]

42 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

You mean like Blacklist?

 

You walked right into that one

 

You're right, not much else to talk about but I feel like it's gone round and round.  

Hey, Blacklist wasn't that bad! Except for the wedding/death/birth episode. They kind of nuked the shark on that one. And all the seasons after it...

 

Okay, yeah, it has been kind of not good for a while.

 

[KDawg]

46 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

 

The decision has already been made, it will be more interesting seeing who sticks to their stance once the bullets really starting flying.  

 

 

I haven't seen anyone saying Haskins shouldn't play at all. This conversation seems to be about week one and the immediate future. Things change quick in the NFL.

[RandyHolt]

Haskins is VERY short on experience.  I am not sold kicking the can down the road changes that significantly, being a scout QB with Kidsy and Tesson.  I am convinced I am the only one that fears the pick is almost wasted if a new head coach comes in here and decides he doesn't want a raw rookie. Wants his own guy especially if secretly.   They don't get much more raw than 1 year of college.

 

Let Keenum and Colt crash and burn and re-eval. If they are so good that there is no doubt they should play (e.g. winning) it all takes care of itself.

 

A little theory I have about Colt dominating in camp. I wonder how much he would have dominated had he had the fear of being hit.   I am going out on a limb fingers crossed but would like to think Haskins should prove more durable than him.  So with full hitting happening, that is when I want to know - who is better.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

5 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The entire premise of starting Haskins week 1, for me anyway, rests on the fact that as of right now, if there is minimal separation between him and Keenum with regards to who has looked better all offseason, then what is the point in waiting for Keenum to inevitably play himself out of the position instead of getting Haskins the much needed experience?  

I figure Case to play himself out of the position by week 5, and unless Colt is healthy enough to play, we'll probably see Haskins at that point.  I'd rather Haskins earn his stripes as the next man up in a lost season vs. throw him to the wolves week 1, for an extra 5 games of reps with the season being on his shoulders.  Haskins may very well be able to take the heat of the season resting on his shoulders, I just don't see the need to push it.  

[Chachie]

1 minute ago, RandyHolt said:

 

 

A little theory I have about Colt dominating in camp. I wonder how much he would have dominated had he had the fear of being hit.   I am going out on a limb fingers crossed but would like to think Haskins should prove more durable than him.  So with full hitting happening, that is when I want to know - who is better.

 

 

Excellent point.

[bakedtater1]

Do you want Haskins to start?

 

Do you think Haskins could handle the eagles,cowboys,bears defense's?

 

I believe if Haskins could make it through those defense's.....50/50 than he's our qb!

 

50/50=makes some great plays..makes some head scratching plays..but comes out healthy..even if we're 1-5...2-6 keep with Haskins

 

#StartDH

 

 

[Renegade7]

39 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

I think part of the thing that doesn't get talked about much here is where Jay falls in all of this.  Or maybe it's been discussed a bunch and I haven't seen it.  But whatever.   He's been coach here for awhile now and it's time to win some games.  He's not on the hot seat but he's certainly a candidate to be.  IIRC his contract is ending soon, too.

 

So Jay's really gotta win some games this year.  If Jay were in year 1 of a new contract and this was his first season, I think there'd have been a greater chance of seeing Haskins from the start.  

 

Case is serviceable.  I dunno if we can win games with him but I think from Jay's perspective he gotta stack the deck in his favor the best that he can this year.  And if that means putting a rookie QBs development on the backburner so he can keep his job/get a new contract...well, that's what it's gotta be.

 

I agree, and mentioned I dont believe Bruce has told him its okay if he doesnt make the playoffs because of focusing 100% on developing Haskins, that's why it feels like hes afraid to go all in in that.  If Bruce said, "hey this ain't a great offense at all and you gotta rookie QB I'll give you a pass this year" different convo entirely.

[bakedtater1]

I also truly believe(and this pressure could start to mount by week 3 if keenum is slippin)that if grudes were to name haskins week 1 starter today the amount of ticket sales would increase for fed ex.

[Renegade7]

9 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I haven't seen anyone saying Haskins shouldn't play at all. This conversation seems to be about week one and the immediate future. Things change quick in the NFL.

 

There have, but its jus opinions and like you said opinions change.  I dont think mine is popular anymore but I'm trying to base it less on the reality reality will inevitably change.  Saying we are going to do this regardless take a lot of the moving pieces out the equation. 

[bakedtater1]

#StartDH ..Callahan puts together a brilliant run scheme ya start Haskins week 1..hand off hand off throw..#StartDH..

[Renegade7]

19 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

The entire premise of starting Haskins week 1, for me anyway, rests on the fact that as of right now, if there is minimal separation between him and Keenum with regards to who has looked better all offseason, then what is the point in waiting for Keenum to inevitably play himself out of the position instead of getting Haskins the much needed experience?  

 

Agreed, we dont have some star QB we dont want to upset or we know is jus light years better then Haskins, these are journeymen veterans were talking about.  All three cap the offenses potential in their own special way.

[KDawg]

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

There have, but its jus opinions and like you said opinions change.  I dont think mine is popular anymore but I'm trying to base it less on the reality reality will inevitably change.  Saying we are going to do this regardless take a lot of the moving pieces out the equation. 

 

Eh. You shouldn't change your opinion based on popularity. My opinion has always been that the best QB plays. And right now that's Case Keenum (with Colt down). 

 

If Keenum looks awful, and McCoy is healthy, I guess I can't really know who the second option is and I'd have to trust the coaching staff. We won't be as "in the know" as we are for camp. 

[DJHJR86]

9 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I figure Case to play himself out of the position by week 5, and unless Colt is healthy enough to play, we'll probably see Haskins at that point.  I'd rather Haskins earn his stripes as the next man up in a lost season vs. throw him to the wolves week 1, for an extra 5 games of reps with the season being on his shoulders.  Haskins may very well be able to take the heat of the season resting on his shoulders, I just don't see the need to push it.  

 

I'm going off of what I've heard locally, and yesterday was the first time that I've heard a beat guy (in this case Keim) act incredulous when Sheehan brought up the QB competition.  Keim was adamant that Haskins wasn't ready and everyone in the building was on the same page.  But Sheehan's point, which I happen to agree with, was that if they are grading out Keenum at a 70 out of a possible 100, and Haskins is say around 65 out of 100, why wouldn't you go with the rookie with upside?

[KillBill26]

2 minutes ago, bakedtater1 said:

#StartDH ..Callahan puts together a brilliant run scheme ya start Haskins week 1..hand off hand off throw..#StartDH..

We have already implemented that "brilliant" scheme, it's actually hand off, hand off, throw, punt, watch your overworked defense run out of gas

 

#DontThrowTheRookToTheWolves

[Renegade7]

Just now, KDawg said:

 

Eh. You shouldn't change your opinion based on popularity. My opinion has always been that the best QB plays. And right now that's Case Keenum (with Colt down). 

 

If Keenum looks awful, and McCoy is healthy, I guess I can't really know who the second option is and I'd have to trust the coaching staff. We won't be as "in the know" as we are for camp. 

 

Ya, I get a lot of crap for having opinions that arent popular, but it comes from a good place.  Theres stuff I dont know because I dont work from the Redskins, a lot of my opinions are based on patterns I'm afraid of repeating outside looking.