RichmondRedskin88

Next Coach?

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Greg Roman is a better hire than Jim Harbaugh because he was the offensive coordinator with the 49ers calling the plays and now he has been successful with Baltimore.

He is 47 years old and he is willing to adapt his offense to the players on the team which is not what Jay Gruden was willing to do very often.   Roman

will help our quarterback and use the tight ends in better formations.   If the Denver Head Coach is fired in the off season then you hire Vic Fangio to

be the defensive coordinator and then reunite both of them from their SF days.  Fangio did well with the Bears defense before he went to the Broncos

and he will not take any guff from spoiled players.  Also Kevin O'Connell could learn a lot from Roman so that if Roman does not work out you can promote

O'Connell to be Head Coach.  Several teams will pursue Roman so that would appeal to the Danny's competitive streak to go after the hot candidates.  Another

good fit would be Roman with Greg Williams as defensive coordinator.  We should let go all the defensive coaches currently on the team.

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1 hour ago, veteranskinsfan said:

 

 

Roman with Fangio or Roman with Gregg would be great. My fear is that it doesn't matter though if Brucie is still infecting the organization. 

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2 hours ago, skins island connection said:

Bottom line, it doesn't matter who is hired as HC, or even a puppet GM, because behind the scenes Bruce will still be there pulling the strings. 

Unless he is not here. 

 

Hypothetical:  Dan goes to Meyer, says “what do you want” and Meyer says “Full control, and my guys doing personnel. And $10m a year. ” Dan’s other option is Bruce and Bowles, which he knows will be met with absolutely no enthusiasm.  

 

He wants a spark and if the coaches he covets want Bruce gone, my bet is Bruce is gone.

51 minutes ago, LetThePointsSoar said:

 

Roman with Fangio or Roman with Gregg would be great. My fear is that it doesn't matter though if Brucie is still infecting the organization. 

Roman will not work for Bruce.  Nor will Gregg.  So the only chance of any hot coach coming here is getting a dual GM/HC title and Bruce gone.  

 

Thats the only chip Dan has to play.  He can offer, if he wants to, complete control over everything to somebody where other organizations might not be willing to do that.

 

I’m not suggesting it’s a great idea.  But it might rid us of Bruce.

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6 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Unless he is not here. 

 

Hypothetical:  Dan goes to Meyer, says “what do you want” and Meyer says “Full control, and my guys doing personnel. And $10m a year. ” Dan’s other option is Bruce and Bowles, which he knows will be met with absolutely no enthusiasm.  

 

He wants a spark and if the coaches he covets want Bruce gone, my bet is Bruce is gone.

Roman will not work for Bruce.  Nor will Gregg.  So the only chance of any hot coach coming here is getting a dual GM/HC title and Bruce gone.  

 

Thats the only chip Dan has to play.  He can offer, if he wants to, complete control over everything to somebody where other organizations might not be willing to do that.

 

I’m not suggesting it’s a great idea.  But it might rid us of Bruce.

 

 I want to believe this so much, but the last 15-ish years has left me uber-pessimistic.

I would think the scenario would be that IF Meyer or whoever tells him they want full control, that Bruce would go to Snyder and convince him to keep him in the mix, just put him in the background where he can 'keep an eye' on the things happening. He would make Snyder believe getting rid of him would be bad for him because no one would be watching his back, as he has been doing.

 

Allen is a damned country tick; he has latched on and has made himself unmovable and unreachable, and any HC prospects with a hair of common sense would say 'no deal', then Bruce would find some schmo's to dangle in front of Snyder.

With everything that has happened since Bruce has gotten here, and he's managed to keep his job? Anyone looking to come here will have some big second-guessing.

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21 minutes ago, skins island connection said:

 

 I want to believe this so much, but the last 15-ish years has left me uber-pessimistic.

I would think the scenario would be that IF Meyer or whoever tells him they want full control, that Bruce would go to Snyder and convince him to keep him in the mix, just put him in the background where he can 'keep an eye' on the things happening. He would make Snyder believe getting rid of him would be bad for him because no one would be watching his back, as he has been doing.

 

Allen is a damned country tick; he has latched on and has made himself unmovable and unreachable, and any HC prospects with a hair of common sense would say 'no deal', then Bruce would find some schmo's to dangle in front of Snyder.

With everything that has happened since Bruce has gotten here, and he's managed to keep his job? Anyone looking to come here will have some big second-guessing.

Yeah, but then coach X might just either stay put or take the cowboy job.  

 

Total control is the only chip Dan has to play.  And without it all the big name coaches are going to stay away.  And I think Dan knows that.  Regardless of what Bruce whispers in his ear.  

 

Remember, Dan didn’t want to fire Vinny but he knew he had to, and finally did. 

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Brian Daboll is certainly someone this team has to consider for the gig. It's amazing how he's been able to make something out of nothing this year - player by player, you could argue that their skill talent is on par with this team's. He may also be one of the few who would feel confident about the challenge of taking on developing someone as raw as Haskins as he is doing so already with Allen. 

 

On top of this, you can tell that he is highly regarded in coaching circles. He has spent 14 years coaching under either Belichek or Saban

 

The challenge would be to find a creative defensive mind. Maybe Daboll could pull in Pete Golding, another Alabama alum, to coach the D

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The next coach is going to have to be someone that has no other head coaching options. I guarantee there were will be a couple of coaches who choose to stay where they are as coordinators than come to this coach-killing franchise.

Edited by Riggo#44
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23 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Unless he is not here. 

 

Hypothetical:  Dan goes to Meyer, says “what do you want” and Meyer says “Full control, and my guys doing personnel. And $10m a year. ” Dan’s other option is Bruce and Bowles, which he knows will be met with absolutely no enthusiasm.  

 

He wants a spark and if the coaches he covets want Bruce gone, my bet is Bruce is gone.

Roman will not work for Bruce.  Nor will Gregg.  So the only chance of any hot coach coming here is getting a dual GM/HC title and Bruce gone.  

 

Thats the only chip Dan has to play.  He can offer, if he wants to, complete control over everything to somebody where other organizations might not be willing to do that.

 

I’m not suggesting it’s a great idea.  But it might rid us of Bruce.

You are assuming that Dan is doing the searching.  We have no idea yet, if that will be the case.  Dan could just let Bruce do it again.

Edited by Rdskns2000
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6 hours ago, Rdskns2000 said:

You are assuming that Dan is doing the searching.  We have no idea yet, if that will be the case.  Dan could just Bruce do it again.

 

He's aslo assuming that "Full control" actually means what he thinks that it does.

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10 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Yeah, but then coach X might just either stay put or take the cowboy job.  

 

Total control is the only chip Dan has to play.  And without it all the big name coaches are going to stay away.  And I think Dan knows that.  Regardless of what Bruce whispers in his ear.  

 

Remember, Dan didn’t want to fire Vinny but he knew he had to, and finally did. 

Vinny wasn't trying to get Danny Boy a shiny new stadium though.

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10 hours ago, Riggo#44 said:

The next coach is going to have to be someone that has no other head coaching options. I guarantee there were will be a couple of coaches who choose to stay where they are as coordinators than come to this coach-killing franchise.

 

Hoffman said asking around the vibe he got from talking to people is whomever comes here has to be either desperate or daring or maybe both.

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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12 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

Yeah, but then coach X might just either stay put or take the cowboy job.  

 

Total control is the only chip Dan has to play.  And without it all the big name coaches are going to stay away.  And I think Dan knows that.  Regardless of what Bruce whispers in his ear.  

 

Remember, Dan didn’t want to fire Vinny but he knew he had to, and finally did. 

 

 Yea, I hope that is the scenario.

8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Hoffman said asking around the vibe he got from talking to people is whomever comes here has to be either desperate or daring or maybe both.

 

 

 That would be something; imagine Snyder looking to bring in a new HC but no one applies or they turn him down; it would be the biggest cake in the face ever! I doubt it would ever happen, but I can dream...

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1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Vinny wasn't trying to get Danny Boy a shiny new stadium though.

 

Yep or represent him at owners meetings, etc.  Bruce is Dan's Bo Jackson do it all type.  It's part of what makes the whole act even sadder to me than Vinny. 

 

Just about everyone who has talked about the subject who has covered the team has given a variation of this argument -- working for Dan is bad enough and a tough sell (yes in the past when his reputation was younger, there was some people who thought he changed or was poised to but the sample size now is too big to sell that again) but now you got Bruce in there who is known in his own right for his own issues (including running over whomever he needs to in order to keep power) - making the job even less attractive. 

 

According to some Lincoln Riley is interested in the Dallas job but not this one.   Ditto Urban Meyer.   Who knows if it's true.  And I know @Voice_of_Reason disagrees with me on this and thinks Dan won't skip a beat from the past as to getting the top man whomever that target is -- and I hope he's right.  But I got my doubts with one exception which is would Dan be willing to do a crazy contract?  Davis with the Raiders had an unattractive job but gave an outrageously crazy offer to Gruden -- I think that type of move would work.   

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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33 minutes ago, skins island connection said:

That would be something; imagine Snyder looking to bring in a new HC but no one applies or they turn him down; it would be the biggest cake in the face ever! I doubt it would ever happen, but I can dream...

They'll call it "casting a wide net" when, in reality, it's finding someone desperate enough to accept what the Redskins have to offer.

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Russell talking about this on the radio a little while ago (also add him to the big pile among local media who says he doesn't hear great things about Haskins from some in that building) saying Dan needs a big splash and hiring someone like Todd Bowles won't move the needle for an organization that's bleeding fans.   I mention Haskins because he thinks it could be a key dynamic, getting someone who they think can help prop him up so he mentioned Meyer.

 

Thinking about that some.  Zorn was hired in theory in part to prop up Campbell.  Jay to in theory transform RG3 to a pocket passer.  If that's the operative point for Dan than that would narrow the list of candidates down some.  If Haskins doesn't end up finishing by showing off some flashes then I wonder if that kills O'Connell.  I used to think O'Connell would be a hot candidate here (and some still think he is) but am starting to doubt that more and more as time marches on.  Also if they are looking for a splash that won't do it.

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

According to some Lincoln Riley is interested in the Dallas job but not this one.   Ditto Urban Meyer.   Who knows if it's true.  And I know @Voice_of_Reason disagrees with me on this and thinks Dan won't skip a beat from the past as to getting the top man whomever that target is -- and I hope he's right.  But I got my doubts with one exception which is would Dan be willing to do a crazy contract?  Davis with the Raiders had an unattractive job but gave an outrageously crazy offer to Gruden -- I think that type of move would work.   

My assumption is Dan would do a crazy contract just like the Raiders did with Jon. Tons of money and essentially full control.  If he’s not willing to do that then i am wrong.

 

I think he’d be willing to do it.  Because he has to change the narrative.  And I think he knows he’s going to have to pay through the nose for it.  Also, he set the market for coaches contracts back in the day at $5/ year with spurrier.  I don’t see why he wouldn’t go to that well again.

 

Its all conjecture.  Nobody knows what Dan’s going to do except Dan.  I’m just pointing out what he has done in the past as it might inform the future. 

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13 hours ago, Riggo#44 said:

The next coach is going to have to be someone that has no other head coaching options. I guarantee there were will be a couple of coaches who choose to stay where they are as coordinators than come to this coach-killing franchise.

 

I agree. Keim has said that the next coach will be someone young and desperate for that first HC gig, or a retread who's grateful for getting a chance to give it another shot because no one else would open the door. Sadly, I think this is the state of things. No one with half an ounce of self-worth will subject himself to serving under the current team president. There SHOULD be some good options this off-season, and the chance to lead the squad in Ashburn won't be at the top of anyone's list. The QB situation complicates this whole thing tremendously. Maybe a prospective new coach tells an outright lie like Gruden did, pretending he wants to work with the young QB and can tailor an offense to his strengths.

 

I still don't get why so many people on here think O'Connell is HC material? I've asked for someone to explain that, but there have been crickets. I wish someone could rationalize that for me.

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3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

According to some Lincoln Riley is interested in the Dallas job but not this one.   Ditto Urban Meyer. 

One more thought:  Marty famously went on TV and said he could never work for Dan Snyder.  Then the money and authority was right and he did.

 

I’m not saying it is going to happen.  I have no idea.  But it’s in the Dan playbook.  When things are at their lowest, like after Spurrier and to some extent after Norv, and after Zorn, he goes all-in for somebody.  And typically the conversation is “who would work for Snyder?” And “this is an awful job” and then all of a sudden. Marty, Gibbs or Shanahan shows up.

 

Its also possible that Dan stays the course with Bruce becauseDan  honestly believes that with a somewhat better coach, either Alex Smith or Haskins I’m his second year, with a healthy Guice, etc, it’s worth one more shot with Bruce and whoever Bruce hires. I see this as unlikely, but definitely possible. 

 

In that scenario I see a Todd Bowles, Marvin Lewis, maybe Mike McCarthy, possibly Gregg Williams type coach who gets some personnel say-so, but not full autonomy like a superstar candidate would get. That would be a recipe for disaster, though.  And I think in either 1 or 2 years we would be back talking about the “all-in” move again because at that point all else would have failed. 

28 minutes ago, skinzplay said:

 

I still don't get why so many people on here think O'Connell is HC material? I've asked for someone to explain that, but there have been crickets. I wish someone could rationalize that for me.

He isn’t yet.  They want to paint him as the next McVay.  But he’s not in that league.  

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21 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

One more thought:  Marty famously went on TV and said he could never work for Dan Snyder.  

 

Sure. old school Dan can pull it off.  No debating that.  Super early in Dan's tenure back then, heck I'd even argue his first 10 years he can pony up the I was young and foolish owner and now am the bigger-better-improved-mature version and I can see that narrative having some legs with prospective coaches.  So Marty in retrospect would make sense.

 

My theory (echoed by some national and local reporters) that the game has played out.  A 20 year sample isn't the same as 3-5 years.   Now he's stuck with the old dog can't learn new tricks label.   That wasn't the issue back then.

 

But as Hoffman said asking around the impression he gets from some is its for the daring and desperate.   If so you never know on that front.  My guess is he can't attract the top tier sexy type draws but will grab one of the 2nd tier types:  Rex, Bowles, Gregg and try to bill that as that was his choice all along.  If Bruce stays, I'd rule out Gregg.  So I'd guess it would be between Rex and Bowles.

 

They were interested in Roman before (who likely will be a hot candidate in the league) but as I posted here they've already upset him by having him prepare for an interview without letting him know they won't hire him and hired Jay.

 

21 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

 

Its also possible that Dan stays the course with Bruce becauseDan  honestly believes that with a somewhat better coach, either Alex Smith or Haskins I’m his second year, with a healthy Guice, etc, it’s worth one more shot with Bruce and whoever Bruce hires. I see this as unlikely, but definitely possible. 

 

 

Sadly, I agree especially if the stadium deal isn't finished and he believes its close.

 

21 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

In that scenario I see a Todd Bowles, Marvin Lewis, maybe Mike McCarthy, possibly Gregg Williams type coach who gets some personnel say-so, but not full autonomy like a superstar candidate would get. That would be a recipe for disaster, though.  And I think in either 1 or 2 years we would be back talking about the “all-in” move again because at that point all else would have failed. 

 

 

I can see that, too.  I wonder if Dan realizes the extent he's in trouble with the fan base.  If Dan is talked into by Bruce that they are close and they play out the rodeo one more time -- even if they end up 8-8 next season I think they will be shocked that not one whit of the fan discontent has gone away -- including the low attendance and TV ratings that accompanies that.

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

My assumption is Dan would do a crazy contract just like the Raiders did with Jon. Tons of money and essentially full control.  If he’s not willing to do that then i am wrong.

 

I think he’d be willing to do it.  Because he has to change the narrative.  And I think he knows he’s going to have to pay through the nose for it.  Also, he set the market for coaches contracts back in the day at $5/ year with spurrier.  I don’t see why he wouldn’t go to that well again.

 

Its all conjecture.  Nobody knows what Dan’s going to do except Dan.  I’m just pointing out what he has done in the past as it might inform the future. 

 

One difference is he isnt packing the stadium any more. So money may be an issue. We just dont know. Yes. TV rights are the majority of his income. But an empty stadium IS taking a toll. We do know that Bruce/Dan have been a hell of a lot more thrifty than Dan of the past. 

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2 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

My assumption is Dan would do a crazy contract just like the Raiders did with Jon. Tons of money and essentially full control.  If he’s not willing to do that then i am wrong.

 

I think he’d be willing to do it.  Because he has to change the narrative.  And I think he knows he’s going to have to pay through the nose for it.  Also, he set the market for coaches contracts back in the day at $5/ year with spurrier.  I don’t see why he wouldn’t go to that well again.

 

 

I think the difference is the length of the contract is a large part of the appeal of the Gruden contract.  You got both the outrageous yearly figure and crazy length.   According to some Dan hates dead money for coaches hence Jay had him at hello in part because he was ok with Haz back then.  Now maybe that attribute is saddled with Dan but its a Bruce thing in reality?  I don't know.  My point is a 10 year contract might be tough for Dan to swallow because in his mind he'd be stuck with the coach for that long and maybe he doesn't envision eating lets say 40 million if he cuts the coach loose within 6 years.

 

Also I think the coaching has control stuff is more interesting now then years back after listening to some of Shanny's interviews.  Shanny sort of nailed Dan with feint praise so to speak.  He said that Dan mostly didn't interfere with him but he did sometimes interfere with him.  He mentioned a Randy Moss story, McNabb.  And Dan can try to deny he didn't interfere with RG3 but the bowling video on youtube among other things wouldn't help.  So if I am a big time coach, I'd really hammer a provision into the contract that if Dan offers any personnel advice, you can opt out with some type of severance pay.  If so would Dan sign a contract like that?

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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Great comments here.

 

I agree that Dan has to reinvent himself. His old moves will not work with the new batch of coaches.

 

My bet is he goes for well-respected Coach who is known for being a hard-ass and is also a GM-type. Marty will never return, Marvin has already been here.

 

That leaves us with....

 

BILL COWHER

 

Boom.

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