Owls0325

!!!!0mgz!!!! Trent Williams finally showed up

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I do not know about his medical issue with the team. 

But if he told Jason LaConfora he will not play this year for the Skins then we should trade him.

 

For the last ten years we have lost with him on the team so we can also lose without him on the team.  He is injured too much the last few years.

If you are working in the front office and you expect to go 6-8 this year why would you put out more money for him and extend his already expensive contract.                             Start the rebuilding process now and use the money you saved by trading him to fill other holes on the team.

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3 hours ago, Califan007 said:

So chalk me up as one who does NOT believe Dan/Bruce/Trent needs to come out and 'splain things in any fashion. What they need is to work this out far away from the public eyes, and only approach the press once it's solved. On the "Things That Need To Happen To Have A Winning Season" list, Constant Good PR isn't even in the top 20. 

 

Bruce didn't mind coming out and basking in his "wonderful draft" press coverage he got, appearing on multiple networks and giving various interviews.  It's quite cowardly to only "'splain things" when the coverage and/or story is positive.  

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20 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

Bruce didn't mind coming out and basking in his "wonderful draft" press coverage he got, appearing on multiple networks and giving various interviews.  It's quite cowardly to only "'splain things" when the coverage and/or story is positive.  

 

In this specific instance, absolutely NO explanation is needed or warranted at this time. None. And that is pretty much standard operating procedure with all teams in the NFL. You don't argue/explain in-house issues in the press, and you don't feel the need to clarify every twitter "report" simply because fans are getting antsy. Doing the first part could make matters worse between the FO and the player, and doing the second part will have you running your franchise like a reactionary chihuahua. 

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

In this specific instance, absolutely NO explanation is needed or warranted at this time....

 

Unless management respects Jay, and doesn't make him the lightning rod for all that ails the team publicly, again.

 

A higher up just needs to come out and address it, if even to say Jay nor the team will not comment on this. Don't make Jay speak for the entire organization. Trent has issues with things way above Jay.

Edited by RandyHolt

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

You don't argue/explain in-house issues in the press, and you don't feel the need to clarify every twitter "report" simply because fans are getting antsy. Doing the first part could make matters worse between the FO and the player, and doing the second part will have you running your franchise like a reactionary chihuahua. 

 

Weird because I remember the team pushing Doug Williams out to speak after the controversial Reuben Foster signing and it was getting bad press and hot takes on Twitter.  And it's no longer a "twitter 'report'" when the head coach has publicly confirmed that Trent is unhappy.  Morgan Moses did as well.

Edited by DJHJR86
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6 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

Unless management respects Jay, and doesn't make him the lightning rod for all that ails the team publicly, again.

 

A higher up just needs to come out and address it, if even to say Jay nor the team will not comment on this. Don't make Jay speak for the entire organization. Trent has issues with things way above Jay.

 

This is Bruce we're talking about here. One of the things he's actually great at is deflecting blame. 

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6 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

Unless management respects Jay, and doesn't make him the lightning rod for all that ails the team publicly, again.

 

A higher up just needs to come out and address it, if even to say Jay nor the team will not comment on this. Don't make Jay speak for the entire organization. Trent has issues with things way above Jay.

 

That's not an explanation, though...and it won't keep questions from being asked or the story from having its own life. The most it will do is give the impression that something serious is indeed going on that it warranted having the team president address it to the media.

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4 minutes ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

Weird because I remember the team pushing Doug Williams out to speak after the controversial Reuben Foster signing and it was getting bad press and hot takes on Twitter.  And it's no longer a "twitter 'report'" when the head coach has publicly confirmed that Trent is unhappy.  Morgan Moses did as well.

 

That's because there was an actual public action that could be discussed--putting in a waiver on a controversial player. What exactly is the action by the Redskins here that the Skins should address in the media? Do you know?

 

And the last thing the Skins should do is attempt to explain anything in terms of what Trent is feeling or not feeling. That's a HUGE mistake Gruden almost started to make in his presser...which is why I reiterate that nothing should be said to the media on it by the Skins' coaches or front office execs. Just deal with it privately. Nothing will keep the press from asking questions about Williams, and nothing will stop Gruden from holding pressers mandated by the league.

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3 hours ago, Darc Requiem said:

If you sign a 5 year contract. The team should pay for 5 years. Period. If you want it to be about performance based pay it needs to go both ways. It doesn't. You out perform the contract and they'll honor it. You don't they reduce your salary or cut you. Either it's contract or it is not. 

 

Well, NFL player contracts are basically an agreement for what a player will be paid for the time that the team continues to want their services.  If a player wants those years to be guaranteed, they have to negotiate for that.  The contract has explicit agreements about what compensation the player gets if the team no longer wants to employ the player.  Why should a team pay for 5 years if they specifically negotiated the option to release the player earlier than that if they want.  "Either it's a contract or it is not"

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4 hours ago, The Hangman- C_Hanburger said:

So you wouldn't call the vikings and offer Trent for their LT and a #1 and #2 in 2020...Also, why waste your time??

 

https://riggosrag.com/2019/06/06/redskins-3-teams-that-could-trade-for-trent-williams-after-reported-trade-demand/2/

 

Dumb huh...I just checked and it's all over the place as a possibility

 

...what? No, the dumb part is what you posted about this possibly being a secret plan between Cousins and Trent to get him there. It reads like it was written in a haze so I understand if you don't remember, but it was ****ing moronic. 

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1 hour ago, DJHJR86 said:

 

Bruce didn't mind coming out and basking in his "wonderful draft" press coverage he got, appearing on multiple networks and giving various interviews.  It's quite cowardly to only "'splain things" when the coverage and/or story is positive.  

Bruce making the rounds in the press after our great draft really pissed me off.  Where was he when we signed Reuben Foster?  Probably under his desk while he let Doug Williams and Jay take the heat.  He’s a joke.

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16 hours ago, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

When exactly should they have drafted an OT this year?  Not draft Haskins?  Not move up to snag Sweat?  Cause anything after that is unsure....so Please..............

 

A good question and a fair question.  As I said before the draft I wanted the Skins to use their FIRST THREE picks on a LT and 2 OG/C and use the rest of the picks for other needs.  

 

I don't think it matters who you have playing QB or DE if the OL, the most important unit on any football team, is severely depleted.  

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11 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

A good question and a fair question.  As I said before the draft I wanted the Skins to use their FIRST THREE picks on a LT and 2 OG/C and use the rest of the picks for other needs.  

 

I don't think it matters who you have playing QB or DE if the OL, the most important unit on any football team, is severely depleted.  

 

Thats an awful plan. It’s exactly how the Giants wound up drafting Flowers with the 10th pick in the draft. They were determined to take a tackle. 

 

I’m super happy that we have Sweat, and not whoever the best tackle was when we drafted Sweat. I think that might actually have been Tytus Howard, the player who Sweat planted on his ass at the Senior Bowl. 

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8 minutes ago, Anselmheifer said:

 

Thats an awful plan. It’s exactly how the Giants wound up drafting Flowers with the 10th pick in the draft. They were determined to take a tackle. 

 

I’m super happy that we have Sweat, and not whoever the best tackle was when we drafted Sweat. I think that might actually have been Tytus Howard, the player who Sweat planted on his ass at the Senior Bowl. 

 

Lets talk again in November and see what you think then.

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53 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

...what? No, the dumb part is what you posted about this possibly being a secret plan between Cousins and Trent to get him there. It reads like it was written in a haze so I understand if you don't remember, but it was ****ing moronic. 

Top 2 words

WHAT IF

 

Last 3 words

Think About it

 

If you don't think a player will lobby another player then YOU are naive. Trent and KC are/were tight.

 

Get a grip

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31 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

 

A good question and a fair question.  As I said before the draft I wanted the Skins to use their FIRST THREE picks on a LT and 2 OG/C and use the rest of the picks for other needs.  

 

I don't think it matters who you have playing QB or DE if the OL, the most important unit on any football team, is severely depleted.  

 

Right, but you also don't pass up the chance to draft a potential franchise QB that dropped in your lap with the #15 pick in the first round.  One that can ride the bench (if they go that direction) behind a recently signed journeyman QB until late in the season and upgrade the OL with the first pick in next years draft. 

 

Especially one that will be very affordable under their rookie contract for 4 years, with a 5th year team option.  Personally, I'm one that believes it starts in the trenches, build up the O and D lines first, if at all possible.  But even with that mindset, I agree with both of those picks.  Sweat dropping that far was a steal and again, potential franchise QB they didn't have to make a reach for and give up future first round picks.

 

My frustration is all the dumb **** this front office has done in the past years/drafts.  This one though was their best draft in years, imo.

 

 

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Just now, The Hangman- C_Hanburger said:

Top 2 words

WHAT IF

 

Last 3 words

Think About it

 

If you don't think a player will lobby another player then YOU are naive. Trent and KC are/were tight.

 

Get a grip

 

Even if your off the wall without foundation was true the Vikings don't have the cap space for William's contract.

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Just now, Dont Taze Me Bro said:

 

Right, but you also don't pass up the chance to draft a potential franchise QB that dropped in your lap with the #15 pick in the first round.  One that can ride the bench (if they go that direction) behind a recently signed journeyman QB until late in the season and upgrade the OL with the first pick in next years draft. 

 

Especially one that will be very affordable under their rookie contract for 4 years, with a 5th year team option.  Personally, I'm one that believes it starts in the trenches, build up the O and D lines first, if at all possible.  But even with that mindset, I agree with both of those picks.  Sweat dropping that far was a steal and again, potential franchise QB they didn't have to make a reach for and give up future first round picks.

 

My frustration is all the dumb **** this front office has done in the past years/drafts.  This one though was their best draft in years, imo.

 

 

 

I hope it turns out to be a great draft but I afraid by November we are going be playing bus station guys on the OL.  Sweat will help, I don't have an opinion about Haskins, but it isn't whether these guys are good or not, when the OL sucks nothing else really matters.

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14 minutes ago, The Hangman- C_Hanburger said:

Top 2 words

WHAT IF

 

Last 3 words

Think About it

 

If you don't think a player will lobby another player then YOU are naive. Trent and KC are/were tight.

 

Get a grip

 

Dude.

 

Come on.

 

WHAT IF we all actually DO live in the matrix?!  Think About It

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23 minutes ago, The Hangman- C_Hanburger said:

Top 2 words

WHAT IF

 

Last 3 words

Think About it

 

If you don't think a player will lobby another player then YOU are naive. Trent and KC are/were tight.

 

Get a grip

 

WHAT IF

 

Chemtrails and flouride keep us docile man. If you don't think they control us through our video game consoles while their drones lay eggs in our minds then YOU are naive.

 

Think About it.

 

Get a grip

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9 hours ago, Burgold said:

Just to be difficult, Joe Gibbs was ten years removed from his game during Gibbs II. So, the fact that a completely rusty and 0ff-HIS-GAME Joe Gibbs took two Vinny Cerrato teams to the playoffs and won a playoff game earns bonus points in my book. It's a cup half full versus cup half empty exercise. You can look at the two losing seasons and say, "AHA!" I see what he accomplished despite being out of the game, out of the business, etc. To me, it's all the more remarkable. You take anything and not do it for ten years... when you come back to it you will be a shadow of yourself. His shadow was playoff worthy 50% of the time with crap teams.

 

We'll never know, but I contend that if we got Gibbs in his prime and at his best, he would have made those teams perennial playoff teams and a challenger. Heck, Joe never had a "great" team to work with even in Gibbs I if you listen to the pundits.

 

Well, you certainly have succeeded at being difficult, so well done.  :P 

 

I personally don't buy the "he was rusty" narrative. I didn't back then and I don't now. 

 

A mind like his? Someone who, wherever he goes, is successful at the highest of levels? Nah. Maybe I could buy it initially in 2014 for the first few games, and even if we want to really push it maaaybe I'll buy it for the first season (but I'd argue it was more just the general woes of most coaches starting anew with a bad team)... but Gibbs would knock whatever rust off he had really quickly. Football is football. Pass, run, block, tackle. The differences over time are really incremental and anyone smart enough can adjust.

 

Furthermore, doesn't that fly in the face of the coaches he surrounded himself with? Do you think Gregg Williams was "rusty"? What happened in 2006 when Gregg lead an historically bad defense? Al Saunders was hired off of an extremely successful stint with the Chiefs who had one of the best offense's in the league under him. Was he rusty? 

 

There's just no way I can really buy into that. 

 

The biggest difference, really, was how different and difficult team-building had become in an ultra-competitive, parity-based system where every team is on a level playing field with limited resources. 

 

I believe we got something very close to Gibbs in his prime. He just didn't have Bobby Beathard, was in charge of personnel himself (which is why I don't even agree with you in terms of calling it a "Vinny Cerrato team", because he had final say on personnel as Team President), and struggled because of said structure and the resulting personnel, nothing else. 

 

If you really look at this without emotion, if it was anyone other than the Redskins or Gibbs... would you really be calling it "remarkable" in terms of what was accomplished? I mean, we have to think big picture here. One playoff win 4 years that they barely eked out with next to no offense (I believe we broke a record at the time for least amount of offense in a playoff win). Making the playoffs both times were desperation runs that came at the end of the season. Nothing came even remotely close to being easy. Nothing could be sustained for any extended period of time. So, yes, while I agree that Gibbs himself was and is remarkable, and I believe we got that same remarkable Gibbs at Head Coach while he was here, I don't think what was accomplished really was "remarkable" overall as a franchise. And all it does is further provide evidence of my views. HOF-level coaching couldn't overcome everything else. :) 

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5 hours ago, hailmary said:

I will start off with I am not sticking up for the medical staff, but I have to say that players on every team and across every league play injured. The decision to play injured is always on the player, only in certain cases do doctors not allow players to play hurt i.e torn ligaments/muscles, broken bones, concussions. So to blame the medical staff for misdiagnosing  ailments and healing time is absurd. On the same note when has the medical staff been notorious for misdiagnosing injuries? 

If we remember last year with Trents thumb injury, he hid that injury from the medical staff to continue playing, the team only found out about that injury when a water boy noticed he couldn't squeeze his water bottle. So Trent can't have it both ways and blame the medical staff for "improper action" when he himself has mislead the medical staff and not allowed them to do their job properly. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.

I think what this all boils down too is Trent is upset that the news got out about the procedure done on his scalp to remove the tumor and is using this as way to cash in his final payday because he realizes his health is getting worse and worse year by year. He's causing a circus and screwing us all because he's unhappy with his 12 million per year for the next two years. He must have taken some notes from Cousins.

Hate to say it because I love Trent and wanted him to be a lifelong Skin and realize how great he's been for us. But maybe we should cut ties with him if this can't easily be resolved. Don't need this cancerous attitude to infect the entire locker room. And we certainly don't need to be paying him top money he's getting too old and is missing too many games to do that. If this doesn't blow over soon I think cutting or trading him to send a message is the best plan of action. 

 

Well, sure sounds like you are sticking up for them. ;) 

 

I agree, players are culpable all the time and it does muddy the waters in terms of how accountable the medical staff can be when players hide things. 

 

Nonetheless, I think you're downplaying their role here. They are the ones who give the final "go ahead" or "thumbs up" to the coaches that a player can go. They ultimately have that power and, therefore, responsibility. They can say no to any player no matter how much they beg them or want to play. It's that simple. If the medical staff themselves are that easily influenced, or are giving the go ahead to guys who it shouldn't be given to, that is ultimately on them. Can't have it. 

 

"Taking notes from Cousins". My God, you guys are cute. I don't even know what to say to this anti-Kirk-Bruce-Allenitis-infected type of disease currently running through the fanbase. It's too much. 

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18 minutes ago, thesubmittedone said:

 

Well, sure sounds like you are sticking up for them. ;) 

 

I agree, players are culpable all the time and it does muddy the waters in terms of how accountable the medical staff can be when players hide things. 

 

Nonetheless, I think you're downplaying their role here. They are the ones who give the final "go ahead" or "thumbs up" to the coaches that a player can go. They ultimately have that power and, therefore, responsibility. They can say no to any player no matter how much they beg them or want to play. It's that simple. If the medical staff themselves are that easily influenced, or are giving the go ahead to guys who it shouldn't be given to, that is ultimately on them. Can't have it. 

 

"Taking notes from Cousins". My God, you guys are cute. I don't even know what to say to this anti-Kirk-Bruce-Allenitis-infected type of disease currently running through the fanbase. It's too much. 

Your logic here is flawed if Trent wants to play and he goes back in and plays against the medical staffs wishes how can he blame the medical staff? And that's what Trent (among others) has done and probably will continue to do regardless of the medical staff. 

The proof is in the pudding that players ultimately make the final decision over the medical staff because if it wasn't that way. Then why did the NFL implement independent doctors on the sideline for concussions. With a rule in place for that independent person to have the final say, because players were over ruling the staffs advice. 

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