mistertim Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: Richardson has made nice plays including deep shots. As have Reed and Davis. Crowder has fallen off because he no longer has Garcon and Jackson to take pressure off him and he's hurt all the time. Smith is mediocre, but Doc is a bottom 10% WR in the league. He's a flat out bust. Is it really fair to call a guy who had 6 TDs his first year playing terrible and a bust because he's had a down second year? Keeping in mind that he now has a QB who has been factually shown to not throw much to his outside WRs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Just now, mistertim said: Is it really fair to call a guy who had 6 TDs his first year playing terrible and a bust because he's had a down second year? Keeping in mind that he now has a QB who has been factually shown to not throw much to his outside WRs? This is Doc's 3rd year in the league. He turns 26 in December. Lets stop treating him like a kid. Its put up or shut up time. He was a 1st round pick, by now he's expected to be a legit #1 option. He wouldn't even start on most teams in the league and wouldn't even make the active roster on some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 9 minutes ago, Warhead36 said: This is Doc's 3rd year in the league. He turns 26 in December. Lets stop treating him like a kid. Its put up or shut up time. He was a 1st round pick, by now he's expected to be a legit #1 option. He wouldn't even start on most teams in the league and wouldn't even make the active roster on some. Last season was really his first actual season of playing. In 2016 he played in 2 games and had 2 receptions before being put on IR. And you can only put up as a WR if the ball gets thrown to you. He finally got some looks today, had 3 receptions for 42 yards, and had at least two completely overthrown deep balls and one that was catchable but difficult with likely uncalled PI as well. He didn't look like a world beater today but the only WR who ever really has with Alex is Tyreek Hill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malapropismic Depository Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 You say it like it's a bad thing, to "not care". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morneblade Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 1 hour ago, mistertim said: Last season was really his first actual season of playing. In 2016 he played in 2 games and had 2 receptions before being put on IR. And you can only put up as a WR if the ball gets thrown to you. He finally got some looks today, had 3 receptions for 42 yards, and had at least two completely overthrown deep balls and one that was catchable but difficult with likely uncalled PI as well. He didn't look like a world beater today but the only WR who ever really has with Alex is Tyreek Hill. The issue with Doctson is not really targets, but completion %. He's below 50% (as in 44%) both last year and this year. This is in Bust territory. He got a lot of targets last year, but didn't make catches. Other players did, he was far and away the worst on the team. This year.............he is worst on the team. That's the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 hours ago, mistertim said: One thing that DID irk me was his route on that slant. Yes he caught it but there was no suddenness in his break to the inside. I think Romo even remarked on it. That might have been because it was a skinny post (bang 8) not a slant. He caught two passes on that route today - one on the left and one the right. Like to see more of those along with some digs and deep crossers to him. Routes were he can use his size and ‘post up’ a defender. Not every pass to him has to be a jump ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PortisBetts Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 3 hours ago, Morneblade said: The issue with Doctson is not really targets, but completion %. He's below 50% (as in 44%) both last year and this year. This is in Bust territory. He got a lot of targets last year, but didn't make catches. Other players did, he was far and away the worst on the team. This year.............he is worst on the team. That's the problem. I am not happy with Doctson production either, but it's becoming more and more obvious that Alex smith is holding him back. There are times when he is open and alex throws it no where near where doctson has a legitimate shot to catch it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playaction2Sanders Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 3 hours ago, MartinC said: That might have been because it was a skinny post (bang 8) not a slant. He caught two passes on that route today - one on the left and one the right. Like to see more of those along with some digs and deep crossers to him. Routes were he can use his size and ‘post up’ a defender. Not every pass to him has to be a jump ball. He's like a skinnier poor mans Alvin Harper, he's got two routes, those jump ball 50-50's and an occasional slant. That's all that's in his arsenal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 3 hours ago, Playaction2Sanders said: He's like a skinnier poor mans Alvin Harper, he's got two routes, those jump ball 50-50's and an occasional slant. That's all that's in his arsenal... That simply isn't true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 5 hours ago, Playaction2Sanders said: He's like a skinnier poor mans Alvin Harper, he's got two routes, those jump ball 50-50's and an occasional slant. That's all that's in his arsenal... Nope. He showed yesterday that if we actually use him on routes like skinny post, dig, slants, sail routes etc and throw him the damn ball he could be a productive NFL receiver. If teams keep defending us the way they are the opportunities will be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 He looked like a bonafide WR on his catches/targets yesterday.... didn't he? I think its good to keep expectations on ALL WRs in check this year. Lets call it the Alex Smith factor. Even with Kirk, Jay seems to prioritize keeping defenses guessing at who will be targeted, by giving everyone 2-5 targets a game. A fantasy nightmare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 I think he just has a demeanor that will never be described as having "fire". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 14 minutes ago, justice98 said: I think he just has a demeanor that will never be described as having "fire". He looked pretty fired up when he squared up to that DB in the first half. Look I’m not saying Doctson is showing signs of being a good/great receiver. But the last two weeks he’s showed he is a football player and can at least be a productive number 2 type starter with the right use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Doctson may never justify his draft position, but he’s giving you everything he’s got right now. And it’s good enough...just barely. I appreciate the effort he’s shown the last few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyHolt Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 If a first round WR eventually proves to be a WR2, is that a bust? Not in my NFLictionary. Bust = out of the league. I thought he would score yesterday, and hadn't stopped to realize just how much of an under type game this would be. But still, he was open deep against a damn good pass D with a decent chance to score. With AP now being the key to victory in DC, his run blocking is important. AP is forcing the issue, getting outside and utilizing WR downfield blocks, which can be big difference makers in the run game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont Taze Me Bro Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 8 hours ago, Morneblade said: The issue with Doctson is not really targets, but completion %. He's below 50% (as in 44%) both last year and this year. This is in Bust territory. He got a lot of targets last year, but didn't make catches. Other players did, he was far and away the worst on the team. This year.............he is worst on the team. That's the problem. Not only can he not catch the ball, he has to screw up my "50/50 v.2.0" nickname for him..........."44/56" has no ring to it. What a jerk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justice98 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 23 minutes ago, MartinC said: He looked pretty fired up when he squared up to that DB in the first half. Look I’m not saying Doctson is showing signs of being a good/great receiver. But the last two weeks he’s showed he is a football player and can at least be a productive number 2 type starter with the right use. I think productive number 2 is being generous. A low-end #2 on a bad team, at best. If he's not going to be good, then they should always be looking to move on from him. If they hope to do anything, he shouldnt really be a starter nor should they have any expectation that he's going to contribute much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 4 minutes ago, justice98 said: If they hope to do anything, he shouldnt really be a starter nor should they have any expectation that he's going to contribute much. He contributed 25% of our pass offense yesterday. Low bar I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petey hodge Posted October 22, 2018 Author Share Posted October 22, 2018 I thought he had blistering speed from his combine stats, but I dont categorize Doc as a speed guy based on my “eye test” everyone chastises Alex for underthrowing that deep shot, but Doc didn’t separate, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 It's unfortunate that Doctson was out his entire rookie year because I think we might have got a better look at what he could do as a #3 WR behind D-Jax & Garcon. Right now we are seeing him in a role that he may never be able to live up to, however until they do get a legit #1 WR we won't know if Doctson can at least excel as a #2 or even #3 I wonder how real the possibility of trading for Amari Cooper is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morneblade Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 7 hours ago, PortisBetts said: I am not happy with Doctson production either, but it's becoming more and more obvious that Alex smith is holding him back. There are times when he is open and alex throws it no where near where doctson has a legitimate shot to catch it. Alex is holding all the WR's back right now. I do expect he will get more accurate (he's been inaccurate for Alex Smith) but as far as distribution and taking chances, he's been par for the course. 8 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: It's unfortunate that Doctson was out his entire rookie year because I think we might have got a better look at what he could do as a #3 WR behind D-Jax & Garcon. Right now we are seeing him in a role that he may never be able to live up to, however until they do get a legit #1 WR we won't know if Doctson can at least excel as a #2 or even #3 I wonder how real the possibility of trading for Amari Cooper is. I don't think Cooper is going to be much of a help. He's been up and down, and he's not going to get that many targets here. No one is goign to get that many targets here, unless you are a RB. Even Reed is not getting the targets he should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsNoles21 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 If Alex Smith hits that throw to Doctson at the end of the second quarter like should have then this is a different conversation altogether. Kid needs targets, period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Not that it was a high percentage throw that should/could be counted on with any kind of regularity, but Smith also did throw that half time closing Hail Mary right into Floyd's chest and he simply dropped it. That also could have changed the course of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 22 minutes ago, petey hodge said: I thought he had blistering speed from his combine stats, but I dont categorize Doc as a speed guy based on my “eye test” everyone chastises Alex for underthrowing that deep shot, but Doc didn’t separate, right? If we are talking about the same play yesterday (deep shot to the right just outside the numbers?) Alex over threw him. He had at least a step and maybe two on the DB. In NFL terms he was wide open on that play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 1 hour ago, MartinC said: If we are talking about the same play yesterday (deep shot to the right just outside the numbers?) Alex over threw him. He had at least a step and maybe two on the DB. In NFL terms he was wide open on that play. Exactly. Separation in the NFL = a step or two for the most part. Generally the only time you're going to see a guy running free without anyone within a yard of him is on a busted coverage, if a DB gets completely burned on a double move (looking at you, Stroman), or if a WR/TE puts a ridiculous ankle breaking juke on the guy covering them (I've seen Reed do this). Doctson had a couple steps on his guy on that play so he was open. There's so little difference in the talent level in the NFL that being "open" is much different than in college. That's one of the things I think that QBs and WRs have to adjust to the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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