RedBeast Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Off season crown reigns supreme! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Only Doug suggested no GM....... Now that's how you get a senior role in a NFL front office. Genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 I'm not about to stand on a table for Scott Campbell, as I posted months ago that I was skeptical of him only because I didn't know a ton about him and have to wonder how a guy sticks for that long in a place like this. But I will say that he's got to be infuriated that "Doug's plan" demotes him and promotes Allen's buddie's son, while Doug gets the title. I guess we'll find out if Campbell is coveted in the NFL now that I'd imagine he'd like to find another home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/video/redskins-cap-guru-eric-schaffer-talks-new-role-working-doug-williams?utm_content=bufferead47&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedBeast Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Keep this thread open, don't lock it. We will need it again in the next few years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scruffylookin Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Snyder hires for front office and what they were doing before joining the Redskins 1999- Vinny Cerrato (out of the NFL) 2001- Marty Schottenheimer (out of the NFL) 2002- Vinny once more (out of the NFL) 2004- Joe Gibbs (out of the NFL) 2009- Bruce Allen (out of the NFL) 2010- Mike Shanahan (out of the NFL) 2015- Scot McCloughan (out of the NFL) Dan Snyder has shown zero ability (or interest) in finding front office talent hidden in other organizations. He hires names and/or people without other options looking to get back into the league any way possible. No surprise that his hires are insecure types who surround themselves with yes men and just grateful for a job. I give you Bruce Allen and Doug Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hailer21 Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Scott Campbell = Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Total nothing move really. Other than by title, so predictable it is beyond belief. We havent taken a step back. I don't think we've moved forward either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrFan Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Can we start drinking now ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSSkinz Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Congrats to Doug, I wouldn't be surprised if he was successful, he's made a career out of proving people wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 44 minutes ago, TK said: http://www.csnmidatlantic.com/video/redskins-cap-guru-eric-schaffer-talks-new-role-working-doug-williams?utm_content=bufferead47&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer Does the interview when it comes to KC sound optimistic to you all? Not to me. I couldn't really see the enthusiasm in Schaffer's demeanor and the way he presented himself when it came to the KC ongoing LTD negotiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 34 minutes ago, jschuck12001 said: Congrats to Doug, I wouldn't be surprised if he was successful, he's made a career out of proving people wrong. Not really, his post-playing career has been a few years here and a few years there in different aspects of football management, with little to no success. His entire FO career can be chalked up to nepotism. He can't stick as a coach, a scout, or an administrator but keeps getting chances and getting shuffled around because of his name. And now he's Allen's fall guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 20 minutes ago, RWJ said: Does the interview when it comes to KC sound optimistic to you all? Not to me. I couldn't really see the enthusiasm in Schaffer's demeanor and the way he presented himself when it came to the KC ongoing LTD negotiations. Wouldn't read too much into this since negotiation is all about posturing, and he's got about a month left in the longest and costliest staring contest of his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsPassion4Life Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 The only issue I have is "Doug made the decision on the GM".....that makes no sense. But overall, I have no problem with the structure....people are freaking out for no reason....It's a collaboration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 13 minutes ago, SkinsPassion4Life said: The only issue I have is "Doug made the decision on the GM".....that makes no sense. But overall, I have no problem with the structure....people are freaking out for no reason....It's a collaboration. Just curious because you are arguably the most hard core pro status quo guy -- how long have you been a fan? I could have definitely related to your point of view when I was in my late 20s-early 30s, etc. Edit: My point is when it was earlier in my fandom years during Danny's tenure, I gave them the benefit of the doubt. It took years of that benefit of the doubt being smashed to pieces that has made me cynical about the process. But I definitely didn't start that cynical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 16 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said: Not really, his post-playing career has been a few years here and a few years there in different aspects of football management, with little to no success. His entire FO career can be chalked up to nepotism. He can't stick as a coach, a scout, or an administrator but keeps getting chances and getting shuffled around because of his name. And now he's Allen's fall guy. Not liking the hire is one thing. but im gonna be straight up. Implying that Williams has only gotten a chance everywhere he's been because he's a name, sounds a lot like bull****, and unbelievably disrespectful and insulting to boot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 1 minute ago, Mr. Sinister said: Not liking the hire is one thing. but im gonna be straight up. Implying that Williams has only gotten a chance everywhere he's been because he's a name, sounds a lot like bull****, and unbelievably disrespectful and insulting to boot I've yet to see anything factual or even opinion outside of Redskins Park in support of Doug's ability to evaluate talent and build a roster. When you read about Doug, you read about how good of a person he is. The custodian at my job is one hell of a lady but I don't want her in charge of HR. Is there any other team, be it NFL or CFL, that would employ Doug Williams to build their roster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 On 6/9/2017 at 2:16 PM, Skinsinparadise said: Gregg obviously isn't the horse's mouth on why he wasn't hired. (and a lot more I won't quote in full lol) "Gregg obviously isn't the horse's mouth on why he wasn't hired. " In what I quoted, Williams never said why he wasn't hired because at the time of that quote nobody had been hired. I was saying "horse mouth" about how well the men (Snyder, Cerrato and Gregg) got along or gelled or whatever. You mentioned something from Vinny (the horse's mouth) that indicated Williams and Snyder not having a comfort together when watching a playoff game together as playing a significant role in Snyder's decision not to hire Williams. I quoted another "horse" that said things went well and described something that would hardly lead to a rejection of him as a coaching candidate. "As for Bruce, being machiavellian doesn't mean evil. I don't connote the word "scoundrel" as you did with the word." The definition of machiavellian is "cunning, scheming, and unscrupulous"...I dunno, but to me, I think attaching the word "scoundrel" to someone like that is almost a bit redundant lol...in fact, so does the dictionary: a scoundrel is "a dishonest or unscrupulous person". So, yeah, maybe you used the wrong word lol..."Political" is more accurate. And I never used the word "evil". It’s funny. Mike Shanahan was viewed as a controlling, divisive force when he was here in Washington, but almost nobody (except me) batted an eyelash at the notion that Shanahan didn’t have the control and power everybody thought he did. And Shanahan has a HUGE history of flat-out lying. I mean, monstrous. Hell, he lied while here with the Redskins, even about what Doc Andrews was supposed to have said to him concerning RG3...to the point that Andrews texted reporters setting the record straight about what he did and did not say to Shanahan. There are Skins fans to this day who do not trust Andrews based on lies Shanahan told to the press. I once actually got into an argument with Jason Reid about it, with me foolishly taking Shanahan's side lol...it wasn't until I went back and started researching Shanny's words, his past actions on the Broncos and even re-watching certain parts of games that I realized this mf'er would lie almost by default. I have rarely trusted anything he's said since, especially all the comments made afterwards in which every single bad decision during his tenure here is passed on to Snyder and Allen "really" being the ones who made that decision, and all the good ones being those apparently few times he was allowed to have a say-so in anything. 1. If the team has a miserable year and my owner approached me to do something about it. Heck yeah I'd listen to him and act on it versus double down with the owner and advocate myself for a position that arguably isn't my niche? Then you're not cunning, scheming, and unscrupulous. Get why I said what I said now?...and for the record, I do feel Vinny was cunning, scheming, unscrupulous, and used all of those qualities to keep himself in power and with the Redskins even after miserable years. Actually, Schotty verified that he was, saying that Vinny putting certain "words" into Snyder's ear played a role in not wanting to work with Cerrato if he agreed to be head coach, and that if Vinny was "in the building" that would most definitely be happening. 2. People's power and attitude can change over time. I've seen it plenty with others around my own jobs. See Russell's article below. It doesn't mean Russell is right but the idea of someone becoming more power hungry over time isn't some type of human nature reach. So, was Allen always power hungry or he became power hungry sometime during the 8 months between meeting with Scot and the earliest reports of tension between the two?...As for Russell, he's squarely on the train of thought that Scot talking way too much and leaking way too much to the press played a huge roll in him being fired, not that Allen's need for power forced him out. Not that he's saying it played no role, but it's much farther down the list that a LOT of people want to believe. I'm a huge Occam's Razor believer...the theories that are simpler and can more objectively be proven tend to be the ones that are closer to the real truth. Drinking problems, leaking too much to the press and going against Allen's directives can be proven objectively. Pride, ego and jealousy can not. Scot being fired "for cause" tends to back up that stance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sinister Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 10 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: I've yet to see anything factual or even opinion outside of Redskins Park in support of Doug's ability to evaluate talent and build a roster. When you read about Doug, you read about how good of a person he is. The custodian at my job is one hell of a lady but I don't want her in charge of HR. Is there any other team, be it NFL or CFL, that would employ Doug Williams to build their roster? I just came across this news, but is that indeed what he is doing? All the evaluation? All the scouting? All the picking? Or is it more of a overseeing capacity, trusting the input of those around you, and making decisions (shared among others) based off of solid info? If so then that is less about X's and O's and more about how you deal with/empower those around you to do their job and help you And really, the notion that he's never worked for anything in his life as an exec/ Sorry, but im not buying that. He may not be the pick people wanted, but stuff like that, just seems out of bounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsPassion4Life Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 11 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said: Just curious because you are arguably the most hard core pro status quo guy -- how long have you been a fan? I could have definitely related to your point of view when I was in my late 20s-early 30s, etc. Edit: My point is when it was earlier in my fandom years during Danny's tenure, I gave them the benefit of the doubt. It took years of that benefit of the doubt being smashed to pieces that has made me cynical about the process. But I definitely didn't start that cynical. Since the first game I ever saw...SB 17. You really need to move past the mistakes Snyder made 15 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 31 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said: Not liking the hire is one thing. but im gonna be straight up. Implying that Williams has only gotten a chance everywhere he's been because he's a name, sounds a lot like bull****, and unbelievably disrespectful and insulting to boot Do guys usually get promoted to a position like this when they haven't stuck in any one aspect of the sport they work in or been promoted before? He's done a couple stints as a coach, both at his alma mater. He's worked in various FO's without much success to show for it, without gaining acclaim or promotion until now, and without interest in his services from anyone outside his Grambling/Redskins/Bucs network. I understand what he means to Redskins fans and he honestly seems like a great guy. But his post-playing career has been the definition of nepotism. He can't stick anywhere or move up in the ranks in any aspect of the sport until now, basically. So now we hope he's a late bloomer surrounded by the right people, assuming he has pull in the Allen/Gruden/Schaffer/Campbell/Smith group. Edit: And let me be clear. I'm not saying he doesn't work hard at whatever he does. I'm saying he clearly isn't qualified for this position, which is why it's basically a fake position with probably negligible impact considering he's part of a much larger "braintrust" of decision makers. I think we all ideally would have liked a "real" hire of a personnel guy with a good record, to have a larger say or final say in the roster. Instead we got this insulting pat on the head and shuffling of titles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 6 minutes ago, Mr. Sinister said: I just came across this news, but is that indeed what he is doing? All the evaluation? All the scouting? All the picking? Or is it more of a overseeing capacity, trusting the input of those around you, and making decisions (shared among others) based off of solid info? If so then that is less about X's and O's and more about how you deal with/empower those around you to do their job and help you And really, the notion that he's never worked for anything in his life as an exec/ Sorry, but im not buying that. He may not be the pick people wanted, but stuff like that, just seems out of bounds He's the senior vice president of player personnel. Responsible for putting together a roster for Jay to work with. Obviously he'll have scouts on the ground, but it would appear he has as much control of the roster as Scott did. I'm not saying the guy hasn't worked for anything he has. He has a great story behind him and for all intents and purposes, appears to be a good dude. What I am saying is that he didn't get this job for his qualifications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSO Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 5 hours ago, TK said: Redskins president Bruce Allen said he doesn't think it's a big deal who has final control over the 53-man roster. He said it will remain a group decision. John Keim, ESPN Staff Writer Clown show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooleyfan1993 Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 Sigh. One of these years we'll get an ACTUAL GM. Thought mccloughan was the one, but drinking got in the way of that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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