The Official ES All Things Redskins Name Change Thread (Reboot Edition---Read New OP)

[Gamebreaker]

I'm hoping that Snyder never gives in and changes the name. The interesting thing is these bleeding heart PC people can't get any polls of the Native American tribes or the general population to agree with them. So they just double up on the annoying articles hoping people will just get sick of the issue and start supporting them to shut them up. 

 

They can't force Snyder to change the name, not even the NFL as a league can do it, and their trademark case is destined to not go in their favor as well. Their only shot at winning this is to keep beating the media drum, have protest with just a dozen people who don't know how to use google, and hope the bad publicity shames Snyder into changing. 

[elkabong82]

And now the Red Cloud Indian School is washing it's hands of all things Redskins after Snyder's reference this week.

 

I'm surprised Danny's new team of PR lawyers didn't clear this w/ the school before name dropping.

 

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/indian-school-officials-raise-questions-about-dan-snyders-account-of-redskins-emblem/2013/10/12/6716a17e-32b9-11e3-8627-c5d7de0a046b_story.html

 

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/letter-from-red-cloud-indian-school-on-the-washington-redskins-name/2013/10/11/e24044ba-32bc-11e3-8627-c5d7de0a046b_story.html

 

Yeah, by saying they had no involvement but then admitting they could neither prove or deny the claim later in the article. They sure didn't seem to mind receiving support from the coach of the team with such an "offensive" name for so many years. I wonder if they would have this attitude if they were still receiving those funds. But hey, Allen's son is our GM, but he couldn't possibly know anything about the emblem or corroborate the story, right? Right?

So when is the heat going to come down on the Kansas City Chiefs?  Because this has moved passed the name. Its now about the entire club branding itself after a group of people. So.....why arent the Chiefs getting any of this. The Vikings should be questioned as well. 

 

The Chiefs apparently don't have the major local paper holding a grudge against the owner and pushing the cause as a way to get back at him, and they also benefit from operating in KC instead of the nation's capital.

[elkabong82]

http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2013/10/12/5-reasons-ncais-report-says-redskins-racist-and-ugly-word-151717

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcJjSk1HKeg (Tom & Jerry Cartoon - Redskin Blues from 1932 when we were still the Braves).  Also learned that Tom & Jerry weren't always a mouse and cat.

 

 

 

Well if indiancountrytoday and NPR want the history of usage of the word to count, then the origin of the name being created by Native Americans and used respectfully, and the history of the word as meaning a sports team for 80 years, should be considered as well, rather than ignored. Way, way past objectionable usage that is long since been outdated and no longer carrying the same meaning should NOT carry more weight than origin and current usage. Otherwise we'll have to get rid of Yankees.

[Destino]

I'm hoping that Snyder never gives in and changes the name. The interesting thing is these bleeding heart PC people can't get any polls of the Native American tribes or the general population to agree with them. So they just double up on the annoying articles hoping people will just get sick of the issue and start supporting them to shut them up.

They can't force Snyder to change the name, not even the NFL as a league can do it, and their trademark case is destined to not go in their favor as well. Their only shot at winning this is to keep beating the media drum, have protest with just a dozen people who don't know how to use google, and hope the bad publicity shames Snyder into changing.

I would love to agree with you but you're wrong. The school mentioned by Snyder came out to say the name is offensive. Reilly's father in law slammed the team and claimed that Redskin is a hateful term that his people have encountered first hand. In that last article we see that the National Congress of American Indians put out a lengthy report as to why the name is bad and questioning the positive origin. The thing these all have in common is that they happened recently and are not from traditional media sources. The voice of opposition has grown and changed, even ignoring the casino CEO, so that it is no longer something that can be written off as members of the PC media.

You're also wrong about what this movement can do. They don't need large crowds, they simply need time to focus on young people. First convince the politically active young people that "Redskins" is racist and then those young people will get Redskins gear banned in schools for being offensive.  Then simply wait.  

I used to think this would blow over but it seems to be doing the opposite.  I keep hoping that next week will be the week that this story just goes away.  Instead I get radio ads and a surge in the story in non-sports media just before a prime time game.

[Spearfeather]

 

 

[Larry]

http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2013/10/12/5-reasons-ncais-report-says-redskins-racist-and-ugly-word-151717

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcJjSk1HKeg (Tom & Jerry Cartoon - Redskin Blues from 1932 when we were still the Braves). Also learned that Tom & Jerry weren't always a mouse and cat.

Thanks for posting that. That's the first example I've seen of the word being used that way.

Although as I understand it, the vast majority of those old cartoons are now forbidden, for ethnic stereotypes.

Still. Important fact.

[Destino]

Bob Costas.... **** that guy.

[Ellis]

**** Costas...

Dealing with the PC Police is like trying to pick up a piece of **** by the clean end... it just can't be done.

If you want to be offended by the name, you will find a reason to be offended. If you want to find pride in the name, you will find it.

[btfoom]

Bob Costas.... **** that guy.

 

AMEN 1000 times over.  First time I'd love the filter to just let one through.  He really deserved it.

 

I get so tired with these pundits getting a few 'facts' and running with these half-truths and ridiculous nonsense.  Not surprised, though, as Costas has always been a PC guy who never missed a chance to try to jump on an issue that he thinks is a winner and running with it. 

[abdcskins]

This year the name has really been under scrutiny.  More than I can ever remember.  At this point, I don't care if they change it or not.  Sort of just wish they would so all this talk could stop.

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

It's been a while since I've been this depressed about the Redskins. The only thing that beats it is the ST murder. We look like ****, and everywhere I turn people are calling for a name change. Costas started that piece on the right foot, carried on through the middle, then flipped his argument at the end. I'm at the phase where this makes me sick. Literally gives me an upset stomach. Part of me just wants to see a change to get this bull**** over with, the other part of me wants to wait to see if the outcry subsides. That Costas piece really put me over the top. I'm officially pissed, and just want this to go away. It's driving me nuts.

[thebluefood]

Between the team's play and the name controversy, its been really hard to find any joy from football this season.

[The 12th Commandment]

Costas at his self-righteous prickiest.  I was at a cowboy fan buddy's house for the game, you know it was bad because my friend didn't even poke fun.

[Enzo]

I know anytime someone mentions that the team was named in honor of Lone Star Dietz.  The media likes to point out he wasn't a really Sioux.  Well here is a whole website on him, make up your mind for yourself.  http://www.lonestardietz.com/

[44aDieselGirl]

I just can't believe the Costas rant - in the middle of the game no less. His other option would have been real journalism- full of fact. But, why would you want to do that? He has never been held to that standard before. He frequently spouts off at the mouth about things he does not fully understand- that have NOTHING to do with him. It completely ruined the rest of the game- regardless of the outcome.

I am getting so tired of this crap.

[Glenn X]

When I heard that Bob Costas was going to "speak" about the Redskins' nickname controversy at halftime of the Dallas game, I turned to my girlfriend and said sarcastically, "Well, this should be edifying."  And Costas did not "disappoint." 

 

What can you expect from Costas, the same man who wants to do away with the 2nd Amendment because occasionally athletes -- and others -- do terrible things with firearms (à la the Jovan Belcher situation in K.C. from last year), and then doesn't even have the cajones to fully own-up to that position after he gets challenged on it?  Of course, he would be against the Redskins' nickname.  It's a horrible slur, dontcha know?  You don't know?!  Well, heck, he just asserted it to be true, even after acknowledging that most American Indians don't have a problem with the name.  So it must be true!  I guess all those American Indians who are unoffended by the nickname are too stupid to know just how offensive it "really" is, right, Bob?

 

His "commentary" also had a list of potential "horribles" that included the Golden State Warriors (who, last I checked, featured the Golden Gate Bridge, rather than the old Philly era brave, as their logo) and the Chicago Blackhawks (who, as far as I know, are named after the Geronimo-esque Chief Black Hawk of the early 19th century).  So Costas is mad at a bridge logo on a basketball jersey and a logo of a brave on a hockey jersey that pays homage to a Sauk Indian leader?  Seriously?  Yes, seriously.

 

thebluefood brought up the lack of fun being had this season, due to our poor record and this nickname controversy.  As to the latter, one must understand that Bob Costas, as a charter member of the mass media's P.C. Police, is duty-bound to make things as unpleasant as possible on this issue.  "The personal is political" was the battle cry of feminists like Betty Friedan back in the 1960s.  Since then, the P.C. brigade has taken this to mean that everything is political and, thus, to be politicized all the time.  Hence, we get to the nickname controversy, the subject of which would not normally be grist for the political mill, as it pertains to an area (i.e. sports) that 60 Minutes once referred to as the "toy section of the department store" of American public life.  But given that everything is political now, including the nicknames of sports teams, this log gets tossed on the proverbial fire.  And since our team's nickname refers to American Indians, a minority group, and since race relations are always a hot topic for the P.C. set, this was bound to be a particularly obvious log for that fire.

 

I've said before that I don't want the team's name changed, mostly because I think this is a nonsensical issue being pushed by nonsensical people.  My Plan B would be to keep the team uniforms intact and change the name to Warriors (as in "Hail to the War-yers, Hail Vic-tow-ree...") or perhaps the Red Clouds, as that above image of Chief Red Cloud looks really cool and the fight song would only have to change by one syllable.  My Plan C has been to rename the team Warriors, retain the team colors and slap a picture of George Washington or George Patton on the helmets.  My Plan C is borne mostly of my frustration at continually fighting this out with stupid people who like to wail "Raaacism!" at the drop of a hat.  (Being a USC alum, the worst I had to deal with there were "U$C" wisecracks and condom jokes regarding the school's nickname from conference rivals.  But this "Raaacism!" stuff really is wearying, which is why the P.C. crew employs it.)  However, having read about this Ray Halbritter character and the terrible way that he treats the Oneidas has opened my eyes to yet another corrupt corner of our society.  Changing the team's nickname will do nothing about that situation.  Moreover, if we have George Washington on our helmets, I can already hear the howls of indignation: "He was a slave owner!"  Or if we put George Patton on our helmets: "He slapped a soldier who was likely suffering from PTSD!"

 

And so it goes.  On and on and on.  Where's the index-finger-"gun"-to-the-head smiley when you need it?

[MusicCitySkin]

Just change it, there's no point in fighting anymore. The facts don't matter. Like the American Indian tribes of the past, soon all sports mascots depicting them will be wiped out and forgotten forever. The PC media will give themselves a nice slap on the back for their hard work towards this, while simultaneously ignoring all the real life problems affecting American Indians. It doesn't matter that a small American Indian child is starving, just so long as there aren't any stereotypical depictions of that child in any mainstream outlet. They must be swept under a rug and forgotten about so the next insensitive item can be attacked, like Newman's Own Salsa depicting Paul Newman in a sombrero; it's just so damned insensitive it makes me sick, so sick I need to write an article talking about how sick it makes me.

 

I don't care what the new mascot will be, it doesn't really matter. I just hope that the Chiefs, Braves, and Indians are ready. The Fighting Irish may just have to wait their turn for the PC police.

[skinsmarydu]

I just can't believe the Costas rant - in the middle of the game no less. His other option would have been real journalism- full of fact. But, why would you want to do that? He has never been held to that standard before. He frequently spouts off at the mouth about things he does not fully understand- that have NOTHING to do with him. It completely ruined the rest of the game- regardless of the outcome.

I am getting so tired of this crap.

I have my PC moments...even with the mouth of a sailor *I'll own that all day*, my grandkids don't learn bad words from me. But they wrap themselves up in the Redskins blanket my mom made for me, and I will never tell them that our team name is controversial. Unless it does change, they'll never know any of this from me. They're all half-Latino, and for all they know, people are people. Until they ask, and I dread that conversation, they'll never know that Grandma is tormented. (And if they ask, I may not be able to hold the bad words in.)

 

Hail!

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

When I heard that Bob Costas was going to "speak" about the Redskins' nickname controversy at halftime of the Dallas game, I turned to my girlfriend and said sarcastically, "Well, this should be edifying." And Costas did not "disappoint."

What can you expect from Costas, the same man who wants to do away with the 2nd Amendment because occasionally athletes -- and others -- do terrible things with firearms (à la the Jovan Belcher situation in K.C. from last year), and then doesn't even have the cajones to fully own-up to that position after he gets challenged on it? Of course, he would be against the Redskins' nickname. It's a horrible slur, dontcha know? You don't know?! Well, heck, he just asserted it to be true, even after acknowledging that most American Indians don't have a problem with the name. So it must be true! I guess all those American Indians who are unoffended by the nickname are too stupid to know just how offensive it "really" is, right, Bob?

His "commentary" also had a list of potential "horribles" that included the Golden State Warriors (who, last I checked, featured the Golden Gate Bridge, rather than the old Philly era brave, as their logo) and the Chicago Blackhawks (who, as far as I know, are named after the Geronimo-esque Chief Black Hawk of the early 19th century). So Costas is mad at a bridge logo on a basketball jersey and a logo of a brave on a hockey jersey that pays homage to a Sauk Indian leader? Seriously? Yes, seriously.

thebluefood brought up the lack of fun being had this season, due to our poor record and this nickname controversy. As to the latter, one must understand that Bob Costas, as a charter member of the mass media's P.C. Police, is duty-bound to make things as unpleasant as possible on this issue. "The personal is political" was the battle cry of feminists like Betty Friedan back in the 1960s. Since then, the P.C. brigade has taken this to mean that everything is political and, thus, to be politicized all the time. Hence, we get to the nickname controversy, the subject of which would not normally be grist for the political mill, as it pertains to an area (i.e. sports) that 60 Minutes once referred to as the "toy section of the department store" of American public life. But given that everything is political now, including the nicknames of sports teams, this log gets tossed on the proverbial fire. And since our team's nickname refers to American Indians, a minority group, and since race relations are always a hot topic for the P.C. set, this was bound to be a particularly obvious log for that fire.

I've said before that I don't want the team's name changed, mostly because I think this is a nonsensical issue being pushed by nonsensical people. My Plan B would be to keep the team uniforms intact and change the name to Warriors (as in "Hail to the War-yers, Hail Vic-tow-ree...") or perhaps the Red Clouds, as that above image of Chief Red Cloud looks really cool and the fight song would only have to change by one syllable. My Plan C has been to rename the team Warriors, retain the team colors and slap a picture of George Washington or George Patton on the helmets. My Plan C is borne mostly of my frustration at continually fighting this out with stupid people who like to wail "Raaacism!" at the drop of a hat. (Being a USC alum, the worst I had to deal with there were "U$C" wisecracks and condom jokes regarding the school's nickname from conference rivals. But this "Raaacism!" stuff really is wearying, which is why the P.C. crew employs it.) However, having read about this Ray Halbritter character and the terrible way that he treats the Oneidas has opened my eyes to yet another corrupt corner of our society. Changing the team's nickname will do nothing about that situation. Moreover, if we have George Washington on our helmets, I can already hear the howls of indignation: "He was a slave owner!" Or if we put George Patton on our helmets: "He slapped a soldier who was likely suffering from PTSD!"

And so it goes. On and on and on. Where's the index-finger-"gun"-to-the-head smiley when you need it?

Loved this post, bravo!

[GoSkins0721]

I'm inches away from being done with all things NFL. The hypocritical marketing, the horrible leadership of Commissioner Gordon, the preferential treatment given to some franchises, and now Costas spewing his hate of this team on national television. Good gawd, if ever there was a time for an announcer to spew hate at a city, he could have at least picked the issue that impacts the majority of the country.

 

Name change. A ****ing name change. Yeah, people, rise up to the power of the name change. With this completed, God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

[Soup's Uncle]

I think

 

The Washington Warthogs, with a couple A-10 Warthogs letting their miniguns loose as our logo. It is a jet, and NY already has the Jets, but one can dream. Has "hogs" in the name!

Warthogs would be awesome.  Call us the Hogs for sure.  That's a cool new name with plenty of links to the past.  Plus those Warthog jets are bad@ss.

 

[Bang]

I purposely did not listen to Costas.

I knew it would do nothing but aggravate me.

 

~Bang

[AsburySkinsFan]

Honestly, this has got to be the most depressing thread on ExtremeSkins.

If I'm in too good of a mood then I just open this thing up and just like that....instant depression.

[GibbsFactor]

Maybe if we changed the name that damn curse someone put on us 20 years ago will be lifted.  Always the bright side!!

[AsburySkinsFan]

Maybe if we changed the name that damn curse someone put on us 20 years ago will be lifted.  Always the bright side!!

Nah, we all know that it's the gold pants that make us win!

BTW, we won three Super Bowls an played in two others as the Redskins. Why would the gods choose now to curse us because of the name? Maybe they didn't know they were supposed to be offended until they heard Bob Costas.