To homeschool or not to homeschool?

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Not necessarily. Ask any teacher: the biggest advantage that a private school has over a public school is the ability to kick out the most disruptive kids so that the rest can learn. Catholic parochial schools, for example, provide a good education despite large class sizes, because the teacher doesn't have to spend half his or her time controlling those three kids who won't stop acting up or have major learning deficiencies.

Now if you are talking about an expensive elite private school, then you are correct. Small class size is part of what you pay for.

In cities like Houston, what you are paying for is basically an English-only classroom and - as you say - a lack of disruptions.

My daugthers go to a Catholic school and both of them are in a class with around 25 students. That may actually be larger than the class sizes at the public school we are zoned for. The difference is, 75 percent of the class in the public school would be ESL. (We actually live in one of the "good" school districts that exist within Houston. In other words, we are not in the Houston Independent School District, but one of these weird smaller districts that exist in the "villages" that make up the city. I've never really studied how these school districts came to exist, but I have to assume that segregation played a role at one time.

The other "advantage" that private schools have is the fact that they don't really deal with Title I or learning disabilities in any real way. Like everything else in America, the most difficult cases are dumped on the public sector while the easiest cases go to the private sector. And then the private sector gets to brag about its superiority.

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As for home-schooling, I think the main problem I have with it is not the lack of social interaction it provides to the kids (though I think that is true). I think the main problem is that parents simply aren't trained to be teachers. My wife and I have four degrees between I us. I can still sit down and do calculus problems. But I have been a total disaster in assisting my daughter with long division this month. I'm not terribly good at teaching a fourth grader and if I was home-schooling, I wouldn't necessarily have an experienced teacher in the classroom next door who could give me some advice.

---------- Post added March-11th-2013 at 12:47 PM ----------

Burgold, I love your analysis, that was really great. I was thinking of talking my stepdaughter into letting me homeschool my oldest granddaughter(she's 7). She's not doing her in-class work, is disruptive and won't even begin to entertain the idea of homework. But she's really smart! She really likes small science stuff, likes figuring out how things work and why. I just wonder if she needs a different setting, and if it's with grandma, (I'm a tough one, not a softy, and she knows it), would it help her? They live about an hour's drive away, but I think she'd get more knowledge in less time with me. She has no social issues, being half Hispanic she deals with everyone well. I've never seen her be mean to anyone other than her bigger brother, and I encouraged her when she punched him once...he kept stepping on her blankie and making her trip and fall, so when she hit him, I said,"Yeah, don't let him do that to you." They're so protective of each other now!

Any ideas? When they're coming over, hubby and I usually plan a little "project" for them, and they usually accomplish it. They're not dummies...I've met their teachers and she's the only one with issues.

Unless there is some diagnosable medical or psychological condition, kids that age have trouble paying attention for two reasons.

1. The work is too hard.

2. The work is too easy.

It seems that #2 may be the issue with your grand-daughter. There are a number of things you can do, work with the teacher to allow her to do "advanced" reading if she completes her assignments. I remember being incredibly bored by the readers in elementary school. One of the rewards, I worked out was having unlimited access to the Encyclopedias if I had my work done. Yes, I was the type of nerd who actually read Encyclopedias. Create a reward system, if she gets a certain grade and behaves herself, she can have access to something that actually interests her. Most teachers will go along with this. If not, go to the principal.

Another great tool for kids who are bored is to make them tutors or helpers for other students.

PS

I used to be one of those people who said "We are drugging too many kids." That was until I adopted a fourth grader with obvious ADHD. I'm not sure she could sit in a classroom without Vyvanse. We screwed up last week and had one day where she did not take it. The teacher told us that by 2 PM, it was clear that the kid was hanging on by a thread.

[endzone_dave]

There is no way my wife or I could do a better job than my kids' teachers. They are very good.

Also, I've always wondered how homeschool parents teach their kids AP math and science. It can't be anything other then just putting the training material in front of their kids. Maybe there are other resources?

[sideshow24]

If I had to think of drawbacks, it would be the socialization factor. I don't know if I've ever met a kid who was homeschooled by themselves or with a sibling who weren't at least mildly socially awkward. I think that would be the biggest concern for me as a parent. I would definitely be concerned as well about the age of your 2 youngest children. .

I have found this to be true.

[Predicto]

There is no way my wife or I could do a better job than my kids' teachers. They are very good.

Also, I've always wondered how homeschool parents teach their kids AP math and science. It can't be anything other then just putting the training material in front of their kids. Maybe there are other resources?

There are computer resources, of varying quality.

In my experience, the homeschooled people I have known have been very good at rote memorization. They know names and dates. They have big vocabularies. They excel at spelling bees. Math can be a big strength. Critical reading and thinking - not so much. Writing skills - not so good. Their understanding of history, social science and law is shallow (names and dates are the least significant parts of history). Accomplishing anything in a group can be almost impossible.

But I admit that my experience is limited to a few people, and may not be representative.

[pjfootballer]

A good friend of mine and his wife decided to home school their two daughters. I like his wife, but....how do I put this nicely?......I wouldn't sign her up for any Mensa clubs anytime soon. The woman can barely spell. I've seen her writing on simple things like a grocery list and I hope to goodness those two girls (10 and 6) are going to be taught well. I mean, she's not stupid, but she only has a high school degree and I wouldn't call her the brightest bulb in the world.

[Old Bay]

My wife and I are seriously considering it for our son. She was homeschooled for the first few grades and it gave her a big head start. Once her mom had two more it became too much and they all went to public school. Whether you and your wife teaching good at teaching should weigh in as well, because not everyone is cut out for it. There are curriculum out there to help out, too, not like you have to just wing it. The socialization thing I'm a bit torn on. There have been a few kids that I thought were weird that were homeschooled but just as many that were completely fine and well adjusted. You just have to do more stuff that allows for kids to be social.

[PleaseBlitz]

Entirely anecdotal: My aunt and uncle homeschool their 4 kids. All four are bright and probably more advanced academically than similar age kids. My aunt puts ALL of her time into it and I have no doubt the quality of the education is outstanding. The kids are obviously not socialized properly. They are well behaved, but they do not know how to work within a group that is not the 4 of them. It's sort of (really) strange.

I am a product of the Loudoun County public school system. Based on my experience and seeing my cousins, I would never consider homeschooling. :2cents:

[Elessar78]

A good friend of mine and his wife decided to home school their two daughters. I like his wife, but....how do I put this nicely?......I wouldn't sign her up for any Mensa clubs anytime soon. The woman can barely spell. I've seen her writing on simple things like a grocery list and I hope to goodness those two girls (10 and 6) are going to be taught well. I mean, she's not stupid, but she only has a high school degree and I wouldn't call her the brightest bulb in the world.

I went to Fairfax County Public Schools. I think the word you are looking for is "stupid".

[SoCalSkins]

Are there any drivers other than promoting religion when homeschooling? Other than shielding kids from facts so they can be indoctrinated in a bubble are there any tangible benefits? Seems like child abuse to me.

[SteveFromYellowstone]

Are there any drivers other than promoting religion when homeschooling? Other than shielding kids from facts so they can be indoctrinated in a bubble are there any tangible benefits? Seems like child abuse to me.

I don't know if I'd put it like that, but most children that are home schooled that I know personally are taught by very religious parents who have no training as teachers. Obviously that isn't all of them, but it's a big motivation for a lot of home school parents. I don't understand why some parents with only high school diplomas and no special training think they can do a better job at educating their children than public school teachers who have lots of experience at dealing with all types of kids. Most home schooled children I know are all at least mildly socially awkward. Social skills are absolutely crucial for college and getting your career going. Don't get me wrong, I've known some booksmart home schooled children but they often lack practical knowledge/critical thinking skills. Think of the kids who memorized huge lists of words and spent hours on homework every night to get an A vs someone naturally smart who rarely studied for that same A. Public school educations can often be very good if your child is motivated to learn and sign up for the more challenging classes. Me personally, I went to a religious private school from nursery to 8th grade and went to public high school afterwards. My most impactful and intelligent teachers were all from my public school. I honestly believe a religiously based education can be harmful in some cases unless the school is ranked very highly academically. Your education in public school is often what you make of it. There are plenty of resources to succeed if you are motivated enough.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

First off I understand your concerns and why you are considering this. That said, as someone who went to community college kinda out in the country where a lot of home schooled kids also attended, do NOT home school your kids. They are almost ALWAYS universally weird. You're on point with you concerns about social skills. It's like they miss out on that social conditioning part of life where they learn how to act in public/around other people. Honestly, I can't think of one home schooled kid I've met who wasn't just plain weird. I really, honestly think it does kids a great disservice to home school them.

Just my opinion from my own experiences.

[Elessar78]

http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2011/02/homeschooled-students-act-scores-higher-than-national-average.html

Found this on some Christian site. It states that homeschool students score higher (22.5 vs 21.1) than their trad. counterparts. Which seems all well and good but, IIRC, 22 is well within the "deny" range of most decent colleges.

[Corcaigh]

Another drawback, you can't date any of your classmates if you're homeschooled. At least you shouldn't.

And sex with the teacher is a whole different mess.

[Major Harris]

And sex with the teacher is a whole different mess.

[SWFLSkins]

Homeschool if you want a child to wake up one day in a world they don't recognize and is cruel and difficult. Adding to that burden is they are unprepared to deal with that cruelty that exists. My children attended a Christian school early on and now attend public school. I found that to be a difficult transition as the private school focused on religion and not science or math. So what subject is homeschooling going to miss out on?

btw , I think there is some excellent advice in here already.

---------- Post added April-12th-2013 at 08:17 AM ----------

http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2011/02/homeschooled-students-act-scores-higher-than-national-average.html

Found this on some Christian site. It states that homeschool students score higher (22.5 vs 21.1) than their trad. counterparts. Which seems all well and good but, IIRC, 22 is well within the "deny" range of most decent colleges.

And actually that average differential is not as high as one would hope considering you are paying to attend a private school. And the dregs lower the average of the public number. I found the advanced classes my kids take to be very challenging for them.

[Heavy Jumbo]

I was home schooled for most of my school-aged years and I would NOT recommend home schooling unless you or your wife are trained teachers. When I went to college, my academic skills were severely lacking because my mom did not work with my siblings or me in high school. We read our books and learned that way. I had absolutely no learning strategies in place when I went to college and had to learn how to study the hard way.

As far as the social aspect of education goes, get your children involved in sports, band, chorus and the like. That does help. Home school co-ops are also good and help children to learn how to interact with peers other than siblings.

If you're concerned about behavior issues, maybe you could try homeschooling for a year or so to get your child back on track. Ultimately you need to work with your child's teachers and implement a behavior improvement plan. If the teachers are not willing to work with you, try putting your child in another school. If the lack of quality education is an issue, try changing schools or school systems and get your child a tutor and WORK WITH YOUR CHILD ON THEIR HOMEWORK.

[SWFLSkins]

http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2011/02/homeschooled-students-act-scores-higher-than-national-average.html

Found this on some Christian site. It states that homeschool students score higher (22.5 vs 21.1) than their trad. counterparts. Which seems all well and good but, IIRC, 22 is well within the "deny" range of most decent colleges.

And actually that average differential is not as high as one would hope considering you are paying to attend a private school. And the dregs lower the average of the public number. I found the advanced classes my kids take to be very challenging for them.

[dchogs]

And actually that average differential is not as high as one would hope considering you are paying to attend a private school. And the dregs lower the average of the public number. I found the advanced classes my kids take to be very challenging for them.

nothing to do with private schools. that was home school vs. traditional (i.e. public schools). also, there are a lot of different private school "flavors;" some are there for kids with awesome grades, some for kids that haven't gotten it together yet, some for students with learning disabilities, etc.

[SWFLSkins]

nothing to do with private schools. that was home school vs. traditional (i.e. public schools). also, there are a lot of different private school "flavors;" some are there for kids with awesome grades, some for kids that haven't gotten it together yet, some for students with learning disabilities, etc.

Gotcha, see that now. I was basing it on my experience. I think for us we made the right call. I love our teachers and was taken back by their competence.

[Elessar78]

If regular school kids do homework, do homeschooled kids do schoolwork?

[China]

Saw this the other day:

Go to Homeschool: My Education Among the Strange Kids of Rural Georgia in the 90s

My brother’s first-grade classroom was a repurposed janitor’s closet. There wasn’t enough room for aisles, so he and his 40 classmates would crawl over the tops of the desks to enter and exit the room. They went on exactly one field trip that year, to one of the actual, honest-to-God classrooms the Cherokee County, Georgia, school system was frantically building to catch up to the massive influx of families moving to suburban Atlanta. “You’d better be on your best behavior,” his teacher said, “or we’ll never move into this classroom.” They never did.

I reckon that my fourth-grade classroom, on the other end of the school, didn’t suffer from as many health-code violations. There were a half-dozen leaks in the ceiling, but those would have probably helped if the classroom had ever caught on fire. We didn’t really have aisles either; the desks were arranged in a sort of amorphous jumble to avoid the drips from above.

My parents were more concerned with the curriculum than what the classroom looked like. In third grade up North, I was learning long division, and then we moved to Georgia, where I stepped down to single-digit addition and subtraction. Worksheets featured such problems as 6-2, 3+9, even the occasional 1+1. One day, the kid next to me scooted his desk over. I thought he was going to laugh with me about the 1+1. He spoke in a thoroughly Southern drawl I was still getting used to. “You know how to do this? I don’t get it,” he said as he pointed at the first problem on his worksheet. Eight plus zero.

The following summer, I encountered the term homeschool for the first time. It was on a button my mom had brought home from a conference of some sort, and it read:

Home’s cool.

HOMESCHOOL!

Sold. For the next four years, my brother and I were homeschooled.

Click on the link for the rest

[greenspandan]

I went to Fairfax County Public Schools.

same here. i want the same level of education and socialization for my kids. they NEED more experience and input than just mine and my wife's. we may be great people (seriously, we rock), but we are not the world.

[Zguy28]

I know this is from last year, but the ignorance in this thread from those who are against homeschooling is staggering. Anyway, I thought this was better than starting a new thread.

http://themattwalshblog.com/2013/12/18/politician-lets-treat-all-homeschool-parents-like-felony-child-abusers/.

[Larry]

I know this is from last year, but the ignorance in this thread regarding those wha are against homeschooling is staggering. Anyway, I thought this was better than starting a new thread.

http://themattwalshblog.com/2013/12/18/politician-lets-treat-all-homeschool-parents-like-felony-child-abusers/.

 

 

I stopped reading after like the ninth "let me put this another way:  If homeschollers don't have unlimited rights, then the world will cease to exist". 

 

Did he actually make a good point, somewhere after that? 

[Zguy28]

I stopped reading after like the ninth "let me put this another way:  If homeschollers don't have unlimited rights, then the world will cease to exist". 

 

Did he actually make a good point, somewhere after that?

Yep.