All Things North Korea Thread

[RVAbrendan]

I feel so bad for the citizens of NK. They know nothing but hunger, cruelty, and disparity.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

(which may or may not work. Have they set one off yet that worked?)

Yes

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17823706

Was just reading something the other day that said that most observers believe they have at least 12 nukes, possibly more. Which, when compared to other nuclear powers, isn't ****. But like you said, just the threat of the one has so much power.

I wonder sometimes if I'll see North Korea collapse in my lifetime. I gotta think the odds are yes. It'll be interesting to see. Hopefully they follow the same path of the failed Soviet Union, and go out in a sputter and not a blaze of glory. And honestly, at this point, I'm not even sure South Korea wants reunification. It would be West/East Germany (still issues to this day) times a million. I think they'd much prefer just a sane, non-threatening neighbor.

[Dan T.]

North Korean missiles dismissed as fakes

That's the military equivalent of stuffing a sock in your pants.

[Larry]

I wonder sometimes if I'll see North Korea collapse in my lifetime. I gotta think the odds are yes. It'll be interesting to see.

Unfortunately, I think it will be a case of "interesting, in the sense of 'may you live in interesting times'."

Maybe just me, but I think that the record on decades-long dictatorships going down peacefully isn't all that great. And I don't know if the world has ever seen a place that is more of a dictatorship, than this one.

[Dan T.]

Unfortunately, I think it will be a case of "interesting, in the sense of 'may you live in interesting times'."

Maybe just me, but I think that the record on decades-long dictatorships going down peacefully isn't all that great. And I don't know if the world has ever seen a place that is more of a dictatorship, than this one.

The scariest part of it all is the seeming mass delusion of the populace. Through a combination of coercion, intimidation, a massive misinformation and propaganda campaign, and tight control of limited resources, they've created a society wholly dependent on a paternal leadership raised almost to a god-like status. It's like a bizarre cult nation-state. How do you break that spell?

[Larry]

The scariest part of it all is the seeming mass delusion of the populace. Through a combination of coercion, intimidation, a massive misinformation and propaganda campaign, and tight control of limited resources, they've created a society wholly dependent on a paternal leadership raised almost to a god-like status. It's like a bizarre cult nation-state. How do you break that spell?

Yeah, "cult" is probably a better analogy than "Dictatorship".

How many cults end peacefully?

[Henry]

The scariest part of it all is the seeming mass delusion of the populace. Through a combination of coercion, intimidation, a massive misinformation and propaganda campaign, and tight control of limited resources, they've created a society wholly dependent on a paternal leadership raised almost to a god-like status. It's like a bizarre cult nation-state. How do you break that spell?

So kinda like Jonestown, except it's an entire country ... with nukes?

[China]

‘No trace’ left after extreme executions in North Korea

SEOUL — North Korea’s young new leader, Kim Jong-un, has instituted a novel method of executing military officers — mortar firing squad, South Korea’s leading daily newspaper reported Tuesday.

The 20-something Mr. Kim ordered a military officer to be executed in a way that would leave “no trace of him behind, down to his hair,” the daily Chosun Ilbo reported, quoting a South Korean government source.

The officer was placed at the aiming point of a mortar range, where an artillery shell exploded and blew him to pieces, the newspaper reported. His crime: being caught drunk during the mourning period for Kim Jong-il, Mr. Kim’s father and predecessor who died in December.

The execution was part of a purge of “unsound” military officers that took place under the control of the new supreme leader, the paper reported.

Click on the link for the full article

[AsburySkinsFan]

These guys take crazy to a whole new level.

[Predicto]

One of the saddest things you will ever read.

The new edition provides testimony starting in 1970 about different types of forced-labour camps: the kwan-li-so for political prisoners, from which there is usually no release; the kyo-hwa-so penitentiaries mostly for those serving out sentences as common criminals; and detention centres for those forcibly repatriated from China. All appear to involve mistreatment that frequently ends in death. In the detention centres near China, North Korean women suspected of being made pregnant by Han Chinese are subject to forced abortions, the report says. (The state preaches an extreme gospel of racial purity.)

Even prison guards attempt to escape the country. Based on their testimonies and those of former inmates, Mr Hawk estimates that there are 150,000-200,000 political prisoners, penned into a string of camps that can be pinpointed on Google Earth (being “sent up to the mountains” is a euphemism among ordinary folk for those who disappear). Many prisoners are stunted and deformed from back-breaking work, 12 hours a day, seven days a week, with so little food that they eat rats and snakes, and pick through cow dung for grains of corn. Clothing is threadbare.

Whole families, including children, are incarcerated for “guilt by association”. Under an edict from Kim Il Sung in 1972, up to three generations must be punished in order to wipe out the “seed” of class enemies. There are no trials for those in the political camps, but presumed deviants are suspected of, as Mr Hawk puts it, wrongdoing, wrong thinking, wrong knowledge, wrong association or wrong background. Crimes include a failure to wipe the dust off a portrait of Kim the patriarch; having been a diplomat or student in eastern Europe in the late 1980s and therefore having witnessed the collapse of socialism; having contact (usually in China) with South Koreans; or being a Christian. Nowhere in the world matches North Korea for forced disappearances. Victims are held incommunicado, rendering the level of inhumanity even worse in the North Korean gulag than in that of the former Soviet Union.

http://www.economist.com/node/21553090

Guilty by reason of birth? Prison camps not only for enemies of the state, but three generations of their families? :doh:

[The 12th Commandment]

You want to have hope for those poor people but it seems hard to come by there. Against common sense I hope the kid is biding his time and will make a move when he has got a base. Hopefully he's smart enough for that, he'll still be alive when the last of the old guard die off.

How could someone who was fairly normal and lived in an open place think that totalitarianism is good for anyone? Wouldn't the elite benefit from more liberal policies and a bigger economy too? Maybe they figure they've gone so far that if the people ever find out why things really have been how they have been, there will be no hope of their benevolence.

[Dan T.]

I think we can dismiss any notion that the new leader is any more enlightened than his father or grandfather. What a ****ed up nation. God help any citizen who doesn't fall lockstep into line.

[Predicto]

I think we can dismiss any notion that the new leader is any more enlightened than his father or grandfather. What a ****ed up nation. God help any serf who doesn't fall lockstep into line.

Fixed that for ya.

[Botched]

One of the saddest things you will ever read.

Guilty by reason of birth? Prison camps not only for enemies of the state, but three generations of their families? :doh:

I recently read the book that is mentioned in that article. It's really disgusting how those prisoners are treated. They're basically cattle, only they're used for decades of hard labor instead of for food.

[Forehead]

So the new guy is apparently executing military officers by mortar? And there was the new attempted show of force, though the missile did blow up. And the (presumed) fake bombs. Add in the widespread assumption that food/aid sent to the country winds up in warehouses and not in the hands of the populace that needs it.

I'm all for compassion and not wiping them off the map, but what now?

[AsburySkinsFan]

You want to have hope for those poor people but it seems hard to come by there. Against common sense I hope the kid is biding his time and will make a move when he has got a base. Hopefully he's smart enough for that, he'll still be alive when the last of the old guard die off.

Did you see China's post earlier...the kid had a guard who was found drunk during the mourning period for Kim Jong-Il killed via mortar squad, meet the new boss.

Quite frankly I'm still trying to figure out how and why any college or university outside of North Korea allowed the spawn of Jong-Il to attend!

Edited May 1, 2012 by AsburySkinsFan

[visionary]

http://news.sky.com/story/960655/north-korea-army-chief-relieved-of-post

North Korea: Army Chief 'Relieved Of Post'

North Korea's top military leader, and a key mentor to leader Kim Jong-Un, has been removed from all posts due to illness, state media has reported.

Ri Yong Ho has been at the young leader's side since he succeeded his father Kim Jong-Il in 2010.

But it has been suggested that the reason for his sudden departure could be Mr Kim's desire to put his own mark on the government he inherited.

The decision to relieve Mr Ri of his duties was made at a Workers' Party meeting on Sunday, according to the North's official Korean Central News Agency.

It was not immediately clear who would take his place and the agency did not elaborate on Mr Ri's condition or future.

Mr Ri was vice marshall of the Korean People's Army and the military's General Staff chief, as well as a top figure in the Workers' Party.

[Jumbo]

"This just in...Kim Jong-il is still dead ..."

[mistertim]

Is "being executed" an illness?

[aszumilo]

Is "being executed" an illness?

Maybe it is a case of lead poisoning?

[mistertim]

Maybe it is a case of lead poisoning?

[The Sisko]

I was just beginning to get over my devastating grief over the loss of Dear Leader and then this thread pops back up. Some people just have no compassion. *SOB* *SNIFF, SNIFF*

[mistertim]

I was just beginning to get over my devastating grief over the loss of Dear Leader and then this thread pops back up. Some people just have no compassion. *SOB* *SNIFF, SNIFF*

YOU'RE NOT CRYING HARD ENOUGH. That's it, off to the dungeon with you.

[ixcuincle]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/north-korea-ri-yong-ho-kim-jong-un-131953945.html

According to the news service, the move suggests that Kim—who last week was seen on state television with a mystery woman at several public events, including the memorial—may be "purging the ruling elite to strengthen [his] grip on the secretive state" and "jazzing up the ruling family dynasty's normally dour image."

Wonder who that woman is

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 12:28 PM ----------

Further research on the young "Mystery woman" leads to here, which says that he was seen watching a performance of Disney characters. Disney Characters in NK

The unusual performance included appearances by Disney characters—including Mickey Mouse, Minnie Mouse and Winnie the Pooh—not often seen in North Korea, which traditionally shuns entertainment of the West.

---------- Post added July-16th-2012 at 12:40 PM ----------

Edited July 16, 2012 by ixcuincle

[visionary]

About that woman....

https://twitter.com/anguswalkeritv

Mystery woman seen with KimJungUn‬ may not be pop singer, could be 27 yr old top student selected by his Uncle to be wife: S Korean sources

2:05 AM