Next Day Thread: Eagles Make Us Sad

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, MartinC said:

For example we allowed the Eagles to isolate Brown on Forbes for most of the game without help. That was just a physical mismatch. I’m surprised the Eagles didn’t go to that more often than they did.  

 

I was wondering about this too.  How is Forrest so consistently out of position to offer help over top on the opponent's #1 receiver?  Philly only has two real vertical threats in their offense, why would we not just run two high shells?  What we were trying to run?

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, MartinC said:

We were actually really good on 3rd down D today. The Eagles were 4-12 on 3rd down. They did convert both 4th downs though. 

 

The second one shouldn't have been a conversion.  Landon Dickerson false-started and it should have been a 4th and 6.  The league has given up officiating Philly's little scrum play and it's bull****.  Every single player on the line of scrimmage lines up in the neutral zone every time they do it, and they constantly jump early.  If they can't officiate that play, then they should have banned it.

[samy316]

23 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

The blow up of his foot, I posted above, being in was pretty damning evidence though. How do you as a ref look at that and say nope not in?

Again, it’s a borderline call on the road.  We know from experience that we don’t get those call more often than not.

[zCommander]

9 minutes ago, samy316 said:

Again, it’s a borderline call on the road.  We know from experience that we don’t get those call more often than not.

 

It is one thing if a ref didn't see it and it is another thing when they review it and it is obvious to everyone. Even on twitter/x an Eagles fan said he was in. The refs were wrong. That's all. 

[757SeanTaylor21]

Jdr scheme compared to the one Dallas runs is pale in comparison

[NoCalMike]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

 

The second one shouldn't have been a conversion.  Landon Dickerson false-started and it should have been a 4th and 6.  The league has given up officiating Philly's little scrum play and it's bull****.  Every single player on the line of scrimmage lines up in the neutral zone every time they do it, and they constantly jump early.  If they can't officiate that play, then they should have banned it.

 

Yes exactly, and what was up with one of the times they did it today, it was like the official walked into that scrum to personally hand them the ball to place it down there? Like nah man, you put the ball down on the ground first and then make them get into that formation.

1 hour ago, zCommander said:

 

The blow up of his foot, I posted above, being in was pretty damning evidence though. How do you as a ref look at that and say nope not in?

 

Another issue I have with it is how inconsistent the officials are with who/when they want to give the benefit of the doubt to on the close ones.  The AJ Brown bobbling "catch" really had no business being called a catch live, even if it was ultimately ruled a catch on replay (IMO, it wasn't a catch as the nose of the ball seemed pretty clearly on the ground as he tried to secure it) but since the officials called it a catch, it made it nearly impossible to over turn.....so why is our #1 WR who IS KNOWN FOR HIS CONTESTED CATCH ABILITY  not afford the same benefit of the doubt and if they want to take a closer look after ruling it a catch, fine go ahead.   

Edited October 2, 2023 by NoCalMike

[petey hodge]

[FootballZombie]

Site is buggin hard for me lets see if this one gets thru...

 

I thought today was by far EBs best game. He embraced the strengths of his roster and called a game that minimized our weaknesses, instead of the opposite that plagued the first 3 games.

 

I have been pushing the idea that he was the tent-pole that most needed to change for our O. The line is not magically gonna fix itself, and Sam is not gonna make bad tendencies instantly disappear, but as the playcaller EB has the ability to mitigate these problems instead of magnify them. By calling a bunch of quick hitters, screens and other scripted plays the Oline does not have to hold their blocks very long and Sam does not need to take time to process much of the field. It is really hard to give up sacks if the ball is coming out in 1.8 to 2.2 seconds. Add in a healthy commitment to the run and suddenly the gameplan does not demand that your young QB has to be superman to find success. He took a lot of weight off of Sam's shoulders and put it on his own, and that is the way it should be right now.

 

Oh, and he ran his passing attack thru his WRs instead of his TEs... you know, the better unit. For me, this was EBs first good game. More of that.

 

The D on the other hand is reverting hard to a group that simply fails to make impact plays. Again I'm pretty sure our D-line is gonna score well analytically, especially the edges and more notably Chase. Even going against what we know is a great O-line there were a bunch of times where the pocket was pushed right on top of Hurts and he had to either get rid of the ball, slide for a short gain or make a great play. We are gonna get our handful of pressures which will show the D-line did their job, but without a greater amount of impact plays, that simply is not good enough. They have to be more than good, they have to be great.

 

I thought Sam had a good day. Having the weight lifted off his shoulders can do a lot for someone in his situation and when he was asked to step up and deliver he did. It is not fair to put a guy in his position in a superman role like we were doing. The way we utilized him today would be much more conductive to building good habits, learning and developing so I hope to see more than that. For me this was Sam's 2nd good game, which gives him more good than bad as well.

 

Still gotta be much better outta the pocket tho. At least two more car crashes today. Bills come due.

 

Rough day for Forby... I though he played that Smith play as well as you possibly could but AJ Brown is like a create-character worse case scenario for Forbes. Kid had no chance and Philly knew it. The only more I can add is it feels like the coaching staff put him on the field today so... progress?

 

 

Bad day for half-time adjustments. Again. What happened on both sides of the ball in the 3rd? Total collapse. Gotta lay that on coaching.

Special note: After being frozen and denied a practice kick, Philly's kicker went back to the sideline to get one in on the net. I don't think I have ever seen that outside of injury or media timeout. Interesting strat.

[Panninho]

4 hours ago, 757SeanTaylor21 said:

Jdr scheme compared to the one Dallas runs is pale in comparison

And it has been since he started here. His "scheme" only works against bad teams because they have bad o-lines and bad QBs. When did our defense show up against a really good offense and just dominate the game under JDR? I know that this is hard but with the talent we have, we should see a performance like that every once in a while. But it feels like whenever we play a good offense we allow +/- 30 points.

I do think that our defense is a little overrated but I think JDR does not put these players in the best place to succeed. I think this defense is not built to rush 4 and sit back. Our LBs are horrible in coverage and our DL, while good, is not good enough to cause pressure fast enough, especially against decent O-lines. And we don't set up the DL for success either when the o-line knows who is coming from where 90% of the time. Man I wish we had a defensive coordinator who would dile up something innovative every once in a while. The most "creative" blitz we saw yesterday was when JDR brought a safety blitz from 20y deep on 3rd & 8 and dropped CY into coverage against AJ Brown. To the surprise of no one the ball was out of Hurts hands before the safety even reached the LOS.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Panninho

[-9-]

7 hours ago, samy316 said:

They love stat padding against weaker opponents and going ghost against tougher competition.

 

It's like deja-vu all over again ...

 

[Thinking Skins]

3 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

Site is buggin hard for me lets see if this one gets thru...

 

I thought today was by far EBs best game. He embraced the strengths of his roster and called a game that minimized our weaknesses, instead of the opposite that plagued the first 3 games.

 

I have been pushing the idea that he was the tent-pole that most needed to change for our O. The line is not magically gonna fix itself, and Sam is not gonna make bad tendencies instantly disappear, but as the playcaller EB has the ability to mitigate these problems instead of magnify them. By calling a bunch of quick hitters, screens and other scripted plays the Oline does not have to hold their blocks very long and Sam does not need to take time to process much of the field. It is really hard to give up sacks if the ball is coming out in 1.8 to 2.2 seconds. Add in a healthy commitment to the run and suddenly the gameplan does not demand that your young QB has to be superman to find success. He took a lot of weight off of Sam's shoulders and put it on his own, and that is the way it should be right now.

 

Oh, and he ran his passing attack thru his WRs instead of his TEs... you know, the better unit. For me, this was EBs first good game. More of that.

 

The D on the other hand is reverting hard to a group that simply fails to make impact plays. Again I'm pretty sure our D-line is gonna score well analytically, especially the edges and more notably Chase. Even going against what we know is a great O-line there were a bunch of times where the pocket was pushed right on top of Hurts and he had to either get rid of the ball, slide for a short gain or make a great play. We are gonna get our handful of pressures which will show the D-line did their job, but without a greater amount of impact plays, that simply is not good enough. They have to be more than good, they have to be great.

 

I thought Sam had a good day. Having the weight lifted off his shoulders can do a lot for someone in his situation and when he was asked to step up and deliver he did. It is not fair to put a guy in his position in a superman role like we were doing. The way we utilized him today would be much more conductive to building good habits, learning and developing so I hope to see more than that. For me this was Sam's 2nd good game, which gives him more good than bad as well.

 

Still gotta be much better outta the pocket tho. At least two more car crashes today. Bills come due.

 

Rough day for Forby... I though he played that Smith play as well as you possibly could but AJ Brown is like a create-character worse case scenario for Forbes. Kid had no chance and Philly knew it. The only more I can add is it feels like the coaching staff put him on the field today so... progress?

 

 

Bad day for half-time adjustments. Again. What happened on both sides of the ball in the 3rd? Total collapse. Gotta lay that on coaching.

Special note: After being frozen and denied a practice kick, Philly's kicker went back to the sideline to get one in on the net. I don't think I have ever seen that outside of injury or media timeout. Interesting strat.

 

In fairness though, its only his 4th game with them as a team. He's still learning how to use them in live non-practices. One thing we've seen all season though is that the 2 minute drill has paid off. That work in the offseason has come in handy. I wonder if we're going to see some 2 minute speed up checks like other teams did. 

[Thinking Skins]

8 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

At the moment it’s hard not to put him with Lawrence.  He doesn’t actually lose, like, ever.  That’s pretty impressive no matter what.  
 

Until he does come back down to earth, he’s got to be up there as one of the best young QBs. 

I just remember things like that were said about Jimmy G. 

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, KDawg said:

 

I also think the team should be exploring trades for Young and/or Sweat right now before the deadline. It’s not likely we find a great RoI now, but we need to be looking around. Does anyone have a LB that is available? Maybe a tackle? We aren’t going to get a stud, but maybe enough of an upgrade to make an impact.

 

 

Big time.  And if I had to pick one reason among others why the Eagles have been better than this team is that they are a slave to both the present and the future.  We are the slave to neither.  We play it all in the middle.

 

That is, they will step on the gas in the present and work to shore up weaknesses.  For example, when Washington beat them last year by utilizing the running game, the next week they added the best DTs they could find including Suh to help solve that problem.  They don't just let it ride as far as weaknesses.  If they had this O line.  They'd have signed Risner, etc.  They don't mess around.

 

And as far as the future, they constantly drum up future capital.  They don't like this team just lose players all the time for comp picks.  If they had two edge rushers and these guys aren't driving wins, they'd 100% trade one before the deadline.

 

Right now I think Young or Sweat would bring a nice haul, they have gotten off to a good enough start on that front.  Do I think Ron will trade either?  Nope.  Ron is always about now but at a medium speed.  I'll give him he doesn't mortgage the future but he also doesn't build for the future either as far as draft capital -- that's the Eagles style not his.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[FootballZombie]

20 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

In fairness though, its only his 4th game with them as a team. He's still learning how to use them in live non-practices.

 

While it is true that you can refine, review and evolve as a team as you grow, this was not that.

 

This was pure hubris.

 

Most of us armchair guys were pointing out issues in the offseason.

-O-line is bad

-TE group is poor

-WR group is stronger

-(I don't watch college so pulling from others here) Taking sacks is part of Sam's game

 

If we saw this, I know the coaching staff did to. And what did EB do for the first 3 games? He passed the ball 80% of the time in and O that featured TEs... even when that had to be TE3. Was on pace to destroy the land speed record of sacks, bottom 10 in yds/gm, ect.

 

That is not learning how to use your team. That is hubris and malpractice. Its believing your -ish is so nice, you can run it regardless of personnel.

 

Then Buffallo happened, and EB got his lunch money taken in front of everybody. That was a massive serving of humble pie.

 

This aint preseason where everything you call generally works b/c your playing your 1s against 2s and 3s. Its big boy space up here.

 

So, at least for a game, EB swallowed his pride, and did what he had to do.

Featured the WRs. Ran the ball more. Quick plays to mitigate the problems of the O-line and QB.

Its a positive. A fairly obvious one, but a positive.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I think they should let both Chase and Sweat walk in the off season.  Spend your money elsewhere.  They’re not good enough for big money deals.  

 

Trade one of them.   Let's do what the big boy teams do.  We could have traded Trent in season depending on the report for either a first or 2nd and thrd.  Instead we let it go to the off season where his trade value dropped to much less because of the competition from FA and the draft.

 

Their value is highest in season for teams competiting for the big dance who have limited options to upgrade.  Other teams do it.  We don't.  We should.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Thinking Skins]

4 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

 

While it is true that you can refine, review and evolve as a team as you grow, this was not that.

 

This was pure hubris.

 

Most of us armchair guys were pointing out issues in the offseason.

-O-line is bad

-TE group is poor

-WR group is stronger

-(I don't watch college so pulling from others here) Taking sacks is part of Sam's game

 

If we saw this, I know the coaching staff did to. And what did EB do for the first 3 games? He passed the ball 80% of the time in and O that featured TEs... even when that had to be TE3. Was on pace to destroy the land speed record of sacks, bottom 10 in yds/gm, ect.

 

That is not learning how to use your team. That is hubris and malpractice. Its believing your -ish is so nice, you can run it regardless of personnel.

 

Then Buffallo happened, and EB got his lunch money taken in front of everybody. That was a massive serving of humble pie.

 

This aint preseason where everything you call generally works b/c your playing your 1s against 2s and 3s. Its big boy space up here.

 

So, at least for a game, EB swallowed his pride, and did what he had to do.

Featured the WRs. Ran the ball more. Quick plays to mitigate the problems of the O-line and QB.

Its a positive. A fairly obvious one, but a positive.

Yeah, but we know BRob and Gibson. He is just learning them. He's just learning how good the TEs are vs the OL and stuff; There is some stuff that he wants to add to BRob;s game like Screens but he makes mistakes (protection). And Gibson with the fubmbles. 

 

And in the midst of all this, he's got to develop Howell because we're only going as far as Howell can take us. So If we have a bunch of games like that Dallas game and that Philly game last year and the Tampa game then Howell isn't developing much and so when crunch time comes and its 3rd and 9 and he throws it 3 yards and you want his head, you will have to look back and say we developed him that way (Pickett, Ridder, etc). 

[Thinking Skins]

7 hours ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

I could see Sam making an effort to get rid of the ball on time or quickly today. Very much improved from last week.

 

I noticed the same thing with the outside zone. That should only be called for Gibson. Robinson gets tracked down from the backside before he can get to the hole. 

He was decisive today. 

 

 

It's simple. One decision he made was to use his legs more as a check down. We see that time and time again throughout the game. And it was a quick decision and he picked up yards. They left the middle of the field open. 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

O line wasn't hot.  But it definitely was better yesterday,

 

Keim just stated it well it's not just been the sacks but the pocket collapsing too much has put Howell under duress this season.  

6 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

He was decisive today. 

 

 

It's simple. One decision he made was to use his legs more as a check down. We see that time and time again throughout the game. And it was a quick decision and he picked up yards. They left the middle of the field open. 

 

That was one of Cooley's biggest takes from watching the Buffalo game, if no one is open, run.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Thinking Skins]

10 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

O line wasn't hot.  But it definitely was better yesterday,

 

Keim just stated it well it's not just been the sacks but the pocket collapsing too much has put Howell under duress this season.  

 

That was one of Cooley's biggest takes from watching the Buffalo game, if no one is open, run.

Yeah. I started to credit it to Cooley but thought that Cooley and EB probably aren't talking this stuff over so it's probably credit due to EB. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Just now, Thinking Skins said:

Yeah. I started to credit it to Cooley but thought that Cooley and EB probably aren't talking this stuff over so it's probably credit due to EB. 

 

lol, I said it was Cooley's takes from that game.  Didn't say he communicated that directly to the team.  EB called a good game. 

[CobraCommander]

Can we bring back those long snappers?

You have ONE JOB!!!

[Warhead36]

Yeah even when hes not sacked, he rarely has a clean pocket. Feels like there is always someone in his face. 

[CjSuAvE22]

I don’t care what anyone says The Mclaurin no catch was for sure a catch in bounds…

[Warhead36]

Just now, CjSuAvE22 said:

I don’t care what anyone says The Mclaurin no catch was for sure a catch in bounds…

It was close. If it was ruled a catch it would have stayed a catch. There wasnt enough to overturn it.

[CobraCommander]

Just now, CjSuAvE22 said:

I don’t care what anyone says The Mclaurin no catch was for sure a catch in bounds…

There's always a play like this when a game comes down to 1 score to win in OT. 

At this point it's sour grapes for officiating we've always known to be inconsistent.

A team needs to control what it can. Like Dotson dropping that third down pass. 

Play better and the bad officiating can be negated.