The All Things 2022 OTAs/Training Camp Thread

[TheShredder]

18 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Can you imagine how angry wed all be if we had a successful punt that Gibson ran and then fumbled away

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

But, but…Kyle Smith is the greatest talent evaluator in history! How will we ever draft another starter!!!???!

[KDawg]

Just Reyes and Apke so far for cuts? Still need three more, right?

Edited August 16, 2022 by KDawg

[Conn]

4 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Just Reyes and Apke so far for cuts? Still need three more, right?

 

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

this draft didn't age well

 

 

It's hard to know what part of the draft was Bruce, what part Kyle Smith.  But I never understood why so many folks wanted to anoint Kyle Smith the next GM, and thought he was absolutely outstanding.  I thought he was pretty good, though there were plenty of misses in his drafts.  

 

That said, as I've mentioned a WHOLE BUNCH of times, all drafts are basically a crap shoot.  So, eh.  

 

I do have 2 memories of stories from this draft:  

 

1. Apparently Bruce REALLY wanted Guice, and that was one of his guys.   And he went pea****ing around after we got him.  That didn't age well almost immediately

2. Doug Williams on the radio right after the draft said he basically had to tackle Jay to prevent him turning the card in for Trey Quinn in the 5th round.  

 

So, yeah.

 

FWIW,

 

2017: Jon Allen and Chase Rouiller are the only remaining player on the roster

2016: Kendall Fuller is the only player on the roster from the 2016 draft, and he left and came back.

2015: No players remain on the roster. 

-----

2019: Montez Sweat, Terry McLaurin, Cole Holcomb and Kelvin Harmon remain on the roster.  

2020: The only player NOT on the roster from this draft is AGG.  Young, Gibson, Charles, Ismael, Hudson, Curl and James Smith-Williams are all on the team and most have significant roles. 

2021: All of the draft picks are hanging around, though we'll see if they all make final roster cuts: Davis, Cosmi, St. Juste, Brown, Bates, Forrest, Cheeseman, Bradley-King, Toney and Milne.

 

I think you can extrapolate a couple of things from this:

 

1. they didn't draft extremely well for year, minus a few first round picks.  

2. Clearly Ron started favoring his own guys and guys who were just drafted prior to him taking over the team.

 

I think the 2021 draft, which was pretty roundly criticized, might have a pretty good year 2.  We'll see.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

It's hard to know what part of the draft was Bruce, what part Kyle Smith.  But I never understood why so many folks wanted to anoint Kyle Smith the next GM, and thought he was absolutely outstanding.  I thought he was pretty good, though there were plenty of misses in his drafts.  

 

That said, as I've mentioned a WHOLE BUNCH of times, all drafts are basically a crap shoot.  So, eh.  

 

I do have 2 memories of stories from this draft:  

 

1. Apparently Bruce REALLY wanted Guice, and that was one of his guys.   And he went pea****ing around after we got him.  That didn't age well almost immediately

2. Doug Williams on the radio right after the draft said he basically had to tackle Jay to prevent him turning the card in for Trey Quinn in the 5th round.  

 

So, yeah.

 

FWIW,

 

2017: Jon Allen and Chase Rouiller are the only remaining player on the roster

2016: Kendall Fuller is the only player on the roster from the 2016 draft, and he left and came back.

2015: No players remain on the roster. 

-----

2019: Montez Sweat, Terry McLaurin, Cole Holcomb and Kelvin Harmon remain on the roster.  

2020: The only player NOT on the roster from this draft is AGG.  Young, Gibson, Charles, Ismael, Hudson, Curl and James Smith-Williams are all on the team and most have significant roles. 

2021: All of the draft picks are hanging around, though we'll see if they all make final roster cuts: Davis, Cosmi, St. Juste, Brown, Bates, Forrest, Cheeseman, Bradley-King, Toney and Milne.

 

I think you can extrapolate a couple of things from this:

 

1. they didn't draft extremely well for year, minus a few first round picks.  

2. Clearly Ron started favoring his own guys and guys who were just drafted prior to him taking over the team.

 

I think the 2021 draft, which was pretty roundly criticized, might have a pretty good year 2.  We'll see.

 

 

 

Last pick in the 7th round or even 5th round, most are busts.  So Quinn doesn't bother me.  I liked Guice a lot predraft but I had no idea about his baggage.  According to Russell, Kyle Smith didn't want Guice because of the baggage but Dan really wanted Guice and overruled Smith.

 

I know there wasn't consensus about Payne at that pick.  Not sure who wanted whom aside from Bruce was wanting Payne according to one of the beat guys, forgetting whom.  

[TheShredder]

10 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

That said, as I've mentioned a WHOLE BUNCH of times, all drafts are basically a crap shoot.  So, eh.  

LA Rams would agree with that.

The rest of the NFL, not leveraging the cap, would say you have to build your roster through the draft.

Teams can derail themselves for years missing on a 1st round pick.

They use the 1st rounder to fill a need, then when they miss and they're slow to admit it and waste multiple years of other star talent in the process.

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

2. Clearly Ron started favoring his own guys and guys who were just drafted prior to him taking over the team.

 

Feels like every new coach does that. Shapes the team in their image and ideal, and suddenly the guys who were hanging around the previous regime don't fit as well, so they move on.

 

Fringe roster guys hanging on after a coaching transition is super hard.

 

Kinda like inheriting a previous regime's QB. He is never seen as the new coach's "guy" if he fails.

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

@Voice_of_ReasonI agree with you about the draft being a crap shoot and that it’s impossible to know what Kyle Smith’s involvement was in that particular year. 
 

My joke was more pointed at the ridiculous amounts of handwringing about him when he left, like he was some kinda guru. 

[Skinsinparadise]

As i mentioned, some who cover the team have speculated (not sure its based on info or its pure speculation) that Payne isn't always the most self-motivating player -- they don't slam him on that front where he's not a hard worker but seem to indicate he might not be the go the extra mile type.  If that's true and Payne needs more external motivation to take it up a notch, then this is the perfect season for it to happen -- contract year-FA.  Plenty of players peak in seasons that are their contract year-FA.  So I do think this is likely the season where Payne explodes.  

 

Logan Paulsen who has been around Payne for years said this year in practice he can see extra oomph in Payne's approach.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 16, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Die Hard]

23 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

As i mentioned, some who cover the team have speculated (not sure its based on info or its pure speculation) that Payne isn't always the most self-motivating player -- they don't slam him on that front where he's not a hard worker but seem to indicate he might not be the go the extra mile type.  If that's true and Payne needs more external motivation to take it up a notch, then this is the perfect season for it to happen -- contract year-FA.  Plenty of players peak in seasons that are their contract year-FA.  So I do think this is likely the season where Payne explodes.  

 

Logan Paulsen who has been around Payne for years said this year in practice he can see extra oomph in Payne's approach.

 

 

 

 

Happy to watch the big dog eat this year.

 

But guys who choose to show up for their contract year…. I’m not committing to long term. Those are the contracts you regret. I’ll take the compensatory pick… especially if the replacement is already on the roster.

 

But for 17 more games…. I’d love to see him try and reach/hit his potential. We’ve been waiting very patiently to see it.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Die Hard

[clskinsfan]

I feel like Payne has been kind of underrated by a lot on this board. He has played very well for what he is being asked to do. I hope he doesnt free lance this year hoping for the big payday. 

[wit33]

 

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

As i mentioned, some who cover the team have speculated (not sure its based on info or its pure speculation) that Payne isn't always the most self-motivating player -- they don't slam him on that front where he's not a hard worker but seem to indicate he might not be the go the extra mile type.  If that's true and Payne needs more external motivation to take it up a notch, then this is the perfect season for it to happen -- contract year-FA.  Plenty of players peak in seasons that are their contract year-FA.  So I do think this is likely the season where Payne explodes.  

 

Logan Paulsen who has been around Payne for years said this year in practice he can see extra oomph in Payne's approach.

 

 

 

 

 

The logic on your part is he will try harder? If he gets 7 sacks, it’s because he’s on the final year of his deal? 
 

Not coming at you in a condescending way, just curious to hear your thoughts. 

[Voice_of_Reason]

19 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

LA Rams would agree with that.

The Rams have basically deemed the draft pointless.  Which is an interesting strategy, one that will catch up to them eventually. 

 

19 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

The rest of the NFL, not leveraging the cap, would say you have to build your roster through the draft.

I don't know that's entirely true.  I think most teams view roster construction as a pairing between the draft and FA.  

 

As an aside, and I've posted this a bunch too, this team is primarily built through the draft.  Most of the RBs, WRs, TEs, and a good number of the OL are all drafted.  Basically the entire DL and LB corps is drafted, and a good bit of the secondary.

 

We are very draft-pick heavy at the moment, which is one reason our cap situation is pretty good, even with the Wentz contract.  

 

19 minutes ago, TheShredder said:

Teams can derail themselves for years missing on a 1st round pick.

They use the 1st rounder to fill a need, then when they miss and they're slow to admit it and waste multiple years of other star talent in the process.

Eh, not nearly as much anymore with the rookie wage scale.  The Cardinals, for example, pick a QB in one draft, realized he wasn't going to cut it, and drafted another one the next year.  Before the rookie wage scale, that would have been impossible.  The Haskins (RIP) pick would have been a much bigger deal.  Sure, we lost out on the opportunity cost of a different player, and the bust was the bust.  But it didn't prevent us for doing anything, which is the real change. 

[Conn]

7 minutes ago, wit33 said:

 

 

The logic on your part is he will try harder? If he gets 7 sacks, it’s because he’s on the final year of his deal? 
 

Not coming at you in a condescending way, just curious to hear your thoughts. 

? this isn’t exactly a novel idea, guys try harder and pop off in a contract year all the time. They have extra incentive, after all. 

[mh86]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

I feel like I saw chase there cheering on a few players and I like that energy 

[CommanderInTheRye]

For some honor, duty and sacrifice are more than just words from a long forgotten era…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The most powerful friend or enemy you’ll ever face is the voice inside your head.

 

Edited August 17, 2022 by CommanderInTheRye

[skinsfan93]

55 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

I feel like Payne has been kind of underrated by a lot on this board. He has played very well for what he is being asked to do. I hope he doesnt free lance this year hoping for the big payday. 

Im worried that Payne is gonna go for sacks and abandon the run. In the preseason game I think it was 3rd and 3 and Payne did a swim move to get to Mayfield and opened up a huge hole for Chubu had an easy first down.
 

I hope we see Mathis rotating in a lot on obvious running plays. 

[wit33]

46 minutes ago, Conn said:

? this isn’t exactly a novel idea, guys try harder and pop off in a contract year all the time. They have extra incentive, after all. 

Payne hasn’t been trying? 
 

Do guys not try harder and pop off in non contract years?

Edited August 17, 2022 by wit33

[Conn]

10 minutes ago, wit33 said:

Payne hasn’t been trying? 
 

Do guys not try harder and pop off in non contract years?

I wasn’t making a comment about Payne, just responding to your seeming confusion over the idea that even a good player might try harder in a contract year, in order to earn a big contract. It’s just about the biggest trope in sports, and for good reason. 

[CommandB11]

52 minutes ago, mh86 said:

I feel like I saw chase there cheering on a few players and I like that energy 

I noticed Chase was constantly on the front of the sideline directly at the LOS during every defensive snap. He was consistently standing directly beside Kerrigan and the chain gang. He also seemed to be the first one to meet anyone coming off the field.

[Llevron]

22 minutes ago, wit33 said:

Payne hasn’t been trying? 
 

Do guys not try harder and pop off in non contract years?

This can’t be the first time you encountered this line of thinking. It’s pretty common and has been for decades. 

[Koolblue13]

2 hours ago, CommanderInTheRye said:

For some honor, duty and sacrifice are more than just words from a long forgotten era…

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The most powerful friend or enemy you’ll ever face is the voice inside your head.

 

If you liked this, learn who David Goggins is and follow that guy. He's ****ing amazing.

1 hour ago, Conn said:

I wasn’t making a comment about Payne, just responding to your seeming confusion over the idea that even a good player might try harder in a contract year, in order to earn a big contract. It’s just about the biggest trope in sports, and for good reason. 

Last year I was saying that Payne is having a very Allens previous year, type of year. Payne is gonna brea out and I don't think it's because of his contract.

 

Side note, Imagine if we could actually start a trend of great DTs making the difference instead of DEs.

[sebestian]

11 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Last pick in the 7th round or even 5th round, most are busts.  So Quinn doesn't bother me.  I liked Guice a lot predraft but I had no idea about his baggage.  According to Russell, Kyle Smith didn't want Guice because of the baggage but Dan really wanted Guice and overruled Smith.

 

I know there wasn't consensus about Payne at that pick.  Not sure who wanted whom aside from Bruce was wanting Payne according to one of the beat guys, forgetting whom.  

 

And here lies the true problem.  What the hell does Dan Snyder know about football.  Can you imagine Mr Rooney going up to Tomlin or Colbert and overruling them based on nothing.  I always wondered why Snyder himself would go watch a QB that they might be interested in...how can Snyder evaluate footwork, or arm strength, etc.  The best owners in sports are the ones that you hear nothing about.  Owners of sports teams are good at making money, so do that, make as much money as possible, just leave the football decisions to the people who do that for a living.  This is such a Washington thing. It blows my mind, i mean, how is it possible that this guy had to buy our team, ma how??