Welcome to the Washington Commanders Phidarian Mathis DT Alabama

[AlwaysBeRedskins2Me]

Maybe Mathis can help stop the run. Watching Philly open up holes that Chris Farley and John Candy ( rip to both ) could easily fit through was unbelievably frustrating and disheartening! 

[Dark Acre]

8 hours ago, skinsfan93 said:

Wilfork wasn’t the epitome of lean 🤣🤣🤣
 

 

Vince is so pear-shaped, it looks like a camera trick until you realize Brady is next to him.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Going Commando]

This is the pick that I keep coming back to where I'm concerned that it was a reach where we paid very high opportunity cost.  I have a terrible feeling that we're going to regret not picking Nakobe Dean at 47, and that we passed over London Fletcher for Jarran Reed.  IMO we reached a point where this kind of reach made sense via mistakes:

 

- Losing our IDL depth earlier in the offseason

- Aborting our original plan in the Daron Payne extension negotation

- Paying sunk cost on Jamin Davis

- Overestimating Holcomb's quality and future value here

 

We painted ourselves into a corner where we felt compelled to reach because the IDL class depth sucked, and it's very frustrating given how much IDL quality we've had since 2018. 

[skinny21]

1 hour ago, Going Commando said:

This is the pick that I keep coming back to where I'm concerned that it was a reach where we paid very high opportunity cost.  I have a terrible feeling that we're going to regret not picking Nakobe Dean at 47, and that we passed over London Fletcher for Jarran Reed.  IMO we reached a point where this kind of reach made sense via mistakes:

 

- Losing our IDL depth earlier in the offseason

- Aborting our original plan in the Daron Payne extension negotation

- Paying sunk cost on Jamin Davis

- Overestimating Holcomb's quality and future value here

 

We painted ourselves into a corner where we felt compelled to reach because the IDL class depth sucked, and it's very frustrating given how much IDL quality we've had since 2018. 

Yeah, I’m definitely torn on this one. 

 

On one hand, did we really need to cut Io?  How much are we really going to save there if we sign another guy?  And do we really need that space?  I’m pretty sure we could have kept the current cap hits when extending Terry and Daron.  And getting Dean - a dawg in the middle that can also command the D, and potentially succeed Holcomb’s - would have been great for us IMO.

 

On the other hand, Dean dropped for a reason, and I get the feeling Io’s cut might have been about more than just money.  Worst case, the team got their 3rd ranked IDL (it’s possible he was #1 or 2 for them, at least in terms of fit) late in the 2nd, and Mathis potentially provides some insurance for next year in case extension talks with Payne break down.  We may wind up with a 3rd or 4th rd comp pick if that happens.  The team obviously likes Holcomb as well, so it’s possible they didn’t think the need was as great (that’s separate from, arguably, putting themselves in a position to “need” a DT).  And of course, DT is seen as a more valuable position than ILB.

 

Guess we’ll see how it plays out.  I’d have loved to land a (potential) stud LB though.

[Forever A Redskin]

4 minutes ago, skinny21 said:

Yeah, I’m definitely torn on this one. 

 

On one hand, did we really need to cut Io?  How much are we really going to save there if we sign another guy?  And do we really need that space?  I’m pretty sure we could have kept the current cap hits when extending Terry and Daron.  And getting Dean - a dawg in the middle that can also command the D, and potentially succeed Holcomb’s - would have been great for us IMO.

 

On the other hand, Dean dropped for a reason, and I get the feeling Io’s cut might have been about more than just money.  Worst case, the team got their 3rd ranked IDL (it’s possible he was #1 or 2 for them, at least in terms of fit) late in the 2nd, and Mathis potentially provides some insurance for next year in case extension talks with Payne break down.  We may wind up with a 3rd or 4th rd comp pick if that happens.  The team obviously likes Holcomb as well, so it’s possible they didn’t think the need was as great (that’s separate from, arguably, putting themselves in a position to “need” a DT).  And of course, DT is seen as a more valuable position than ILB.

 

Guess we’ll see how it plays out.  I’d have loved to land a (potential) stud LB though.

 

I don't think Nakobe Dean will be as good of a pro, Logan Paulsen even said he questions how his game will translate to the pros. He had an all-time defensive line keeping him clean at Georgia as an undersized LB.

 

I also think the fanbase way over-valued both Matt and Settle.

 

The guy I worry we passed over is Leo Chenal. But I'm waiting to reserve judgement until I see Mathis' impact and if he improves our LBs as a result of his play.

[CommDownMan]

On 5/6/2022 at 4:38 PM, skinsfan93 said:

Wilfork wasn’t the epitome of lean 🤣🤣🤣
 

 

 

Looks like someone photoshopped his head smaller and put it back in place. 

Edited May 12, 2022 by CommDownMan

[bird_1972]

On 5/11/2022 at 8:53 AM, Going Commando said:

This is the pick that I keep coming back to where I'm concerned that it was a reach where we paid very high opportunity cost.  I have a terrible feeling that we're going to regret not picking Nakobe Dean at 47, and that we passed over London Fletcher for Jarran Reed.  IMO we reached a point where this kind of reach made sense via mistakes:

 

- Losing our IDL depth earlier in the offseason

- Aborting our original plan in the Daron Payne extension negotation

- Paying sunk cost on Jamin Davis

- Overestimating Holcomb's quality and future value here

 

We painted ourselves into a corner where we felt compelled to reach because the IDL class depth sucked, and it's very frustrating given how much IDL quality we've had since 2018. 

 

Didn't Nakobe Dean fall because he needed shoulder surgery and neglected to get it?

 

Not sure that would have been good for us in the 2nd round but we had at least one other chance to grab him (I think he was still there in the 3rd and maybe even the 4th round before the Eagles took him).

On 5/11/2022 at 10:44 AM, Forever A Redskin said:

 

I don't think Nakobe Dean will be as good of a pro, Logan Paulsen even said he questions how his game will translate to the pros. He had an all-time defensive line keeping him clean at Georgia as an undersized LB.

 

I also think the fanbase way over-valued both Matt and Settle.

 

The guy I worry we passed over is Leo Chenal. But I'm waiting to reserve judgement until I see Mathis' impact and if he improves our LBs as a result of his play.

 

I've read somewhere where talent evaluators considered Dean the best player on the best defense in NCAA history. 

 

Personally, I think with all of that talent on the roster, it's hard to know if a given guy is a reason for that domination or simply a beneficiary of it.

[SkinsFTW]

On 5/14/2022 at 1:28 PM, bird_1972 said:

 

 

 

I've read somewhere where talent evaluators considered Dean the best player on the best defense in NCAA history. 

 

Personally, I think with all of that talent on the roster, it's hard to know if a given guy is a reason for that domination or simply a beneficiary of it.

Must not have been NFL talent evaluators because the dude didn't get picked until almost the 4th round. 

[bird_1972]

On 5/15/2022 at 7:26 PM, SkinsFTW said:

Must not have been NFL talent evaluators because the dude didn't get picked until almost the 4th round. 

 

True - but I had heard that might be more due to injury concerns than talent. Supposedly, he had a shoulder injury and had refused to get surgery on it.

[Forever A Redskin]

For those upset about the selection of Mathis and using the argument that it was a need we created by not resigning Settle/Matt. I think the likely reason they didn't re-sign is because of their roles here. If either player thought they'd have opportunities with another team for more playing time, it's a way more attractive option because it gives them the opportunity to earn more money down the line, even if it was the same price offered to stay here as a backup.

 

We ran into the same problem signing depth DEs last season, guys don't want to be stuck behind Chase and Sweat. That's why we traded for the extra 7ths to get the rights to draft backups Shaka Toney and WBK

 

This on top of not being able to pay all four of our 1st round DL talent made this a much bigger need than people make it out to be. It's actually very smart, Ravens-level draft strategy. You draft the guys before it becomes a need, not after.

 

 

[Koolblue13]

I wonder how Suh would fit in the rotation. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

Daron Payne gets it: playing at Alabama isn't the easiest thing in the world.

First, it's not as if Alabama opens its doors for every prospect that aspires to be a college football player. Being a perennial national championship contender tends to create a high standard. And then, if you're lucky enough to receive a scholarship, you need to have the patience to wait your turn behind a list of players who are projected to be NFL draft picks.

That was the case with Phidarian Mathis, the Washington Commanders' second-round pick, as he had to wait until his senior year to be a starter. Payne, who played with Mathis during his redshirt season in 2017, has watched from afar as Mathis worked to climb up the depth chart, and he couldn't be prouder of how far the rookie has come.

"I think he did exactly what he was supposed to do with his opportunity," Payne said on a Twitter Spaces segment hosted by the NFL ahead of the draft.

 

Mathis wasn't lacking for talent in his first three seasons with the Crimson Tide. He was the fourth-ranked defensive tackle and the No. 37 overall prospect at the high school level by ESPN. What's more, he played well when he got the snaps; he improved his tackle production every season, and in 2020 he recorded 31 tackles, three pass breakups, 1.5 sacks and a forced fumble.

The only issue was that he played part of a dominant defensive front that included Quinnen Williams (taken third overall in 2019) and Raekwon Davis (a second-round pick in 2020). Still, Payne appreciated how Mathis didn't let that hamper his work ethic.

"He stayed the course, kept chopping the wood, kept coming to work every day," Payne said. "And he finally got his time to shine."

 

Mathis was a team captain in his final season at Alabama and put together a career performance in 2021 with 53 tackles, two pass breakups and nine sacks.

"I knew what time it was," Mathis said after being drafted. "I knew it was time for me to step up. I finally had my chance to be a starter. I finally had my chance not to sit behind so many guys. There were so many guys that came through I had to sit behind. I had to wait my turn. So, it was finally my turn and I think I stepped up when it was time to step up and when they needed it the most."

 

It will be something of a reunion when Mathis, Allen and Payne are finally on the field again, but it's hardly the first time they've been in contact over the years. He considers Payne and Jonathan Allen, although he was drafted after Mathis joined the team, his "big bros."

It'll be a blessing, he said, to be able to play with them at the NFL level.

"I can't wait to get around those guys and just learn from them and also just come in and help them out."

Mathis will be playing behind Payne and Allen in the interior defensive line, but he's still expected to be a key contributor. Ron Rivera likes the unselfish attitude he brings to the position as well as his ability as a pass-rusher.

 

"One thing he did very well was he held the point of attack," Rivera said. "He absorbed the double teams, allowed the linebackers to run. He allowed them to run and be productive."

And Mathis is all in for doing whatever he can to help the defensive line succeed.

 

"I'm just going to take whatever comes to me and I'm going to go in, just do my job," Mathis said. "Whatever coach asks me, I'm doing it. So whatever my role is, that's what I'm coming to do. And I'm going to put my best foot forward no matter what."

Edited May 17, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

I listened to this on Galdi.  Scot likes Mathis motor, good run stuffer, with sneaky pass rushing upside

 

 

 

[SkinsFTW]

He's a Football Player, like Sua Cravens!!!

[Fresh8686]

Some cool insights, worth a watch 

 

 

[CommanderCarson]

Those are some great plays by Mathis. I really like our draft overall. I think it’s the best draft in the Rivera era.

[RWJ]

Glad we signed Mathis.  Something I find as a bit strange and I say a bit.  The rookie pool for signings in the draft is set to some degree.  Those in the know are better than I but it would seem that we should have signed Mathis and Butler by now.  They are the only two remaining picks to sign.  

[RandyHolt]

Nothing against the player at all but I am somehow stuck on meh with the pick. I feel like our "no name" front 7 did just as good as the big names the past 2 seasons. I remember seeing Smith-Williams getting an awful lot of snaps over Chase and I always thought Settle deserved more snaps. If a DC wants to play straight plain vanilla DL and depend on winning 1 on 1 matchups for sacks so be it, but I feel like stunts twists blitzes etc gets more bang for the buck ("lessor" players) which keeps the offense guessing far more while pressuring them into mistakes. I feel like for more than a decade teams could stunt on us and get a free man while we never had such luck, but also rarely ever tried. Rushing in our lanes patiently waiting 4 to beat 5 just didn't work out for us. And regardless if that is all wrong our DL was jack stacked and WOEFULLY under performed.

 

I am not convinced throwing even more picks at the problem we kinda created is the solution. Also, I prefer our top picks to be used on potential full time players, vs obvious rotational pieces all things equal.

Edited May 23, 2022 by RandyHolt

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

On 5/22/2022 at 11:15 AM, Fresh8686 said:

Some cool insights, worth a watch 

 

 

 

Benefits of All 22 and end zone camera angles.  The stuff they're saying we can't really see from normal TV sideline angle cutups.

[Going Commando]

On 5/23/2022 at 7:20 PM, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

Benefits of All 22 and end zone camera angles.  The stuff they're saying we can't really see from normal TV sideline angle cutups.

 

Yeah it's really hard to see some of the contact in the gaps.  Sometimes it looks like players will disappear after entering the mass of players at the line of scrimmage and it can be hard to pick them back up again after the play starts to separate again.  But most of that insight is pure expertise on technique and situation that comes from being at the top of your field for decades.  I'm a layman who spends a lot of time watching games and reading coaching blogs and forums for the youth level, but I'll never pick up on the kinds of advanced techniques that the players are using at the high college and NFL level unless someone from that level does a film breakdown where they demonstrate them.

 

That said, Rivera and Paulsen can convince me that Mathis is a great technician and an unselfish player who is a great fit for the scheme.  But they haven't convinced me that he'll be a great player as a whole because one of the things I can still get a feel for from broadcast angles is speed given that it is a relative trait.  And I think the thing that separates Mathis from the more talented IDLs like Allen and Payne is that he's kind of slow.  And that's the number one reason I saw so many close but no cigar plays in the Bama D cut ups.  He's diagnosing rapidly and playing with great technique but he just doesn't have an elite first few steps or range to finish the big play opportunities.

 

I'm also not convinced he's better than Nakobe Dean and I'm not sure anything other than a hindsight scenario where he has a better career than Dean will convince me of that.

[JSSkinz]

I listened to Logan Paulsen break down this pick shortly after the draft and he mentioned what he was hearing from the team ( I know he speaks with Ron, they do film breakdown together) is that every D lineman cant just rush the passer, someone has to do the dirty work and it really sounded like the team wanted a true nose.

 

My takeaway from Logan saying that was that its possible Payne isn't playing that role to the coaches liking, maybe that's why him and J Allen got into it last year.

 

Who knows but the logic kind of fits, how many times did we watch ourselves get gouged up the middle over the last few years, many say its our linebackers and I'm sure there's plenty of truth to that but spending a 2nd rd. pick on a D tackle IMO means the team wasn't looking for depth, they were looking for a new starter who fit a certain set of physical and mental skills they felt they were lacking.

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

23 hours ago, Going Commando said:

 

Yeah it's really hard to see some of the contact in the gaps.  Sometimes it looks like players will disappear after entering the mass of players at the line of scrimmage and it can be hard to pick them back up again after the play starts to separate again.  But most of that insight is pure expertise on technique and situation that comes from being at the top of your field for decades.  I'm a layman who spends a lot of time watching games and reading coaching blogs and forums for the youth level, but I'll never pick up on the kinds of advanced techniques that the players are using at the high college and NFL level unless someone from that level does a film breakdown where they demonstrate them.

 

That said, Rivera and Paulsen can convince me that Mathis is a great technician and an unselfish player who is a great fit for the scheme.  But they haven't convinced me that he'll be a great player as a whole because one of the things I can still get a feel for from broadcast angles is speed given that it is a relative trait.  And I think the thing that separates Mathis from the more talented IDLs like Allen and Payne is that he's kind of slow.  And that's the number one reason I saw so many close but no cigar plays in the Bama D cut ups.  He's diagnosing rapidly and playing with great technique but he just doesn't have an elite first few steps or range to finish the big play opportunities.

 

I'm also not convinced he's better than Nakobe Dean and I'm not sure anything other than a hindsight scenario where he has a better career than Dean will convince me of that.

 

With you for all of this.  I don't think he's a future star, but he's a 2nd rounder so thankfully that's not the expectation.  I still can't believe Dean fell to where he did.  His medicals must have really scared most teams off.  Not buying the narrative that he only played like he did because of the d-line, when his fellow LB went in the 1st round.

[Koolblue13]

I think Payne is capable of getting after the QB better than most people think and could be poised for an Allen style break out this season. He's shown flashes in the past, so we know it's there. Mathis should be as disruptive in doing his job as Payne is, or at least close enough and it should allow Payne to be 1 gap aggressor at times this year. It should also keep the snap counts down for Allen and keep all three fresh. I think that might be what we want to see out of Payne, before committing big money to him.

 

But it also looks like the best compensation that we could get for Payne is a conditional 4rth round pick and one year of play, so who knows.

[Skinsinparadise]

On 5/31/2022 at 9:19 AM, Koolblue13 said:

I think Payne is capable of getting after the QB better than most people think and could be poised for an Allen style break out this season. He's shown flashes in the past, so we know it's there. Mathis should be as disruptive in doing his job as Payne is, or at least close enough and it should allow Payne to be 1 gap aggressor at times this year. It should also keep the snap counts down for Allen and keep all three fresh. I think that might be what we want to see out of Payne, before committing big money to him.

 

But it also looks like the best compensation that we could get for Payne is a conditional 4rth round pick and one year of play, so who knows.

 

Payne can break out, I agree.  But as for Jonathan Allen, even though last was arguably his best season: 9 sacks -- it wasn't that novel for him.  He did also have a season with 8 sacks, too.   At Alabama his last two seasons: 12 and 10.5 sacks.

 

Payne has never been a sack guy in college or the pros and from my observation that isn't because he's just two gapping all the time and they don't let him cut loose to the QB.  He's cut loose plenty.  But I do agree he was better at bringing pressure last season compared to prior ones so maybe the sacks come.  IMHO for Payne to break out he needs to add another move beyond the bull rushes and swim moves.  And maybe they need to rest him more.  Because in the games I've watched back he can falter at points of the game.  Sometimes he looks unblockable and at times he looks very blockable as far as him pushing the pocket.  He is consistent against the run though, not elite on that front, he's not IMO Snacks or Vea but he's very good. 

 

Payne isn't much of a leader from what I've heard or observed when watching camp.  Quiet dude.  That's fine but its good to have some leader types, Mathis, seems to fit that profile more. Reading about him, he comes off a smart player-technician type which might put him more in the mold of Jonathan Allen.  It feels like he's a blend of Allen and Payne maybe closer to Payne in that I think he's a natural run stuffer who doesn't per se major in 2 gapping, playing nose, etc but can do it well when asked upon and can also play-3-5 and 1 gap, too.