Russian Invasion of Ukraine

[LD0506]

I put $50 on a Free Russia longshot bet in February @ 2500-1 that I'm kinda feeling good about right now.

[China]

Wagner chief sends blood-stained hammer to EU 'after prisoner was bludgeoned to death'

 

The head of the bloodthirsty Wagner mercenary group (PMC) has issued a chilling threat to the EU in the form of a sledgehammer covered in fake blood. Yevgeny Prigozhin's stunt comes after the European Parliament on Wednesday backed an initiative to designate the PMC as a terrorist organisation. The symbolically significant resolution passed in a 494-58 vote with 48 abstentions. In a threatening gesture, Prigozhin posted a video on Twitter showing the weapon with the Wagner symbol emblazoned on the top.

 

The video shows a violin case containing a sledgehammer with the inscription “PMC Wagner” on its head and fake blood stains on its handle.

 

 

The move is a nod to a video posted by the Wagner Group showing the killing of one of its defector with a sledgehammer.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[Wildbunny]

He really believes his company of thugs can take on full trained and fully equiped military soldiers?

 

They're struggling against Ukrainians forces that have been fighting for months and have no air support for their troops.

 

The guy should just shut up. They're a private company illegal in Russia. I'm pretty sure NATO could bomb their **** without Putin backing him off.

[PokerPacker]

16 hours ago, China said:

Wagner chief sends blood-stained hammer to EU 'after prisoner was bludgeoned to death'

 

The head of the bloodthirsty Wagner mercenary group (PMC) has issued a chilling threat to the EU in the form of a sledgehammer covered in fake blood. Yevgeny Prigozhin's stunt comes after the European Parliament on Wednesday backed an initiative to designate the PMC as a terrorist organisation. The symbolically significant resolution passed in a 494-58 vote with 48 abstentions. In a threatening gesture, Prigozhin posted a video on Twitter showing the weapon with the Wagner symbol emblazoned on the top.

 

The video shows a violin case containing a sledgehammer with the inscription “PMC Wagner” on its head and fake blood stains on its handle.

 

 

The move is a nod to a video posted by the Wagner Group showing the killing of one of its defector with a sledgehammer.

 

Click on the link for the full article

Great.  Now let's assassinate the terrorist ****.

[China]

 

[RansomthePasserby]

10 hours ago, Wildbunny said:

He really believes his company of thugs can take on full trained and fully equiped military soldiers?

 

They're struggling against Ukrainians forces that have been fighting for months and have no air support for their troops.

 

The guy should just shut up. They're a private company illegal in Russia. I'm pretty sure NATO could bomb their **** without Putin backing him off.

They must have a short memory. That already happened during the Battle of Kasham in Syria where Wagner made the foolish decision to attack a US military fortification. Putin let Wagner get decimated without any reprisal or support.

[CousinsCowgirl84]

Russians like to drop the f bombs an unnecessary amount of times…

[Wildbunny]

2 hours ago, RansomthePasserby said:

They must have a short memory. That already happened during the Battle of Kasham in Syria where Wagner made the foolish decision to attack a US military fortification. Putin let Wagner get decimated without any reprisal or support.

I know.

 

He also let Turkey shoot down two airplanes and be cool with it.

[LD0506]

I'll admit, I have been following this intensely since the beginning. This is a huge historical moment that might literally change the course of human history. It helps if you remember that catastrophic change can be catastrophic change for the better. There are multiple threads that are come together in this to forge something new, something none of us have experienced before. War is war, people die, innocents die, that ain't new in the least but war happening right in our laps, war being covered and recorded and broadcast in almost realtime to the entire world IS new. The technological imbalance of forces employed is staggering, arguably the greatest ever. Communication and information technology including immediate interactive commentary laterally, sideways people to people as opposed to top down, filtered and massaged by government interests is new. There is an awareness and engagement here that has never happened before. Brand new newness still NIB new. But what does it mean?

 

A lot of people are swept up in the day-to-day, geographical points, villages liberated, death counts, a kind of war pornography that might spark base interests but doesn't enlighten. What will this mean? What might this mean? Those are the questions that keep me and my circle occupied. 

 

Instead of just being World War Next could this actually end up being World War Last? Russia is the keystone of so much of the bull**** in the world, insurgencies and disinformation and narco wars and destabilization for its own sake, where might we be if this changed? And I mean we as in we the human race, not just we Americans. If this results in Russia cracking, caving in and opening itself to change, will the world seize the chance to help them into the modern world? What return could you see on a Marshall Plan level of engagement? Right off the bat it'd be a lot harder to justify $800billion/year on our military. China would be loathe to bring that level of **** down on themselves in some misbegotten Taiwan escapade. Europe is forging relationships that they have never had. And a generation is watching this, growing up with this and learning different things, forming different conclusions. It feel like we are on the cusp of something immense and unknowable but do we fall off the edge or finally learn to fly??

 

Stayed tuned

[The Sisko]

I understand why you might see a Russian breakup as potentially a good thing @LD0506. As you say, they have been involved in a lot of 💩 around the world. However, the Russian “Federation” is made up of a lot of different ethnic groups/republics, many of which hate each other or have expansionist ambitions. Without the Russians to keep order, many of them are going to go to war against each other with unpredictable results globally. At the very least, there are likely to be more disruptions to global energy supplies. Also, many of the republics are Islamic so more spreading of Islamic extremism is possible. Then there’s the issue of ethnic Russians living in these republics. I’m not sure at this point what I think of it, but I’m leaning toward a Russian breakup being more negative than positive. 

[LD0506]

6 minutes ago, The Sisko said:

I understand why you might see a Russian breakup as potentially a good thing @LD0506. As you say, they have been involved in a lot of 💩 around the world. However, the Russian “Federation” is made up of a lot of different ethnic groups/republics, many of which hate each other or have expansionist ambitions. Without the Russians to keep order, many of them are going to go to war against each other with unpredictable results globally. At the very least, there are likely to be more disruptions to global energy supplies. Also, many of the republics are Islamic so more spreading of Islamic extremism is possible. Then there’s the issue of ethnic Russians living in these republics. I’m not sure at this point what I think of it, but I’m leaning toward a Russian breakup being more negative than positive. 

 

Oh yeah, that's absolutely possible but at this point there is a glut of people predicting dire consequences, I'm taking a different tack. It would be in everyone's best interests to prevent that scenario and it's pretty obvious so maybe we can do better this time? A big part of their problem is exactly that, they are a polyglot collection of peoples but lorded over by "True" Russians that keep them in check, it's ****ing medieval. That just what I referred to, they all seriously need a hand to take a leap forward into the modern age. They're living in different centuries, different from us and different from each other. We don't need a Marshall Plan to rebuild war damage ala Germany, we need a Marshall Plan for their collective psyche to help them finally leave their cave and get over the shock of seeing sunlight. With the consciousness around the world of collective peril and the dawning awareness that it might actually be possible to build the future we want, drawing out Russia et. al. is an imperative. Keystone Boss Level ****. And I am more sure of the resilience of our race and the passion of youth than I am discouraged.

 

But it wouldn't be meaningful if it was easy. 

[Barry.Randolphe]

I'm perfectly fine with Russia having a civil war and being broken up into different ethnic sub-countries. Russia destabilizing and not able to spread their bull**** around the world anymore is a good thing. Couple that with Iran losing a trading partner and their ongoing revolt that hopefully will result in some meaningful regime change, that would be a major win for world peace. The rest of the world could then focus on China.

[LD0506]

Just now, Barry.Randolphe said:

I'm perfectly fine with Russia having a civil war and being broken up into different ethnic sub-countries. Russia destabilizing and not able to spread their bull**** around the world anymore is a good thing. Couple that with Iran losing a trading partner and their ongoing revolt that hopefully will result in some meaningful regime change, that would be a major win for world peace. The rest of the world could then focus on China.

 

Kinda shortsighted IMO. Versailles Treaty shortsighted. We need to look at the bigger picture and longer game. We don't need our grandchildren reenacting this horse**** decades from now. 

 

History is mean, bitterly mean but history does have a sense of humor and a sense of honor. We might be on the verge of one of those rare once-in-a-century opportunities to take the wheel and steer instead of just bouncing around in the back as the whole thing careens into a ditch again.

[DCSaints_fan]

If Russia breaks apart it will just attempt to recreate itself again.  This has been a pretty consistent theme throughout history.

[Wildbunny]

1 hour ago, LD0506 said:

 

Kinda shortsighted IMO. Versailles Treaty shortsighted. We need to look at the bigger picture and longer game. We don't need our grandchildren reenacting this horse**** decades from now. 

 

History is mean, bitterly mean but history does have a sense of humor and a sense of honor. We might be on the verge of one of those rare once-in-a-century opportunities to take the wheel and steer instead of just bouncing around in the back as the whole thing careens into a ditch again.

We're gonna need better leaders them. Some that are up to the challenge and will rise to the History in the making.

We don't have such kind of leaders in Europe right now. See A. Merkel latests talk about Germany/Russia relationship from yesterday, that's quite disappointing. Many are clearly ok with a country being destroyed as long as they can make good busines with the attacker.

I'm not.

 

For sure we have to look at the bigger picture, but our leaders are not looking at it right now and are quite shortsighted. Are we as westerned ok to deal with it and end it once for good? I really doubt it. Fighting for it would be going at war, having our people die and take what it takes to win it.

 

We clearly aren't up to it. Mainly because we're playing scared. Despise war ongoing nearby, Europe still seems to have not gotten it and get ready for war.

 

That's the main problem I do have with Democracy as it haven't learned to defend itself so far. We need armies to defend ourselves, and not wait for the US to do it for us.

 

1 hour ago, DCSaints_fan said:

If Russia breaks apart it will just attempt to recreate itself again.  This has been a pretty consistent theme throughout history.

I don't have mich problem with Russians, but I do have one with autoritarians countries like Russia or China. If you crumble their politicial systems to ashes, you just don't know what will happen next. Having the Russian federation to keep in order such a huge part of the world is important. But could you have that kind of order without the autoritarian regime they do have now? I don't know, but I'm not sure.

 

Still so many of those ethnies wouldn't be viable by themselves economically and politically speaking, so they also need Russia to protect themselves.

 

2 hours ago, Barry.Randolphe said:

I'm perfectly fine with Russia having a civil war and being broken up into different ethnic sub-countries. Russia destabilizing and not able to spread their bull**** around the world anymore is a good thing. Couple that with Iran losing a trading partner and their ongoing revolt that hopefully will result in some meaningful regime change, that would be a major win for world peace. The rest of the world could then focus on China.

People in Iran did revolt against their old regime to put Khomeiny and the theocracy in place. Khomeiny used to hide in France before being Iran leader against US.

Iran has been a complete mess for more than a century. This whole region has been a complete mess since the fall of the Persian Empire.

[Larry]

If we manage to cripple Russia?  My money would be that in 10 years half their economy will be selling natural resources to China. At prices set by China. 
 

And what do you think are the odds that China lets Russia climb back out of that hole?  
 

Now, the bad news about that?  It likely results in a stronger, more dangerous, China. 
 

 

Edited November 26, 2022 by Larry

[Riggo-toni]

China has both a demographic and a debt bombshell. Xi has ruined his country's future, though not nearly as badly as what Putin is doing to Russia. Also, the oil that Russia can sell to China comes from Siberian oil fields, which neither Russia nor China know how to maintain. As the machinery breaks down, more and more  will be gone forever. And given China's debts, they won't front the $$$ to build a new pipeline from the Caspian or elsewhere. Russia will be the new Venezuela, but at least they'll have enough homegrown food supply to avoid starving.

[LD0506]

I love the conversations that happen here

Well done people 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

3 hours ago, Larry said:

If we manage to cripple Russia?  My money would be that in 10 years half their economy will be selling natural resources to China. At prices set by China. 
 

And what do you think are the odds that China lets Russia climb back out of that hole?  
 

Now, the bad news about that?  It likely results in a stronger, more dangerous, China. 
 

 

The problem is a feel like China has an interest in  keeping Russia a world power aligned with them. If not Russia, who else?

[RansomthePasserby]

China has about a decade max before their debt and demographic issues catch up with them. While seizing Russian natural resources in the aftermath of a collapse would give them some additional power, managing a crumbling Russia on their border will be more of a detriment than a opportunity. Especially with Russian oil becoming less and less valuable as the world moves away from fossil fuels over the next few decades. 

[LD0506]

Why Russia’s strategic defeat is in the cards

 

https://thehill.com/opinion/international/3699640-why-russias-strategic-defeat-is-in-the-cards/

 

[Larry]

Euronews: Thousands of children have been deported from Ukraine, report authorities in Kyiv 

 

Quote

 

According to the Institute for the Study of War (ISW), Russian occupation officials and forces are intensifying filtration measures in Russian-occupied territories in Ukraine. 

The US-based think-tank also reports that Russian officials are deporting children from occupied areas of Ukraine to Russia. 
 

Russia-installed authorities in the so-called Luhansk People’s Republic claimed that they sent Ukrainian children from this region to the region of Krasnodar in Russia

 

 

Fog of war. Propaganda happens. I hope that's what this is.

 

[TradeTheBeal!]

This is fine.

 

 

[China]

Surgeons work by flashlight as Ukraine power grid battered

 

Dr. Oleh Duda was in the middle of a particularly complicated surgery at a hospital in Lviv, Ukraine, when he heard explosions nearby. Moments later, the lights went out.

 

Duda had no choice but to keep working with only a headlamp for light. The lights came back when a generator kicked in three minutes later, but it felt like an eternity.

 

“These fateful minutes could have cost the patient his life,” the cancer surgeon told The Associated Press.

 

The operation on the patient’s major artery took place Nov. 15, when the city in western Ukraine suffered blackouts as Russia unleashed yet another missile barrage on the power grid, damaging nearly 50% of the country’s energy facilities.

 

The devastating strikes, which continued last week and plunged the country into darkness once again, strained and disrupted the health care system, already battered by years of corruption, mismanagement, the COVID-19 pandemic and nine months of war.

 

Scheduled operations are being postponed; patient records are unavailable because of internet outages; and paramedics have had to use flashlights to examine patients in darkened apartments.

 

Click on the link for the full article

[China]

European Commission preparing to deliver to Ukraine 200 medium-sized transformers, two autotransformers, 40 heavy generators

 

The European Commission, through the EU's Emergency Response Coordination Centre, is preparing the emergency support Ukraine needs to restore and maintain power and heating for the civilian population.

 

According to the EU Delegation to Ukraine, these are 200 medium-sized transformers and a large autotransformer from Lithuania, a medium-sized autotransformer from Latvia and 40 heavy generators from the rescEU reserve located in Romania.

 

In particular, each of these generators can provide uninterrupted power to a small to medium sized hospital.

 

The European Commission is additionally working on a new energy rescEU hub in Poland to allow donations from third parties and help with their delivery to Ukraine in a coordinated fashion, particularly with our G7 partners.

 

Click on the link for the full article

 

Glad to see somebody's on top of things and helping out in this regard.