The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Voice_of_Reason]

5 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Until we know the team is sold, we can’t speculate when they get approved.  My guess BOA is now trying to get the initial group of bidders that remain to increase their bid and If Bezos is bidding, to top them. Can this be in 3 weeks from Sunday when the SuperBowl is?

So this is definitely the negotiation period, and the IBank is doing everything it possibly can to create competition and drive up the price.  

 

Something to keep in mind, the first round of bids for an NFL franchise is somewhat perfunctury.  I don't think Walmart was part of the first round of bidders for the Broncos, but here we are.  A lot of times, after the first round, that sets the floor, and then there are groups which combine, some that bow out, and then others which emerge.

 

Remember WAY back there was a story Bezos and his group were going to submit a bid in mid-January?  That came out in either late November or early December.  Bezos had absolutely no interest in being part of round 1 from the very beginning. And he didn't just telegraph that, he leaked it so it would be reported.  

 

The question of can this be done in 3 weeks ...  Maybe?  It wouldn't be unusual for the time between round 1 and round 2 to be about a month.  

 

Also, the NFL REALLY wants this put to bed by the time the new league year starts.  For a million reasons.  They will "help" the process along as much as they can.  However, note: they are NOT the ones driving the process.  That's Dan and BofA.  If they want to drag their feet, they can.  And the NFL can't do much about it.  

 

However, I think Dan would be motivated to move this along as quickly as possible because sellers typically want a fast close.   They get their money sooner and have to incur less expenses.  

 

5 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

 

I think Jason Wright is gone and the owner installs his president immediately. He will probably have a Gm type person assist with the draft but I think the permanent Gm doesn’t get hired until summer, after the draft.

I actually very much doubt this.  I think the league loves Jason Wright, and I think the NFL will convince the new owner to keep him on at least through the 2023 season, and then make a change if they want to.  It will help transition, and Wright only works on the business side.  I do think there would be significant changes throughout the staff, but I could see Wright staying for about a year.

 

If the owner has a new GM type it would be somebody out of football now.  Because FO contracts run through the draft, and there are both written and unwritten rules about switching before the draft. Not saying there won't be a new person inserted, but it won't be somebody who's currently employed.  I think the most likely scenario is everything stays pat until after the draft, and then you start to see some changes made.  Because that's basically what happens.  

 

5 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Dan isn’t going to spend a dime; so the team spending will be on a strict budget. Once the new owner takes over, spending will be resumed. How far into free agency remains to be seen, but likely are sitting out early free agency. We may not be able to franchise Payne. Have to wait and see.

The team HAS to spend to the minimum by the CBA, and there are "normal course of business" type of things which have to continue to occur during any sale process. 

 

I agree they won't go out and spend $150m guaranteed on a QB.  But they absolutely could sign a couple new OL and a LB to moderate deals.  Remember, they have to spend to the cap.  Keep this in mind also: Dan won't have to actually SPEND any of the cash except for signing bonuses and putting guaranteed money in escrow.

 

Signing bonuses will be a decrease in cash.  But because of the CBA and revenue sharing, some of that is expected.  

 

Guaranteed to escrow is NOT a decrease in cash, it's just moving between account.  The new owner acquires the escrow account. It's kindof irrelevant in the accounting.  

 

I don't think franchising Payne will be a problem financially.  They won't pay the money until the season starts.  They transfer the cash to escrow, eh, Dan won't care.  It's still cash. 

 

5 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

I think lame duck Ron won’t get an oc of any note. They May interview the but highly doubtful they take it, if offered.

I poste in the OC thread, no OC with any other options will come here.  

 

5 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Ron will be on a prove it year. A playoff win at minimum, is what he needs to do.

Yeah, I don't think a new owner would fire Ron after making the playoffs.  But I think there's no question Ron would have to make the playoffs.

 

The deck is somewhat stacked against him, though.  He's going to get a "meh" OC, probably be forced to ride with Howell whether he really wants to or not, and they can't make the "big splash" in FA.  A couple OL and LB and CB depth is probably where they are at in FA.  

[Warhead36]

I don't know what to think about Jason Wright. He's a bright guy, well educated, but man there was mistake after mistake so far during his tenure. On the flip side, how much of that is on him? I feel like its still mostly just the Snyders messing things up and Wright is just paid a lot of money to be the public face and own the mistakes. 

 

Ultimately he has nothing to do with the actual football operations so I really couldn't care less if he stays or goes. 

[dunfer]

Just now, Warhead36 said:

I don't know what to think about Jason Wright. He's a bright guy, well educated, but man there was mistake after mistake so far during his tenure. On the flip side, how much of that is on him? I feel like its still mostly just the Snyders messing things up and Wright is just paid a lot of money to be the public face and own the mistakes. 

 

Ultimately he has nothing to do with the actual football operations so I really couldn't care less if he stays or goes. 

Based on the Sean stuff, either wright is working on a shoestring budget or off the field personnel is still in working from home covid pajamas

[Skinsinparadise]

Intangibles at the QB spot.  Not always easy to ferret it out in advance of the draft.  

 

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

I am good with riding with Howell.  But curious about what else is out there.    Based on this tweet, I gather Tannehill might hit the market

 

 

 

[dunfer]

Any vet we would be at all excited to bring in, would cost more than theyre worth... That tweet says to me  "start the bidding"

 

The only exception to the rule is if Brady wanted to do something for free for his country

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

23 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I am good with riding with Howell.  But curious about what else is out there.    Based on this tweet, I gather Tannehill might hit the market

 

 

 

 

Pass on Tannehill. He had a surprise season in 2019 with Tennessee, then he rode behind a all-time great rushing attack in 2020. But 2021 and 2022 are back to more of what we knew about Tannehill. He's going to be 35. The aging and declining veteran is not something we should do. Especially when Tannehill is likely going to command more in FA than he'd likely be worth. His cap hit in 2022 was 38.6m, and 2023 is projected to be 36.6m. The way his level of play has been going as he's aging, along with Derrick Henry being a productive workhorse, means his cap would be too high even at 1/3rd of what he's currently supposed to make.

[Skinsinparadise]

5 minutes ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

Pass on Tannehill. He had a surprise season in 2019 with Tennessee, then he rode behind a all-time great rushing attack in 2020. But 2021 and 2022 are back to more of what we knew about Tannehill. He's going to be 35. The aging and declining veteran is not something we should do. Especially when Tannehill is likely going to command more in FA than he'd likely be worth. His cap hit in 2022 was 38.6m, and 2023 is projected to be 36.6m. The way his level of play has been going as he's aging, along with Derrick Henry being a productive workhorse, means his cap would be too high even at 1/3rd of what he's currently supposed to make.

 

For me, as I said I am not pushing Tannehill.  Just saying looks like there is a decent chance he's going to be in that pool of veteran QBs out there.  

Edited January 21, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

9 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

For me, as I said I am not pushing Tannehill.  Just saying looks like there is a decent chance he's going to be in that pool of veteran QBs out there.  

 

Oh for sure. I swear it seems like every year there's an abnormal amount of movement in the QB market. Lots of long term starters are on the move...again.

[NoCalMike]

I am not keen in not going with Howell for 2023 unless they manage to sign or trade for an elite QB.  I don't think a mid tier vet should come in and contribute to kicking the can down the road another season.

 

We have a young mobile QB w/an arm, so bring in an O-coordinator that has a track record working with that style QB, let Howell develop behind a revamped O-line in 2023 then after next season you should have a good idea of how high Howell's ceiling can potentially be going into the that offseason where the new ownership has sat back and quiet their first year and are ready to put their imprint on the team. 

[Command The 414]

3 hours ago, NoCalMike said:

I am not keen in not going with Howell for 2023 unless they manage to sign or trade for an elite QB.  I don't think a mid tier vet should come in and contribute to kicking the can down the road another season.

 

We have a young mobile QB w/an arm, so bring in an O-coordinator that has a track record working with that style QB, let Howell develop behind a revamped O-line in 2023 then after next season you should have a good idea of how high Howell's ceiling can potentially be going into the that offseason where the new ownership has sat back and quiet their first year and are ready to put their imprint on the team. 

I totally agree, all these other teams go with their young QB's why shouldn't we, sometimes the thing we look for the most has been or is right under our noses.....I definitely don't want any mid level QB...Tannehill, Marcus Marottia, Mayfield etc....for what the cost and effect will be we got that in Howell imho.

[Darrell Green Fan]

On 1/18/2023 at 11:48 PM, Jumbo said:

 

 

I'd add my own van that I live in down by the river.

 

For fun I spent a lot of time researching buying an older van and converting it into a camper.  Seniors in retirement do this so they can save money on travel.  Stores such as Walmart lets you stay overnight for free.

 

Then my wife informed me that she has no intentions of spending her retirement years sleeping in a van in a Walmart parking lot.  All in all not an unreasonable position to take.  

[KDawg]

Tannehill is a non-starter conversation for me. He’s Alex Smith light. 

[Darrell Green Fan]

12 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Tannehill is a non-starter conversation for me. He’s Alex Smith light. 

Well it's got to be someone.  And Marcus Mariotta is IMO a far worse choice.  

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Darrell Green Fan said:

Well it's got to be someone.  And Marcus Mariotta is IMO a far worse choice.  

Mariota isn’t even a choice in my eyes.

[Darrell Green Fan]

8 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Mariota isn’t even a choice in my eyes.

Neither is Trubiski for me.  So who are we talking about and what do you think the cost will be?  

[GoDeep81]

Just go with Howell.. These older vets will do nothing but screw up a chance at drafting a top QB and cost a ton of money. We need to take our medicine and see what happens. 

[Wyvern]

42 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Tannehill is a non-starter conversation for me. He’s Alex Smith light. 

First of all, I'm a little conflicted about challenging a statement from a great ES'er who has produced so many posts on which I've posted "likes" and "thumbs-up."

 

That said, I'm kind of surprised by this comment, unless KDawg was worried that Tannehill will be too expensive, for the interim Commanders FO to sign up.

 

IMHO, Tannehill would be a decent 'transition' QB -- Someone  comfortable with a 'run first' offense but with a decent arm, while most importantly, a great veteran mentor (with unique insights on the QB-to-WR connection) for Washington's QB-1 in waiting (likely, Sam Howell, or some other 2023 draftee QB.) But Tannehill, and his new contract would need to reflect that understanding.  ... And I'm not even Tannehill is even mentally ready for that, much less willing to sign on to the chaos this Washington franchise has become, without guaranteed mega-bucks.  😕

 

Bottom Line :  I'm staying medium on the chances of Howell fully ascending to the level of Washington's long-awaited "franchise-QB" in 2023 and believe some kind of mentorship and bridge might be needed, at least for the 2023 season.  If Howell proves to be the "answer" -- it's probably in 2024, and Washington needs to avoid subjecting  Sam to the David Carr treatment.  Moreover, I'd rather have a veteran QB absorb the pains of the team learning a new offensive strategy -- while Howell absorbs the lessons learned.

 

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by Wyvern

[FootballZombie]

I can see some pros and cons to pulling in a guy like Tanny.

 

He is getting up there in age, so he does not feel like much of a long term solution even if the move works out. Plus he is like the definition of an average QB, and honestly that is kinda debatable at this point. He is more accurate that either of the guys we had this season, but I'd still only see him as a fit if we plan on running that run-heavy O direction.

 

Then there is the contract situation. I can't imagine Tanny costing a team the world, which is a major plus, and I also don't see a team offering him a deal that ties him to the hip of an org for more than two years, if even that. If he signs a 3 or 4 year deal, it will be structured w/ easy exits due to his age.

 

But there in-lays the rub, I do see bringing him in as a decent situation for Howell. Tanny represents that competition Vet that could win the job, meaning Howell has to earn that week 1 starting job, and even if Tanny wins it, your looking at a situation due to age where Howell will be givien the oppo to supplant him at some point. Bringing in Tanny would not limit the oppo for Howell in a way lets say... a Mayfield potentially could.

 

In terms of Howell getting a shot, Tanny is probably one of the better "competition quality" vets we could bring in, and I phrase CQ vets as guys who have a legitimate shot to be QB1 if brought in, not guys who have been perennial backups.

[El Mexican]

Ahhh just go with Howell and keep TH as a backup.

 

Draft another QB in the mid-rounds of this year's lottery and boom! Bob's your uncle.

 

 

[KDawg]

17 minutes ago, Wyvern said:

First of all, I'm a little conflicted about challenging a statement from a great ES'er who has produced so many posts on which I've posted "likes" and "thumbs-up."

 

That said, I'm kind of surprised by this comment, unless KDawg was worried that Tannehill will be too expensive, for the interim Commanders FO to sign up.

 

IMHO, Tannehill would be a decent 'transition' QB -- Someone  comfortable with a 'run first' offense but with a decent arm, while most importantly, a great veteran mentor (with unique insights on the QB-to-WR connection) for Washington's QB-1 in waiting (likely, Sam Howell, or some other 2023 draftee QB.) But Tannehill, and his new contract would need to reflect that understanding.  ... And I'm not even Tannehill is even mentally ready for that, much less willing to sign on to the chaos this Washington franchise has become, without guaranteed mega-bucks.  😕

 

Bottom Line :  I'm staying medium on the chances of Howell fully ascending to the level of Washington's long-awaited "franchise-QB" in 2023 and believe some kind of mentorship and bridge might be needed, at least for the 2023 season.  If Howell proves to be the "answer" -- it's probably in 2024, and Washington needs to avoid subjecting  Sam to the David Carr treatment.  Moreover, I'd rather have a veteran QB absorb the pains of the team learning a new offensive strategy -- while Howell absorbs the lessons learned.

 

 

Cost.

 

And I don’t want a bridge QB. Howell should be starting for us. If we need a backup take a mid tier guy who is a career backup type that can run the system and challenge/push. But I want nothing to do with a guy who thinks they are a starter. 
 

I’d rather draft a guy. If we are on a budget I don’t want to blow it on Ryan Tannehill. Immediately setting up Howell to fail.

[Darrell Green Fan]

I don't think TH will be back, his value was he knew Turner's system and he would create a distraction.  But they are not going into a season with only Sam Howell and another late draft pick. They will have to sign a vet as a fall back and just as importantly a mentor to Howell.  

[NickyJ]

Tannehill is washed up, and in his prime he wasn't all that great. He's worse than Alex Smith to me, at least Alex scrambled. Tannehill is a statue. He has one of the most prolific runningbacks in NFL history to carry him on his shoulders and could only put up 2 good seasons. I want nothing to do with him.

[88Comrade2000]

I don’t buy Ron going into the season with Sam as the starter. He will sign some lower tier qb, with the expectation of going into the season with them as opening day starter. If Sam is the opening day starter; he clearly won the training camp battle.

 

Sam would have to show you enough in 23, for us to feel we can build around him and not use a first round pick on qb.

[Andre The Giant]