spjunkies Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 5 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: How do we feel about the EO allowing genetic males to compete against genetic females in athletics? I don't like it...doesn't seem fair at all to me. I don't care. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 8 minutes ago, spjunkies said: I don't care. OK, then why comment? hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: OK, then why comment? hahaha Because you asked 🤦♂️ 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just now, spjunkies said: Because you asked 🤦♂️ Fair enough...I guess I should have been more specific. Anyone who actually cares one way or the other on this issue...what are your thoughts on the EO allowing men to compete against women? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 I care more about things like this, I'd rather the country not create a bunch of trump Youth. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, spjunkies said: I care more about things like this, I'd rather the country not create a bunch of trump Youth. That's fine. I didn't mean to imply that the transgender athletics should be at the top of anyone's list. It's just something that hasn't been discussed nearly as much as some of the more mainstream issues. This seemed like the right thread for it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spjunkies Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just now, TD_washingtonredskins said: That's fine. I didn't mean to imply that the transgender athletics should be at the top of anyone's list. It's just something that hasn't been discussed nearly as much as some of the more mainstream issues. This seemed like the right thread for it. Don't get me wrong this is definitely the right thread for the discussion. I just personally don't mind them competing together, people are entitled to disagree though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, spjunkies said: Don't get me wrong this is definitely the right thread for the discussion. I just personally don't mind them competing together, people are entitled to disagree though I think it's a horrible precedent. I don't personally care if a genetic man wants to identify as a woman. But I don't see why we have to ignore all the genetic differences in those cases. Can I identify as a woman and then start a woman-owned small business to get those perks/set-asides? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabbyrwock Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 minute ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: I think it's a horrible precedent. I don't personally care if a genetic man wants to identify as a woman. But I don't see why we have to ignore all the genetic differences in those cases. Can I identify as a woman and then start a woman-owned small business to get those perks/set-asides? I understand what you are saying, but I'm perfectly happy to live with the response "I don't know" on how I feel about it right now. Like for most civil rights issues, I suspect once the rights have been extended the doomsayers will find little support for their arguments about why rights shouldn't be extended. But again, I'm happy to wait and see. Maybe you are right...who knows? Lets find out and keep an open mind...maybe some fiddling is necessary to get it to work without suppressing peoples rights, but we won't know until we try. Also...I just want to point out how much I hate the phrase "rights being extended" as if that person didn't have the rights already and we generously award them it...I just don't know what the appropriate alternative verbiage is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 The actual text of the EO. Section 1. Policy. Every person should be treated with respect and dignity and should be able to live without fear, no matter who they are or whom they love. Children should be able to learn without worrying about whether they will be denied access to the restroom, the locker room, or school sports. Adults should be able to earn a living and pursue a vocation knowing that they will not be fired, demoted, or mistreated because of whom they go home to or because how they dress does not conform to sex-based stereotypes. People should be able to access healthcare and secure a roof over their heads without being subjected to sex discrimination. All persons should receive equal treatment under the law, no matter their gender identity or sexual orientation. These principles are reflected in the Constitution, which promises equal protection of the laws. These principles are also enshrined in our Nation’s anti-discrimination laws, among them Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, as amended (42 U.S.C. 2000e et seq.). In Bostock v. Clayton County, 590 U.S. ___ (2020), the Supreme Court held that Title VII’s prohibition on discrimination “because of . . . sex” covers discrimination on the basis of gender identity and sexual orientation. Under Bostock‘s reasoning, laws that prohibit sex discrimination — including Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, as amended (20 U.S.C. 1681 et seq.), the Fair Housing Act, as amended (42 U.S.C. 3601 et seq.), and section 412 of the Immigration and Nationality Act, as amended (8 U.S.C. 1522), along with their respective implementing regulations — prohibit discrimination on the basis of gender identity or sexual orientation, so long as the laws do not contain sufficient indications to the contrary. Discrimination on the basis of gender identity or sexual orientation manifests differently for different individuals, and it often overlaps with other forms of prohibited discrimination, including discrimination on the basis of race or disability. For example, transgender Black Americans face unconscionably high levels of workplace discrimination, homelessness, and violence, including fatal violence. It is the policy of my Administration to prevent and combat discrimination on the basis of gender identity or sexual orientation, and to fully enforce Title VII and other laws that prohibit discrimination on the basis of gender identity or sexual orientation. It is also the policy of my Administration to address overlapping forms of discrimination. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Also, this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabbyrwock Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: The actual text of the EO. In the spirit of "teaching a man to fish": Recent: https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/ Historical: https://www.federalregister.gov/presidential-documents/executive-orders 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergasun Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 I am ready to give the dreamers citizenship tommorrow. I don't even think Democrats should bother negotiating anything with the GOP. I see there is some type of 8-year plan. That is too long for the Dreamers. 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) I'm against the policy of allowing born men competing with born women and the opposite as well. This meme says it all for me. Plus it erases Title IX protections for females and erases the class of female. Edited January 21, 2021 by LadySkinsFan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 This didn't take long, FB post from a hardcore Trumper... Quote On his first day of office, Joe Biden overtook the position of 'worst president in history' from former President Barrack Obama. He signed executive orders that effectively ended border security, reversed the travel ban between known Middle East terror states and the US, rejoined the wasteful Paris Climate Accord(under Trump, the US outperformed all member nations in reducing carbon emissions), recommited funding to the pro eugenics and de-population centered WHO, signaled his war on energy by canceling the Keystone Pipeline permit, rescinded Trump's 1776 Commission which sought to preserve American history while bolstering the lefts commitment to push the divisive narrative of Critical Race Theory. Get used to it snowflakes. Myself and all the other 'Patriots' are here to remind you on a nearly daily basis just how horrible your Commander-in-Cheat, Jim Crow Joe truly is. Feel the unity 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 9 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said: I'm against the policy of allowing born men competing with born women and the opposite as well. This meme says it all for me. Plus it erases Title IX protections for females and erases the class of female. I'm against it, too. If you're transitioning from a male to a female, you still benefit from having a lifetime of testosterone running through your body. Probably more muscle mass than a born woman. Different skeleton system. That said, this picture makes me laugh. It looks like she's competing against middle-schoolers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 41 minutes ago, LadySkinsFan said: This meme says it all for me. I understand the sensitivity of the topic, but the topic deserves better than cherry-picked data and a misleading photo as being representative of the entire topic. That university, (FPU) later stated: "FPU has further agreed that it "will take such measures as are necessary to ensure that female athletes are provided intercollegiate athletic opportunities and benefits that are equal to those provided to male students".... and it will not permit athletes of one sex to participate in sports of the other sex except in the narrow circumstances permitted under Title IX implementation regulations." NCAA did need better regulations and enforcement related to HT and testosterone levels. I'm not sure if they have improved their policy. Ross Tucker (and Joanna Harper) are worth reading on the topic. https://sportsscientists.com/2019/03/on-transgender-athletes-and-performance-advantages/ https://www.kinesophy.com/joanna-harper-on-the-performance-of-transgender-athletes/ Edited January 21, 2021 by Corcaigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Thanks for that post and the links. I'm going to read them fully when I can. But I guess I still struggle to understand the motive for wanting to compete against the opposite gender? I understand if someone identifies as a female, but they also must comprehend that they are genetically different, right? So how is that any different than me saying I identify as a grade-schooler and going all Billy Madison in rec league basketball? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: Can I identify as a woman and then start a woman-owned small business to get those perks/set-asides? Do you want permission? I can’t speak for everyone but you certainly have mine. What does that open up for you? 😜 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 2 hours ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: Anyone who actually cares one way or the other on this issue...what are your thoughts on the EO allowing men to compete against women? Is that what the EO says? 9 minutes ago, Die Hard said: Do you want permission? I can’t speak for everyone but you certainly have mine. What does that open up for you? 😜 For your business to be certified as woman-owned you have to submit official government ID documentation, such as birth certificate, passport, drivers license etc. I love the idea that a trans person would choose to live as they are to get an advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinny21 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Gotta love the Tailgate. Hundreds of thousands dead, major concerns about employment, evictions, small businesses dying, healthcare and education attacked relentlessly by the Right, we abandoned allies, were hacked by Russia to an astounding degree, climate change threatens the globe, we’re in the middle of a war on facts and expertise, are caging people, just went through an insurrection attempt, white supremacy is on the rise and has infiltrated government, police and the military, guns are killing students, infrastructure is crumbling, authoritarianism is on the rise, Russia continues it’s invasion of Ukraine, and on and on... but boys identifying as female might win some trophies! It’s a step up from tan suits, to be sure, but I hope we keep our eyes on the prize - namely, holding onto our democracy, securing the safety and livelihood of our citizens, and not leaving devastation for our kids and grandkids. To the issue at hand though, it sounds awfully similar to the “welfare queens” argument. Personally, I think attempting to not have trans people treated as 2nd or 3rd class citizens outweighs sporting equity. With that said, it seems plain to me that localities need to be the ones legislating who trans people compete against, while the EO focuses on recognizing the 14th amendment rights of transgender individuals. Just my opinion of course. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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