Momma There Goes That Man Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Yeah it does a real disservice to TS people to just think people are waking up and saying “think I’ll be a girl today so I can easily win” and everybody just immediately lets that person sign up and start playing. It makes any argument of “well what if I just say I identify as a kid, guess I’ll go win some little league titles” completely ridiculous there is a discussion to be had regarding the equality of the sports competition (and nobody mentions F->M transitions that contain an unfair advantage) but that discussion has to have an entirely different framing than what is often what takes place as we kick around “well what if I” followed by some ludicrous hypothetical scenario 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 @skinny21 I also love the notion that in a forum of dozens of threads, if you dare discuss an issue that isn't the Covid-19 death count or how our democracy is magically saved with Biden taking office, then you're mocked. If this issue itself isn't important or interesting to you, feel free not to comment. It's fine. 26 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said: Yeah it does a real disservice to TS people to just think people are waking up and saying “think I’ll be a girl today so I can easily win” and everybody just immediately lets that person sign up and start playing. It makes any argument of “well what if I just say I identify as a kid, guess I’ll go win some little league titles” completely ridiculous there is a discussion to be had regarding the equality of the sports competition (and nobody mentions F->M transitions that contain an unfair advantage) but that discussion has to have an entirely different framing than what is often what takes place as we kick around “well what if I” followed by some ludicrous hypothetical scenario Thanks for responding and I see your point. Having said that, I guess I'll re-phrase one of my hypotheticals. Does a man who identifies as a woman have business ownership protections also? Maybe I need to better understand the psychology behind self identification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) To be honest, I agree that all persons have the same rights stated in our Constitution. What I don't agree with is that persons who can never change their DNA can declare that they are the opposite of their born sex. They can identify as trans. The problem is that females have fought for their rights for centuries, even our Title IX protections for females, is now undermined to include born males. This undermine the class of females and what it means to be female. You men may not feel that this is a big deal, but it is. The trans agenda currently is changing language that denotes female/male born sex characteristics. If you read about some of these changes it's completely oriented to obliterating female language. For example, front hole now takes the place of vulva and neovagina takes the place of vagina. Vagina is a female bodily organ, not just a passage for a penis or penis-like object. Penis is being called a variety of things such as the offensive ladydick. So rights for everyone yes, obscuring or deleting rights for 50% of the population no. As far as waking up and saying you're the opposite sex, there was a guy on the internet who identified as a woman until he found out that he wasn't being paid what he wanted as a wedding photographer because he identified as female so he conveniently went back to being male for that. So yeah, situational identification. And then we females are supposed to recognize these males as women and then we're supposed to accept them as Lesbians for sex, penis and all. Um, no to that! Edited January 21, 2021 by LadySkinsFan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 ok... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Die Hard Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, Corcaigh said: For your business to be certified as woman-owned you have to submit official government ID documentation, such as birth certificate, passport, drivers license etc. I love the idea that a trans person would choose to live as they are to get an advantage. It's freaking hilarious isn't it?!?! LMAO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) Republicans are transparent AF: “If you don’t do exactly what I want you are creating a deeper divide and you are against unity.” edit: **** all of them Edited January 21, 2021 by Hersh 5 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 20 minutes ago, Die Hard said: It's freaking hilarious isn't it?!?! LMAO I'm not claiming someone would pretend, I used that as an example to illustrate the point. I'm curious/confused where people think the line is for someone who identifies as a woman (despite biologically being a man)? Does someone who identifies as a woman get all the same privileges and treatments? Locker rooms? Bathrooms? Sororities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sisko Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: @skinny21 I also love the notion that in a forum of dozens of threads, if you dare discuss an issue that isn't the Covid-19 death count... COVID? What's that? Oh right, that's it. It's that thing we forgot about after the election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Just want to go on record, that mocking and attacking folks not fully aligned with the liberal platform plays into why folks don't buy into the democratic platform. In a way I get it, we're coming out of a horrendous 4 years and folks want to relish in the moment for a while. But it's not a good look to denounce anyone that questions the platform and then wonder why the lunatic almost got re-elected. I hate Trump and the GOP that sucks his toes as much as anyone and I understand that nit-picking pieces of policy at time like this, seems petty and on-brand for the opposition. But I'd be lying if I said that I can't see why it deters a certain faction away from the democrats. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, LadySkinsFan said: The problem is that females have fought for their rights for centuries, even our Title IX protections for females, is now undermined to include born males. This undermine the class of females and what it means to be female. You men may not feel that this is a big deal, but it is. Respectfully it does no such thing. Just as I would argue gay marriage doesn't diminish a man/woman marriage. You lose nothing by including trans people into your clique. Personally, I'll continue to side with the position of being inclusive. Man, woman, cis, pan, non binary et al are welcome to be happy and included. Edit..let me additionally add as a white hetero male I've never fully experienced the struggle that females, gays, etc al experience. I'm appreciative of my advantages but I'm also saddened by terfs and others who fight like hell for equal acceptance but fail to include misgendered people. Edited January 21, 2021 by The Evil Genius 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 Dang, the Tailgate sure got a whole lot more snippy and argumentative and confrontational (and stupid), since yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, Larry said: Dang, the Tailgate sure got a whole lot more snippy and argumentative and confrontational (and stupid), since yesterday. Buckle in for ONE THOUSAND FOUR HUNDRED AND FIFTY EIGHT CONSECUTIVE DAYS of performative pearl-clutching about Trans folks and public bathrooms. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said: Buckle in for ONE THOUSAND FOUR HUNDRED AND FIFTY EIGHT CONSECUTIVE DAYS of performative pearl-clutching about Trans folks and public bathrooms. Is there anyone here even worried about that enough, outside of TD, to even think it's worth debating about among this contingent? Perhaps I'm wrong, as it's not a topic I really care about at all and don't know the history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, LadySkinsFan said: You men may not feel that this is a big deal, but it is. And then we females are supposed to recognize these males as women and then we're supposed to accept them as Lesbians for sex, penis and all. Um, no to that! Of course it's a big deal. It deserves serious discussion. I posted a couple of links related to MTF athlete topic and if/how that should be accommodated in female sports that protect the rights of all. But your meme and that last sentence of yours quoted above are not representative of someone who wants to discuss the topic with any nuance. You come across like a bigot. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 In a country where a lot of folks are still racist, I think we're still several generations away from accepting the trans community in full. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfitzo53 Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, LadySkinsFan said: So yeah, sid then we females are supposed to recognize these males as women and then we're supposed to accept them as Lesbians for sex, penis and all. Um, no to that! This makes no sense. You are allowed to tell someone you don't want to have sex with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 12 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Is there anyone here even worried about that enough, outside of TD, to even think it's worth debating about among this contingent? Perhaps I'm wrong, as it's not a topic I really care about at all and don't know the history. That's fair...we don't need to discuss it if I'm the only one who thought it would be an interesting topic. Thanks to those who weighed in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goskins10 Posted January 21, 2021 Author Share Posted January 21, 2021 So, seems like once we lost a common enemy we start going at each other - lol Who didn't see that coming.... I started this here thread so I stayed out of it for a while while there was conversation but it seems to have gone another way - I would ask people to remain civil please. If you are not interested in the topic that's fine. Just stay out of it. Or if it's really critical start another thread. That was the point of this thread to be kind of a catch all and if something became a big enough discussion then a new thread should be considered. Still it's a public message board so do what you like as long as it stays within the rules. If it's outside the rules you make get a TK "Hi There"! 🙂 I will also say that people may be missing there is a much deeper issue that comes out of trans people competing in sports. It gets down to our civil rights core and has much more broad impact than just if someone wants to change genders then compete on that level. It may even be deep and broad enough for it's own thread. Happy to keep it here but @TD_washingtonredskins you may want to consider starting a seperate thread. I am being honest when I say there is more to this than sporting events. For me, you are free to make decisions about your own life but those decisions have consequences. It's is a scientific fact that men on the whole are built genetically stronger. We needed that to hunt. That does not mean that women can't be strong. But to expect a fair competition when one person was born genetically different but then changed their private parts does not seem fair to me. Again, decisions have consequences. Then the problem comes where is the line - Ok no physical sports. What else ends up being thrown in that category. There is a lengthy philosophical discussion to be had here. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatteredFanSyndrome Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said: That's fair...we don't need to discuss it if I'm the only one who thought it would be an interesting topic. Thanks to those who weighed in. Don't let me deter you from discussing it, perhaps it is a hot topic here and I just haven't been looking at it. I just gather 'discussing' it will lead to much of the posting base to pile on that you're a bigot, homophobic, etc. for questioning or not having full support of all the policies entail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 6 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Don't let me deter you from discussing it, perhaps it is a hot topic here and I just haven't been looking at it. I just gather 'discussing' it will lead to much of the posting base to pile on that you're a bigot, homophobic, etc. for questioning or not having full support of all the policies entail. See that's what's sad to me. It discourages discussion when any pushback results in being labeled intolerant or discriminatory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hersh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 The sports topic in this thread is pretty interesting to me as someone that coached HS sports for 13 years. I’d like to see the science and numbers behind it, perhaps in a new thread 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corcaigh Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) The EO seeks to address discrimination against trans folks. If someone chooses to imagine a possible consequence that they find offensive from that basic principle ... that no-one is actually proposing, well the label might apply. President Biden's EO against discrimination is not going to mandate how many penises are in anyone's bed. 12 minutes ago, Hersh said: The sports topic in this thread is pretty interesting to me as someone that coached HS sports for 13 years. I’d like to see the science and numbers behind it, perhaps in a new thread This is fascinating to me too, as both a coach and administrator. The couple of links I posted earlier are a start but it is a very complex topic. Most people agree accommodations would have to be sport-specific because even with HT treatments and monitoring testosterone levels, for example, there will be sports where being born a male will convey significant advantages even after transition. Some not so. https://sportsscientists.com/2019/03/on-transgender-athletes-and-performance-advantages/ https://www.kinesophy.com/joanna-harper-on-the-performance-of-transgender-athletes/ Edited January 21, 2021 by Corcaigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TradeTheBeal! Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said: Is there anyone here even worried about that enough, outside of TD, to even think it's worth debating about among this contingent? Perhaps I'm wrong, as it's not a topic I really care about at all and don't know the history. No. And TD is just doing that “asking questions” passive-aggressive deal. 1) The EO extends anti-discrimination protection to trans Americans in accordance with well established federal law. 2) The idea that a person would willingly undergo a full year or more of hormone treatments so that they could raise their status in the ultra-lucrative field of women’s amateur sports Is beyond ridiculous. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadySkinsFan Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 I think that most here don't know that most trans people now don't have to take hormones or have surgery to identify as another sex, they can self identify, and some aren't undergoing any counseling either, since that's usually required for legal hormone prescriptions and surgery. Speaking as a Lesbian, who used to join dating websites, I quit specifically because the most people responding to my ads were trans people (males) even after I requested that I wasn't interested in hearing from men or trans people. There's no respect for boundaries, in that if males identify as women then we are supposed to welcome them into our beds. Saying No gets you tagged as a TERF, which is a slur by the way. I stated at the very beginning of my post that I agree that everyone should have the same rights as stated in the Constitution. The language disruptions are ongoing and getting more extreme. This is disrespectful to females as a class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) My apologies then. I have never heard terf being labeled a slur. Acronym yes, slur no. Edit..does this mean homophobe is a slur too? 😕 I'd be curious if you (and really anyone else) have the same position on females who want to/or do transition male. Edited January 21, 2021 by The Evil Genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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