A New Start! (the Reboot) The Front Office, Ownership, & Coaching Staff Thread

[TD_washingtonredskins]

I'm guessing they'd want to validate that the video exists (it does) and hear what the grievances are from the growing number of women coming forward. 

[FootballZombie]

@TD_washingtonredskins

 

When there are 50 claims against a team, I don’t believe anyone would need to wait it out for more deets before making a choice on whether to stay on as a sponsor. Unless they were all visited by Zombies and are now sans brain.  

 

The tapes and who requested them and the subject of many of the harassment claims would fall under information we don’t have yet. If we learn more and its worse than we are hearing now, that would certainly add gasoline to the fire, but at this point it is purely accusation and speculation, which as we are seeing first hand, is clearly not enough to give an owner the boot.

 

I’m looking at the current landscape, and based off what we know now there has been little to no action taken that really threatens Snyder’s ownership in any way shape or form.

 

If you believe that the further reveal of horrible wrongdoings will lead to increased pressure for his removal, I am 100% with you on that. All I’m saying is that that pressure has yet to substantially manifest in a meaningful way within our current environment, and is unlikely to manifest by all important metrics, unless there is more to the story.  Otherwise, it already would have happened

Edited September 1, 2020 by FootballZombie

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Thanks for the reply...a couple things:

 

1) Is the zombie reference in every post a bit that you always do?

2) I don't think the tape needs to be "worse than what we are hearing" for something to happen. But I do think waiting to confirm that it exists is fair before sponsors or other owners would act. 

 

What could be worse? He took nude footage that would never be needed for the calendars and then created an "outtakes" video to pass around to his pals in Ashburn. That's ILLEGAL and IMMORAL and DISGUSTING. 

[FootballZombie]

1 hour ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

 

1.)    Yes. It is something I try to incorporate in all of my posts. It serves as both a brain teaser for myself and a way to prevent me from spamming as I will only try to comment if I have something to contribute to the conversation. Otherwise I blow a bad joke or pun. Let’s call it my Raison Death-tra. (Haha, I think that one goes in my top 10!)

 

2.)    I think you would need proof that it exists and that Snyder had a direct hand in it. Otherwise it will just be thrown on the pile of the previous bad culture and won’t hurt Snyder much at all. Unfortunately, that still might not be enough as we have been exposed to the story now. If it does not grow in severity, it will not have the same impact as “Fresh news”. People will become numb to it and there will be less outrage. Time will have this effect as well. If we are simply regurgitated the same story three months from now, there will be more “We already knew that” and less “That’s Outrageous!” Similar to how more women continue to come forward. When you have 50 charges against you, public opinion isn’t really going to get any worse. Your throwing water into the ocean. Any sponsor or person who supports you is not thinking 50 is where I draw the line.

 

What is worse would be a Donald Streling scenario. Something (likely in the moment) that is so vile that all players, sponsors and the league can turn on him immediately w impunity or w/o retribution for themselves, and receive pats on the back for doing so. These cases usually culminate within days, so the fact that we are at the weeks/months area with our own case tells me the current charges are unlikely to lead to the Sterling outcome.

Edited September 2, 2020 by FootballZombie

[CTskin]

Exactly @FootballZombie. We all agree that the environment and the accusations are despicable, but unless there’s proof that directly ties Snyder to this, I don’t see how he could be forced to sell.

 

good to see the nfl getting involved now, fingers crossed they find that damning email.

[Dissident2]

32 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

What is worse would be a Donald Streling scenario. Something (likely in the moment) that is so vile that all players, sponsors and the league can turn on him immediately w impunity or w/o retribution for themselves, and receive pats on the back for doing so. These cases usually culminate within days, so the fact that we are at the weeks/months area with our own case tells me the current charges are unlikely to lead to the Sterling outcome.

 

Number one, posters with ongoing "bits" ... just ... just be mindful of how old that can get really, really fast. 

 

Number two ... the "these cases usually culminate in days" line, I don't know where that comes from. Every case is different. If someone is caught SAYING something that can't be refuted, sure, that's an easy out. But this case is multi-faceted, and there's still an awful lot to learn. 

 

I said it before and I'll double down on it: if Snyder can be linked to those videos, he is done. There is nothing that's come out so far that is more potentially damaging than this. It's my understanding that lawyers don't even have the videos yet, that the Post won't give them out. So someone has to be able to access the videos, then prove that they came from the team's shoots. That shouldn't be too hard. The Post article already made it pretty obvious that they were made from team footage. So SOMEONE on the staff is screwed basically, if not many more than one. And Larry Michael, as the "senior VP of broadcasting," has the biggest target.

 

Then the admittedly difficult part: to prove that Snyder is the one who ordered them to be made. But here's the thing ... that might not be able to be proven until the inevitable lawsuits happen, because that's when people involved in creating these things are going to feel the pressure, and they'll either take the fall or they'll flip. There were two people named in the story who were accused of actually making one of the videos. Those same two people of course deny it. But what happens when they get in a court room and are presented with the videos and have to testify under oath? That's where it will get interesting. 

 

So no, to think something like this has to be settled in "days" or that means "nothing will happen" is shortsighted. It's going to be awhile. And who knows what might come out during that time. 

[FootballZombie]

21 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

Number one, posters with ongoing "bits" ... just ... just be mindful of how old that can get really, really fast.

 

Hmmm…. I’ll keep that in mind. Maybe I’ll only do some posts. Use it as a pick me up on days I’m feeling rotten (Zombie pun, I could not help it. I will take what you said seriously and dial it back tho.)

21 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

 

 "these cases usually culminate in days" line

 

I think timing is very important. If you have to wait months or even years for court cases to process, anger will dissipate. Its hard to stay passionate for that long. Futhermore if Snyder can buy a plea bargain where he claims no responsibility, it would be hard to hold these things against him. It would be amazingly difficult to out an owner over a court case. You need a raw nerve to stimulate change, not a simmering pot.

 

Tying Snyder directly to any of this would be big, but without it, not only do I not see fire around booting the owner, there is no smoke. Furthermore if you can’t prove it without a court case, where he could probably buy his way out, he aint going nowhere.

[Koala]

The NFL seems to be taking the position to just wait and see how things play out.  THey have the luxury of doing that, mostly because the national outcry on this story has been limited.  I been pretty disappointed in the #metoo movement's lack of response in this case. 

 

And I think I know why, and without derailing this thread completely, it has a lot too do with bias against women who are in professional roles that feminists traditionally turn their nose up at.   I think Ill leave it at that.    

[Conn]

9 minutes ago, Koala said:

The NFL seems to be taking the position to just wait and see how things play out.  THey have the luxury of doing that, mostly because the national outcry on this story has been limited.  I been pretty disappointed in the #metoo movement's lack of response in this case. 

 

And I think I know why, and without derailing this thread completely, it has a lot too do with bias against women who are in professional roles that feminists traditionally turn their nose up at.   I think Ill leave it at that.    

I think that’s unlikely. It’s more likely that many of the same people who support #metoo also support other causes that are sliiiiightly more in the spotlight right now. There’s kind of a lot going on in this country. That doesn’t make any issue more or less important, obviously, we’re just at a pivotal moment in history in regards to social movements, and right now the conduct of a sports team is probably not on a lot of people’s radar in general. 

[Koala]

22 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

I think that’s unlikely. It’s more likely that many of the same people who support #metoo also support other causes that are sliiiiightly more in the spotlight right now. There’s kind of a lot going on in this country. That doesn’t make any issue more or less important, obviously, we’re just at a pivotal moment in history in regards to social movements, and right now the conduct of a sports team is probably not on a lot of people’s radar in general. 

 

You may have a point, I guess when you have big orange fish to fry, everything else takes a back seat.  But I still think the fact they are cheerleaders has something to do with the muted outcry, maybe not from #metoo, but at least the general public....

Edited September 2, 2020 by Koala

[88Comrade2000]

6 hours ago, FootballZombie said:

 

I don’t think the lawyers are much of a threat. Whoever those lawyers are, they will not be as big and bad as the ones employed by Snyder. He will have the best available.

I doubt we see a mass exodus of sponsors either. If the sponsors were going to pull, they likely would have done so by now. No need to wait for accusation 51.

The other owners will not vote him out. No NFL owner has ever been voted out. The other owners will never do something that will collectively make themselves more vulnerable.

I don’t believe he can be pressured to sell. He has already faced and resisted this pressure from his own people for some time.

 

Without something new, or something we don’t know about yet, we simply are not at the tipping point in terms of giving Snyder the boot. Maybe the investigation changes that, but I’m not sure what that can tell us that all these women have not already. The longer this takes, the better this is for Snyder as well. Without more gasoline on the fire, there just is not enough here at this point.

 

It is going to require something bigger to force Snyder out. I’m talking zombie apocalypse big.

Snyder himself has to be sexually harassing the women or Snyder himself has to be saying racial things to employees.

 

The NFL isn't going remove of their own unless it's some conduct by an owner themselves that can't be tolerated.  While I don't think any team can be as bad as the Redskins under Snyder; other teams probably has things they don't want to come out.

 

At best, we maybe get Snyder suspended for a year.

[Burgold]

3 hours ago, Dissident2 said:

 

 

 

Then the admittedly difficult part: to prove that Snyder is the one who ordered them to be made. But here's the thing ... that might not be able to be proven until the inevitable lawsuits happen, because that's when people involved in creating these things are going to feel the pressure, and they'll either take the fall or they'll flip. There were two people named in the story who were accused of actually making one of the videos. Those same two people of course deny it. But what happens when they get in a court room and are presented with the videos and have to testify under oath? That's where it will get interesting. 

 

So no, to think something like this has to be settled in "days" or that means "nothing will happen" is shortsighted. It's going to be awhile. And who knows what might come out during that time. 

I don't think the bar is set at "Snyder ordered them made." For me, if Snyder watched them, was aware of them of them being distributed, etc. is probably enough. After all, as was pointed out. This tape is not only a gross abuse, but in all liklihood illegal. If his reaction to the tape was "Cool. I got to see this." instead of "Fire the bum who did it and burn the tape." I think he's in hot water or at least liable to be sued.

 

I think the question now that the League is involved is this. If there is a tape and if it is illegal and if it's existence opens them up to lawsuits, and the League fails to act can the League then be looped into the suit for doing nothing? If this threatens to cost the League money, if it threatens to cost them enough embarrassment, it could force their hand. 

 

I doubt the League wants to go nuclear and blow up the ownership. I do think that they've been spending a lot of effort in trying to groom female fans and that if there's blowback from sponsors, ratings, etc. because of this frat crap then they will act, but ultimately whatever happens will be about money and not about right or wrong.

Edited September 2, 2020 by Burgold

[Voice_of_Reason]

@Burgoldis right.  The tape is the smoking gun.

 

the thing is, you need a direct and named connection between the tape and Snyder. If Larry knew about the tape and will state on the record he gave it to Snyder, that’s one thing. 
 

If it’s a nebulous “he must have known” that’s not good enough.

 

Somehow I think Larry is going to be the lynchpin in all of this.  Because some random guy from the video editing department isn’t going to have been the one to deliver the tape to Snyder. 
 

As an aside, if Snyder is forced out, I really hope the new owner gives the current team a chance to prove themselves.  For the first time in a ling time, I have confidence in the leadership group, Ron and Jason, and even in Kyle Smith (to an extent) and Julie.  It would be good to see what these folks can do before upsetting the Apple cart.

Edited September 2, 2020 by Voice_of_Reason

[Califan007 The Constipated]

This may have been discussed on an earlier page, but did Chris Russell allude to the NFL working with Snyder and the Skins for years now in terms of "fixing" what's broken with the team, and that the "NFL is taking over the investigation/Snyder asked the NFL to do so" is more window dressing than anything? Meaning, the league taking over the investigation is just a continuation of the NFL and Snyder working together, so it's not as big a deal as we may think.

 

I'm wildly paraphrasing what I think I remember glancing over on twitter lol...

Edited September 2, 2020 by Califan007

[Est.1974]

56 minutes ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

For the first time in a ling time, I have confidence in the leadership group, Ron and Jason, and even in Kyle Smith (to an extent) 

agree on the ‘to an extent’ with Kyle Smith. He may not be on a hot seat but I think it’s more than luke warm. Very interesting to see how our roster cuts leave us looking week one.

[JoggingGod]

27 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

This may have been discussed on an earlier page, but did Chris Russell allude to the NFL working with Snyder and the Skins for years now in terms of "fixing" what's broken with the team, and that the "NFL is taking over the investigation/Snyder asked the NFL to do so" is more window dressing than anything? Meaning, the league taking over the investigation is just a continuation of the NFL and Snyder working together, so it's not as big a deal as we may think.

 

I'm wildly paraphrasing what I think I remember glancing over on twitter lol...

Listening to Chris Russell on anything is your first mistake.

[spjunkies]

8 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

Listening to Chris Russell on anything is your first mistake.

 

I used to feel this way, but Russell has turned out to be right about a lot of things regarding this garbage organization in hindsight.

[Dissident2]

38 minutes ago, spjunkies said:

 

I used to feel this way, but Russell has turned out to be right about a lot of things regarding this garbage organization in hindsight.

 

Russell, from accounts I've heard, was treated horribly by Redskins staff as a reporter. He's a good guy. Maybe annoying at times, I grant you, but he's a good guy. 

 

As far as the NFL taking over this investigation "not being a big deal" or being "window dressing," I don't think that's true. What Russell was probably referring to as far as the NFL working with Snyder in recent years was the NFL trying to get Lafemina entrenched in Washington to help them correct their culture problem. The fact that he was fired after just 8 months did NOT sit well with the league at all. Whether this investigation yields what we're all hoping for remains to be seen, but I think it is most definitely a big step in the right direction.

 

Thom Loverro had a great comment the other day about Snyder, saying (paraphrasing), "Times like these are when you start using all the goodwill you've stored up in the bank. Snyder has nothing saved in the bank." That's true for the public, and it's true for the owners as well. 

 

 

[Burgundy Yoda]

7 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Russell, from accounts I've heard, was treated horribly by Redskins staff as a reporter. He's a good guy. Maybe annoying at times, I grant you, but he's a good guy. 

 

As far as the NFL taking over this investigation "not being a big deal" or being "window dressing," I don't think that's true. What Russell was probably referring to as far as the NFL working with Snyder in recent years was the NFL trying to get Lafemina entrenched in Washington to help them correct their culture problem. The fact that he was fired after just 8 months did NOT sit well with the league at all. Whether this investigation yields what we're all hoping for remains to be seen, but I think it is most definitely a big step in the right direction.

 

Thom Loverro had a great comment the other day about Snyder, saying (paraphrasing), "Times like these are when you start using all the goodwill you've stored up in the bank. Snyder has nothing saved in the bank." That's true for the public, and it's true for the owners as well. 

 

 

 

Which will easily be blamed on Bruce Allen. He will be the main one Snyder will blame for this culture failure. 

Edited September 2, 2020 by Burgundy Yoda

[JoggingGod]

51 minutes ago, spjunkies said:

 

I used to feel this way, but Russell has turned out to be right about a lot of things regarding this garbage organization in hindsight.

He turned out to be right about the literal most obvious things. Like yeah we already knew Bruce was bad and Dan was bad. 
 

But he doesn’t have league sources and neither does anyone else on 106.7.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

2 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

He turned out to be right about the literal most obvious things. Like yeah we already knew Bruce was bad and Dan was bad. 
 

But he doesn’t have league sources and neither does anyone else on 106.7.

Look, the guy is annoying, but you have to give the guy some credit where it's due.  He's been ahead of more than just "Dan and Bruce are bad".  He worked in Ashburn for several years and it's clear that some folks are still talking to him.  it is a slippery slope because guys can't out their sources or they won't have sources anymore.

[Dissident2]

23 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

 

Which will easily be blamed on Bruce Allen. He will be the main one Snyder will blame for this culture failure. 

 

Sure, and he's already attempted to do that with the nonsensical, "I've been too hands-off" comment. Whether or not he's successful in that blame game remains to be seen. Most people with any sense of how that place operates know how ridiculous his "hands-off" comment was. Something a liar would say. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I'm still floored that the worst thing we've heard about Bruce was "He had to have known."

 

I'm assuming the investigators will be talking to him, as well as Vinny since some of the accusations go back to when he was an executive with the team.

[Conn]

1 hour ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Russell, from accounts I've heard, was treated horribly by Redskins staff as a reporter. He's a good guy. Maybe annoying at times, I grant you, but he's a good guy. 

 

As far as the NFL taking over this investigation "not being a big deal" or being "window dressing," I don't think that's true. What Russell was probably referring to as far as the NFL working with Snyder in recent years was the NFL trying to get Lafemina entrenched in Washington to help them correct their culture problem. The fact that he was fired after just 8 months did NOT sit well with the league at all. Whether this investigation yields what we're all hoping for remains to be seen, but I think it is most definitely a big step in the right direction.

 

Thom Loverro had a great comment the other day about Snyder, saying (paraphrasing), "Times like these are when you start using all the goodwill you've stored up in the bank. Snyder has nothing saved in the bank." That's true for the public, and it's true for the owners as well. 

 

 

Wright’s name was also essentially passed to Snyder’s desk by the NFL front office for that position, he came approved and endorsed by them big time after they failed to hire him themselves last year. There is more NFL influence and attention on our FO right now than is normal across the league for sure. Whether it means anything big follows in the future remains to be seen.

58 minutes ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

 

Which will easily be blamed on Bruce Allen. He will be the main one Snyder will blame for this culture failure. 

If he does that, then Bruce has no reason to keep the peace and keep his own mouth shut. Turning those rats on each other should be the NFL’s first and biggest move to find out what really was going down. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

38 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Sure, and he's already attempted to do that with the nonsensical, "I've been too hands-off" comment.

 

It's the Mark Cuban defense lol...

 

In fact, I expect (for now anyway) for the end result to be similar to what happened with Cuban: sanctions, fine, comment about how Snyder (and Tanya lol) have taken positive, significant steps to changing the culture, and an apologetic statement to the victims from Snyder (and Tanya lol).

Edited September 2, 2020 by Califan007