2020 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[volsmet]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

this is Rivera talking the draft with a brief glimpse at 2 players, anyone can tell which ones?  Hard for me, looked like the receiver was playing at the Gators stadium but could be wrong.  He was an outside receiver. 

 

 

 

The catch in that clip was Garrett Wilson over *Derion Kendrick.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Self indulgent exercise for me so I can go back to this later.  I've watched more receivers than any other position by a mile.  Every player I mention here I've watched.  If I had to break them down for me it would be.

 

1st rounders or early 2nd and out of reach: 

Lamb, Jeudy, Ruggs, Jefferson.  I love all 4.

 

Early to mid 2nd rounders in my book ranked.

 

5.  Higgins (love, contested catches, sticky hands, just a baller)

6.  Pittman (love, just so well rounded, complete receiver)

7.  Mims (love with some reservations, feisty, great blocker, fast, good size)

8.  Reagor (love with some boom-bust qualities to him though, so dynamic when he's on his game, a bit hot and cold)

 

3rd round type talent

9. Bryan Edwards (love, but need him to be healthy, just a baller, good hands, YAC, plays with attitude, fun to watch)

10. Devin Duvernay (love, good hands, explosive, YAC)

11.  Van Jefferson (love, so smooth, consistent, good hands)   

12.  Tyler Johnson (love, makes play after play, can separate) 

 

Guys draft geeks tell me I am supposed to love but its hard for me to fall hard for them

13.  Brandon Aiyuk (love him as a returner and for YAC, seems raw as a receiver)

14.  Laviska Shenault (ball handler more than a receiver, and a baller at that, but can he stay healthy, or develop as a route runner?)

 

4th rounders

15.  A. Gibson (some draft geeks see him as a RB, not me to me he's more of a WR, he brings everything that Shenault does and you can get him later in the draft)

16.  Lynn Bowden (similar to Gibson but even more versatile)

17.  KJ Hamler (very dynamic but he's one dimensional, got him rated lower than most people) 

18.  KJ Hill (good slot player, great hands, lacks athleticism and size, hard for me to see him playing outside)   

 

5th rounders

19.  Collin Johnson (i like but don't love, has some boom bust in him, great size, decent hands wish I knew his speed -- am skeptical about it)

20    Isaiah Hodgins (sticky hands, contested catches)

21.  Chase Claypool (I can dig him if he turned into a TE don't love him as a receiver, contested catches and YAC but not much of a route runner-separater)

22.  John Hightower (a bit skinny, but potentially good deep threat, playing Z)

23.  Gabriel Davis (I like him but seems to have some boom-bust in him, decent at much but not great IMO at anything)

24.  Antoinio Gandy-Golden (another one with a lot of boom-bust but intriguing talent especially for size, YAC)

25. Quartney Davis (doesn't do anything great but real solid overall, can play inside, outside)

 

 

6th rounders

26. Jauan Jennings (To me he's a slower Bryan Edwards, if he were faster, he'd be a top 15 receiver IMO, YAC, YAC, YAC, broken tackles)

27. Donovan People-Jones (major boom-bust, I lean closer to bust but high potential, can't get past poor production, I am lower on him than most)

28. Quntez Cephus (his combine was horrible, he's had character issues, but he just balls out in some of the games I watched, feisty, good hands)

29. James Proche (he's put up monster numbers but for some odd reason it was tough for me to love him when I watched him, I have to rewatch)

 

7th rounders

30.  Joe Reed (he's raw but he has a lot of Jauan Jennings and Bryan Edwards in him, a baller with the ball in his hands)

31.  Quez Watkins (one dimensional but speed, speed, speed, could be an interesting weapon if used right)

32.  Isaiah Coulter (same thing I said about Watkins but I like Watkins a hair better)

 

[clskinsfan]

Like a lot about your WR list Paradise. I do have Hamler and Bowden rated a little higher though. Thing is this draft is so deep at WR that some of those guys are going to fall. There will be real talent in the 4th at the position. I like Gandy-Golden for us late in the draft as well. The guys hands are like peanut butter. Everything sticks to them.

[Koolblue13]

Out of curiosity, since I know you've been deep into the TEs, where would you place them in that same list?

[Skinsinparadise]

11 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Like a lot about your WR list Paradise. I do have Hamler and Bowden rated a little higher though. Thing is this draft is so deep at WR that some of those guys are going to fall. There will be real talent in the 4th at the position. I like Gandy-Golden for us late in the draft as well. The guys hands are like peanut butter. Everything sticks to them.

 

I am a big Bowden guy.  I just think he's a bit unpolished as a receiver right now but could develop into a stud.  I like just about every receivers on my list but just to different degrees.  But they can't all go early so I tried to proportionately fit them as best as I can.  In the typical draft these guys would be going give or take a round plus higher.

 

As for Hamler.  I can see him being electric because he is certainly fast but I see him more as a spot type of player.  I just don't see him holding up over a season.  He's small and IMO he plays small too as for his physicality.  I think he has to be a slot guy.  I can see success if the right coach gets a hold of him, he can have a good career.  I just have a hard time seeing him surviving as a full-time player.  The other thing about him is the drops.  His hands aren't hot.   I like Duvernay over him.  But I don't dislike Hamler, I just don't like him as much as some others do.  For the most part, I'd be happy about landing most of the receivers on that list.  It's such a deep group.

 

Gandy-Golden is a big dude, fun at times to watch, he doesn't strike me that polished or at times dynamic.  But I would't dislike taking him. 

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

this is Rivera talking the draft with a brief glimpse at 2 players, anyone can tell which ones?  Hard for me, looked like the receiver was playing at the Gators stadium but could be wrong.  He was an outside receiver.  

 

Looks like it was the Fiesta bowl to me.  There is a playstation logo on the field.  That was Clemson vs Ohio State so it's probably Higgins or Hill or Victor.

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Out of curiosity, since I know you've been deep into the TEs, where would you place them in that same list?

 

 I was going to do TE's tomorrow.  I didn't realize how many receivers I watched until I put them all in order.   That's more than any position I've watched any year.  TE's would be the next most.  But I've waffled back and forth on both positions so I want to put some final thoughts into TE.

 

Off the top of my head.  My top TE would probably be #12th among the receivers.  So I'd put Trautman at 12 and Kmet at 13 just after Jefferson.   Asiasi would be #17.    Hopkins 19.  Harrison Bryant 20.  Albert O (I waffle on him) 22, Hunter Bryant, 23.  I might change my mind some tomorrow but probably not much after re-immersing myself into that position again. 

[Stormy]

That's a great grouping of your WR tiers, SiP. So, if pick #66 rolls around, and we stay put, and all of your 3rd round guys are on the board, (Edwards, Duvernay, Jefferson, Johnson), along with say Trautman, I. Wilson, Niang, Arnette, and Igbinoghene... who do you take? And does the fact that there's still a viable group of strong WRs likely to be around for round 4 factor into your decision? Thanks!

[Skinsinparadise]

18 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Looks like it was the Fiesta bowl to me.  There is a playstation logo on the field.  That was Clemson vs Ohio State so it's probably Higgins or Hill or Victor.

 

They mention outside receiver and you can see the play being made on the right side.  Higgins played there plenty.  Ditto Victor.  Definitely not Hill, then.  That reminds me I forgot to include Victor on my list, I watched him, too not sure though he gets drafted. 

[HTTRDynasty]

Good breakdown.  And speaks to the concerns I've had with Simmons for a while now.

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

17 minutes ago, Stormy said:

That's a great grouping of your WR tiers, SiP. So, if pick #66 rolls around, and we stay put, and all of your 3rd round guys are on the board, (Edwards, Duvernay, Jefferson, Johnson), along with say Trautman, I. Wilson, Niang, Arnette, and Igbinoghene... who do you take? And does the fact that there's still a viable group of strong WRs likely to be around for round 4 factor into your decision? Thanks!

 

That's a really tough one for me.   I'd eliminate Jefferson and T. Johnson -- love both but not as much as the others in the context of our team and that pick.

 

Removing those 2, If I am doing it purely on BPA.  for me it would be:

 

1.  Bryan Edwards (but I got no idea if he's healthy)

2.  Duvernay

3.  Igbinoghene 

4.  Arnette

5.  Trautman

6.  Niang

7. Wilson

 

But I'd be happy with any of them.   If I had to pick one, probably Niang because I just don't think a team can be very good with a porous O line especially at LT.  My caveat with Niang is how is he post hip surgery.  I like Niang more than the typical mock draft type.  

 

 

 

 

[Skin'emAlive]

I could be happy with Bryan Edwards As a backup plan if we traded down a bit in the 3rd. 

[clskinsfan]

11 minutes ago, Skin'emAlive said:

I could be happy with Bryan Edwards As a backup plan if we traded down a bit in the 3rd. 

Edwards hands concern me. He had some horrendous drops in his career. One of my big issues with Jeudy as well in all honesty.

[DWinzit]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Self indulgent exercise for me so I can go back to this later.  I've watched more receivers than any other position by a mile.  Every player I mention here I've watched.  If I had to break them down for me it would be.

 

3rd round type talent

10. Devin Duvernay (love, good hands, explosive, YAC)

11.  Van Jefferson (love, so smooth, consistent, good hands)   

12.  Tyler Johnson (love, makes play after play, can separate) 

 

4th rounders

15.  A. Gibson (some draft geeks see him as a RB, not me to me he's more of a WR, he brings everything that Shenault does and you can get him later in the draft)

16.  Lynn Bowden (similar to Gibson but even more versatile)

 

While my breakdowns would differ slightly you are pretty much on it, nice job SIP

I still can't get over this talent in the third and forth rounds plus others could fall and join them.

They need to grab one of these guys!

[Skin'emAlive]

14 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Edwards hands concern me. He had some horrendous drops in his career. One of my big issues with Jeudy as well in all honesty.

True, but that’s also why he’s a 3rd round prospect. It’s no secret we’ve thoroughly researched prototypical x wrs in this draft. Rivera has coveted big bodied possession wrs in Carolina with Funchess and Benjamin. Edwards has the size and fearlessness to go for contested catches that rivera is looking for opposite of Mclaurin. The question is which of the big bodied wrs should we take if we are stuck picking from the 3rd and down?

 

Bryan Edwards

Antonio Gandy Golden

Chase Claypool

Collin Johnson

Stephen Guidry

Isaiah Hodgins

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

As for Edwards, from the games I watched he had really good hands. A 4% drop rate is very good.  The knock on him seems to be how fast is he?  I admit I'd feel better about him if I knew.  the other is that he had a ton of receptions on screens -- but I actually like that.  I like receivers who can break tackles and do something with the ball in their hands.  And from what I saw he was good with intermediate routes.

 

I admit I am a bit biased towards either really fast players or physical.   And among the physical players, I love to watch Edwards, Jauan Jennings, Robert Hunt, Adam Trautman.  I love the tone setter types.  I was reading an article about SF where some of their players pumped up how Kittle's physical style of play is contagious and it compelled them also to play more physical.   To me some players are tone setters like that.  Shanny used to say that about Garcon.  That's what I feel about Edwards.    He also sounds like a good guy and perhaps smart since he had one of the higher wonderlic scores among receivers

 

 

 

Yet what might play as big a role in how high Edwards goes in the draft is the character he will bring to a roster and locker room.

“General managers of teams he’s talked to speak very highly of who he is as a person, his character,” said Edwards’ agent, Tory Dandy with Creative Artists Agency (CAA). “Most teams talk a lot to his college coaches and people at USC, and everybody just raves about the kind of young man Bryan is.

 

“I call Bryan a humble superstar. He’s the all-time leading receiver at South Carolina. But meeting him, he’s well-mannered, he’s very humble, he’s very appreciative. He doesn’t have that entitled mindset. He’s a hard worker.”

Edwards’ high school coach at Conway, Chuck Jordan, imparted a call he had with a representative of an NFL team who said he had spent several years in the FBI and was looking into Edwards’ background.

 

 

...At 6-foot-3 and 212 pounds, Edwards combines good size with good speed, giving him the ability to win one-on-one battles for the ball while also stretching the field.

“So you start looking at teams who could use somebody like that — it’s darn near all of them,” said draft analyst Daniel Jeremiah of NFL Network.

 

[bakedtater1]

Might be the timing in the photo but dude dont look to happy.

[volsmet]

I haven’t watched much Dobbins, can he sneak into rdn 1?  Value at +333.

 

*

[Skinsinparadise]

2 minutes ago, volsmet said:

I haven’t watched much Dobbins, can he sneak into rdn 1?  Value at +333.

 

*

I like Dobbins. I’d be surprised though. I’d guess mid 2nd.

[KDawg]

29 minutes ago, volsmet said:

I haven’t watched much Dobbins, can he sneak into rdn 1?  Value at +333.

 

*

He most certainly could. I wouldn’t bet against any of the top 4 backs or so doing that. Dobbins is a zone back. If Swift goes earlier than anticipated and Kansas City wants a back it’s very likely to be Dobbins at 32. Some stuff has to happen for that. But it’s possible.

[volsmet]

Dobbins as rb1 is +1350, but I’m not sure if anyone has a RB other than Swift at RB1.

[Skinsinparadise]

Often you get some trade ups on the late first. I’d bet on a run on CB and OT at the tail end of the first, maybe even a QB like Eason. 5 year contract, etc.  

 

Id be surprised if it would Be Dobbins there. I touted Dobbins some throughout the season, he can be explosive and a home run hitter.  Fun watch.
 

I think Swift makes the first and probably Taylor I’d be surprised if Dobbins makes it too

[KDawg]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

Often you get some trade ups on the late first. I’d bet on a run on CB and OT at the tail end of the first, maybe even a QB like Eason. 5 year contract, etc.  

 

Id be surprised it would Dobbins there. I touted Dobbins some throughout the season, he can be explosive and a homer in hitter. 
 

I think Swift makes the first and probably Taylor I’d be surprised if Dobbins makes it too

 

Depends on the type of back you're looking at. Zone scheme guys are Swift + Dobbins. 

[Skinsinparadise]

13 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

Depends on the type of back you're looking at. Zone scheme guys are Swift + Dobbins. 

 Could be but not sure I would bet on it.

 

Thinking about it.  Maybe the Chiefs who do have an outside zone attack. They also value pass catching which Dobbins while is not great as a receiver is still decent at it whereas Taylor isn’t as good a fit as that type of weapon.

[RWJ]

Something tells me it's gonna take our 3rd round pick to get O.J. Howard.  Would you trade it for Howard?