Presidential Election: 11/3/20 ---Now the President Elect Joe Biden Thread

[bearrock]

10 hours ago, thegreaterbuzzette said:

Would this be too simple? States move to "open primaries" and then people like me (registered Rep, but anti-Trump, left/right based on issue) could vote for a more moderate and well rounded candidate who then opposes Trump, and I will vote for them. More complicated - we need a computer algorithm to draw district lines. 

 

Note : the alternative is not that I would vote for Trump.....that will NEVER happen. But what would happen is that I end up going third party or "write-in". 

 

I think this raises the broader issue of being stuck with two realistic candidates, both of whom are spectacularly bad choices right?  Another thought I had was a multi nominee system where the party with say more than 5% support in the previous election has to nominate 2 or 3 candidates.  Then voters in the general can vote by ranking system.  This would seem to broaden the possibility of having some decent choices and lower the possibility of 30% diehard plus straight party line voters electing a truly bad choice into office.

[redskinss]

So are the Democrats just taking a page from the Republican playbook by putting up so many candidates?

 

It has to be so that the smear train cant get really rolling until after the primaries and therefore less time to get **** to stick to the walls right?

[PleaseBlitz]

19 minutes ago, redskinss said:

So are the Democrats just taking a page from the Republican playbook by putting up so many candidates?

 

It has to be so that the smear train cant get really rolling until after the primaries and therefore less time to get **** to stick to the walls right?

 

I mean, a lot of people think they can beat Trump, he's not particularly popular.  Certainly, a few of those people have egos that may be causing them to think this erroneously (Gabbard, Castro, Hickenlooper, others), and others may have motivations for running other than actually becoming POTUS (Yang, Inslee, this person). 

[Larry]

35 minutes ago, redskinss said:

So are the Democrats just taking a page from the Republican playbook by putting up so many candidates?

 

It has to be so that the smear train cant get really rolling until after the primaries and therefore less time to get **** to stick to the walls right?

 

My money would be on "there will never be a better person to run against than Donald Trump", as the primary reason for so many candidates. 

[twa]

34 minutes ago, Larry said:

 

My money would be on "there will never be a better person to run against than Donald Trump", as the primary reason for so many candidates. 

 

 

 

I think there are so many because there is no obvious candidate, just like when 17 or so ran in the R one.

Biden is the nearest, but far from a lock.

When the popular vote winner is deemed not viable the field is pretty open.

 

That ones like Beto and Buttieg are being seriously considered confirms it.

[NoCalMike]

7 hours ago, Larry said:

 

As we've seen in NC, if you want to steal an election, you get yourself put in charge of counting the votes, and then you attack the absentee ballots. That way, you can get at hundreds of votes, without witnesses. 

 

Yep, all the hub-bub about voter ID and trying to puff up claims of voting fraud has actually shed a light on the real issue which has been election fraud, which has been shown to be happening and recently it has mostly been the GOP election officials taking part in it. Funny how that turned out.

 

The issue is not with the votes being cast, it's what is happening with the votes once they are cast.  

[twa]

Been quite a bit of fraud by Dems proven here as well.

[NoCalMike]

1 minute ago, twa said:

Been quite a bit of fraud by Dems proven here as well.

 

Dems are no stranger to it historically. Can't disagree there, but the overall point is that election fraud seems to be the actual issue, not voter fraud. 

[twa]

10 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

Dems are no stranger to it historically. Can't disagree there, but the overall point is that election fraud seems to be the actual issue, not voter fraud. 

 

Well voter fraud is both harder to prove(especially w/o ID requirements) and traditionally light on punishment

 

not worth the effort generally speaking

[The Evil Genius]

Election fraud also occurs with an impact of 1000x + greater than voter fraud.

 

Whereas the proven NC election fraud affected thousands of ballots. Proven voter fraud happens in the dozens...if that.

 

Edit..should note that I believe election fraud occurs also when the GOP controlled states purge voting roles and mysteriously eliminate valid voters. To me, the continued GOP attack on voter registration is as undemocratic as one can get.

 

 

[LadySkinsFan]

Republicans are responsible for voter suppression.

[NoCalMike]

20 minutes ago, twa said:

 

Well voter fraud is both harder to prove(especially w/o ID requirements) and traditionally light on punishment

 

not worth the effort generally speaking

 

Or, you know......just not happening as much as Trump and the GOP claim it is.

[PleaseBlitz]

Will just note that Crystal Mason was sentenced to 5 years in prison because she voted, using her real name and ID, not realizing that she wasn't supposed to because she had a record.

 

 

McCrae Dowless, the person at the center of the NC election fraud case, faces three felony charges of obstruction of justice, two charges of conspiracy to commit obstruction of justice and two charges of possession of absentee ballot.  He intentionally collected and either altered or threw out hundreds or possibly thousands of absentee ballots.  According to this article, he faces up to 2 years in prison.  

 

 

[twa]

1 hour ago, NoCalMike said:

 

Or, you know......just not happening as much as Trump and the GOP claim it is.

 

If you expect politicians not to lie or exaggerate you will usually be disappointed IME

 

Just like Dems saying it doesn't occur ect.

[thegreaterbuzzette]

3 hours ago, redskinss said:

So are the Democrats just taking a page from the Republican playbook by putting up so many candidates?

 

It has to be so that the smear train cant get really rolling until after the primaries and therefore less time to get **** to stick to the walls right?

I think in theory this is a good thing. It allows the voters to more transparently review options and have choices. Rather than the GOP/DEM political machines just deciding "who" will represent them. I think this was the DEMs fatal flaw with going with Clinton instead of Bernie. I think a pretty strong case could me made that Bernie would have beat Trump in 2016.

 

Honestly I feel that if Bernie or Clinton had won we would still being having HUGE issues and I'd be just as unsettled. But at least they would have done it with finesse, tact, and respect!

[twa]

1 hour ago, PleaseBlitz said:

Will just note that Crystal Mason was sentenced to 5 years in prison because she voted, using her real name and ID, not realizing that she wasn't supposed to because she had a record.

 

 

McCrae Dowless, the person at the center of the NC election fraud case, faces three felony charges of obstruction of justice, two charges of conspiracy to commit obstruction of justice and two charges of possession of absentee ballot.  He intentionally collected and either altered or threw out hundreds or possibly thousands of absentee ballots.  According to this article, he faces up to 2 years in prison.  

 

 

 

How much of that 5 yrs was because she committed the crime while on parole?

The sentence for the voting crime was 10 months+ 26months parole

 

[Hersh]

8 minutes ago, twa said:

 

How much of that 5 yrs was because she committed the crime while on parole?

The sentence for the voting crime was 10 months+ 26months parole

 

 

It’s an absurd sentence either way

[PleaseBlitz]

15 minutes ago, twa said:

 

How much of that 5 yrs was because she committed the crime while on parole?

The sentence for the voting crime was 10 months+ 26months parole

 

 

All of it.  If she hadn't been on parole, it wouldn't have been a crime, all she did was vote.  Point is, she got 5 years for making one mistake, the NC guy can only get up to 2 years for intentionally committing widespread election fraud across multiple elections (and costing taxpayers millions of dollars).  

[twa]

1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

All of it.  If she hadn't been on parole, it wouldn't have been a crime.  Point is, she got 5 years for making one mistake, the NC guy can only get up to 2 years for intentionally committing widespread election fraud across multiple elections.  

 

 

Don't do the crime then do another crime while on parole impacts the NC guy as well.

 

by your standard there  we will not know how long he serves till he makes it crime free thru his parole period.

[PleaseBlitz]

Just now, twa said:

 

 

Don't do the crime then do another crime while on parole impacts the NC guy as well.

 

by your standard there  we will not know how long he serves till he makes it crime free thru his parole period.

 

Your sense of justice is as bad as your writing. 

[NoCalMike]

28 minutes ago, twa said:

 

If you expect politicians not to lie or exaggerate you will usually be disappointed IME

 

Just like Dems saying it doesn't occur ect.

 

Don't think Dems said "it doesn't happen" I believe they said there is no evidence or studies showing it happens in the numbers being claimed and/or enough to sway elections. Also, the narrative that droves of people are out there purposely doing it or as Trump claimed "people going to their cars and changing clothes so they can come back in and vote again"

 

 

[Momma There Goes That Man]

2 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

 

Don't think Dems said "it doesn't happen" I believe they said there is no evidence or studies showing it happens in the numbers being claimed and/or enough to sway elections. Also, the narrative that droves of people are out there purposely doing it or as Trump claimed "people going to their cars and changing clothes so they can come back in and vote again"

 

Don't forget the buses upon buses full of illegals being transported from Mexico to all parts of the US with their sole intent to vote for the democrat 

[nonniey]

25 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

Your sense of justice is as bad as your writing. 

All  he is doing is pointing out the apples to oranges comparison you used. She got got 10 months for voter fraud not five years as you allude. The additional 4 plus years was for her previous crime (whatever that was). 

[PleaseBlitz]

8 minutes ago, nonniey said:

All  he is doing is pointing out the apples to oranges comparison you used. She got got 10 months for voter fraud not five years as you allude. The additional 4 plus years was for her previous crime (whatever that was). 

 

This is incorrect.  She got 10 months on a federal charge (violating the terms of her release) and 5 years on a state charge (voting when she wasn't supposed to).

 

So you think that is just?  She made a mistake, resulting in one uncounted vote (it was a provisional ballot), now she's back in for 5 years.  

 

McCrae Dowless intentionally and repeatedly committed election fraud specifically to fraudulently tip an election.  He might get 2 years.

 

Apples to oranges whatever, no two situations are exactly alike, do you think that is a just outcome?  Honest question.

 

[PleaseBlitz]

Of course this had to be written 

 

Beto O’Rourke standing on countertops, explained

 

https://www.vox.com/2019/3/22/18274294/beto-orourke-standing-on-countertops-tables

 

Quote

Beto O’Rourke likes to stand on countertops while campaigning for president.

 

It’s not a totally unreasonable thing to do. Normally at a political rally, the featured speaker would be up on an elevated stage just like any other kind of performer. But campaigning in the early primary states often features a lot of appearances in more intimate settings — house parties hosted by supporters or local notables, restaurants or coffee shop appearances, etc. There’s no stage in these kinds of places, but there generally is a countertop — so why not hop up and make your own stage?

...

Becoming a meme over something basically innocuous, in other words, is part of a pretty good strategy to hog as much attention as possible.

 

But it’s also true that, in its way, climbing up onto counters and standing on tables is a way of throwing some pretty sharp elbows.

 

Beto’s main rivals are old

Ronald Reagan was 69 on Inauguration Day and 77 when he left office eight years later. Bernie Sanders is already 77, Joe Biden is 76, and Trump is 72. It’s only in the context of the septuagenarian frontrunners and incumbent that Elizabeth Warren — who at 69 years old today would, if she wins, be the second-oldest president ever — comes across as a relatively youthful option. (Kamala Harris, at 54 years old, wouldn’t be cashing Social Security checks in office but would still be older on Inauguration Day than Barack Obama, George W. Bush, or Bill Clinton was.)

 

Beto, meanwhile, is 47. The age of the contenders is clearly a factor on voters’ minds as they assess the field, but it’s not really something that would be seemly or appropriate to raise directly.

 

Climbing up on top of various objects — like chatting with voters while literally running a 5k — is a good way of making the point more implicitly. It starts with getting Democrats who don’t necessarily have strong preferences about the 2020 candidates to just imagine the sheer joy of if Beto were the nominee watching him physically humiliate the prideful and loathsome Trump.

 

This also made me realize that we have so many old people running for Pres.  The ages at the beginning of their term for Clinton, W and Obama were 46, 54 and 47 respectively.