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Standing during the Pledge or National Anthem


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3 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Yes.  They are both protected under the 1st.

1). No one directly said it but some SEEM to struggle with it.

 

2). Absolutely.  Do you agree that it is important to defend speech you don't agree with?

 

Ummm...... What?

 

There's something I don't agree with, and there's asking a Puerto Rican-Italian guy if he would defend the rights of white supremacists who support the subjugation of all rights, and eradication  of all those who do not look like them.

 

 

Gee, thats a hard one to answer. How about **** no

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5 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

When you've been so deep in the GOP muck for so long that your natural reflex is to compare peaceful kneeling for equal rights to ARMED OPEN CARRY NAZI MARCHERS...repeatedly.

 

The propangda is powerful.  It just dominates so many minds.

 

Careful....we'll be teetering on the violence in Chicago talking point next....

 

 

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8 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

 

Says the dude who groups peaceful kneeling football players with armed Nazis every chance he gets.

Just saying they are both exercising their rights.  Are they not?  

7 minutes ago, RonArtest15 said:

 

Careful....we'll be teetering on the violence in Chicago talking point next....

 

 

Show me where I have EVER brought that up.

 

 

perhaps you all should review my posting history.  I am not TWA.

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Just now, RonArtest15 said:

 

Careful....we'll be teetering on the violence in Chicago talking point next....

 

 

 

Have you seen the meme comparing the dead and wounded to the Vegas shooting?

 

some people have no class.

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And in all honesty, i only brought up the Constitution because someone here wanted to tell us how kneeling was disrespectful to flag (unbeknownst to our Founding Fathers, who, you know, made sure that anyone who actually bothered to look that up centuries down the road, would let someone know what a dumbass they were, every time they tried it.

 

Other than that, i don't **** with it all that much, just so i don't find myself in headscratchingly retarded arguments about why i should be defending the rights of people my grandfather fought against.

 

I am against those who are against freedom, justice, equality, human decency, and just general, plain ass common sense. Basically, everything good in America.

 

 They have more rights than i ever will, anyway

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I don't like this new direction owners are taking.  It seems really sketchy and makes me wonder what went down behind doors.

I don't think I would have been that upset or surprised if the owners had initially come out against the protests, but this is a rather bizarre reversal considering Jerry Jones himself knelt along with his team.  Something about this feels wrong.  Are they being pressured to do this?

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1 minute ago, visionary said:

I don't like this new direction owners are taking.  It seems really sketchy and makes me wonder what went down behind doors.

I don't think I would have been that upset or surprised if the owners had initially come out against the protests, but this is a rather bizarre reversal considering Jerry Jones himself knelt along with his team.  Something about this feels wrong.  Are they being pressured to do this?

If I had to guess, and that is all this is, they thought they could let the players "get it out of their system" and then stand on they let them protest while also stopping it after the one occurrence.  Billionaires, the ultimate fence sitters.  I guarantee everything they do has only their pocketbook as consideration.

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2 hours ago, spjunkies said:

This is about to get way uglier

 

These dudes are literally risking thier brain for money. They are gonna sell out. I expect it but I will be extremely disappointed when it happens. 

 

White man say no n-word, you stand. And they will stand. They call the NFL modern day slavery for a reason. 

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Just now, BenningRoadSkin said:

Be clear

jerry jones and the Cowboys knelt before the anthem, not during.

 

Jones was never for it and could not give a damn. These owners don't give a damn either.

 

Snyder looked like a damn hostage when he linked arms with Norman.

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5 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

Be clear

jerry jones and the Cowboys knelt before the anthem, not during.

True, but timing hasn't really made much difference to the response.

 

 

Looking at what Jones said, it's interestingly vague and repetitive. 

https://www.apnews.com/9adb272073514fe9843e501007f1708c?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=AP

Quote

“I know this, we cannot ... in the NFL in any way give the implication that we tolerate disrespecting the flag,” Jones, also the team’s general manager, said after a 35-31 loss to Green Bay.


“We know that there is a serious debate in this country about those issues, but there is no question in my mind that the National Football League and the Dallas Cowboys are going to stand up for the flag. So we’re clear.”

 

The Cowboys knelt arm-in-arm before the national anthem when they played at Arizona two weeks ago, days after President Donald Trump criticized NFL players for anthem protests.

 

Dallas players, coaches and others, including Jones and his family, were among those in the line in Arizona. All of them stood during the anthem, with arms still locked.

 

Other than that, Dallas players have stood on the sideline, many with hands over their hearts, during the anthem ever since former 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick started kneeling last season in protest of what he believed were instances of police brutality in the U.S.

 

Jones said he wasn’t aware of whether any of his players had raised a fist at the end of the anthem before the Green Bay game.

 

“I don’t know about that,” said Jones, who was inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in August. “But if there’s anything that is disrespectful to the flag, then we will not play. OK? Understand? If we are disrespecting the flag, then we won’t play. Period.”

 

Jones said showing respect for the flag and the anthem is more important to him than any potential issues of team unity.

 

“There is no room here if it comes between looking non-supportive of our players and of each other or creating the impression that you’re disrespecting the flag, we will be non-supportive of each other,” Jones said. “We will not disrespect the flag.”

 

Although he does say team unity isn't as important, so it does seem like he's referring to anything done for that effect that could be interpreted as disrespecting the flag, though he doesn't call out any specific action as doing that.

Edited by visionary
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3 minutes ago, Llevron said:

 

They call the NFL modern day slavery for a reason. 

Who calls it that?  And what is their justification for that statement?  That may be the dumbest thing I have ever heard.  Since when do slaves get paid like that?  

 

This is may need to be another thread.

1 minute ago, Llevron said:

 

You are grouping yourself playa

By defending free speech?  Defending things you agree with is easy.  The real test of freedom is if you can defend what you don't agree with.

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2 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

Who calls it that?  And what is their justification for that statement?  That may be the dumbest thing I have ever heard.  Since when do slaves get paid like that?  

 

The players. You can call it dumb it you want. When you walk into a college station filled with 90% white people sayin 'Our boys' (who are 90% black, btw) are better then theirs you may (or may not, you are purposefully dense sometimes) get it. I literally get called something racist every time I go to a tech game. These same people are Redskins fans. That **** doesn't just stop in school. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.si.com/nfl/2016/11/16/seattle-seahawks-doug-baldwin-nfl-modern-day-slavery

 

2 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

 

By defending free speech?  Defending things you agree with is easy.  The real test of freedom is if you can defend what you don't agree with.

 

Sure. I get that.  No argument here. But once you compare people arguing for genocide and people wanting to be free from persecution as equal you are emulating the devil. Not just playinghis advocate. If that is truly your stance you are a bad person and I don't have room within me to budge on that point. Agree yo disagree or whatever makes you feel better homie. But if you can't see the difference the problem is you. 

8 minutes ago, visionary said:
 

 

 

I guess the vets just don't get it huh?

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32 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said:

The real test of freedom is if you can defend what you don't agree with.

 

Says you

 

To me, the real test of freedom is putting yourself out there to protect those who's freedom ( in every sense of the word) is in question.

 

You can be upset/miffed all you want to that we don't support neo nazi scumbags, or wait, people we "don't agree with," fact is, we didn't fire them. Their bosses did, for the same reason you were quick to point to the reason why owner x can bench player x.

 

Maybe you should call them up and ask them why they decided to fire their employees when all they wanted to do was show up, harass others, wave their torches around and spread a little hate.

 

And like I said, I don't have to defend them (nor will i ever). This country is already doing a bangup job at that

 

Edited by Mr. Sinister
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There's probably been about, oh, 500 nationwide gatherings of peaceful pro-Confederate statue protestors over the past couple years.  These folks would be a vastly more appropriate comparison vis a vis the NFL protests.  They wave their flags and hand out their pamphlets and then move on with their lives.

 

But we got Nazis on the brain.  And we just can't get past it because...reasons.

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The lesson here is that NFL players need a stronger union.  

 

We can argue principles and rights all day, and we should, but power always gets the last word.  The owners can black ball players and make up patriotism rules as they go, because no one can do a thing about it.  

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