ESPN: Kirk Cousins Open to Being Traded

[Taylor703]

I would have to argue that Jordan Reed, nor many 3rd round picks are more valuable than a quality backup QB. You have to think pretty hard about trading a quality QB. The value dwarfs other positions in general. I think the reality is that he will be more valuable to us as a back up, than to another team. No way I trade him for less than a second pick (which I doubt anyone will offer) and I would hesitate to take that.

I disagree. Jordan Reed when healthy is far more integral to this teams success than Cousins, who will hardly see the field unless Griffin is injured or plays poorly. I understand people are terrified of dealing Cousins away due to Griffins injury history but you simply cannot hold onto someone who will not make an impact on the field very much when dealing him away gives us the possibility to find someone who can contribute and make an impact.

[skinsfan4128]

I wouldn't do Cousins JUST for a 3rd this year. Not enough. However, I'd be interested in one of two other options:

 

1) A 3rd this year and a conditional 3rd next year (Bump to 2nd if Browns make the playoffs and Cousins starts X games)

 

2) A 3rd and 4th for Kirk, as Cleveland has 2 of both. Perhaps Indy's 3rd (19th of round 3) and Clevelands own 4th (6th of round 4)

 

Essentially, a pick to "replace" Cousins and an extra player. Could take a project QB like Boyd, Thomas, McCarron? in the 4th or 5th to replace Cousins,

 

As I said, I don't like JUST getting a 3rd for Cousins. I think Cousins is worth more than an unknown 3rd rounder that would cause us to have a hole at backup QB. If you get two picks for him, then you at least get an extra player AND replace that hole you just created.

 

-------

 

Now, all that said...I think the Browns take Manziel if he's still on the board and they end up having a top 10 offense in yards next year with Kyle Shanahan bringing the offense from 2011 over and pairing it up with Manziel.

I could get behind this scenario, Z. But I still believe you had to consider a 2nd if the Browns are ready to deal it (foolishly or not). The two options you presaented might very well be more likely for the Browns to offer, particularly if Kyle is the driving force to get KC as his QB. I had a feeling that if Kyle landed in Cleveland that we'd hear rumblings of a KC trade to Cleveland. Seems that Kyle likes KC a bit more than we originally thought.

 

Either way, if we can land quality pick(s), we would be amiss not to pull the trigger, make the trade, and hope that it bears fruition in the acquisition of quality players to fill the numerous holes this team has.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

The Browns' 2nd rounder, as far as trade value, would be equal to a 55 (late 2nd), 3rd and 4th.

 

So if you can get the Browns' 35th pick, you do that, because you can use the 34th pick on whoever falls there and use 35 to trade down and amass picks! I would be okay with the 3rd/4th for Cousins too, but if you're debating whether to do that or the 2nd, you do the 2nd, since that could result in a trade down that would exceed the 3rd/4th

[Est.1974]

I wouldn't do Cousins JUST for a 3rd this year. Not enough. However, I'd be interested in one of two other options:

Another option on top of the third for me would be for us to also flip our #34 with their #26. That number #26 could result in great ammo to trade back.

 

Last year the Vikes traded up to #29 and gave the Patriots a 2nd,3rd,4th and 7th.

 

Not saying that's a given to happen, but moving up to the #26 opens up the chance to create more value in a trade back, imo. Or we get our hands on a better prospect at #26 ourselves.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

UKSKins...

 

Possibly. The difference in value between 26 and 34 on paper is 140, which is the equivalent of a late 3rd.

That being said, the earlier in the draft you are, the more teams are willing to move in and get someone, and overpay the pick's value, as evidenced by your example.

[ZRagone]

I could get behind this scenario, Z. But I still believe you had to consider a 2nd if the Browns are ready to deal it (foolishly or not). The two options you presaented might very well be more likely for the Browns to offer, particularly if Kyle is the driving force to get KC as his QB. I had a feeling that if Kyle landed in Cleveland that we'd hear rumblings of a KC trade to Cleveland. Seems that Kyle likes KC a bit more than we originally thought.

 

Either way, if we can land quality pick(s), we would be amiss not to pull the trigger, make the trade, and hope that it bears fruition in the acquisition of quality players to fill the numerous holes this team has.

 

If they offer us a 2nd I take it and don't look back...I said as much earlier. You get offered a 1st or 2nd this year you take it and run.  Anything less than that and it'd probably be a no unless there were multiple picks involved in my mind.

 

I'd take a 2nd over any combination of late rounds picks except possibly both their 3rds.

[Cliffmark1]

Exactly.  There are plenty of veteran QBs out there that could do what Kirk does and more. 

Vet QBs cost money, more money than Cousins demands.  It wouldn't matter if it was capless but its not.  Its a cost benefit analysis.  Do you want to spend more money, or picks for what gain?  I'm just saying the difference in cost in cap space is going to be about 30-50% or more bringing in a Vet and the payoff has to be enough to justify the costs of replacing him.  I don't think Rex makes the roster, I don't even know why he made it last year, with all due respect, hes a good guy, we were just hard for capspace.

 

 

I disagree. Jordan Reed when healthy is far more integral to this teams success than Cousins, who will hardly see the field unless Griffin is injured or plays poorly. I understand people are terrified of dealing Cousins away due to Griffins injury history but you simply cannot hold onto someone who will not make an impact on the field very much when dealing him away gives us the possibility to find someone who can contribute and make an impact.

well its not just his history, its his style of play and his build. 

If RG3 is healthy than reed is more important but can we agree kc is def more important than many third rounders we have bet on over the years.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

Vet QBs cost money, more money than Cousins demands.  It wouldn't matter if it was capless but its not.  Its a cost benefit analysis.  Do you want to spend more money, or picks for what gain?  I'm just saying the difference in cost in cap space is going to be about 30-50% or more bringing in a Vet and the payoff has to be enough to justify the costs of replacing him.  I don't think Rex makes the roster, I don't even know why he made it last year, with all due respect, hes a good guy, we were just hard for capspace.

 

But, if you can take Cousins, trade him for a 2nd round pick, and trade that 2nd round pick back to acquire a 3rd ... you could potentially replace Kirk's $600k salary with a vet QB's $1.2 million salary, but also add two young, likely starters for a combined $1.4-$1.6 million, not only for 2014, but for 3-4 more years. So looking beyond THIS year, yeah, you have to pay maybe half a million to a million more for your backup QB, but you could theoretically add TWO starters for cheap, where you otherwise would need to go out and spend $2-4 million per year on a similar quality player via FA.

 

A cost/benefit can go much deeper than just "Cousins' replacement is going to be worse but cost twice as much" ... sure, but you're replacing Kirk with two quality starters, whereas his value as a backup QB is debatable.

 

I propose this example: Trade Kirk Cousins to Cleveland for the 35th pick. Trade the 35th pick to move down to 50 and pick up a 3rd rounder in the process. With the 50th pick you draft Cyril Richardson. With the 3rd rounder you draft Christian Jones.

 

So would you rather have:

 

Scenario 1: Pay Kirk Cousins $650k as your backup QB. Spend about $7 million to bring in a free agent LG and ILB.

 

Scenario 2: Trade Kirk Cousins. Sign Seneca Wallace for $1.2 million. Use draft picks created by Cousins trade to draft Christian Jones and Cyril Richardson. Between those two contracts, spend about $1.6 to $2.0 combined for the next 3-4 years on a starting LG and ILB. Use $6 million excess money to spend on other needs.

[pjfootballer]

But, if you can take Cousins, trade him for a 2nd round pick, and trade that 2nd round pick back to acquire a 3rd ... you could potentially replace Kirk's $600k salary with a vet QB's $1.2 million salary, but also add two young, likely starters for a combined $1.4-$1.6 million, not only for 2014, but for 3-4 more years. So looking beyond THIS year, yeah, you have to pay maybe half a million to a million more for your backup QB, but you could theoretically add TWO starters for cheap, where you otherwise would need to go out and spend $2-4 million per year on a similar quality player via FA.

A cost/benefit can go much deeper than just "Cousins' replacement is going to be worse but cost twice as much" ... sure, but you're replacing Kirk with two quality starters, whereas his value as a backup QB is debatable.

And I'll add that I think we can afford a veteran QB for 1.2 million.

[goskins10]

Again...trade TYPE.

The players mentioned are irrelevant. ..let's discuss whether a player + pick swap deal is more plausible, & realistic to consider.

Of course nobody wants Blackmon...heck, some don't want Gordon. That's not the point.

(Sorry mods for double post...working with cell phone here)

 

Not trying to be an ass, but maybe best not mention a specific player if you don't mean a specific player. Since you specifically named several players people are going to respond to those players.

 

If you want to stay hypothetical say - "Would we be interested in a pick+player trade" leaving player open, or better something like a starting OLB, Slot WR, development FS, something more specific than just throwing out "trade type" would make more sense. In the abstract  the answer is always going to be no as you don't know what player you are getting.

 

I personally don't want to trade him at all unless we get a kinds ransom. I know people disagree as they think because he struggled in the 3 games shanny threw him to wolves on a team that he had lost, that's the best he will be. The interesting thing is most of those same people say RGIII will be fine because of how he played in 2012 and using last year isn't fair, which I absolutely agree with. Well, Cousins did pretty well in 2012 himself with the limited chances he had. Why doesn't he get a pass?

[Fat Stupid Loser]

 

I disagree. Jordan Reed when healthy is far more integral to this teams success than Cousins, who will hardly see the field unless Griffin is injured or plays poorly. I understand people are terrified of dealing Cousins away due to Griffins injury history but you simply cannot hold onto someone who will not make an impact on the field very much when dealing him away gives us the possibility to find someone who can contribute and make an impact.

I hear you, if Cousins never sees the field, you're right. But that is not why you have a backup QB. His value is insurance. How many starting QB's go down each year? How many times does it end the team's season?

All the Jordan Reeds in the world are useless if Colt Brennan or Taj Boyd is your backup and has to play.

[Bang]

I hear you, if Cousins never sees the field, you're right. But that is not why you have a backup QB. His value is insurance. How many starting QB's go down each year? How many times does it end the team's season?

All the Jordan Reeds in the world are useless if Colt Brennan or Taj Boyd is your backup and has to play.

By th same token, we've seen Good Kirk and Bad Kirk when he's come in to play. (Bad Kirk has a goatee...)

I would not say we're "set" at backup QB.. we like him, and we think he can play, but all players play better with play, if you'll pardon that verbal mess..   and backups don't play much.. leads to spotty performance when pressed in.

 

I'd say that his ability to come in and play well over say... Rex's ability to come in and play well isn't much different over the short term.

Long term, you have something there.. I think we'd all prefer KC. But I don't know if it's wise to plan for long term backups.. I think it may be better served to get trade value, and take a shot on another backup, low round draft choice / low rate vet..

 

At the bottom of it all is a roll of the dice..  do you roll on the trade and hope you don't have to worry about long term backup,, or do you roll on KC being a guy who can be that long term answer if needed..  and if so.. how much are you willing to refuse to sit on that possibility?

 

~Bang

[Canadianfanforlife]

Personally I don't want to trade K.C. RG3's health worries me to no end. Putting that aside lets say we do trade K.C. for a 2nd or a 3rd, do we really trust Allen or a rookie HC who's never had to draft anyone into the NFL to use that pick wisely? Do we trust that they'll use that pick on a player that'll fill a hole? I don't know.....

 

HTTR!!!

[Cliffmark1]

But, if you can take Cousins, trade him for a 2nd round pick, and trade that 2nd round pick back to acquire a 3rd ... you could potentially replace Kirk's $600k salary with a vet QB's $1.2 million salary, but also add two young, likely starters for a combined $1.4-$1.6 million, not only for 2014, but for 3-4 more years. So looking beyond THIS year, yeah, you have to pay maybe half a million to a million more for your backup QB, but you could theoretically add TWO starters for cheap, where you otherwise would need to go out and spend $2-4 million per year on a similar quality player via FA.

 

you had me at 2nd round pick.  lol  I'd be ok with that.  I'd be ok with a pretty high third tbh but thats my line. 

 

In terms of player for player trades.  I mean if you could get a NFL starting caliber free safety for Kirk I'd do it but not A WR with ?s

[Taylor703]

Personally I don't want to trade K.C. RG3's health worries me to no end. Putting that aside lets say we do trade K.C. for a 2nd or a 3rd, do we really trust Allen or a rookie HC who's never had to draft anyone into the NFL to use that pick wisely? Do we trust that they'll use that pick on a player that'll fill a hole? I don't know.....

 

HTTR!!!

So what you're saying is we shouldn't use any of our draft choices? Come on man, great teams weren't build holding onto back ups who don't contribute to the action on the field. As long as Griffin is healthy than Cousins contributes nothing.

[Mocountyskins]

People that think we get a 2nd for KC are smoking the finest of dope.

[Taylor703]

People that think we get a 2nd for KC are smoking the finest of dope.

They played the clip on 980 from Clayton's visit this morning to Mike and Mike. He said Cousins value throughout the league right now is a 2nd and based on how things play out it could go even higher. This league puts a premium on QBs and Cousins torched a decent Browns defense on their field and that was with next to no playing time. Teams are not going to hold the last three games against him as much as fans think because the team had quit.

I'm not a fan who overvalues our own players but I promise you what Cousins brings in a trade is going to shock you. He's young, talented and has the personality to be a field general, a personality fans and owners alike love. He doesn't have RGIII's talent but not many do, Cousins however can ball. He has prototypical size, good mobility and good enough arm strength to make every throw. I won't buy into the hype and believe the last three games ruined his value when the Browns, Ravens and first half against the Falcon games show you what he's capable of.

But most of all the browns who hold two first round picks would be investing next to nothing by dealing a second for a guy whom they'd only have to pay fourth round money. Even if he exceeds expectations by rule he cannot negotiate a new deal until his rookie contract is up. If he becomes a franchise QB in his first year there than they control his rights on fourth round money for two full seasons.

[Bang]

People that think we get a 2nd for KC are smoking the finest of dope.

... and?

 

But you make a good point, I really don't care how many pretzels the dog eats. 

 

~Bong

[redskins55]

If teams offer anything lower than a 4th you take it!  You cant have a back-up QB on your roster who has trade value just sitting there waiting to become a free agent when then you'd get absolutely nothing for him!! Also, we have to many holes to fill and to little draft picks this year to simply have picks riding the bench.

 

I actually think the Skins would be compensated with more like a 4th rounder this year and a 4th  rounder next year with the potential of the 4th  becoming a 2nd if Cousins plays 75% of the snaps this year.

[MrJL]

I'd just like to ask the people who think guys like Kolb will sour teams on trading for QBs one question. What, in the history of the league, makes you think teams learn any lessons when it comes to QBs?

[War Paint]

People that think we get a 2nd for KC are smoking the finest of dope.

That's why we should just go ahead and forget about trading him.  I don't want him traded anyways.

[pjfootballer]

Why is everyone so concerned if Griffin gets hurt that Cousins is the "only" QB in the entire NFL that could back him up and run the offense?  Are the other QBs in the league that stupid or not talented enough to come in to be the backup?  Get for real.  If we get offered a 2nd or 1st, you make the deal, don't look back and go out and get a veteran backup.  The hell with the cap ramifications.  It's not like we don't have the cap space to sign a backup QB.  You guys act like Cousins is married to Griffin and one can't function without the other.  He wasn't drafted to be his lifelong buddy or eternal backup.  The guy wants to play and if we can accomodate him and get something significant for him, you pull the trigger.

[Momma There Goes That Man]

They played the clip on 980 from Clayton's visit this morning to Mike and Mike. He said Cousins value throughout the league right now is a 2nd and based on how things play out it could go even higher. 

 

Goodbye! Get on the phone and send him out. An extra 2nd could go a long way in this draft for a guy that, under the best case scenario and plans, is never supposed to see the field. 

[theTruthTeller]

Why is everyone so concerned if Griffin gets hurt that Cousins is the "only" QB in the entire NFL that could back him up and run the offense?  Are the other QBs in the league that stupid or not talented enough to come in to be the backup?  Get for real.  If we get offered a 2nd or 1st, you make the deal, don't look back and go out and get a veteran backup.  The hell with the cap ramifications.  It's not like we don't have the cap space to sign a backup QB.  You guys act like Cousins is married to Griffin and one can't function without the other.  He wasn't drafted to be his lifelong buddy or eternal backup.  The guy wants to play and if we can accomodate him and get something significant for him, you pull the trigger.

Also, his trade value drops to nothing next year.  So if he spends all meaningful playing time on the bench again this year, we're basically watching a draft pick fly out the window.

 

On the other hand, I don't see why anyone would pony up a first or second for him.  If Kyle wants someone who knows his system, why wouldn't he just pick up Matt Schaub for nothing and let him duke it out with Hoyer for the starting position in training camp?

[skins island connection]

 Trading Cousins.   Wow.

 

 This board has reduced itself to getting rid of a good back-up, possibly starting QB, because 'well we just need draft picks to take a chance on in hopes we find a gem'.

 

  The MINUTE a player shows promise, why is it always the norm for the Redskins to get rid of him? I'd bet that the majority are multiple divorcees! 

 

 The guy has done zero to warrant trading him away; zero. He hasn't been busted smoking weed, beating up his girlfriend, DWI, hated in the locker room, nothing. Only thing he has done was step in when he was called upon, and led the team to victories in crucial games we needed in order to stay in the NFCE race, and now some want him gone. what is wrong with you people?

 

Fact is, until the great wonderful perfect Griffin not only learns to slide, but improves alot from last season, Cousins is the absolute best scenario this team has. Griffin is no lock to be a top tier QB, and whoever believes he will be is just wrong; there's that word called 'proven', and 1 season doesn't equate into proven. Thus far, we've seen Griffin have 1 good season and 1 bad one, and the jury is out on him until he proves otherwise; until then/if this happens, Cousins needs to be kept. Remember, Griffin's one-man highlite reel is 1 boneheaded mistake away from riding the bench on IR, and if you're willing to trade Cousins for an unknown prospect while giving up on the season, then you'll never be satisfied in life.