No Excuses Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I believe there is enough dark matter in the universe that eventually expansion will stop and contraction will begin. Dark energy is what is accelerating the expansion of the universe. Right now, we know very little about how it works so it's not a given that it will continue the acceleration or if it will eventually reverse sometime in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techboy Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I believe there is enough dark matter in the universe that eventually expansion will stop and contraction will begin. Actually, the prevailing theory at the moment is that the universe is not just expanding but actually accelerating, an observation that led to the 2011 Nobel Prize in Physics. This seems to be inconsistent with a Big Crunch. You could always worry about The Big Rip, though. From the abstract: Cosmologists have long wondered whether the Universe will eventually re-collapse and end with a Big Crunch, or expand forever, becoming increasingly cold and empty. Recent evidence for a flat Universe, possibly with a cosmological constant or some other sort of negative-pressure dark energy, has suggested that our fate is the latter. However, the data may actually be pointing toward an astonishingly different cosmic end game. Here, we explore the consequences that follow if the dark energy is phantom energy, in which the sum of the pressure and energy density is negative. The positive phantom-energy density becomes infinite in finite time, overcoming all other forms of matter, such that the gravitational repulsion rapidly brings our brief epoch of cosmic structure to a close. The phantom energy rips apart the Milky Way, solar system, Earth, and ultimately the molecules, atoms, nuclei, and nucleons of which we are composed, before the death of the Universe in a ``Big Rip''. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 You could always worry about The Big Rip, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I think we'll find that those of us who are less inclined to believe that the universe happened by chance, are also less inclined to believe that it has no purpose. (i.e. If you believe in a higher power, you believe there's a purpose.) That won't hold true across the board of course, but I'd expect a solid trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I've always thought that 14billion years ago something happened in another universe where a 'splosion' created this Universe. We are the leftovers of its purpose, and to rub it in we can't see most of the matter or energy holding us together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I think we'll find that those of us who are less inclined to believe that the universe happened by chance, are also less inclined to believe that it has no purpose. (i.e. If you believe in a higher power, you believe there's a purpose.) That won't hold true across the board of course, but I'd expect a solid trend. You're overlooking a rather gargantuan point that there's the premise that "purpose" (on myriad levels) is something you can (and we do) create, "universe creation by chance" notwithstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 It exists to serve me. I thought it was to piss me off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I thought it was to piss me off that was my bidding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I thought it was to piss me off Haven't you inverted that? :pfft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grhqofb5 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 I've always thought that 14billion years ago something happened in another universe where a 'splosion' created this Universe.We are the leftovers of its purpose, and to rub it in we can't see most of the matter or energy holding us together. If you step back and think about it, 14 billion years is just a measure of time. So rewind back to year "negative 1," and we should be able to see what was there. Kind of blows my mind, because there is an answer to this question. And all that vast expanse of space we always talk about.... should be right there as well, I mean it'll be like right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
styx491 Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 http://xkcd.com/1071/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destructis Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Why yes it does, it's here so old Japanese men can wear schoolgirl outfits [ATTACH]46973[/ATTACH] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 To answer OPs question: No. On the same note, is Mathematics a human created idea or is it really "universal?" Because math is based on human created principles and numbers, yet it's necessary for the kind of life we live. Since that's the case, how necessary IS it really (in the grand scheme of things) if it's human created anyways? Mathematics are simply our way of creating a model for reality based on what we can perceive. It is more an invented tool and a process than it is some sort of inherent thing although it can be used to construct representations of and models for ALL things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Curious One Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Originally Posted by styx491On the same note, is Mathematics a human created idea or is it really "universal?" Because math is based on human created principles and numbers, yet it's necessary for the kind of life we live. Since that's the case, how necessary IS it really (in the grand scheme of things) if it's human created anyways? Mathematics are simply our way of creating a model for reality based on what we can perceive. It is more an invented tool and a process than it is some sort of inherent thing although it can be used to construct representations of and models for ALL things. I don't agree that Mathmematics is soley a human creation or invention. The only thing that is unique about it to us is the way we report it (in other words, our numeral systems). If there are other intelligent life forms in the universe, I would be surprised if they had a base 10 numbering system. But math is real, we didn't make it up. one apple plus one apple really is two apples. One apple plus one orange equals two pieces of fruit. What is unique to humans is our perception of time, distance, and light. Our perceptions of those change with, ahem, time. We all know that there are light frequencies we cannot see, such as infrared. And among those that need reading glasses as we got older haven't spent time "trying to get the light right" before we went to the eye doctor? Time goes by faster the older you get. 100 yards seems like a long way when you are a small kid. Adults don't see 100 yards as being such a long way. Until you get older and can't walk as well as you used to, then 100 yards seems like a long way again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebluefood Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Personal belief: yes. What it is, I cannot say. I haven't fully realized my own purpose in life and can't even begin to explain what the entire universe's purpose could be; but I do believe it has a purpose. Objectively speaking: I can't say and no one on this Earth can say they *know* if it does. They can believe something one way or another, but no one can truly know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I want to vote yes again and provide visual evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
China Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I want to vote yes again and provide visual evidence. http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s107/jumboskins/porpoise.jpg So long, and thanks for all the fish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I don't agree that Mathmematics is soley a human creation or invention. The only thing that is unique about it to us is the way we report it (in other words, our numeral systems). If there are other intelligent life forms in the universe, I would be surprised if they had a base 10 numbering system.But math is real, we didn't make it up. one apple plus one apple really is two apples. One apple plus one orange equals two pieces of fruit. Mathematics is not the existence of the fruit, though. It is an extension of language that serves to describe certain qualities of the fruit (in this case, quantity) as it exists in the universe. That language is entirely made up by us and it is not actually based on what will actually happen 100% of the time in the universe. It is based on our best estimation of what will happen based on our collective experience in what we perceive reality to be. Something as simple as 1+1=2 is so commonplace and thoroughly tested that we can pragmatically state that it is 100% truth but when you start dealing with more complicated math (particularly in the form of physics applications) you find yourself dealing with a fair bit less certainty. Your point about the probability of other intelligent life forms using math is really neither here nor there. While it makes sense that they would develop an analogous system that doesn't really answer the question being asked at all. It says more about the usefulness of math than the nature of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RemoveSnyder Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 ... progeny? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 On the same note, is Mathematics a human created idea or is it really "universal?" Because math is based on human created principles and numbers, yet it's necessary for the kind of life we live. Since that's the case, how necessary IS it really (in the grand scheme of things) if it's human created anyways?To answer your question, I believe the universe does NOT need a purpose mainly because science/physics/math do not need a purpose to exist, and they MAY still exist without any human thought or rationality because those things are considered "primal nature laws," as in, laws that don't change regardless of what happens, and laws that we live our lives by. After all, gravity and anti-matter are the reason the universe exists in the first place, and gravity is a beast of nature that cannot be contained. Woah there, Math is truth, that simple. A world without math is a world without truth. Does such a world exist? ---------- Post added June-21st-2012 at 06:32 AM ---------- Mathematics is not the existence of the fruit, though. It is an extension of language that serves to describe certain qualities of the fruit (in this case, quantity) as it exists in the universe. That language is entirely made up by us and it is not actually based on what will actually happen 100% of the time in the universe. It is based on our best estimation of what will happen based on our collective experience in what we perceive reality to be. Something as simple as 1+1=2 is so commonplace and thoroughly tested that we can pragmatically state that it is 100% truth but when you start dealing with more complicated math (particularly in the form of physics applications) you find yourself dealing with a fair bit less certainty. 1 + 1 = 2 is true because we defined "2" to be "the number that succeeds 1". There must be such a number, and this number must be unique, so we can give it a name. We could call it FOO and all the theorems would still be true. math itself is all about what will happen 100% of the time. That differs from things like probability which looks at "likelihood" and "almost certain" things, but math is all about being able to PROVE that things are true. I can say without hesitation that there are infinitely many colors because I can prove it. That's a mathematical statement (nothing to do with numbers though). Likewise, I can say that there are infinitely many prime numbers for the same reason (because I can prove it). But if I were to say that there are infinitely many "twin primes" (primes that differ by two, like (3 and 5) or (17 and 19)), then although we've found twin primes going up to 65516468355 · 2^(333333) ± 1 (that's a whole lot of twin primes), we can't say that there are infinitely many of these because nobody has proven that to be a true statement yet. In all likelihood most people (and mathematicians) believe this to be true and there's a high chance of it being true, but that doesn't satisfy mathematicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodriggo Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 It would be nice if it did. Thinking about the universe can be both infinitely hopeful and depressingly bleak. I was watching something recently about how there exists a theory that we are just holograms of a past world. They were showing how a particle beam aimed at a wall with two partitions creates a simultaneous "copy" of itself as it passes through both and how that when that behavior is "observed" it ceases to exist. I forget what "observed" meant, but they also mentioned how a quantum computer (which they said was more powerful than a modern computer the size of the universe) would function until it was "detected" being "observed." If a quantum computer is more powerful than a modern computer the size of the universe then maybe the Matrix is actually possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.A.M.F. Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 It contains all purposes. The question is, what purpose do you want it to have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 well, it has a god, or at least a god particle....we'll know more about the god later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 The answers supplied do not match the question asked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsluggo Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 The very foundations of the universe were created and exist as a precurser to ME making an appearance and brightening its shores. The rest of you are all simple window dressing to the center stage... ME. in 60 (or so) years, we can wrap up this tent (the universe) and put it back on a shelf with the understanding that it performed its duty admirably... and is complete. thank you all for participating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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