nomachetejuggling.com - The Star Wars Saga: Introducing Machete Order - In interesting order in which to consider watching the Star Wars films

OK, I'm not a huge Star Wars nut. I like the movies but I'm not a hardcore fan. Fortunate for you guys (and gals but let's be serious, there aren't any gals clicking on that thread title), I happen to be fairly certain that ES is crawling with Star Wars nuts... crawling.

I stumbled across a facebook post from a fried a while ago. He posted a link, said that it was a long read but suggested that the method he posted was the correct order in which to watch the Star Wars saga. Needless to say, I spent the new few minutes reading it over and it makes plenty of sense to me (the non-hardcore fan). It made so much sense that I figured I'd share it with you guys.

Here goes...

Brace yourselves, what follows is an amazingly long blog post about Star Wars.

I’ve already discussed how I’m not a huge fan of the various modifications made to the original Star Wars trilogy, so it’s reasonable to assume I’m not a big fan of the prequel trilogy either. There are many people who dislike the prequel trilogy so much that they don’t even consider watching them. On bad days, I’m one of those people, but on good days I see some value in the prequel trilogy, even though I consider them inferior in virtually every way.

For people that couldn’t care less about the prequel trilogy, I suggest Harmy’s Despecialized Editions. They are 720p blu-ray discs (AVCHD discs actually) that are the result of “Harmy” from The Original Trilogy forums painstakingly reconstructing the theatrical releases of all three films utilizing a wide variety of video sources as well as custom mattes. Downloading, burning, labeling, and printing cases for these films is one of the neckbeardiest things I’ve done (aside from writing this blog post), and I’m extremely glad I did it. When I feel like watching Star Wars for just me, these are the ones I watch. If that’s enough for you as well, stop reading now.

Two Options

There are two obvious options for watching the Star Wars saga.

• Release Order – Watch the films in the order they came out, recreating your experience with the films for someone new to them.
  
• Episode Order – Watch the films in the order George Lucas intends, starting with Episode I and going straight through to Episode VI
  

There are two critical flaws with both of these orders, unfortunately, that prevent either from being appropriate.

The problem with Episode Order is that it ruins the surprise that Vader is Luke’s father. If you think that this reveal doesn’t matter since it’s common knowledge, I suggest you watch the

. This reveal is one of the most shocking in film history, and if a newcomer to the series has managed to avoid having it spoiled for them, watching the films in Episode Order would be like watching the ending of The Sixth Sense first.

The other problem with Episode Order is that the prequels don’t really have a story. They’re just background for the real story, which is Luke’s attempt to destroy the Empire and save his father. Watching 3 films of backstory is boring if you’ve never seen the films they’re the background to. Hell, that’s why George Lucas made A New Hope first, he knew if he started with Episode I he’d never be able to complete the series. Starting someone off with Episode I is a surefire way to ensure they don’t make it through the entire franchise.

Unfortunately, Release Order is also an instant failure, and the reason is a single shot. If you’re watching the original trilogy first, then after the Empire is destroyed and everyone is celebrating, Luke looks over at his mentors, Ben Kenobi and Yoda, and suddenly they are joined by… some random creepy looking teenager who needs a haircut. Placing Hayden Christensen in the ending of Jedi, since he’s not in ANY of the other films, turns an ending that should be celebratory into one that is confusing for the viewer. The fact that Christensen looks like he’s undressing someone with his eyes doesn’t help.

So neither order really works. What to do?

An Alternative Suggestion

How can you ensure that a viewing keeps the Vader reveal a surprise, while introducing young Anakin before the end of Return of the Jedi?

Simple, watch them in this order: IV, V, I, II, III, VI.

George Lucas believes that Star Wars is the story of Anakin Skywalker, but it is not. The prequels, which establish his character, are so poor at being character-driven that, if the series is about Anakin, the entire series is a failure. Anakin is not a relatable character, Luke is.

This alternative order (which a commenter has pointed out is called Ernst Rister order) inserts the prequel trilogy into the middle, allowing the series to end on the sensible ending point (the destruction of the Empire) while still beginning with Luke’s journey.

Effectively, this order keeps the story Luke’s tale. Just when Luke is left with the burning question “how did my father become Darth Vader?” we take an extended flashback to explain exactly how. Once we understand how his father turned to the dark side, we go back to the main storyline and see how Luke is able to rescue him from it and salvage the good in him.

The prequel backstory comes at the perfect time, because Empire Strikes Back ends on a huge cliffhanger. Han is in carbonite, Vader is Luke’s father, and the Empire has hit the rebellion hard. Delaying the resolution of this cliffhanger makes it all the more satisfying when Return of the Jedi is watched.

Narratively, it’s just like a movie that starts with a big opening, then fades to “2 years earlier” for most of the movie, until it catches up with the present time and concludes.

Introducing: Machete Order

Now I’d like to modify this into what I’ve named Machete Order on the off chance that this catches on because I’m a vain *******.

Next time you want to introduce someone to Star Wars for the first time, watch the films with them in this order: IV, V, II, III, VI

Notice something? Yeah, Episode I is gone.

Episodes II and III aren’t exactly Shakespeare, but standing next to the complete and utter trainwreck that is Episode I, they sure look like it. At least, III does anyway.

Episode I is a failure on every possible level. The acting, writing, directing, and special effects are all atrocious, and the movie is just plain boring. Luckily, George Lucas has done everyone a favor by making the content of Episode I completely irrelevant to the rest of the series. Seriously, think about it for a minute. Name as many things as you can that happen in Episode I and actually help flesh out the story in any subsequent episode. I can only think of one thing, which I’ll mention later.

Every character established in Episode I is either killed or removed before it ends (Darth Maul, Qui-Gon, Chancellor Valorum), unimportant (Nute Gunray, Watto), or established better in a later episode (Mace Windu, Darth Sidious). Does it ever matter that Palpatine had an apprentice before Count Dooku? Nope, Darth Maul is killed by the end of Episode I and never referenced again. You may as well just start with the assumption that Dooku was the only apprentice. Does it ever matter that Obi-Wan was being trained by Qui-Gon? Nope, Obi-Wan is well into training Anakin at the start of Episode II, Qui-Gon is completely irrelevant.

Search your feelings, you know it to be true! Episode I doesn’t matter at all. You can start the prequels with Episode II and miss absolutely nothing. The opening crawl of Episode II establishes everything you need to know about the prequels: a bunch of systems want to leave the Republic, they are led by Count Dooku, and Senator Amidala is a senator who is going to vote on whether the Republic is going to create an army. Natalie Portman is called Senator Amidala twice in the first 4 minutes of the movie, so there’s no question of who’s who.

What Gets Removed?

Here’s some stuff that you no longer have to see as part of your Star Wars viewing experience, thanks to skipping Episode I.

Buh-bye, Binks!

• Virtually no Jar-Jar. Jar-Jar has about 5 lines in Episode II, and zero in Episode III.
  
• No midichlorians. There is only one reference to midichlorians after Episode I, and in the context it appears to mean something as benign as “DNA.”
  
• No Jake Lloyd. Sorry Jake, your acting is terrible and I never really wanted to see Darth Vader as a little boy.
  
• No confusing Padme/Queen switcheroo. The whole subplot with Padme and her decoy makes absolutely no sense. It’s clear that this was just so people could interact with Padme without knowing she was the Queen, but it’s incredibly convoluted and pointless.
  
• Less confusing master/apprentice relationships. Darth Sidious is training Count Dooku, Obi-Wan is training Anakin. No other trainer/trainee relationships exist to confuse the backstory. Fewer characters to learn about, so the story is more focused.
  
• Nothing about trade disputes. The “problem” as of Episode II is that a group of systems want to leave the Republic. This is much easier to understand for a kid than trade disputes.
  
• No pod racing. Seriously, who gives a ****? An action sequence for the sake of an action sequence and it goes on forever. A huge number of plot holes surrounding gambling and the subsequent freeing of Anakin are removed as well.
  
• No virgin birth. We simply don’t know or care who Anakin’s father is, and the subtle implication that it’s Palpatine is gone.
  

But booting Episode I isn’t merely about pretending a crappy movie doesn’t exist. Viewing Episode II immediately after V and Episode III immediately before VI actually tells the story better than including Episode I does.

Much, much more at the link.

http://www.nomachetejuggling.com/2011/11/11/the-star-wars-saga-suggested-viewing-order/

Thoughts?

I'm a big Star Wars fan and I kinda like it. The only issue I have with it is that it takes away from the questions you have at the end of Empire. Is Vader really Luke's father, or is he lying to mess with Luke's feelings? In the end, it's a minor complaint and this may be the best way to watch the series.

Edit: Actually I take it back. This is better because you're going to spend both Episode II and III wondering whether Obi-Wan is telling the truth that Vader killed Anakin or is Vader telling the truth. There's a lot more tension this way.

My first thought is that I can't imagine meeting someone who has never seen Star Wars and has no idea of Darth Vader's story from popular culture and I feel it necessary to spend 10+ hours watching the movies with them. IV, V and VI I could watch any day. Episode I I've pretty much blocked out of my memory, and Episodes II and III were average to below average. There was a lot I wanted to like about Episode III but I just couldn't, by the end of it, actually consider it a good movie. I wouldn't recommend it to someone who's never watched Star Wars.

I didn't actually mean for the post to be that crotchety or snobby. I definitely appreciate the link to Harmy's versions. De-specializing them has always been something that I wish would've been done, and HD is just icing on the cake. I'm going to have to take some time over spring break and get them burned I think.

It's interesting, and I haven't tried it yet, but I do know some people that said this worked better. That being said this proposed machete order has been around for quite a while now.

It assumes you'd still want to watch II and III. While the author is right, they're both way better than I, they're still a waste.

I still think Episode III might arguably be the best in the entire series--original and prequel.

I still think Episode III might arguably be the best in the entire series--original and prequel.

What would that argument be?

This is the order (the 4, 5, 1, 2, 3, 6 option) in which I showed them to my girlfriend. This is the way it should always be done.

---------- Post added January-19th-2013 at 05:41 PM ----------

I still think Episode III might arguably be the best in the entire series--original and prequel.

I agree with you 100%.

What he is saying TJ, is skip I entirely.

What he is saying TJ, is skip I entirely.

Yeah, but I don't agree. As annoying as Episode I is, it does have some redeeming qualities. If you skip it, the bond between Anakin and his mother, which explains why he goes off the rails after she dies, doesn't carry the same weight.

Yeah, but I don't agree. As annoying as Episode I is, it does have some redeeming qualities. If you skip it, the bond between Anakin and his mother, which explains why he goes off the rails after she dies, doesn't carry the same weight.

Yeah. But on the other hand, you might assume that their characters had depth. In which case it might actually carry more weight not seeing it, because you don't have poor actors and laughable dialog attached to their relationship in your mind.

The only way to watch Star Wars is Star Wars, empire, Jedi.... Repeat... Pretend the others don't exist... They were needless tripe anyway.

I still think Episode III might arguably be the best in the entire series--original and prequel.

I agree with you 100%.

No. Just... no.

The idea that any of the prequels is better than the originals is absurd. And I'm saying this as someone young enough to not be influenced by the difference between seeing the originals in theaters without spoilers and seeing them on tape with spoilers. Doesn't matter. The prequels are just pathetic in comparison to the originals.

The prequel bashing is so tired. If you don't like them, fine but there are plenty of people who do. Get over it.

Having said that, technically he is right. You don't really need the Phantom Menace for the story of the Saga. George tried to make it as stand alone as possible to mirror the stand alone nature of Star Wars. Both films begin their trilogies but are made where a sequel isn't a given (of course back in 77 this was actually the case whereas for the prequels it was just to mimic).

For me though the only benefit there is to skipping the Phantom Menace is then Padme and Anakin's relationship is more believable.

A weak feature, for me, in the prequels is that I just don't buy the Padme/Anakin relationship. She was an older sister, a surrogate mother even, for a too young Anakin away from his mother for the first time. I never bought how she could develop romantic feelings for him when they grew up. So eliminating their relationship in the Phantom Menace would make their courtship and marriage more believable for me.

In reality, if you bash the prequels, then you need to bash Return Of The Jedi, which would mean that the only "True" Star Wars films were IV and V.

The prequel bashing is so tired. If you don't like them, fine but there are plenty of people who do. Get over it.

That statement could just as easily read, "If you like them, fine. There are plenty of people who don't. Get over it."

We're discussing Sci-Fi/Space Opera movies on an internet messageboard. It's all personal opinion, I think everyone comes in with that recognition. (Or any reasonable person ought to.)

I am still interested to know why people who think that Episode III is the best in the entire series think so. I can give you that Return of the Jedi, in terms of the quality of writing and acting, is possibly more in line with the prequels, but I can't see putting III ahead of IV or V.

In reality, if you bash the prequels, then you need to bash Return Of The Jedi, which would mean that the only "True" Star Wars films were IV and V.

Why would you bash RoTJ? I wasn't a big fan of the Ewoks, but it was better than any of the prequels, possibly close to a tie to Episode III, but still edging it out. Remove the Ewoks and its the second best movie in the entire series. With Ewoks, I rank them in this order from best to worst - Episode V, IV, VI, III, II, I. Without the Ewoks, Id rank them Episode V, VI, IV, III, II, I.

---------- Post added January-21st-2013 at 01:06 PM ----------

That statement could just as easily read, "If you like them, fine. There are plenty of people who don't. Get over it."

We're discussing Sci-Fi/Space Opera movies on an internet messageboard. It's all personal opinion, I think everyone comes in with that recognition. (Or any reasonable person ought to.)

I am still interested to know why people who think that Episode III is the best in the entire series think so. I can give you that Return of the Jedi, in terms of the quality of writing and acting, is possibly more in line with the prequels, but I can't see putting III ahead of IV or V.

I think III was pretty awesome in terms of the new films, and at times, strictly due to the fight scenes, Anikin's turn to the dark side and transformation into Darth Vader was a better part of the story than ROTJ. But, ROTJ gave us Jabas palace, destruction of another Death Star, swing in power back to the Rebel Alliance, father vs son vs monster, retransformation of Vader back to Anikin. Remove the Ewoks and this was the second best movie in the series.

Episode III was the worst of all of the movies. How that one gets so much praise compared to the other two prequels is beyond me. It was horrendous in every way.

Darth Vader's "NOOOOO!" was the most laugh-out-loud awful moment out of all 6 films. When I saw it in the theater, the whole audience cracked up at that part. Oh, and nevermind that he was upset his wife died...because "she lost the will to live". I wasn't aware that was fatal. :pfft:

And how about the lightsaber duel between the Emperor and Sam Jackson? That's right, a senior citizen and a black dude in a (painfully awkward) sword fight. And...that's when Anakin officially becomes a bad guy, so it's arguably the most important scene of the entire saga.

For me, I rank them 5, 4, 6, 2, 3, 1.

Three is supposed to be such a crucial turning point with Anakin turning into Vader and the acting and set-up for it all is just butchered in the movie. It sucks because the conflict Anakin has between loyalties, losing his wife by his own actions of trying to prevent her death (self-fulfilling prophecy) after losing his mother, the emperor crying out to Anakin to save him (mirroring Luke doing same in 6), and Aanakin's own conflicting ambitions to become a jedi sooner than he is ready. All looks great on paper, but terribly executed both in writing and in acting. The "Noooo!" is just awful and laugh-worthy as Botched said. The battle between Anakin and Obu Wan is the redeemer of the movie, that was done well, but that's because you had Ewan McGreggor carrying the scenes and you saw what actual acting can do for a movie.

All that being said, it's still not anywhere near as bad as 1. Really they should have just said "oh here is Anakin, hello. Oh look, Darth Maul, uh-oh." Then the great battle, then movie over.

Also, the quality of 4, 5, and 6 have degraded due to the stupid additions Lucas put in. Thankfully I got copies of the de-edited, actual original versions of 4, 5, and 6 from a friend.

I really like this idea. Never been more let down for a movie than The Phantom Menace and never cared for it at all anyway and it makes more sense overall. Thee are slight pieces of plot that are missed but its not a big deal.

"Well, at least now I don't have to tell him that thing about his dad…"

I'm still really hoping someone will chime back in and explain how Ep. III was better than the original trilogy. And not just to say they're wrong. I watched Phantom Menace in theaters, and as a result I never had the urge to watch Clones or Sith. I've seen Attack of the Clones by this point, but never in one sitting. It's been on TV (mostly Spike) so much in the last year that I've seen almost all of Clones just by catching random parts here and there while trying to find something else to watch. And I just never got into it. Because of that I've never seen any of Revenge of the Sith. And so far that's the only Star Wars movie I haven't seen. But I just can't bring myself to watch it. I was really hoping somebody would justify why it's so good, but nobody who thinks it is seems to want to defend it.

Does it have better acting? Are the special effects so great that it's worth seeing? Does the Obi/Ani fight not seem to drag on as much as it should, given how much time it takes? Are the Ani/Padme scenes better than in the other 2 films? I'm just trying to find some redeeming quality so I don't go into the movie dreading it deep down, knowing it will be a waste of time. Come on guys, I want to believe.

I may be in the minority here (Let's face it, this is all about opinion...some people like the prequels, some people don't. No one is wrong since it's opinion and personal preference. I think that is being forgotten here), but I dig all six. The Phantom Menace is clearly the worst of all 6, but I still watch it. Everyone has to admit that the Darth Maul fight is badass.

Anywho, I dig all 6 movies. Tell me how stupid I am, I don't care.

I may try to watch them in the order 4,5,1,2,3,6.

My ranking of best of the movies are:

1 - Empire Strikes Back

2 - Revenge of the Sith

3 - A New Hope

4 - Return of the Jedi

5 - Attack of the Clones

6 - The Phantom Menace

As someone who has studied writing and filmmaking my opinion is that the prequels, all three of them, are so bad it's almost not worth pointing out the many errors made with the story. The originals for the most part are just about perfect examples of story telling. George Lucas either A. Got too rich and detached from his hungrier days and lost his creative ability to put together a mystifying and comprehensive story, or B. Was one of the many people in history who was amazingly creative when he had great people around him directing his thoughts and ideas into whatever was proper and appropriate. When he did away with anybody who would tell him "no" or "it should be done differently" after the original trilogy, he lost that check which gave his creativity focus and made directionless, meaningless movies as a result.

I think it's probably more B than A. I think his comfortable position was detrimental to his films in the sense that he got lazy and green screened everything, but from a storytelling perspective I think he failed so miserably with his audience in general because his ideas went unshaped by more sensible people who, whether he knew it or not, he had relied on in the past.

Episode III was the worst of all of the movies. How that one gets so much praise compared to the other two prequels is beyond me. It was horrendous in every way.

Darth Vader's "NOOOOO!" was the most laugh-out-loud awful moment out of all 6 films. When I saw it in the theater, the whole audience cracked up at that part. Oh, and nevermind that he was upset his wife died...because "she lost the will to live". I wasn't aware that was fatal. :pfft:

And how about the lightsaber duel between the Emperor and Sam Jackson? That's right, a senior citizen and a black dude in a (painfully awkward) sword fight. And...that's when Anakin officially becomes a bad guy, so it's arguably the most important scene of the entire saga.

100% agree, all three prequels were terrible but I’d watch an entire Jar Jar movie before trying to sit through another Hayden Christensen acting attempt. Holy **** what a terrible job casting.