Moving Towards our Future Front Office and Coaching Hires. All the Way to the Water Boy - Adam Peters Hired as GM! The Mighty Quinn is HC Kliff Kingsbury as OC. Joe Whitt jr at DC.

[RWJ]

Just now, ThatNFLChick said:

 

Just seems that tomorrow we'll hear of Peters being named GM/VP of OPS 

[kfrankie]

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record during his ownership tenures of the 76ers and Devils.  He purchased the 76ers in October 2011, the team squeaked into the playoffs in 2011-2012, then endured 5 straight dreadful seasons trying to "tank" to get top picks. I remember the national media harping on the teams inability to succeed despite having a boat load of top picks, including some colossal misses Jahilil Okafor/#3, Ben Simmons/#1, Markelle Fultz/#1. The team didn't turn a winning record until 2017-2018, but still hasn't made it past the second round of the playoffs. Also on their 4th coach (I know, NBA coaches come and go far more often than in the NFL, but still).

 

As far as the Devils, his group took them over in 2013, and they've generally been terrible, only making the playoffs twice. So I definitely understand the excitement with having Snyder gone and all, he burned this franchise to the ground.  But in a vacuum, Josh Harris is not what I'd describe as a successful sports franchise owner. 

[HigSkin]

55 minutes ago, Est.1974 said:

Vrabel really is a coach I’d have always loved here. We’re probably in a different space now with Harris and Co whereby it’s fresh blood we need, up and coming HC prospects. But Vrabel is a bloody good HC, in my opinion.

 

He could still be a coach of interest, we just don't know and they don't have to "request an interview" because he's free to sign with anyone.

[CobraCommander]

The problem with a defensive HC is you end up losing any OC worth a damn to promotion. Count me in as getting an Offensive guy as HC and hiring a DC

[Warhead36]

22 minutes ago, kfrankie said:

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record during his ownership tenures of the 76ers and Devils.  He purchased the 76ers in October 2011, the team squeaked into the playoffs in 2011-2012, then endured 5 straight dreadful seasons trying to "tank" to get top picks. I remember the national media harping on the teams inability to succeed despite having a boat load of top picks, including some colossal misses Jahilil Okafor/#3, Ben Simmons/#1, Markelle Fultz/#1. The team didn't turn a winning record until 2017-2018, but still hasn't made it past the second round of the playoffs. Also on their 4th coach (I know, NBA coaches come and go far more often than in the NFL, but still).

 

As far as the Devils, his group took them over in 2013, and they've generally been terrible, only making the playoffs twice. So I definitely understand the excitement with having Snyder gone and all, he burned this franchise to the ground.  But in a vacuum, Josh Harris is not what I'd describe as a successful sports franchise owner. 

This has been addressed and refuted ad nauseum. 

[CapsSkins]

24 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Just seems that tomorrow we'll hear of Peters being named GM/VP of OPS 

 

Yeah I think Rooney Rule for GM/HOFO is only one in-person interview w/ an external minority candidate so Glenn Cook's interview this afternoon would have satisfied the rule. They are free and clear to hire Peters now if they want.

 

It's conceivable they announce Peters as HOFO and continue interviewing candidates like Cunningham for a GM role reporting to HOFO. That would be very interesting. And not to tease @Skinsinparadise too much, but Peters came up in college scouting while McClay came up in pro scouting. So they would have complementary skillsets

[wit33]

The truth is, achieving elite success in American professional sports is exceedingly challenging and often involves an element of luck. However, having skilled and intelligent individuals working towards that goal significantly improves the chances of hitting that elite window.
 

Alternatively, there's the Bengals' approach: drafting Burrow.

[illone]

27 minutes ago, kfrankie said:

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record during his ownership tenures of the 76ers and Devils. 

 

 

No taking a stance here as I am in the "wait and see" mode, but what do you mean by great track record?

 

Is this more referring to the on-court/ice performance?

 

I admittedly havent looked too much into his other teams sans peeking at his NBA record the past few years, but the 76ers have been contenders.  I think most fans here would be happy with making the playoffs consistently... 

 

Cant blame anyone for being pessimistic, though. It's not like the guy is carrying around multiple Champ trophies.

[RWJ]

38 minutes ago, kfrankie said:

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record during his ownership tenures of the 76ers and Devils.  He purchased the 76ers in October 2011, the team squeaked into the playoffs in 2011-2012, then endured 5 straight dreadful seasons trying to "tank" to get top picks. I remember the national media harping on the teams inability to succeed despite having a boat load of top picks, including some colossal misses Jahilil Okafor/#3, Ben Simmons/#1, Markelle Fultz/#1. The team didn't turn a winning record until 2017-2018, but still hasn't made it past the second round of the playoffs. Also on their 4th coach (I know, NBA coaches come and go far more often than in the NFL, but still).

 

As far as the Devils, his group took them over in 2013, and they've generally been terrible, only making the playoffs twice. So I definitely understand the excitement with having Snyder gone and all, he burned this franchise to the ground.  But in a vacuum, Josh Harris is not what I'd describe as a successful sports franchise owner. 

We could have had an owner that picked his own GM and HC.  That's what we had in Snyder.  Harris so far has hired an advisor group led by people in the know that have built championship teams, Myers (Golden State Warriors) and a GM that has been in the biz for a while now, Spielman.  Let's give him a chance as he's got us going in the right direction and not the wrong one.   

[JSSkinz]

36 minutes ago, kfrankie said:

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record

I dont think you're being negative, you're being honest about the results, something you dont see too much on ES.  I too am not that impressed with what he's done in the NHL or NBA.  It took 5 years to make the playoffs for the Devils and half the league makes the playoffs. All those blown picks for the Sixers have them trapped in the 2nd round of the playoffs each year.

 

I'm glad we have anyone but Dan but I dont see anything in either team that makes me think Josh has a secret sauce to success in sports ownership. I'm hoping the mistakes he made with the Devils and Sixers will help him, honestly I wish he would sell those piece of **** franchises and focus on this team.

[FlyBigBeard]

49 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Just seems that tomorrow we'll hear of Peters being named GM/VP of OPS 

I see everybody else's name but has Peter's actually been interviewed yet? 

[CapsSkins]

3 minutes ago, FlyBigBeard said:

I see everybody else's name but has Peter's actually been interviewed yet? 

 

His interview is this evening. Prob happening now as I type this

[Curtisp5286]

40 minutes ago, kfrankie said:

So, not be be a negative Nancy here but....  Josh Harris does not appear to have a great track record during his ownership tenures of the 76ers and Devils.  He purchased the 76ers in October 2011, the team squeaked into the playoffs in 2011-2012, then endured 5 straight dreadful seasons trying to "tank" to get top picks. I remember the national media harping on the teams inability to succeed despite having a boat load of top picks, including some colossal misses Jahilil Okafor/#3, Ben Simmons/#1, Markelle Fultz/#1. The team didn't turn a winning record until 2017-2018, but still hasn't made it past the second round of the playoffs. Also on their 4th coach (I know, NBA coaches come and go far more often than in the NFL, but still).

 

As far as the Devils, his group took them over in 2013, and they've generally been terrible, only making the playoffs twice. So I definitely understand the excitement with having Snyder gone and all, he burned this franchise to the ground.  But in a vacuum, Josh Harris is not what I'd describe as a successful sports franchise owner. 

Both teams certainly had a rough first few years under his ownership group, but 76ers will make the playoffs for a 7th consecutive time this season and are legit title contenders.  The Devils also underwent a lengthy rebuild but broke out last season and now look primed to be very good for many years to come.

 

If I had to generalize the two organizations under his ownership group I’d say that they are well managed and operate professionally.  Both did undertake rebuilds that were probably longer than they needed to be, but both also came out of those rebuilds in very good shape.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

17 minutes ago, JSSkinz said:

I dont think you're being negative, you're being honest about the results, something you dont see too much on ES.  I too am not that impressed with what he's done in the NHL or NBA.  It took 5 years to make the playoffs for the Devils and half the league makes the playoffs. All those blown picks for the Sixers have them trapped in the 2nd round of the playoffs each year.

 

I'm glad we have anyone but Dan but I dont see anything in either team that makes me think Josh has a secret sauce to success in sports ownership. I'm hoping the mistakes he made with the Devils and Sixers will help him, honestly I wish he would sell those piece of **** franchises and focus on this team.

Let’s be honest, how many guys have the secret sauce to sports ownership?

 

What we know we have is a guy with experience, leading a group of investors - some of which have a lot invested in this area.  Simply judging from the day he took over to now, what more can we ask for?  He’s deployed a team that is acting at light speed to get the best the business has to offer to lead our organization.  He’s clearly not a douche bag.  
 

All that is good enough for me, particularly given there was a point where I thought I’d die before Dan let go of this team.  There is no telling how successful he will be, but he exhibits the traits of someone capable of building a winner and he’s not embarrassing to boot.

Edited January 9 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[redskinss]

4 minutes ago, Curtisp5286 said:

Both teams certainly had a rough first few years under his ownership group, but 76ers will make the playoffs for a 7th consecutive time this season and are legit title contenders.  The Devils also underwent a lengthy rebuild but broke out last season and now look primed to be very good for many years to come.

 

If I had to generalize the two organizations under his ownership group I’d say that they are well managed and operate professionally.  Both did undertake rebuilds that were probably longer than they needed to be, but both also came out of those rebuilds in very good shape.

Plus I think it gets lost on fans that there are 30 to 32 teams in these leagues and they're all fighting and clawing for a championship, all things being equal to be average is to win a championship every 30 years so not having one in ten years doesn't mean he's below average.

 

These teams that win 3 in ten years or like the patriots win 6 in 20 is so staggeringly far above average that we lose perspective on how difficult it is and how long it really should take you to win one.

[Skinsinparadise]

42 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

Yeah I think Rooney Rule for GM/HOFO is only one in-person interview w/ an external minority candidate so Glenn Cook's interview this afternoon would have satisfied the rule. They are free and clear to hire Peters now if they want.

 

It's conceivable they announce Peters as HOFO and continue interviewing candidates like Cunningham for a GM role reporting to HOFO. That would be very interesting. And not to tease @Skinsinparadise too much, but Peters came up in college scouting while McClay came up in pro scouting. So they would have complementary skillsets

 

Peters alone would be no joke.  If it was him AND McClay, i think reputation wise that would be the best tandem in the NFL. 

 

Though I don't see the two working in tandem where they'd want to.  they are both big names.  But more on point they are both big time evaluators so would one want to listen to the other on that or co-author moves?

 

If they are going with two guys.  Lets say its Peters, I can see someone with a different brand of skills like Halaby working with Peters or a rising star type but is still young without the title like Cunningham who would covet the GM title.

Edited January 10 by Skinsinparadise

[CapsSkins]

6 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Peters alone would be no joke.  If it was him AND McClay, i think reputation wise that would be the best tandem in the NFL. 

 

Though I don't see the two working in tandem where they'd want to.  they are both big names.  But more on point they are both big time evaluators so would one want to listen to the other on that or co-author moves?

 

If they are going with two guys.  Lets say its Peters, I can see someone with a different brand of skills like Halaby working with Peters or a rising star type but is still young without the title like Cunningham who would covet the GM title.

 

I tend to agree but there's a lot we don't know in terms of how these guys want to structure an FO and which parts of the job they enjoy doing. Not to say my half-joking Peters/McClay tandem is an iron-clad prediction. But in general, there is a vast scope of responsibilities and I think Harris will be both flexible and open-minded in building a structure that attracts the best talent. That's exciting in of itself, and I think until proven otherwise, we should allow ourselves to dream big.

[Skinsinparadise]

16 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Let’s be honest, how many guys have the secret sauce to sports ownership?

 

What we know we have is a guy with experience, leading a group of investors - some of which have a lot invested in this area.  Simply judging from the day he took over to now, what more can we ask for?  He’s deployed a team that is acting at light speed to get the best the business has to offer to lead our organization.  He’s clearly not a douche bag.  
 

All that is good enough for me, particularly given there was a point where I thought I’d die before Dan let go of this team.  There is no telling how successful he will be, but he exhibits the traits of someone capable of building a winner and he’s not embarrassing to boot.

 

Yep, its about doing it the right way.

 

Spending everything you can on facilities, training and everything that helps team gain an edge.

 

Ditto as to the FO, spend whatever it takes, get the best people.

 

Ditto as for the coaches.

 

It doesn't mean you are going to get it right every time.   You get Embid who is one of the best players in the NBA but not the best.   23-12 is a very good record but not the best. 

 

But I don't give credit or blame to owners for playoff loses.    Just build it right and get out of the way.

 

We used to talk all the time on the FO thread about potential big name GMs.  The previous owner wouldn't give a rats ass about that and wouldn't interview them.  Now we are interviewing almost all of them.

 

The players have talked about how Harris has already talked to them about meeting their needs and is on it.     We are likely going to get a new facility in a couple of years.  They hired a sports scientest to help players with recovery.  And they are just getting started.

 

I am not giving Harris credit or blame for postseason success unless its coaching or GM related failures.  I want an owner that spends what needs to be spent and values what needs to be valued.  And on those counts, he's killing it IMO.  And most who covered him in Philly (not all) think he's a 10 out of 10 level good owner.

Edited January 10 by Skinsinparadise

[JSSkinz]

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Let’s be honest, how many guys have the secret sauce to sports ownership?

I agree, 100%, the NFL chews up and spits out billionaires but his history at Philly and NJ is all we have to draw any conclusions as to what he'll be here. I'm realistic that he needs some time so there won't be any harsh judgments from me for at least a couple of years unless he goes full Tepper. Where I think he will win early and often is with business and public relations, I think they know that's where they can make an immediate impact and buy some goodwill with the fans.

[Spaceman Spiff]

On 1/8/2024 at 3:01 PM, Spaceman Spiff said:

Commies:  Hire Peters

ES:  YAAYYYY BEST DAY EVARRRRRRRR 

Peters:  Passes on Caleb Williams

ES:  omfg wtf this guys sucks 

Remember mother****ers, I called it. 

[Skinsinparadise]

7 minutes ago, CapsSkins said:

 

I tend to agree but there's a lot we don't know in terms of how these guys want to structure an FO and which parts of the job they enjoy doing. Not to say my half-joking Peters/McClay tandem is an iron-clad prediction. But in general, there is a vast scope of responsibilities and I think Harris will be both flexible and open-minded in building a structure that attracts the best talent. That's exciting in of itself, and I think until proven otherwise, we should allow ourselves to dream big.

 

Agree, there is a lot we don't know.  I am going in my head with all that I've read over the years about McClay.  McClay is supposedly worshipped in that building.  Jerry has backed off in reverence to him.  But it comes off like he has defacto control over personnel.   So i am guessing to leave he'd want even more power so that would likely mean the title that he hasn't gotten in Dallas with similar control.

 

Peters and McClay would sort of feel like Batman and Superman together.  Would it be too much for them to take a little backseat to each other?  That's why I see somebody like Halaby being a more smooth combination because their superpowers are a bit different.

 

Edited January 10 by Skinsinparadise

[Conn]

I know people were making fun of the fact that Harris running a “normal” hiring process seems like some sort of godlike miracle here to the point that it’s being overhyped…but I do think it’s clear that this ownership group is more organized and is operating with more of a plan and intentionality than other teams around the league. They are off to the races but not in a reckless, haphazard way—in a measured, planned way. 
 

[Skinsinparadise]

8 minutes ago, Conn said:

I know people were making fun of the fact that Harris running a “normal” hiring process seems like some sort of godlike miracle here to the point that it’s being overhyped…but I do think it’s clear that this ownership group is more organized and is operating with more of a plan and intentionality than other teams around the league. They are off to the races but not in a reckless, haphazard way—in a measured, planned way. 
 

 

Agree.

 

The idea alone that they are interested in the biggest names in GM circles and are going 100 miles an hour to interview them is beyond night and day from the past-- its like they are operating from a different galaxy from the past regime. 

 

From what I heard they are just getting started building the analytics department, sport science additions, making Fedex improvements, building a new facility -- catering to the players to fulfill their needs, etc.

 

Harris has talked about this previously which is he wants to give players all the best trappings they can to succeed.  And ditto give his FO all the resources they need to succeed, etc.

 

Does that guarantee success?  Nope.  But it is moving this team from being the crappiest run team in the NFL to being one of the best run.

 

I know maybe to some it comes off like homers but everything being said here has been said by national observers.  Whether Harris deserves kudos or not for his ownership elsewhere, the perception is clearly he's a really good owner and this is a destination spot now.

 

Keim has said he knows agents representing GM-coaching clients who have told him this is a great destination spot and the feeling is very high around the league about Harris.

Edited January 10 by Skinsinparadise

[Die Hard]

Just now, Spaceman Spiff said:

Remember mother****ers, I called it. 

 

2 minutes ago, Conn said:

I know people were making fun of the fact that Harris running a “normal” hiring process seems like some sort of godlike miracle here to the point that it’s being overhyped…but I do think it’s clear that this ownership group is more organized and is operating with more of a plan and intentionality than other teams around the league. They are off to the races but not in a reckless, haphazard way—in a measured, planned way. 
 

I wouldn’t say it’s a typical process. Rich Gannon spoke about it in a podcast in this thread. Apparently teams typically use a 3rd party consulting company to compile a list of top candidates and vet them. So hiring guys like Myers (not even someone within the sport) and Spielman (long track record outside of the organization) is a little outside of the box thinking.

 

But hiring the front office before the coaching staff… that’s a more SOP. 😄

 

 

[88Comrade2000]

9 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

He's been saying that for a while on Belichick.  

 

I don't think there was a chance EB was going to get an interview after the way the season ended.  If the offense had ended top-10, and Howell looked like a legitimate starter, he would have been the favorite for the job.

 

Neither thing happened.  He's out.

 

My guess is he's going back to the Chiefs. He's a good ying to Reid's yang. Mahomes and Kelce have both brought up, unsolicited, that they miss the accountability he brought to their team, and their offense has been a bit of a mess this year. 

 

EB should give up on the HC dream and go back to the Chiefs.  They're going to win a few more SBs.  This off-season, they're going to sign 25 WRs and then see which ones of them can catch footballs, which seems to be the thing their current crop of WRs can't do.  Which is somewhat part of the job description of a WR.

 

If I was the Chief's, I'd call the Commanders and offer a second for Terry.  If I was the Commanders I'd turn that down.  But I would offer it. Terry already knows the system, he's better than any WR they have, and Mahomes would make him a 1500 yard receiver.    

If Terry wants to go, let him.  It will be 2-3 years before we will be good. Let him go somewhere and experience championship football.  

 

I doubt we get anything higher than a 3rd rounder for him.