The Official 2023 ES Free Agency Thread... available until Free Agency 2024 begins

[RWJ]

I am probably in the minority here, but I like Blake Freeland as our OT.  Yes, there are others and I think he needs to put on about 10 to 15 more lbs., but I think he can play LT and RT both and hold his own well.  He could be had in the late 2nd early 3rd.  I'd like to see us traded down 3 or 4 spots and grab much needed CB (i.e., Deonte Banks from MD).  I think he is very underrated and will do well in the NFL and fits what we need in a CB.  

[method man]

2 minutes ago, RWJ said:

I am probably in the minority here, but I like Blake Freeland as our OT.  Yes, there are others and I think he needs to put on about 10 to 15 more lbs., but I think he can play LT and RT both and hold his own well.  He could be had in the late 2nd early 3rd.  I'd like to see us traded down 3 or 4 spots and grab much needed CB (i.e., Deonte Banks from MD).  I think he is very underrated and will do well in the NFL and fits what we need in a CB.  

I actually think Banks will not last 3-4 spots down in the draft. He is being mocked to Pitt right behind us in a lot of mocks I am seeing. I think he is underrated relative to the top 3 because he lost his sophomore year to injury 

[RWJ]

2 minutes ago, method man said:

I actually think Banks will not last 3-4 spots down in the draft. He is being mocked to Pitt right behind us in a lot of mocks I am seeing. I think he is underrated relative to the top 3 because he lost his sophomore year to injury 

Going to be hard to tell MM but we will have to see.  We may have to grab him at #16 especially if Porter is gone.  I like Banks and Porter both.  We can hope but I'd like for the scenerio I mention to happen.  One can dream or hope, right?

Edited March 18, 2023 by RWJ

[method man]

3 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Going to be hard to tell MM but we will have to see.  We may have to grab him at #16 especially if Porter is gone.  I like Banks and Porter both.  We can hope but I'd like for the scenerio I mention to happen.  One can dream or hope, right?

I would love any of the top 4 guys but I wouldn’t be heartbroken if they waited to take someone like a Brents or Ricks in rd 2. I am in the opposite camp you are in regarding OT. They have to find a way to bring Paris, Dawand or DWright in. I know there is scheme risk with the latter two but the three of them feel relatively safe

[RWJ]

19 minutes ago, method man said:

I would love any of the top 4 guys but I wouldn’t be heartbroken if they waited to take someone like a Brents or Ricks in rd 2. I am in the opposite camp you are in regarding OT. They have to find a way to bring Paris, Dawand or DWright in. I know there is scheme risk with the latter two but the three of them feel relatively safe

That's the beauty of all of us.  We all like different flavors and see things differently.  Could be what you are saying is true but I disagree.  

[method man]

Just now, RWJ said:

That's the beauty of all of us.  We all like different flavors and see things differently.  Could be what you are saying is true but I disagree.  

Yep. It really does pain me though not having our normal 3rd this year. We are missing out on a potential future starter not having that pick

[skinny21]

56 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

Regarding Thomas, I think the staff wants to see how he looks in minicamps/OTAs first, and then see how the draft plays out. He's the only experienced TE on the roster but if he isn't healthy and/or we draft someone early, he's gonna get cut. On the flip side if he's healthy and looking like the Thomas from 2020 we'll probably keep him around. 

 

All of the above can be applied to Roullier as well.

 

Leno is our starting LT and is fine in that role. He's not getting cut unless we draft a LT at 16 that can start day one.

 

Not sure why Norwell is still on the roster. He should have been cut.

 

My guess is we take a TE and IOL somewhere in the middle rounds and cut Thomas and Roullier after the draft. Maybe designate them as post June 1 cuts if that helps matters.

I’m pretty much with you here.  They’re clearly overpaying Thomas and Roullier in relation to what they brought to the table the last 2 years.  Of course they’ve also seen them play at a high level, and know that they fit in terms of culture and the lockerroom.  I’m sure they don’t love the cap those two are taking, but they also have some time to work things out.  Going the pricier FA route would have meant eating the dead cap, paying out a large-ish contract, and hoping they could lure those replacement FAs.  Lastly, if we find a stud center or TE in the draft, or one of our TEs takes off, we would have potentially been paying a FA starting money for a backup (or soon to be backup) role.  Thomas and Roullier give us some flexibility in the draft, some hope for plus play, and are no-brainer cuts if things work out with replacements.  I don’t know if it’s the right road to take, but I can see the logic.

 

As for Norwell, while he’s a below average starter, I think it hinges on some other questions that need to be answered.  Does Paul emerge?  Does Gates beat Norwell and Paul out at LG?  Does Gates man the center spot instead?  Do we draft a starting level guard?  And even - does Wylie stay at tackle or join the mix competing at LG?  So, IMO Norwell is simply temporary insurance.

 

 

Zooming out a bit, do we currently have any positions on the team in which we don’t 1) have a guy with starting experience, and 2) have a guy that has played at a decent level as a starter.  Frankly, I can’t think of any (ok, punt returner and maybe kicker I suppose).  Point being, I think the staff has positioned themselves properly for the draft.

Don’t get me wrong though - I still have concerns about this roster, and we could absolutely use more upgrades.  And philosophically, I’m not sure going after quantity over quality is/was the right move.  On the other hand, I can’t argue that they’ve done a nice job over the years addressing depth and competition level.  I mean, we’ve lost a lot of guys to injury each year, and started a backup qb for a year and a half, yet have remained competitive.  The question is - can they lift the team beyond average.  We’ll see.

[Chump Bailey]

59 minutes ago, RWJ said:

I am probably in the minority here, but I like Blake Freeland as our OT.  Yes, there are others and I think he needs to put on about 10 to 15 more lbs., but I think he can play LT and RT both and hold his own well.  He could be had in the late 2nd early 3rd.  I'd like to see us traded down 3 or 4 spots and grab much needed CB (i.e., Deonte Banks from MD).  I think he is very underrated and will do well in the NFL and fits what we need in a CB.  

 

[CommDownMan]

7 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

I should clarify my use of the word conservative. 
 

According to over the cap we are 5th in the league in active cash spend in 2023. Added to this we apparently have more players under contract than any other team. So, we have been very active in terms of building the roster.

 

My thoughts on being ‘conservative’ are, 

 

We roll with Howell but give a vet QB 8m

We love our young group of TE but still have Thomas due 7m in cash

We’ve clearly brought in a staring Center but still have Roullier slated for 9m in cash

Are we really going to pay Norwell 4m in cash.

 

Maybe it’s loyalty, maybe it’s conservative in terms of not wanting to cut players before necessary, eg let’s see what the draft brings first, or the offseason, fair enough. Ron likes that safety net though doesn’t he, IMO.

 

Ultimately between Thomas, Roullier and Norwell you’ve got 20mil in 2023 cash spend.

 

Is that a good allocation of resource. Would other teams do that ? Could that have gone on a LB and another OL, still with change left over, or whatever else....a skill player or DB upgrade. Use it to pay Curl now ?

 

Again, I’m trying hard to fight against appearing too negative  it’s these ‘safety net’ calls I find ‘conservative’...

 

Its definitely slim pickings now, pending cuts around the league aside. Will be interesting to see our next moves.

 

So not going to argue they do it in what feels like an inefficient way, but I think there are some reasons.

 

Howell- they simply refused to play last year until the Wentz Cleveland disaster basically forced it.  I think there is reason for excitement from us, but they needed something a little more proven vs more inexperience.  After all the Heinicke whining, I think many here needed more here.  I think JB was a good option.

 

Thomas and Norwell, I see as very draft based decisions.  I would imagine they are on shorter ropes and this could still change later.  They also could be guys they try to take pay cuts, but IDK.  I see them mostly as draft insurance if they go another way.  I would still guess at least one of them is cut post draft.

 

Roullier may not have passed a physical yet and they may not want to deal with injury settlement.  If he can return to health and/or take a pay cut it is one more level of wait and see.  With him I see another potential cut (guessing 2 of 3 guys when the dust clears).

 

It's definitely a slower conservative way to do things, but cutting them after draft or in fall during 53 man roster trimming, most of the cap savings/dead money won't change.  You can still sign Curl in July.  As much as there are more aggressive ways to do things, I think slow playing a few of these guys and seeing if another few months of recovery helps their play is ok.  If some good options at OL/TE are skipped in the draft, post-draft options at TE/OL are there and also skipped simply to keep these 3 then I'll agree the team is being weird about the approach.  Aggressive may be better and I can understand that, but I think a few weeks of patience is ok.

 

 

Edited March 18, 2023 by CommDownMan

[Est.1974]

14 minutes ago, CommDownMan said:

 

So not going to argue they do it in what feels like an inefficient way, but I think there are some reasons.

Agreed, logical and in reality I do go with that line of thinking. I think for me, it is the diversions around ‘budget constraints’ that are slightly misleading.

 

I see it this way, we’ve commit 200mil in 2023 cash. We have 74 players contracted. There or there about anyway. 
 

Of that, not far off 20mil of cash is currently commit on 3 specific players, Roullier Thomas and Norwell. So that’s broadly 10% of the cash budget on 3 players from 74.
 

Those 3 players have questionable futures on the team.

 

We are up against the cap, right now, because we’re holding onto those players. I have no idea if that is impacting recruitment. Maybe is, maybe isn’t.

 

Budget constraint discussion aside, I’ll take some convincing that is a good way to manage any kind of resource allocation.

 

Slay got a good deal in Philly. But they dumped him first and I bet he came back begging and signed for way less than he wanted. And he got a wedge in the end. But they let him go first to drive the reduction. 
 

Edited March 18, 2023 by Est.1974

[FrFan]

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

19 hours ago, wit33 said:

I dislike playing out a lot of money to the Oline anyways

I think I’ve read posts from you where you state you dislike paying OL, QB, DL, S, TE, WR, LB, CB, RB.  I’m not sure who’s left?  Punter? Beer man? Yourself?

 

 

[Acworth skins fan]

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I think I’ve read posts from you where you state you dislike paying OL, QB, DL, S, TE, WR, LB, CB, RB.  I’m not sure who’s left?  Punter? Beer man? Yourself?

 

 

Beer man definitely deserves a raise. 

[wit33]

1 hour ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I think I’ve read posts from you where you state you dislike paying OL, QB, DL, S, TE, WR, LB, CB, RB.  I’m not sure who’s left?  Punter? Beer man? Yourself?

 

 

Lol, there’s truth here in what you say. 

 

For most part it’s position less for me and more to do with the individual situation of the team and player. 
 

I like paying elite talent, good to great players that are home grown, and churn the rest of the roster in cost efficient manner with jags, draftees, and whoever else. 
 

Secondary I’m totally out on and believe most are overpriced and highly dependent on others doing their job around them for them to impact games. I’m a Dline guy over secondary, arguments for both sides exist, but that’s where I’m at. I’ve been advocating for Washington to sign at least 3 of the 4 Dline and wouldn’t be upset if they made all 4 happen for another 2-3 year window. I’m also very bullish on the impact and ROI a Dline can provide, it’s second to the elite QB in terms of impacting wins and losses on the aggregate. 
 

Oline I’m less bullish, but lean towards being cost effective with this unit. With that said, I was pro resign Trent Williams guy, due to believing he was the best football player in Washington the last 25 years. It’s about value, variance in level of play, and my perceived real opportunity to build an effective Oline at a good cost. 

 

Its a moving target year to year for most part for me. 

 

[The Rook]

18 hours ago, wit33 said:

On the surface this makes sense and I once accepted this as truth, but not sure if I ever want Washington to go all out at the cost of long term success Have the Patriots, S.teelers, Packers, Ravens, or Chiefs employed this strategy over last 20 or so years (I really don’t know)? These are the teams that come to mind that have sustained success and what I’d want Washington to achieve. Less inclined to follow the Saints, Bucs, or Rams model. 

Im still working this through a bit and haven’t reached any sort of philosophical conclusion. 

 

 

What these teams have had, for the most part, is sane, stable ownership.  Maybe this team can get some, one day soon.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

5 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Regarding Thomas, I think the staff wants to see how he looks in minicamps/OTAs first, and then see how the draft plays out. He's the only experienced TE on the roster but if he isn't healthy and/or we draft someone early, he's gonna get cut. On the flip side if he's healthy and looking like the Thomas from 2020 we'll probably keep him around. 

 

  
That’s the impression I get. Some players teams will hold onto as contingency options.

 

Same idea that drives the 3rd wave of FA, guys get cut. That’s the phase when they signed Leno and McCain and also the same phase where they cut Moses after drafting Cosmi. 

Edited March 18, 2023 by Skinsinparadise

[CommDownMan]

4 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

Of that, not far off 20mil of cash is currently commit on 3 specific players, Roullier Thomas and Norwell. So that’s broadly 10% of the cash budget on 3 players from 74.
 

Those 3 players have questionable futures on the team.

 

We are up against the cap, right now, because we’re holding onto those players. I have no idea if that is impacting recruitment. Maybe is, maybe isn’t.

 

Well, that money includes no bonus/escrow and maybe this is an easier way to push money to new owner.  Idk if these guys get paid all year or in season only, but it's probably cheaper than signing a new guy to the equivalent per year level. 

 

The silver lining in my mind is at this point,  if we do cut a few guys post draft and have limited signings, we're maintaining a big avaliable cap for next year (with potentially more rollover to come) and leave it to new owner to use.   People have joked about Synder screwing the cap by putting a massive guaranteed contract for Lamar.  Save aggressive for the new guy that hopefully knows how to run things better.   Boring this lame duck offseason is better than more lasting damage, so I'm mostly good with their slow approach. 

[Chump Bailey]

https://riggosrag.com/2023/03/18/3-underrated-second-level-free-agents-commanders-2023/4/

3 underrated second-level free agents the Commanders should sign in 2023

1. Commanders could sign Fabian Moreau (CB)

2. Commanders could sign Foster Moreau (TE)

3. Commanders could sign Nicholas Morrow (LB)

Edited March 18, 2023 by Chump Bailey

[Koolblue13]

5 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I think I’ve read posts from you where you state you dislike paying OL, QB, DL, S, TE, WR, LB, CB, RB.  I’m not sure who’s left?  Punter? Beer man? Yourself?

 

 

Wit is the dude who gives pennies wrapped in tinfoil to his niece and nephews at christams.

[zCommander]

40 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

Wit is the dude who gives pennies wrapped in tinfoil to his niece and nephews at Christmas.

 

Come on now... He is much classier than tinfoil. He uses these instead...

 

[wit33]

51 minutes ago, zCommander said:

 

Come on now... He is much classier than tinfoil. He uses these instead...

 

 

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

Wit is the dude who gives pennies wrapped in tinfoil to his niece and nephews at christams.

Lol…

Escrow be damned, they’re getting their Christmas gifts. 
 

Im happy the organization is finally in alignment with me. SB here we come!

 

Edited March 19, 2023 by wit33

[clskinsfan]

We might have to sign Abram Smith from the XFL. Dude can play.

[method man]

3 hours ago, Chump Bailey said:

https://riggosrag.com/2023/03/18/3-underrated-second-level-free-agents-commanders-2023/4/

3 underrated second-level free agents the Commanders should sign in 2023

1. Commanders could sign Fabian Moreau (CB)

2. Commanders could sign Foster Moreau (TE)

3. Commanders could sign Nicholas Morrow (LB)

Morrow would be a solid veteran get. I’d be fine with him or Walker Jr

[RWJ]

3 hours ago, Chump Bailey said:

https://riggosrag.com/2023/03/18/3-underrated-second-level-free-agents-commanders-2023/4/

3 underrated second-level free agents the Commanders should sign in 2023

1. Commanders could sign Fabian Moreau (CB)

2. Commanders could sign Foster Moreau (TE)

3. Commanders could sign Nicholas Morrow (LB)

Keim said on either his last or next to last Podcast that he heard the team was at 3rd level signings now.  Take it as you will.   

[Est.1974]

Saturday, March 18

G Seumalo signs three-year deal with Pittsburgh

The Pittsburgh Steelers beefed up their offensive line Saturday night, acquiring a full-time starter from across the state. Former Philadelphia Eagles guard Isaac Seumalo signed a three-year deal with Pittsburgh, sources told ESPN. Seumalo is the Steelers' second offensive line signing in free agency, joining Nate Herbig, who spent three years with the Eagles before a one-year stint with the New York Jets.