The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[clskinsfan]

5 hours ago, KDawg said:

Hindsight is 20/20. Chase Young was the consensus best player on the board

I agree here. Young was the pick. And yes he was bust. But more because of health than anything imo. He was the defensive rookie of the year after all. The other thing about the 2020 draft is that it was a weak draft talent wise. And pretty much all of us were on board with that. That made the Young pick even more solid imo. This 24 draft is the polar opposite. It is stacked with talent. Especially on the offensive side of the ball. 

[PeterMP]

2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

The point has nothing to do with what am saying.  But to play along.  It's not exactly true.  I recall Kiper nonstop clowned Washington among some of his guests for not taking a QB in that draft and said so before and after.  I recall some in PFF criticizing it too in real time.

 

Just to add in, Kiper had Young as the #1 player on his board.  But assuming the medical training staff signed off, he thought we should take Tua.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/02/28/mel-kiper-redskins-tua-tagovailoa-chase-young/

 

And while I understand and generally agree with your point about not passing on the QB you think is best.    I don't watch a bunch of college football but this year have gone out of my way to watch the top QBs a little.  I don't love Maye or Williams a lot more than the others and certainly not Maye.  I'm not excited with taking Maye #2 overall.  If there isn't a guy you love and think is really above the others, I wouldn't be against trading out of 2 and moving down and grabbing a guy later in the first round after the move down.

 

In 2020, could you have said I don't love Tua or Hebert traded back to like 5 and taken who was left (assuming whoever you traded out with at 2 took one of them but the other is then left for you at 5).  And I think you would have ended up with Tua or Hebert and be in pretty good shape today.

Edited January 7 by PeterMP

[Skinsinparadise]

46 minutes ago, PeterMP said:

 

Just to add in, Kiper had Young as the #1 player on his board.  But assuming the medical training staff signed off, he thought we should take Tua.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2020/02/28/mel-kiper-redskins-tua-tagovailoa-chase-young/

 

And while I understand and generally agree with your point about not passing on the QB you think is best.    I don't watch a bunch of college football but this year have gone out of my way to watch the top QBs a little.  I don't love Maye or Williams a lot more than the others and certainly not Maye.  I'm not excited with taking Maye #2 overall.  If there isn't a guy you love and think is really above the others, I wouldn't be against trading out of 2 and moving down and grabbing a guy later in the first round after the move down.

 

In 2020, could you have said I don't love Tua or Hebert traded back to like 5 and taken who was left (assuming whoever you traded out with at 2 took one of them but the other is then left for you at 5).  And I think you would have ended up with Tua or Hebert and be in pretty good shape today.

 

I agree if you don't love or don't like a lot a player you don't take them.  It's common sense though so i don't really expect there is a variable in play where they take someone they don't dig aside from the Dan Snyder era where they took players Dan dug but the FO didn't. 

 

The point I am making is that a team typically doesn't trade down from a top 3 pick WHEN they need a QB.  Teams tend to trade up when they need a QB, especially when it involves the top 3, not trade out of it.  It's perfectly OK if they thought all the top QBs are meh and not worth the pick.  I am not going to hit them for it.  But my point is they better be right.  When Ron explained why he didn't like Herbert -- while it was cool he had an explanation, he was wrong. 

 

And IMO if they do trade down they better be right about the QBs they skipped over because its an unusual move.  

 

As for takes on these QBs, I've talked about it plenty on the draft thread.  But its not about me infusing my own opinion on the QBs and saying for example I am not a Penix guy so if they trade down to lets say #7 to target him, I'd hate it. 

 

My point is if you love a QB you take them early versus trading down and risk losing that player.  

 

I wouldn't care if I loved lets say Nix and thought Drake Maye is a bum and in turn would trade down for that reason because i am not a professional evaluator.   I'll ultimately trust the GM.  But if he does something funky and yes IMO when you need a QB and you are picking in the top 3 and its a ballyhooed draft for QB and you trade out of your pick -- its a funky move -- that funky move better work out.

 

If its just talking about opinions.   I am in the camp that Drake Maye is likely a stud and would be thrilled to have him.  But its not about that, its about the GM getting it right at QB.  And if they trade down, the QBs they skip over in the process if they become great and the QB this team takes isn't nearly as good -- then it will be IMO the epitaph of that GM.  

Edited January 7 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

[FootballZombie]

Giants straight S.O.L. when it comes to getting a top QB.

Nobody is going to trade out.

[clskinsfan]

3 minutes ago, FootballZombie said:

Giants straight S.O.L. when it comes to getting a top QB.

Nobody is going to trade out.

Maybe they reach for Penix or Nix at 6? I think Atlanta is going to take one of them. If they dont trade for Fields or sign Russ. 

[HTTRDynasty]

 

[mhd24]

4 minutes ago, clskinsfan said:

Maybe they reach for Penix or Nix at 6? I think Atlanta is going to take one of them. If they dont trade for Fields or sign Russ. 

 

Nah, Atlanta is either trading for Fields or going hard for Kirk in FA.  They can win with competent QB play.  

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

2 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

Our souls are aligned.

[Conn]

7 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

 

4 minutes ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said:

Our souls are aligned.

He makes me afraid for some reason. Now that I know it’s not a tease and we’re actually drafting at 2, I’ll dive in. 
 

But right now I prefer Daniels despite the risk. 

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

2 minutes ago, Conn said:

 

He makes me afraid for some reason. Now that I know it’s not a tease and we’re actually drafting at 2, I’ll dive in. 
 

But right now I prefer Daniels despite the risk. 

In complete agreement.

 

My personal favorites are Williams, Daniels and Harrison Jr.

[Bacon]

18 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

 

Any one of these QBs could be a stud with support in the right system. I don't know what our system is going to look like, so I don't have a very strong feeling one way or another about the QBs as they pertain to our situation.

 

What I do know is that Michael Penix, healthy and with a decent supporting cast, is going to be a monster in this league. He wins and does it the right way, making the right reads and throwing dimes. He's a special talent. We won't go for him, but whoever he ends up with later in the first round will be an example of the rich getting richer. 

[Conn]

10 minutes ago, Bacon said:

 

Any one of these QBs could be a stud with support in the right system. I don't know what our system is going to look like, so I don't have a very strong feeling one way or another about the QBs as they pertain to our situation.

 

What I do know is that Michael Penix, healthy and with a decent supporting cast, is going to be a monster in this league. He wins and does it the right way, making the right reads and throwing dimes. He's a special talent. We won't go for him, but whoever he ends up with later in the first round will be an example of the rich getting richer. 

 

Medicals are going to be huge for him. He can be healthy now and still have knees with an observable shelf life or a shoulder that’s got chronic arthritic issues in the near future. 
 

I don’t see anything special in his arm. His accuracy and ball placement is good, but so are his weapons. I remember the Mike Evans effect on Johnny Manziel. It matters. But I don’t think he has a special arm. Definitely good, above serviceable.

 

I’m inherently skeptical of a guy who finally blows up in college by utilizing his super senior status to get really good at reading college defenses. The Pickett effect, but more exaggerated with Penix having like 6 years and beating up on kids while he’s a grown man. It has to be taken into consideration.

 

Seems like a great consolation prize for someone at the top of the 2nd round if his medicals check out. Maybe the Giants. Which automatically means he’s worthy of a late 1st trade-up for a team who really loves him and wants that 5th year option on his rookie contract.

 

 

Edited January 8 by Conn

[Ball Security]

2 minutes ago, Conn said:

 

Medicals are going to be huge for him. He can be healthy now and still have knees with an observable shelf life or a shoulder that’s got chronic arthritic issues in the near future. 
 

I don’t see anything special in his arm. His accuracy and ball placement is good, but so are his weapons. I remember the Mike Evans effect on Johnny Manziel. It matters. But I don’t think he has a special arm. Definitely good, above serviceable.

 

I’m inherently skeptical of a guy who finally blows up in college by utilizing his super senior status to get really good at reading college defenses. The Pickett effect, but more exaggerated with Penix having like 6 years and beating up on kids while he’s a grown man. It has to be taken into consideration.

 

Seems like a great consolation prize for someone at the top of the 2nd round if his medicals check out. Maybe the Giants. Which automatically means he’s worthy of a late 1st trade-up for a team who really loves him and wants that 5th year option on his rookie contract.

 

 

The medical concerns are legit, but to me, my biggest concern is that he’s played in the same offense for five seasons now. That’s a huge benefit. My question would be: can that offense translate to the NFL and can excel in a different offense? 
 

What he’s doing on the college stage has been incredible and very fun to watch. But you draft not for what they did in college, but what you anticipate he’ll do in the NFL.

 

He comes across as a pretty awesome, inspiring dude.

[illone]

1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

 

1 hour ago, BRAVEONAWARPATH said:

Our souls are aligned.

 

That makes three of us.

 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

There’s a lot more “Maye ain’t the guy” takes here than I expected. I don’t really understand it. Not sure how anyone can look at Maye and not be impressed with him as a prospect.
 

But it’s a long time until draft day. We’ll see how it plays out.

 

The cool thing about a regime change is that we have plenty to pay attention to in the offseason. Let’s hope this disaster of a season will be our last for a long time. 
 

 

[illone]

3 minutes ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

Not sure how anyone can look at Maye and not be impressed with him as a prospect.

 

How closely do you follow college football? 

[Warhead36]

It’s classic prospect fatigue and/or overthinking. 
 

Pair Maye with a legit coach and run the division for the next decade.

[HTTRDynasty]

 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

6 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

It’s classic prospect fatigue and/or overthinking. 
 

Pair Maye with a legit coach and run the division for the next decade.

It’s not that at all.  We haven’t even hit that point, there’s still so much more to learn about all the prospects.  
 

I do think declaring that Maye and a legit coach = run the division for a decade is a wild call at this juncture.  

[Llevron]

51 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

It’s not that at all.  We haven’t even hit that point, there’s still so much more to learn about all the prospects.  
 

I do think declaring that Maye and a legit coach = run the division for a decade is a wild call at this juncture.  

I like the idea that you take a players highlight tape and find out how to get him there consistently. I also want to believe we can build a program here that allows for players to reach their max potential given they want to do that. 
 

All that to me says it’s Daniels (assuming Williams isn’t there). But I’m still forming an opinion on all of them (y’all are my scouting department) 

[skinsfan66]

8 hours ago, HTTRDynasty said:

 

I am taking it Lawarence is not in the top 12, QBR rank 24 And concerns after 8-3 start and only 1 win 7 int's in last 6 games he started, Carolina being only win. He had some injuries late but played bad. no.1 overall pick. Where did they have them picked before the season, Lawerence top 5?

[clskinsfan]

11 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Everything in my soul tells me Drake Maye is not the guy.

My soul tells me both Caleb and Maye are the guys. The rest? They are all projects or high risk to me. 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

9 hours ago, illone said:

 

How closely do you follow college football? 

I watch a lot of college football. 
 

I also read this board a lot. Lots of people here like to set a narrative. As soon as we got the second pick (which Maye is a high probability), people start in with their gut feelings/etc. This way when he fails, these people can come out of the woodwork to say how right they were all along. 
 

Gut feelings/recency bias aside, there are some things to Maye’s game that need improvement. No prospect is flawless.

 

But anyone who doesn’t think that Maye is a bonafide top 5 pick in any draft is being disingenuous. 
 

 

 

 

Edited January 8 by AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy