The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[El Mexican]

2 hours ago, HigSkin said:

 

They'll improve that oline next year.  I could see the attraction especially if Bezos buys the team.  A lot of high profile QB's that like the spotlight would be intrigued about coming here.  The only thing I wonder about was the rumors last year that Brady and Sean Peyton were a package deal to Miami.

 

 

 

Intrigued = bat **** crazy?

If this O-Line magically transforms from one year to the next it will be RR's crowning achievement.

 

His track record seems pretty weak in this regard, though.

[Conn]

11 minutes ago, El Mexican said:

 

I'm quoting the relevant part of the argument to avoid text walls. Makes it easier to read.

 

But I'm seeing the same argument again and again with a huge bias. Clearly TH is an unbalanced QB, but he's the best QB we have right now.

 

Sad? Yes. But the blame should be placed on RR, not the guy throwing the passes since he's had more than enough time to evaluate him.

Placing all our chips on Wentz (and before that the bearded 40 y/o guy that lasted for about 1 quarter before getting injured) was a huge planning mistake.

 

That's two consecutive years the guy makes the same horrible QB evaluation error.

This has nothing to do with your comment about Heinicke’s lack of arm strength. That’s all I was addressing. 

[NoCalMike]

I get the reasons why TH might have been seen as the better option at one time, but I don't really see the style of offense he runs as being very effective against the 49ers defense.

The running game will attempt to do it's thing, but the 49ers have the #1 run defense so assuming every 2nd and 3rd down are going to be a fight, that short passing game is going to be very cut throat against a fast & hard hitting linebacking core, especially if TH isn't throwing the ball on tight lines with some velocity.

The only real hole in the 49ers defense right now is their secondary, which isn't even bad, but down some starters.  

 

Our offense has the skill position players to get a lot of yards, but you have to be able to hit on those bigger passes.  

 

Not saying Wentz would be super effective either due to the 49ers pass rush, but at least his ability to push the ball vertically downfield with velocity could be an asset.

 

If Rivera is adamant about TH starting the game, fine.....but I won't be surprised if he is benched at some point.  Rivera sort of came out and said the 3rd quarter TD drive by TH saved him from being benched last week.

[kfrankie]

So, anyone think there should be a quarterback change?

[shemp nixon]

1 hour ago, Conn said:

The other thing with Brady is that, because he’ll be playing retirement limbo for as long as he desires, he may actually still be available whenever we get a new owner in the late spring/early summer. Everyone else at QB will be mostly figured out around FA/the draft. But if we spend the offseason beefing up the OL and the rest of the roster, and leave a nice Brady-sized hole in the salary cap because the thing with Bezos or whoever is all but done and they’ve spoken…it’s not impossible. If your owners are Bezos/Jay-Z types the back channel pull is ridiculous. 

Brady looks shot.  The dude is 45 years old, no thanks.

[Conn]

6 minutes ago, shemp nixon said:

Brady looks shot.  The dude is 45 years old, no thanks.

He actually really doesn’t when you isolate him from the crapfest he’s mired in. Dinosaur playcalling mixed with horrible, high school level play sequencing, poor situational decision-making from the coaches, and many other problems. But on a play to play basis, Brady is still making some ridiculous throws. His arm looks great the majority of the time, though something is seriously off with his timing on the deep ball with Evans. He’s turning the ball over more than his norm because for maybe the first time as a vet, he’s spent an entire season uncomfortable and forced into frequent, disadvantageously predictable 3rd and long passing situations where teams can tee off. Godwin isn’t himself yet after the injury, Evans looks disinterested half the time and has always been a bit more limited than his equally elite peers (meaning he is great at a couple things—mainly running vertical downfield), Gage has been injured most of the year, and Otton, as the only decent TE they have, has been playing limited snaps as a rookie. 
 

It’s just a horrendous mixture of poor execution and out-of-touch playcalling and decision-making. Brady arm and individual ability is still fine, imo. Miraculously, at his age. And acting like we, of all franchises, are the team who can afford to turn our nose up at a guy like that because there’s a chance we might be a season late—as if our likely alternatives move the needle at all—that’s frankly hilarious to me. 
 

Yeah, if we have a shot at a blue chip stud rookie or younger franchise signal-caller, obviously I’d prefer that. But the odds that those options will be on the table for us—not great. And this roster, with some OL help, is ready to compete. If our incoming juicy billionaire can open the door to a guy like Brady, you’d be crazy not to consider it. 

[CommanderDOOM]

On 12/19/2022 at 1:15 PM, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

.....believe Wentz got a raw deal....

 

Carson should've started after the bye. We missed the wave....again...and still?? 

Carson ain't Herbert tho, don't treat him like it. Same gameplan as with TH but hopefully we can punish teams more with P/A.

It baffles me that Howell cant do what TH is doing...thought he was a steal. Sucks seeing every other rookie qb play but ours.

[Skinsinparadise]

10 hours ago, BleedBNG said:

Hell if I know. I just didn't want to lose the 2nd round pick. I don't really care who they put in. My preference would be Howell at this point. 

 

OK, yeah I didn't want to lose the 2nd rounder either, but there is no danger of that anymore.  Carson would have to take 70% of the snaps for the season, he has not shot at that.

10 hours ago, El Mexican said:

 

With this O-Line Brady would be signing a deathwish by coming here.

Dude wouldn't last a game.

 

We are on an odd track as a team.  Traditionally under Dan, we've had good O lines, and "meh" weapons.  Now we got some of rthe best weapons in the league but a weak offensive line.

 

But the offensive line issue feels to me like a one off.  Masko did a nice job in the first two years under Ron where the line was good.  It fell off this year.  I think in the off season they can walk and chew gum at the same time.  That is fix QB AND O line.  It's clear based on Ron's rhetoric that -- that is the plan as to the O line at least.

[Skinsinparadise]

I seriously doubt it, I'd think 7-10 million but if it ends anywhhere near that, then adios.   But who the heck would pay him that?

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

Agree with the point below

 

 

 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

My dream was for Heinicke to get pulled before Wentz was back at full health so Ron would be forced to play Howell.  That ship has sailed. 😢
 

As for Heinicke’s FA value, I won’t believe he gets anything much more than what he got here 2 years ago until I see it.

 

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by BatteredFanSyndrome

[Est.1974]

45 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I'd think 7-10 million

Yep broadly same here. Maybe a bit less. 5mil base per year with as much again in incentives. Watch him end upon another NFC East roster in 2023.....

[Chump Bailey]

Any NFL executive that opts to pay TH close to twenty-million per needs to be separated from the gene pool ASAP. 

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

16 minutes ago, Chump Bailey said:

Any NFL executive that opts to pay TH close to twenty-million per needs to be separated from the gene pool ASAP. 

My guess is the teams win-loss record weighs heavily into the estimate, of which obviously scouts and FO’s will dig much deeper.

[Warhead36]

20 Mil for Taylor Heinicke LMAO what a time to be alive

[HigSkin]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Agree with the point below

 

 

 

 

FWIW - EB on The Junkies this morning in the "Hit the Skins" segment said they (coaches) really, really like Sam Howell.

 

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by HigSkin

[method man]

9 hours ago, El Mexican said:

 

Intrigued = bat **** crazy?

If this O-Line magically transforms from one year to the next it will be RR's crowning achievement.

 

His track record seems pretty weak in this regard, though.

They overplayed their hand with Matsko. Our starting OL has zero players who would start on the Eagles or Cowboys. Good news is adding an RT and center depth would do wonders

[mastdark_inc]

8 hours ago, Conn said:

He actually really doesn’t when you isolate him from the crapfest he’s mired in. Dinosaur playcalling mixed with horrible, high school level play sequencing, poor situational decision-making from the coaches, and many other problems. But on a play to play basis, Brady is still making some ridiculous throws. His arm looks great the majority of the time, though something is seriously off with his timing on the deep ball with Evans. He’s turning the ball over more than his norm because for maybe the first time as a vet, he’s spent an entire season uncomfortable and forced into frequent, disadvantageously predictable 3rd and long passing situations where teams can tee off. Godwin isn’t himself yet after the injury, Evans looks disinterested half the time and has always been a bit more limited than his equally elite peers (meaning he is great at a couple things—mainly running vertical downfield), Gage has been injured most of the year, and Otton, as the only decent TE they have, has been playing limited snaps as a rookie. 
 

It’s just a horrendous mixture of poor execution and out-of-touch playcalling and decision-making. Brady arm and individual ability is still fine, imo. Miraculously, at his age. And acting like we, of all franchises, are the team who can afford to turn our nose up at a guy like that because there’s a chance we might be a season late—as if our likely alternatives move the needle at all—that’s frankly hilarious to me. 
 

Yeah, if we have a shot at a blue chip stud rookie or younger franchise signal-caller, obviously I’d prefer that. But the odds that those options will be on the table for us—not great. And this roster, with some OL help, is ready to compete. If our incoming juicy billionaire can open the door to a guy like Brady, you’d be crazy not to consider it. 

He probably won't want to come here but the games I have seen him this year, he does finally look like he is missing throws preventing them from winning.  Missing throws at a rate higher than he has in the past, I should say.  If he's willing to come here, why not bring him in but you still have to draft a qb. 

[Warhead36]

11 minutes ago, method man said:

They overplayed their hand with Matsko. Our starting OL has zero players who would start on the Eagles or Cowboys. Good news is adding an RT and center depth would do wonders

I think losing Roullier REALLY hurt. He is by all counts a top 10 ish C and also calls all the protection schemes and they were banking on him returning healthy. That would have had a domino affect on the rest of the OL. 

 

But ultimately, Rivera really screwed the pooch. He inherited an OL with Trent Williams, Brandon Scherff, and Morgan Moses. Two All Pros and in Moses a rock solid starter who doesn't miss games. He let them all go for essentially nothing(okay a 5th and future 3rd for Williams, that's basically nothing for a GOAT-tier LT). 

 

That coupled with missing on a franchise QB in 2020 is what's gonna end up resulting in his downfall.

[mistertim]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I seriously doubt it, I'd think 7-10 million but if it ends anywhhere near that, then adios.   But who the heck would pay him that?

 

 

 

 

This is legitimately one of the most insane things I've ever seen. The idea of anyone paying Heinicke $20 million per year is beyond ridiculous. I'd be shocked if he got any offers over $5 million per year.

[El Mexican]

9 hours ago, Conn said:

This has nothing to do with your comment about Heinicke’s lack of arm strength. That’s all I was addressing. 

 

Oh...

[50yrSKINSfan]

8 hours ago, kfrankie said:

So, anyone think there should be a quarterback change?

Last game I think we were 1 for 13 on 3rd down and when that happens the problem is the QB so a change would not be a bad idea. If we were not hosed by the refs at the end of the game and TH got us a 2 pt conversion to tie and then drove us to a win I would stay with TH. Problem was refs decided for that not to happen. Only other problem is that the guy who will replace him is not very good this year and you are playing a real good defense. Glad it is RR decision and not mine.

[wit33]

41 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

 

FWIW - EB on The Junkies this morning in the "Hit the Skins" segment said they (coaches) really, really like Sam Howell.

 

 

This would be a home run if Washington coaches love Howell and feel he can be the starter next year. So many doors open up to put together an elite roster. 

[skinny21]

2 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

This is legitimately one of the most insane things I've ever seen. The idea of anyone paying Heinicke $20 million per year is beyond ridiculous. I'd be shocked if he got any offers over $5 million per year.

Yeah, this was scrutinized a while back - it was one of Spotrac’s 5 comps that blew up the average.

[kfrankie]

9 minutes ago, 50yrSKINSfan said:

Last game I think we were 1 for 13 on 3rd down and when that happens the problem is the QB so a change would not be a bad idea. If we were not hosed by the refs at the end of the game and TH got us a 2 pt conversion to tie and then drove us to a win I would stay with TH. Problem was refs decided for that not to happen. Only other problem is that the guy who will replace him is not very good this year and you are playing a real good defense. Glad it is RR decision and not mine.

I love trying to squeek into the playoffs every year at 9-7, 8-8, 8-7-1, 7-8-1, and now at  9-7-1, 8-8-1, 9-8, and 8-9.