The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Leonard Washington]

59 minutes ago, HigSkin said:

One of the highlights from first quarter came on a third-and-4, when Howell delivered a strike to former UNC teammate Dyami Brown, who turned the pass into a 26-yard gain. He also had a 15-yard pass to Alex Erickson, which led to a field goal later in the quarter, and a 28-yard shot to Matt Cole that led to another field goal in the third quarter.

Kinda sad that is the highlight.  The ravens seemed to be hitting 40yd+ bombs on every drive.

[The Rook]

16 minutes ago, Leonard Washington said:

Kinda sad that is the highlight.  The ravens seemed to be hitting 40yd+ bombs on every drive.

 

I agree.

 

Here were three thoughts I had about the last game:

1 - The Ravens were attacking on Defense and Offense 

2 - The Offensive play calling was "meh" - Wash seemed to just be "running plays"

3 - I really appreciated the zoomed out camera perspective in that game

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[88Comrade2000]

Carson gets us to the playoffs; he’s coming back. He fails to do that, we likely move on.  Only way he returns from not making the playoffs; he has a career year  but other factors prevent playoffs. More than likely, our defense.
 

I know most disagree with me but Carson fails; that could be fatal to Ron’s future. Ron’s staking it all on Carson. Carson busts and Dan really going to trust Ron? If we have move on from Carson; Dan’s not going to be willing to go with Sam. Dan’s going want to trade up to get one of the top qbs in the 23 draft.

 

 

John Kiem thinks Sam will be our starter in 23.

[MartinC]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Carson is intriguing.  But I admit I became much less intrigued after his subpar Senior Bowl and the stories that he's a really weird dude personality wise.  Though we do have one of his favorite targets in Cole Turner.

Strong had a total of 4 attempts all preseason. Really strange for a guy they gave such a large guarantee to.

 

He must have really stunk in practice or alienated the coaching staff with attitude.

[Voice_of_Reason]

26 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

John Kiem thinks Sam will be our starter in 23.

He never said that.  Or anything approaching that.  He said maybe he would develop into a backup by 2023. He said that If he develops into a good backup that’s a success.  

 

I’ve listened to every one of his podcasts.  
 

Let’s not mis-quote reporters please. 
 

@Skinsinparadise I didn’t get that wrong did I?

[Warhead36]

50 minutes ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

Carson gets us to the playoffs; he’s coming back. He fails to do that, we likely move on.  Only way he returns from not making the playoffs; he has a career year  but other factors prevent playoffs. More than likely, our defense.
 

I know most disagree with me but Carson fails; that could be fatal to Ron’s future. Ron’s staking it all on Carson. Carson busts and Dan really going to trust Ron? If we have move on from Carson; Dan’s not going to be willing to go with Sam. Dan’s going want to trade up to get one of the top qbs in the 23 draft.

 

 

John Kiem thinks Sam will be our starter in 23.

Yeah if Wentz busts, and I mean really BUSTS, then you have to start questioning if Rivera really is the guy. You can't not have QB figured out after three years, especially since there were ample opportunities in two straight drafts to get a young guy to build around.

 

But even if we're below .500, if Wentz mostly plays well, they'll both stick around, Wentz will get an extension to free up cap room, and I see Rivera going "all in" in Free Agency to really try to win now.

 

The thing is, in the Snyder era, no coach has had three straight losing seasons. Shanahan got a winning record in year three before being fired after going 3-13 in year four but even Gruden managed back to back winning seasons in years 2 and 3(ok 8-7-1 in 2016 but still counts)and Gibbs had winning seasons two out of four years. 

[NoCalMike]

Howell and not Wentz could be the key to Rivera's future beyond this season.  Can't get ahead of ourselves but Howell did enough in the preseason that there is already some drafter's remorse around the league when comparing what some of the QB's drafted higher looked like.  Like I said, this is way too early to even speculate, but I could see a scenario where Wentz has a good season, but the organization thinks his price tag is too high (assuming he doesn't want to restructure) and they let him walk, feeling Howell could take over in 2023, and be ready to take a huge step in 2024.   Now that could still be the case whether Rivera is here or not, I guess it is how willing ownership is in taking a good looking QB prospect and starting over with a new everything going into his second year as a pro and first year starting.   All this to say, who knows at this point, way too many possibilities are there for beyond 2022.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, MartinC said:

Strong had a total of 4 attempts all preseason. Really strange for a guy they gave such a large guarantee to.

 

He must have really stunk in practice or alienated the coaching staff with attitude.

 

Makes sense, something definitely had to go awry.  The other thing with him is his deep history of injuries.

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

He never said that.  Or anything approaching that.  He said maybe he would develop into a backup by 2023. He said that If he develops into a good backup that’s a success.  

 

I’ve listened to every one of his podcasts.  
 

Let’s not mis-quote reporters please. 
 

@Skinsinparadise I didn’t get that wrong did I?

 

I've not heard Keim say Howell will be the 2023 QB.   though I hven't listened to his last podcast which I plan to do this morning.

 

I've heard Keim talk about Wentz plenty of times and him saying that Wentz would be gone in 2023 would be a wild departure for him.  I've heard many reporters speculate that Howell becomes the prime back up in 2023.  

[Skinsinparadise]

@Thinking Skins

 

 

 

[88Comrade2000]

11 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

He never said that.  Or anything approaching that.  He said maybe he would develop into a backup by 2023. He said that If he develops into a good backup that’s a success.  

 

I’ve listened to every one of his podcasts.  
 

Let’s not mis-quote reporters please. 
 

@Skinsinparadise I didn’t get that wrong did I?

I need to listen to that again but swore he said that yesterday on the Junks.

[KDawg]

5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

@Thinking Skins

 

 

 

This was obvious with the QB trade the other day.

[DJHJR86]

https://www.si.com/fannation/bringmethesports/vikings/rg3-cousins-probably-not-happy-about-kellen-mond

 

lol

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

1 hour ago, Koolblue13 said:

 

 

Supposedly he couldn't grasp anything in meetings, couldn't understand film, and couldn't implement concepts onto the practice field. I heard the Eagles beatreporters were as excited as you could get for a UDFA, but within days it changed to a "He can't play".

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

 

 

 

 

[KDawg]

3 hours ago, DJHJR86 said:

https://www.si.com/fannation/bringmethesports/vikings/rg3-cousins-probably-not-happy-about-kellen-mond

 

lol

 

Well, the guy who was drafted second overall in a similar mold to Kellen Mond lost his spot to Kirk, so safe to say, especially now: Kirk was unbothered. 

Edited August 30, 2022 by KDawg

[Thinking Skins]

7 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

@Thinking Skins

 

 

 

Yeah, I have a feeling he's really bad? Like a Josh Rosen (who was also cut). What could be going on?

[Conn]

5 hours ago, KDawg said:

 

Well, the guy who was drafted second overall in a similar mold to Kellen Mond lost his spot to Kirk, so safe to say, especially now: Kirk was unbothered. 

right, the dude space jam-style absorbed the career expectations of a historically hyped #2 overall phenom QB without breaking a sweat, nailed down 5+ years and counting of fully guaranteed elite franchise QB money, and obsessively plans his own days out into little 15-minute boxes. That type of dude, with his production, is gonna be bothered by a raw 3rd round QB pick? lol no 

[SkinsFTW]

10 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

 

It's good to see that at least 1 team knows that it's better to cut 2nd year 3rd rounders who obviously suck.

 

He's even a QB and they still did it.

 

 

 

 

[The Rook]

22 hours ago, Warhead36 said:

Yeah if Wentz busts, and I mean really BUSTS, then you have to start questioning if Rivera really is the guy. You can't not have QB figured out after three years, especially since there were ample opportunities in two straight drafts to get a young guy to build around.

 

 

"ample opportunities"? I'm not seeing it

Which young guy would you have picked?

2020 - Tua? You would have had to have a crystal ball to select Herbert when they weren't even sure they needed a QB. Remember, they had a young QB in Haskins.

2021 - Jones or Fields? They really excite you to have thrown draft capital for them? Or would you tried a RG3 trade and end up with Zack Wilson?

2022 - Someone other than Howell you liked better in this year's draft?

 

The guy I wanted is playing QB for the Rams, but he would not have come here over LA ,AND he is not a young guy.

(TBH, I did hope they would draft Davis Mills in the 2021 third round, but the Texans got him first.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Rook

[Voice_of_Reason]

12 hours ago, 88Comrade2000 said:

I need to listen to that again but swore he said that yesterday on the Junks.

I rather doubt it because he’s been adamant that the best case scenario is to develop into a backup.  
 

[Dark Acre]

11 hours ago, Always A Commander Never A Captain said:

 

Supposedly he couldn't grasp anything in meetings, couldn't understand film, and couldn't implement concepts onto the practice field. I heard the Eagles beatreporters were as excited as you could get for a UDFA, but within days it changed to a "He can't play".

Sounds like our Andre Johnson pick (granted he was (technically) an OT), except we traded up into the 1st round to select that bust.

[IrepDC]

I just watched Kurt Warner's break down of Carson Wentz preseason performance in our offense. He gives some great insight. He should be coaching somewhere with the knowledge he has. He breaks down the areas Wentz needs to improve really well. Here are my biggest takeaways from his analysis:

 

1. Footwork. Warner likes a lot of what Carson's doing, but he points out a few examples where Wentz' footwork effects the accuracy of his his throws. At times he will remain square instead of shifting his feet and it usually shows in the throw.

2. Balance. Wentz actually shows great balance navigating the pocket, but Warner points out instances where Wentz falls back in his throwing motion- instead of shifting weight forward. At times you could see the pass rush causing him to do this, but other times he does it unnecessarily.

3. The scheme. Warner points out at least 3 plays where the offensive scheme isn't doing the QB any favors. He shows instances where our offensive scheme brings extra defenders to the play side, or runs our receivers into coverage, or leaves the QB with little to no options. That's something I have been suspicious of for years when watching our offense, such as noticing multiple receivers in the same area, but Warner confirmed my suspicion and broke it down further. Turner has room to grow as an OC.

 

Overall Warner seems to like what he's seeing from Wentz from a mental standpoint. The analysis was more about Carson's weaknesses, but Warner comments on Wentz seeing things well and processing what he's supposed to do in the offense well. Still seems like there's a wide spectrum of possible outcomes for this season.

[KDawg]

8 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I rather doubt it because he’s been adamant that the best case scenario is to develop into a backup.  
 

That is an equally asinine take. I don’t care where Howell was drafted. He lost all of his weapons, turned the WR3 into a 1500 yard receiver and because he lost two backs he now rushed for nearly a grand as well. And that season was looked down upon by pundits because he wasn’t a 50/3 for 6k yards guy. It’s absurd. 
 

Howell was a first or second round talent for this draft class that went in the fifth. His ceiling is not developing into a backup. That’s ridiculous.

[Skinsinparadise]

8 hours ago, Voice_of_Reason said:

I rather doubt it because he’s been adamant that the best case scenario is to develop into a backup.  
 

 

He's not said that in his podcasts that I can recall.  He's said if he turns into a backup that's good pick, meaning if he's just that its still a good pick too.  I don't recall him saying though his potential is limited to a backup.