2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[RWJ]

21 minutes ago, KDawg said:

Mayfield is our best option at 11 and somewhat realistic in that you can make a reasonable argument for why he’d be available. If you can get him for just 11 he’s also very worth his cost.

 

Issues with this scenario: he probably costs more than a 1. But not too much more. And, quite frankly, if Cleveland lets him go who is their QB? Are they comfortable with Keenum?

No, they'd be in the same situation as us.  Best FA QB and bundle their pick and our picks together and move up and get the best QB they can.  I would give up our #1 and a conditional 2023 3rd that could turn into a 2nd round pick for Mayfield.  That's just me though.  

[skinny21]

2 hours ago, KDawg said:

Mayfield is our best option at 11 and somewhat realistic in that you can make a reasonable argument for why he’d be available. If you can get him for just 11 he’s also very worth his cost.

 

Issues with this scenario: he probably costs more than a 1. But not too much more. And, quite frankly, if Cleveland lets him go who is their QB? Are they comfortable with Keenum?

I don’t know where their head is at (ie, how fans would react, if the coach/FO would be in jeopardy), but if they could get a 2023 1st instead* (ie, ammo to get a qb next year) and withstand a year of mediocrity this year (ie, landing a higher draft pick than if Mayfield plays for them this year), it could be a savvy move for them…

 

*not that I think a 2023 1st would be enough compensation for them

 

That might be the most complex (and oddest?) sentence I’ve ever typed

Edited February 20, 2022 by skinny21

[Burgold]

I don't know that I'd want Baker Mayfield. Maybe I don't follow closely enough, but I keep hearing the Brown's are ready to explode and they keep being the Browns. I'm not sure he has the qualities you need for a premier QB.

 

I'd also expect that he'd be pretty pricy.

 

Just did a quick look at his stats. His career accuracy is in the low 60's. His TD:INT is not that great either.

                         Comp%    Yards    TD    INT    Rating

2021	Browns	60.5	3,010	17	13	83.1
2020	Browns	62.8	3,563	26	8	95.9
2019	Browns	59.4	3,827	22	21	78.8
2018	Browns	63.8	3,725	27	14	93.7

[PlayAction]

On 2/18/2022 at 6:31 AM, Est.1974 said:

Clearly the QB move pretty much dictates the whole direction of travel we go.

 

If we don’t go big at QB in free agency, we could target defense in FA to plug the gaps at LB and FS. Draw that line under the D.

 

You then get left with say Trubisky or Mariota, but in the draft you add a QB, stud WR prospect and another couple of pieces at RB and TE. In theory you could do that with your first 4 picks IF we sorted LB and FS in free agency.
 

 

 

The Commanders' talent level at almost every position does not match up to the top teams.  A great QB will elevate the talent around him but the top teams have both the QB and the talented position players.  I don't think the team should reach for a QB in the draft.  How many "sure fire" QBs have failed?  The Commanders have had more than their share of such failure and an all-in trade that didn't pan out would hamstring the team for another ten years.  IMO, the team needs two years of GOOD drafts and GOOD free agent acquisitions to put a rookie QB into a position where he could be successful. It sux but I think that's the reality we face.  No shortcuts.     

[Going Commando]

If Baker gets traded, he's a buy-low candidate.  The Browns wouldn't be able to command a big return because he's coming off his worst season, there was a ton of acrimony between him and the team as he played seriously hurt and put off getting surgery for them until they were eliminated from the postseason, he's headed into his walk year, and everyone they'd deal with would know they aren't going to pay him.  Their options are:

 

1 - Pay him

2 - Take what they can get in trade

3 - He walks for nothing

 

Matt Ryan is a buy-low candidate too.  This is going to be his last year with Atlanta if they don't trade him this offseason.  He's not going to get another extension with them and I doubt they'll let him walk after '23 for nothing.  They're in a **** or get off the pot situation with him too, and Arthur Smith said he wanted to keep all of his options on the table.  And really, it makes sense for them to get Smith his long term direction at QB ASAP so he isn't entering his third season with no plan there. 

 

And the huge dead cap hit isn't going to be a big barrier to trade for two reasons: either they deal him now or on draft day for '22 draft compensation and they cram the dead cap hits for Ryan, Julio Jones, and Calvin Ridley all into the same tank year to clear their books up for the future, or they pick a QB in this draft and wait until June to deal him for '23 compensation to cut the dead cap hit in half.  Either outcome would be good for us as the potential trade partner, because the first one means we're paying almost none of his salary next season and would have a ton of cap space left, and the second one means we get a full '22 draft class plus they'd undermine their asking price by already having their next QB in house.

[Est.1974]

16 minutes ago, PlayAction said:

 IMO, the team needs two years of GOOD drafts and GOOD free agent acquisitions to put a rookie QB into a position where he could be successful. It sux but I think that's the reality we face.  No shortcuts. 

Rivera just hasn’t got that amount of time. I agree a rookie QB from this class more than likely isn’t the answer, unless you are looking longer term. Rivera isn’t looking longer term in my opinion, he’s thinking we are close to winning now...which is why a trade for the Jimmy G’s of this world is the more probable outcome......

[mhd24]

2 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

If Baker gets traded, he's a buy-low candidate.  The Browns wouldn't be able to command a big return because he's coming off his worst season, there was a ton of acrimony between him and the team as he played seriously hurt and put off getting surgery for them until they were eliminated from the postseason, he's headed into his walk year, and everyone they'd deal with would know they aren't going to pay him.  Their options are:

 

1 - Pay him

2 - Take what they can get in trade

3 - He walks for nothing

 

Matt Ryan is a buy-low candidate too.  This is going to be his last year with Atlanta if they don't trade him this offseason.  He's not going to get another extension with them and I doubt they'll let him walk after '23 for nothing.  They're in a **** or get off the pot situation with him too, and Arthur Smith said he wanted to keep all of his options on the table.  And really, it makes sense for them to get Smith his long term direction at QB ASAP so he isn't entering his third season with no plan there. 

 

And the huge dead cap hit isn't going to be a big barrier to trade for two reasons: either they deal him now or on draft day for '22 draft compensation and they cram the dead cap hits for Ryan, Julio Jones, and Calvin Ridley all into the same tank year to clear their books up for the future, or they pick a QB in this draft and wait until June to deal him for '23 compensation to cut the dead cap hit in half.  Either outcome would be good for us as the potential trade partner, because the first one means we're paying almost none of his salary next season and would have a ton of cap space left, and the second one means we get a full '22 draft class plus they'd undermine their asking price by already having their next QB in house.

 

 

Atlanta is interesting because they could win that division by default next year depending on what Tampa does at QB.  The Saints have major cap issues and a new staff.  Carolina has major strife with Rhule and the owner (and no 2nd or 3rd round picks).  Atlanta has an extra 2nd with the Julio trade.  I think they either trade down from 8, take the best WR at 8, or take a QB at 8.  Pass rusher is a major need, but I don't think they take the 3rd best edge rusher (I figure Aiden and Kayvon are long gone).  They could take the best WR in the draft at 8.  Heck, they could say that we want the BPA and take Linderbaum at 8.

 

I just don't see how Cleveland moves on Baker without a ready-made replacement.  They need a QB to compete, and Kennum (while competent) won't get them to the playoffs. 

 

 

[Riggo#44]

26 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

If Baker gets traded, he's a buy-low candidate.  The Browns wouldn't be able to command a big return because he's coming off his worst season, there was a ton of acrimony between him and the team as he played seriously hurt and put off getting surgery for them until they were eliminated from the postseason, he's headed into his walk year, and everyone they'd deal with would know they aren't going to pay him. 

Mayfield would be a very intriguing get, especially of we don't have to give up a #1 for him. If the team decides to go after him, I'd be all for it--Zampese knows him inside and out. He was Mayfield's QB coach and was largely credited for his success his 1st year, if I recall correctly...

[Going Commando]

11 minutes ago, mhd24 said:

Atlanta is interesting because they could win that division by default next year depending on what Tampa does at QB.  The Saints have major cap issues and a new staff.  Carolina has major strife with Rhule and the owner (and no 2nd or 3rd round picks).  Atlanta has an extra 2nd with the Julio trade.  I think they either trade down from 8, take the best WR at 8, or take a QB at 8.  Pass rusher is a major need, but I don't think they take the 3rd best edge rusher (I figure Aiden and Kayvon are long gone).  They could take the best WR in the draft at 8.  Heck, they could say that we want the BPA and take Linderbaum at 8.

 

I just don't see how Cleveland moves on Baker without a ready-made replacement.  They need a QB to compete, and Kennum (while competent) won't get them to the playoffs.

 

The Falcons are at a crossroads.  Capped out with a 37 year old QB and a team that was bad enough to pick 8th overall is not a good spot to be in for a second year coach.  But they're also not that far away from competitiveness with the roster as is.  You can talk yourselves into them making a run next season if they can replace Ridley with a bonafide stud rookie receiver--like if Wilson or Burks have OBJ type rookie years.

 

If the HC is the one calling the shots on QB, then I could see them trying to run it back and compete next season because HC's are short term thinkers.  IMO they need a GM with real power and job security to force them to take their bitter medicine for the long term health of the team.  They can't put themselves in the position where a 38 year old Matt Ryan heads into his walk year with mid-round '23 picks and no extra draft capital for a year 3 Arthur Smith regime. 

 

If I were their GM, I'd push reset on the roster and trade off Ridley, Jarrett, Ryan, and Matthews (if I take Penning at 8).  The Saints, Bucs, and Panthers aren't going to figure out all of their problems this offseason.  I'd eat a massive dead cap hit this season to clear my cap for next year, and load up on '23 draft capital.  If Smith tells me he wants Willis or Pickett, then I'll pick them at 8 and go BPA with my two seconds.  If he doesn't want them, then I go BPA (Linderbaum or Penning probably) and probably go something like Ridder at 43 and a RB or WR at 58.  See if I strike gold with Ridder like the Eagles and Cowboys did with Hurts/Prescott.  Or look to the first round crop of QBs in '23.

 

The Browns have bungled the situation with Baker Mayfield such that they no longer have the luxury of choices with him.  They have to either pay him or deal him or else wind up like we did with Kirk, which is absolutely the worst outcome and the one that will get all of them fired.  Their flow chart is pretty simple: either they believe he's the guy for them long term and they pay him, or they don't believe he is the guy and they have to take whatever they can get for him--regardless of whether or not another starting QB comes back in the deal.  They're stuck.

[KDawg]

I would gladly give up 11 for Mayfield. But I would not sacrifice next year’s 1. If things go south with contract negotiations or Baker just isn’t good our 1 next year could net us a franchise level QB. 
 

11 for Mayfield I’d do in a heartbeat, though. And the Browns have really hurt themselves in that situation with how it’s been handled.

[Koolblue13]

I'm posting about a rookie RB in the FA thread. Yall talking about a vet QB in the draft thread. Guess the QB thread is discussing FA LBers. 

[Warhead36]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

I would gladly give up 11 for Mayfield. But I would not sacrifice next year’s 1. If things go south with contract negotiations or Baker just isn’t good our 1 next year could net us a franchise level QB. 
 

11 for Mayfield I’d do in a heartbeat, though. And the Browns have really hurt themselves in that situation with how it’s been handled.

I'd negotiate and try to see if he can't be had for less. I don't the market will be THAT hot for Mayfield.

[Koolblue13]

6 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

I'd negotiate and try to see if he can't be had for less. I don't the market will be THAT hot for Mayfield.

Pretty sure everyone would negotiate every deal.

[Ball Security]

1 hour ago, KDawg said:

I would gladly give up 11 for Mayfield. But I would not sacrifice next year’s 1. If things go south with contract negotiations or Baker just isn’t good our 1 next year could net us a franchise level QB. 
 

11 for Mayfield I’d do in a heartbeat, though. And the Browns have really hurt themselves in that situation with how it’s been handled.

What kind of contract would you offer him and would you do it before the season started or would you wait and risk losing leverage?

[Koolblue13]

10 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

What kind of contract would you offer him and would you do it before the season started or would you wait and risk losing leverage?

I'd wait. Let him play out the year, then explore the cost of drafting a rookie. Tag him if needed, while we have plenty of cap.

 

He might come in and immediately win the locker room over and take us deep into the playoffs. 

 

Who knows what could happen. He could slip off a water slide mid-season. Crazy **** happens.

[Darth Tater]

3 hours ago, Est.1974 said:

Rivera just hasn’t got that amount of time. I agree a rookie QB from this class more than likely isn’t the answer, unless you are looking longer term. Rivera isn’t looking longer term in my opinion, he’s thinking we are close to winning now...which is why a trade for the Jimmy G’s of this world is the more probable outcome......

Yep, only 1 non-expansion team coach with 3 non-winning seasons (2 if those include a 10+ loss season) has gone on to be anything but another mediocre coach for that team. Ron has got to know that he will be out of a job in 2023 if he doesn't get at least 8 wins and will probably be a fail if he doesn't get a playoff spot (though he may get a couple of lame duck years). Almost all successful coaches in NFL history took 1 season to turn a turd into a diamond (though it may have been their turd).

[Skinsinparadise]

I've mentioned months back love Dameon Pierce, I know @KDawg and @Koolblue13 do as well.  Big Senior Bowl from him. I like short, low center of gravity, good balance and powerful RBs like Pierce.  Not much wear on his tires.   He can run power well which I think is a good mix with our RBs who major more in zone.  I am guessing he goes 3rd-4th round give or take.

 

But looking now at some potential mid rounders.  4th-5th.

 

I really dig Rachaad White, RB.  A bigger and more physical but not as elusive McKissic.  He's a today kind of back.  Hybrid-pass catcher-RB who can pass block. Don't get me wrong, he's not a WR, he's not really a route runner but he has soft hands who doesn't drop passes that often and accelerates quickly after catching a pass.

 

Pros

Borderline elite pass catcher -- replace McKissic down the line or even now?  He has almost 500 yards as a receiver.  Soft hands.   Catches the ball in stride and accelerates quickly with the ball in his hands

Dangerous in open space both as a pass catcher and a runner when he finds daylight.  He doesn't look to be super fast but he's fast enough.  He has long legs so if he has some daylight he has some homerun ability.

Can run power and zone.  He ran almost an even amont of both at Arizona State.

Gets skinny in the hole

Patient runner, he waits for his blocks to develop

Nice juke moves in open field

Good pass blocker

Breaks tackles well in open space when he has some steam going to his runs

Good change of direction

Rare pass catcher-who can be an everydown RB -- he's well rounded enough IMO

 

 

Cons

Runs upright at times

I am not generally big on tall RBs -- he's 6 "2.  I like the lower center of gravity guys everything being equal

His vision looks good when running to the right (usually the strong side) but not hot running to the left (often weak side).  

As a pass blocker he's not always aware, meaning if a play breaks down he doesn't always adjust well to that and find the next guy to block

His patience serves him well at times but sometimes he's too patient, giving defenders time to collapse the pocket

For a big dude, his power is good when he builds some momentum on his runs but without that momentum he can be stuffed so it makes me wonder about short yardage in the NFL, comes off to me that he might be a better runner as for short yardage coming out of the gun

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Darth Tater]

3 hours ago, mhd24 said:

I just don't see how Cleveland moves on Baker without a ready-made replacement.  They need a QB to compete, and Kennum (while competent) won't get them to the playoffs. 

 

Yeah, if Cleveland actually considers an offer from us on Mayfield, I'd be worried about what we are getting.

[Skinsinparadise]

Kyren Williams, smaller and shifiter than Rachaad White. I like both players, I'd give a slight edge to Williams but I like both of them, so I might change my mind on that over time.   Of all the players i've watched so far he reminds me the most of Michael Carter but not as explosive who was one of my guys in the last draft. 

 

But IMO Williams and White are in the same flavor in that they are well rounded, they can run, catch, pass block.  Not sure though he'd be a power back complement to Gibson considering his size even though Williams prides himself for blowing up defenders and his power run score from PFF is really good -- I am just wondering if that translates from college to the pros, I am not sure.

 

I don't think he's anything special as a RB.  He is good but not great IMO.  The charm for me is he's a good enough runner while being also a really good pass catcher and good pass blocker.  So jack of all trades in a good way.

 

Positive

Wicked spin move

Changes directions fast 

Stop and go moves reminds me some of Michael Carter 

Good pass blocker -- reminds me of Portis in some ways where he looks like he enjoys being physical without the ball in his hands despite his size

Really good receiver and like White he accelerates fast once he catches the ball 

Good contact balance

 

Negative

Size -- 5 "9, 199.

For a dude that small he doesn't look super fast.  Looks to have decent speed but nothing special

While he is elusive in short space, it seems like it takes him a step or two to build speed

Seems like he thinks at times too much about juking defenders even from the jump when he gets the ball versus doing one cut and running -- my point is I can see him getting stuffed some at the line of scrimmage and even losing yards on some plays in the pros because of that mindset.

While he prides himself on being a power guy, I've seen him stuffed back on some runs by big defenders and I can see that happening more to him in the pros versus college.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Koolblue13]

The brownies would have 11&13 and be able to draft whoever they want or trade for Jimmy with their 2nd. 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

The brownies would have 11&13 and be able to draft whoever they want or trade for Jimmy with their 2nd. 

 

I don't love the idea of trading for Jimmy G or even like it but I also don't hate to the extent than some others do.   Depends to me on the price as for how I'd digest the deal.

 

I do think him moving to a team might set forth some dominos that could effect other QBs so I am hoping he gets traded soon.  Ideally, not to us but to the Raiders or Browns with the thought of that would make it easier for them to discard their incumbent QBs.

 

The rumor is building that Tampa will trade Brady to SF and Bradys retirement is fake in order to push for this move and if that happens Jimmy G might go in return to Tampa.

 

Pittsburgh like us seem to be rumored to be interested in just about every Qb including Jimmy G.  It wouldn't surprise me if Jimmy G is moved this week.  

Edited February 20, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[kingdaddy]

10 hours ago, Going Commando said:

If Baker gets traded, he's a buy-low candidate.  The Browns wouldn't be able to command a big return because he's coming off his worst season, there was a ton of acrimony between him and the team as he played seriously hurt and put off getting surgery for them until they were eliminated from the postseason, he's headed into his walk year, and everyone they'd deal with would know they aren't going to pay him.  Their options are:

 

1 - Pay him

2 - Take what they can get in trade

3 - He walks for nothing

 

Matt Ryan is a buy-low candidate too.  This is going to be his last year with Atlanta if they don't trade him this offseason.  He's not going to get another extension with them and I doubt they'll let him walk after '23 for nothing.  They're in a **** or get off the pot situation with him too, and Arthur Smith said he wanted to keep all of his options on the table.  And really, it makes sense for them to get Smith his long term direction at QB ASAP so he isn't entering his third season with no plan there. 

 

And the huge dead cap hit isn't going to be a big barrier to trade for two reasons: either they deal him now or on draft day for '22 draft compensation and they cram the dead cap hits for Ryan, Julio Jones, and Calvin Ridley all into the same tank year to clear their books up for the future, or they pick a QB in this draft and wait until June to deal him for '23 compensation to cut the dead cap hit in half.  Either outcome would be good for us as the potential trade partner, because the first one means we're paying almost none of his salary next season and would have a ton of cap space left, and the second one means we get a full '22 draft class plus they'd undermine their asking price by already having their next QB in house.

I would go for Matt Ryan if the price is right....he could really help us out and is motivated to win a SB too. I'll bet RR would love to get Matt Ryan here for the next 3 years.

[FLSkinz83]

I wouldn't trade for Mayfield and then have to pay him.    Would rather draft a QB

[RWJ]

6 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't love the idea of trading for Jimmy G or even like it but I also don't hate to the extent than some others do.   Depends to me on the price as for how I'd digest the deal.

 

I do think him moving to a team might set forth some dominos that could effect other QBs so I am hoping he gets traded soon.  Ideally, not to us but to the Raiders or Browns with the thought of that would make it easier for them to discard their incumbent QBs.

 

The rumor is building that Tampa will trade Brady to SF and Bradys retirement is fake in order to push for this move and if that happens Jimmy G might go in return to Tampa.

 

Pittsburgh like us seem to be rumored to be interested in just about every Qb including Jimmy G.  It wouldn't surprise me if Jimmy G is moved this week.  

Interesting if this did happen.  Wonder what Tampa would want back from S.F. in a trade for Brady?  Don't know if TB would have the cap space to take on Jimmy G but would be happy with this.   

[HigSkin]

This would suck...