2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[HTTSkins]

On 2/5/2022 at 4:55 PM, KDawg said:

Not to me.

 

Cant win without a QB.

I’m all in on Howell as well; being a UNC grad I saw every game and he’s a leader 

[RWJ]

14 minutes ago, HTTSkins said:

I’m all in on Howell as well; being a UNC grad I saw every game and he’s a leader 

Howell/Corral.  I like them both and would be happy with either one if we drafted one of them.  

[Going Commando]

Thibodeaux is the guy I hope the Giants don't get the most at #5.  That dude hits like a truck and his explosiveness would give our tackles problems.  Most of the mocks I've seen have him going top three but some have him slipping.

[mhd24]

53 minutes ago, Going Commando said:

Thibodeaux is the guy I hope the Giants don't get the most at #5.  That dude hits like a truck and his explosiveness would give our tackles problems.  Most of the mocks I've seen have him going top three but some have him slipping.

 

 

I think the Jets take him/Hutch (whomever is there at 4).  They need an edge BADLY.  It is a major requirement for the Saleh defense.  

[DWinzit]

17 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

1.  Wilson, Rodgers (obviously mega long shots but Mayfield isn't my top desire by a long shot if it was purely a wish list and not based on realism)

2.  Among the 2nd tier guys I like Mayfield the best.  It was once Carr but he's not going to be traded.  The more I digest Jimmy G the more I pause.

3.  Corral at 11 and I think he will be there unless something crazy happens for him in the combine

4.  Mariota in FA with Corral.   (I would be OK with Pickett, Howell, Willis)

5.  Mariotta with Strong or Ridder in the 2nd.  I go back and forth on that, I've been mostly on team Strong between those 2 but was shaken a little by him having supposedly a meh Senior Bowl week.  But I'll stick back with Strong over Ridder.

 

 

The only one that I not a huge fan of is 3 with just Corral. That makes me assume it is him go TH, Allen and Corral, which isn't good enough.

 

I have warmed to trading for Mayfield but I don't see him being available.

I still have little interest in Jimmy G. I can't see him being worth a 1st or possibly even 2nd rounder

Edited February 13, 2022 by DWinzit

[DWinzit]

17 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

1.  Corral:  I noticed him before the previous draft because I studied the Ole Miss prospects a lot for the 2021 draft, Elijah Moore in particular was my guy in that draft.  I recall commenting then on Corral's arm and moxie back then. He was a fun watch but a bit too much a gunslinger.  So I followed him closely through this season.  He's been my QB 1 pretty much the whole time.  Strong arm-good mobility-good pocket presence-tough-good leader.  His accuracy is good -- not great IMO but IMO none of these guys have great accuracy.  Worry some about his size.  i think he can adjust from the RPO offense.  He's the best IMO among this group as to manipulating defenses with his eyes/body language.  Same thing I highlighted last year about Mac Jones.

 

2.  Willis:  I posted about him on off during the season.  His running IMO is special.  Arm strength through the roof.  I don't get why some say Trey Lance is such a better prospect -- when Willis might be even more mobile and have a stronger arm than Lance.  Both are raw with good intangibles.

 

3.  Howell:  Really consistent as far as his accuracy.  He has a strong arm, i think Corral's is a hair stronger but Howell throws better IMO off his back foot.  Showcased good mobility at the combine. Tough. Baller.    Worried about pocket presence, peripheral vision.   There is nothing he does that blows me away but there is a lot he does that I like.  I tend to favor QBs with more personality than Howell -- I prefer extroverts at that spot (more of a Joey T guy on that front than Rypien) but its not a deal breaker -- see Justin Herbert for example.

 

4.  Pickett:  I don't know what to make of his small hands, but I can't ignore his fumbling issues which might be related.  Remembering Daniel Jones in college that issue followed him to the pros.  In some ways he might be the most tailored QB in the class to this team for several reasons.  He played in a pro system, is more seasoned and more likely to hit the ground running.  I think his ability to make plays on the move with boots, etc marry really well with the heavy outside zone running scheme we run -- i can see a lot of play action boots.   I play up personality in QBs, that dude IMO so far is the one I like the best on that front.  Extroverted.  Charismatic.  Reputation of being a leader.  Doesn't surprise me at all he interviewed the best and by a good margin at the Senior Bowl.  

 

After those 4, a peg drop off to the next two IMO.

 

5.  Strong:  Throws a beauty deep ball.  Really good arm strength -- I know there was mixed reports on that at the Senior Bowl but I've seen enough to buy into his arm.  Nice touch.  Can make some wicked tight window throws.  I like his personality -- extroverted, emotional.  His injury history is a concern.  It's funny i see both here and among mock draft types as to people either thinking he has really poor pocket presence or really good pocket presence.  I think both camps are right and wrong.  IMO he sees pressure well from the A gap but really struggles with D gap pressure from the edges. 

 

6.  Ridder:  that was my guy last year as for who I wanted in the 2nd round when I thought he was coming out. I like his size and mobility.  He has long legs so when he finds daylight as a runner he can hit some homeruns.  His accuracy is hit and miss.  He really struggles IMO with quick outs and tight window throws.  He has high intangibles.  teammates like him.  His arm strength IMO is a bit underrrated.  He doesn't throw well off his back foot IMO but if he can step into his throws he puts zip on them.

As we move towards the combine and pre draft workouts, it will be interesting to see who is able to improve their stock. I bet some wish there was another all star game.

Aside from growing 2 inches, putting on 10 pounds of muscle without losing speed or having larger hands than anticipates it's mostly going to be about interviewing or speed. 

How else could they do themselves good?

[Skinsinparadise]

51 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

 

The only one that I not a huge fan of is 3 with just Corral. That makes me assume it is him go TH, Allen and Corral, which isn't good enough.

 

I have warmed to trading for Mayfield but I don't see him being available.

I still have little interest in Jimmy G. I can't see him being worth a 1st or possibly even 2nd rounder

 

I meant to put up Mariota with Corral ahead of the category of just Corral.

 

Mariota's injury issues is definitiely a problem.  But I'd me much more jazzed about him than Trubisky because I think he's a full peg better QB than Trubisky.  I wouldn't hate Trubisky mainly because while I don't love the dude as a passer to say the least, he's a really good runner, not as good IMO as a runner as Mariota but close.

Edited February 13, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I meant to put up Mariota with Corral ahead of the category of just Corral.

 

Mariota's injury issues is definitiely a problem.  But I'd me much more jazzed about him than Trubisky because I think he's a full peg better QB than Trubisky.  I wouldn't hate Trubisky mainly because while I don't love the dude as a passer to say the least, he's a really good runner, not as good IMO as a runner as Mariota but close.

Got it and makes sense. 

It's Mariota's injury history that moves me to have Trubisky ahead of him. 

I am super antsy to see what vet are targeted and who is finally brought in. That move will dictate the draft

[Skinsinparadise]

22 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Got it and makes sense. 

It's Mariota's injury history that moves me to have Trubisky ahead of him. 

I am super antsy to see what vet are targeted and who is finally brought in. That move will dictate the draft

 

Tough for me to get over Trubisky's sketchy accuracy, especially going down field.  He was consistently bad on that front too even the year without Nagy.   Also, doesn't strike me the most cereberal QB for reasons I talked about the QB thread.

 

Having said that I like his size and he can run.  He's IMO an improvement over Heinicke.  I wouldn't bbe jazzed at all if the signed him.  But I'd be OK with it.  He's be the FA I'd take after Mariota. 

 

I do think he can improve elsewhere but I think his ceiling is somewhat in the Daniel Jones range but I thiink he indeed reaches that strata.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

I prefer Trubisky to Mariota still. Availability is one of the best abilities and Mariota doesn’t have it. If you could guarantee he’d be healthy I’d likely prefer him. But a year away from Nagy, surrounded by Allen, not the top guy in the QB room and under Ken Dorsey can make a pretty big difference in a guy.

 

So factoring in all things I think Trubisky’s availability outweighs the very slight edge in QB ability that Mariota possesses. 
 

It’s almost better to just roll with a rookie than it is to sign Mariota.

 

But if he were given a total clean bill of health and the assumption he stays healthy I’d take him over Trubisky. I just don’t think you can accurately give that assessment.

[Skinsinparadise]

Coming from the dude among others who voluntarily mentions Mariota's injury's issues, its not like he's a debacle on that front ala Jimmy G. 

 

In the last three seasons he started.  Two of those seasons he missed a whopping one game each of those seasons.  The bad season for injuries was his last year as a starter where he missed 3 games.  That season, Trubisky missed 2 games by the way with a shoulder injury.

 

Mariota from what I've read hasn't had any major injuries, no ACL's or any major surgery.  He just seems to get banged up, with knee sprains, shoulder sprains, etc.  Arguably it comes with the turf when you are a running QB.

 

If Mariota is off the table with his nagging injuries where for the most part he hasn't missed much playing time than Jimmy G would have to be off the table completely.  Jimmy G is the dude who is big time injury prone who actually missed many games.  It would be comical to even compare. 

 

 I don't think Mariota or Trubisky is the answer for different reasons.  I think Trubisky football IQ and accuracy limits his ceiling among other things.  But beggars can't be choosers in FA, most of these guys hit FA for a reason.  My level of excitement for Trubisky if they sign him is a 1 out of 10.     Mty exctiement for Mariota would be probably be about a 4 out of 10.  But i admit the other QBs are flat 0 for me.  I am not much of a Winston guy or Brisset, etc.

 

The irony for me with Trubisky is the main reason why I wouldn't hate it is I'd like to see him in this scheme.  I think a running QB helps this scheme.  Mariota and Trubisky have something in common in that they are both IMO really good runners both in the open field and as for scrambiling away from pressure.  Mariota IMO is a hair better at it than Trubisky in part because he runs in the 4.4's whereas Trubisky is a 4.6's guy.  But they are both fast.  Mariota to me a clear peg better as a passer.    But I'll downgrade him a half of peg for getting banged up more than Trubisky. 

 

I admit I have a soft spot for Mariota in part because I was in the hospital hanging with my son recovering from a concussion years back, where I was glued to watching the playoff game at the time where the Titans, and Mariota played well, came back to beat the Chiefs in ironically Alex Smith's last game as a Chief.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[KDawg]

I don’t want Jimmy, either. I’d prefer Mariota to him.

[DWinzit]

3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Tough for me to get over Trubisky's sketchy accuracy, especially going down field.  He was consistently bad on that front too even the year without Nagy.   Also, doesn't strike me the most cereberal QB for reasons I talked about the QB thread.

 

Having said that I like his size and he can run.  He's IMO an improvement over Heinicke.  I wouldn't bbe jazzed at all if the signed him.  But I'd be OK with it.  He's be the FA I'd take after Mariota. 

 

I do think he can improve elsewhere but I think his ceiling is somewhat in the Daniel Jones range but I thiink he indeed reaches that strata.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

I want to see Trubisky play once freed from Nagy and having a year under his belt stress free well coached experience in Buffalo

 

It seems like Mariota has been listed on an injury list with issues most games every year. Heck even last year as a backup wasn't he on the IR for like 5 weeks?

 

Like I have stated earlier, I am not a fan of Jimmy G, especially needing to give up assets for him...that seems crazy. I would be mush happier with Mariota or even FA's like Winston, Bridgewater or even Brissett. 

 

Have there been any rumors of a possible Fitz reboot?

[clskinsfan]

15 hours ago, Going Commando said:

Thibodeaux is the guy I hope the Giants don't get the most at #5.  That dude hits like a truck and his explosiveness would give our tackles problems.  Most of the mocks I've seen have him going top three but some have him slipping.

There are some rumors out there about him slipping a little bit due to him taking plays off. That stuff came out after the Senior Bowl. Now could be that a team wants him to fall a little bit. But you do see it on tape from time to time. 

[Redskins 2021]

1 minute ago, clskinsfan said:

There are some rumors out there about him slipping a little bit due to him taking plays off. That stuff came out after the Senior Bowl. Now could be that a team wants him to fall a little bit. But you do see it on tape from time to time. 

He will go top 5. 

[clskinsfan]

1 minute ago, Redskins 2021 said:

He will go top 5. 

We will see. McShay has him listed as his #7 prospect right now. 

[Skinsinparadise]

26 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I want to see Trubisky play once freed from Nagy and having a year under his belt stress free well coached experience in Buffalo

 

 

Tough for me to finesse this point without it being taking out of context if someone clings to one point ( A verus but not the other.  And I'll couch it is of course its totally my opinion and I can end up dead wrong.  I have been on a hot steak lately with QBs but that requires some serious luck and that luck is bound to run out.  And I hope it runs out with a QB that we take that I don't love.  . I would take Jimmy G over Trubisky but Jimmy G would require a pick and more cap room.  Trubisky is cheap so I wouldn't hate it. The Nagy narrative moves me a little but not a lot.

 

A.  I recall the debates about Darnold.  I know some say now Darnold wasn't a serious QB option last year but that's not true.  Most but not all NFL national media types sold Darnold, and hard and ditto the DJ's, Kiper types.  The narrative was hey the dude has talent.  Who was his coach?  Adam Gase, enough said.

 

Ok so now its Trubisky, similar rap, now its because he's Nagy free.  The reason why I didn't buy the Gase argument with Darnold is because Darnold had fundamental issues, mainly accuracy-decision making issues that IMO had very little to do with the scheme.  You are either accurate or you aren't.  You either make good decisions in the heat of battle or you don't.  Darnold and Trubisky accuracy numbers judging by metrics are almost twin brothers identical.    Kyle Shanny is a smart offensive guy.  Yet Jimmy G isn't the best decision maker.  There is an aspect of playing the game where you are making snap decisions that have little to do with coaching and a lot to do with how well you see the field.  Arians talks about this some -- saying its the QBs who are quick processors as for seeing things on the field that have a tremendous advantage and there is so much you can coach that up. 

 

I'd add, and yes this is subjective from me, watching Trubisky's interviews and reading about him -- I like the dude but don't get the impression he's the smartest QB.  He comes off like jock which I am used to with some positions but not QB. His wonderlic score seems to fit him.  Just like Alex Smith's wonderlic score seems to fit him.  The kicker for me was watching Allen Robinson explain the differences between playing with Foles versus Trubisky and citing Foles adjusts to what he sees from the defenses so he has to be more on his toes on the line of scrimmage. 

 

B.  Having said that, here's why I think Trubisky > Darnold.  And i do think he can reach his ceiling which to me is Daniel Jones. While I am not impressed with Trubisky as a pure passer.  I borderline love him as a runner.  I think you can adapt your scheme to that.  And one thing I saw when I watched some of his Bears games, watching the Manning QB school on him among other things -- he was awful at selling play action.  I praise for example Matt Corral (previously I did the same to Mac Jones) for being good at play action fakes, looking off the safety, etc.  As Manning showcased with Trubisky. he really struggles with selling play fakes.  When I watched his Bills preseason game, while I didn't per se see enough to see if he's learned how to sell playf akes -- I did notice (also an issue that Darnold had) he wasn't starring at WRs the way he did with the Bears.  They might have fixed that part of this game.

 

So I can buy he's better post Nagy.  i didn't buy he's a totally different guy without Nagy.  But I could be wrong.  I really hope he's not wearing Burgundy and Gold next season because I'd want someone better but at the same time I wouldn't hate it.  And i'd definitiely take him over Heinicke. 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

24 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Tough for me to finesse this point without it being taking out of context if someone clings to one point ( A verus but not the other.  And I'll couch it is of course its totally my opinion and I can end up dead wrong.  I have been on a hot steak lately with QBs but that requires some serious luck and that luck is bound to run out.  And I hope it runs out with a QB that we take that I don't love.  . I would take Jimmy G over Trubisky but Jimmy G would require a pick and more cap room.  Trubisky is cheap so I wouldn't hate it. The Nagy narrative moves me a little but not a lot.

 

A.  I recall the debates about Darnold.  I know some say now Darnold wasn't a serious QB option last year but that's not true.  Most but not all NFL national media types sold Darnold, and hard and ditto the DJ's, Kiper types.  The narrative was hey the dude has talent.  Who was his coach?  Adam Gase, enough said.

 

Ok so now its Trubisky, similar rap, now its because he's Nagy free.  The reason why I didn't buy the Gase argument with Darnold is because Darnold had fundamental issues, mainly accuracy-decision making issues that IMO had very little to do with the scheme.  You are either accurate or you aren't.  You either make good decisions in the heat of battle or you don't.  Darnold and Trubisky accuracy numbers judging by metrics are almost twin brothers identical.    Kyle Shanny is a smart offensive guy.  Yet Jimmy G isn't the best decision maker.  There is an aspect of playing the game where you are making snap decisions that have little to do with coaching and a lot to do with how well you see the field.  Arians talks about this some -- saying its the QBs who are quick processors as for seeing things on the field that have a tremendous advantage and there is so much you can coach that up. 

 

I'd add, and yes this is subjective from me, watching Trubisky's interviews and reading about him -- I like the dude but don't get the impression he's the smartest QB.  He comes off like jock which I am used to with some positions but not QB. His wonderlic score seems to fit him.  Just like Alex Smith's wonderlic score seems to fit him.  The kicker for me was watching Allen Robinson explain the differences between playing with Foles versus Trubisky and citing Foles adjusts to what he sees from the defenses so he has to be more on his toes on the line of scrimmage. 

 

B.  Having said that, here's why I think Trubisky > Darnold.  And i do think he can reach his ceiling which to me is Daniel Jones. While I am not impressed with Trubisky as a pure passer.  I borderline love him as a runner.  I think you can adapt your scheme to that.  And one thing I saw when I watched some of his Bears games, watching the Manning QB school on him among other things -- he was awful at selling play action.  I praise for example Matt Corral (previously I did the same to Mac Jones) for being good at play action fakes, looking off the safety, etc.  As Manning showcased with Trubisky. he really struggles with selling play fakes.  When I watched his Bills preseason game, while I didn't per se see enough to see if he's learned how to sell playf akes -- I did notice (also an issue that Darnold had) he wasn't starring at WRs the way he did with the Bears.  They might have fixed that part of this game.

 

So I can buy he's better post Nagy.  i didn't buy he's a totally different guy without Nagy.  But I could be wrong.  I really hope he's not wearing Burgundy and Gold next season because I'd want someone better but at the same time I wouldn't hate it.  And i'd definitiely take him over Heinicke. 

You and I have been on the same page from day one regarding Darnold...Gase or no Gase he isn't very good,

Trubisky is > Darnold

Mitch away from Nagy is going to be much better,has to be lol

We agreed last year Mariota would probably have been a top option similar to this year

Mariota is a good option this year especially compared to most of the other FA's.

WE are not looking at Trubisky or Mariota to be the teams future, just a bridge

I sure as hell hope the team is miles better than last year really soon!

 

and for me if they go trade for a QB and they are not one of the biggest names, I am much more of a Mayfied or Jimmy G fan,

Edited February 13, 2022 by DWinzit

[Skinsinparadise]

22 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

You and I have been on the same page from day one regarding Darnold...Gase or no Gase he isn't very good,

Trubisky is > Darnold

 

 

Agree.  But I guess a good way for me to bring the point home is the difference is Trubisky is a real dual threat.  As a passer IMO Trubisky and Darnold are close to being the same guy.

 

But I'd rather stop debating about Trubisky, I don't want to start hating him the way I did Darnold and the deeper I dive into Trubisky and the more I am pushed in a debate, the more alarm bells I get.    So I want to get rid of that angst.   I'll cling to Trubisky is one of the better runners in the NFL, that's the thing I really like about him. 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Koolblue13]

4 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Tough for me to get over Trubisky's sketchy accuracy, especially going down field.  He was consistently bad on that front too even the year without Nagy.   Also, doesn't strike me the most cereberal QB for reasons I talked about the QB thread.

 

Having said that I like his size and he can run.  He's IMO an improvement over Heinicke.  I wouldn't bbe jazzed at all if the signed him.  But I'd be OK with it.  He's be the FA I'd take after Mariota. 

 

I do think he can improve elsewhere but I think his ceiling is somewhat in the Daniel Jones range but I thiink he indeed reaches that strata.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Huge improvements!

5 hours ago, DWinzit said:

Got it and makes sense. 

It's Mariota's injury history that moves me to have Trubisky ahead of him. 

I am super antsy to see what vet are targeted and who is finally brought in. That move will dictate the draft

 

If he gets hurt we start the rookie without putting a dead franchise on his shoulders. It's a win.

[DWinzit]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree.  But I guess a good way for me to bring the point home is the difference is Trubisky is a real dual threat.  As a passer IMO Trubisky and Darnold are close to being the same guy.

 

But I'd rather stop debating about Trubisky, I don't want to start hating him the way I did Darnold and the deeper I dive into Trubisky and the more I am pushed in a debate, the more alarm bells I get.    So I want to get rid of that angst.   I'll cling to Trubisky is one of the better runners in the NFL, that's the thing I really like about him. 

No more unneeded debate or pushing angst 

Besides, chances are neither Trubisky or Mariota are playing for Washington pairing with a draft pick

Edited February 13, 2022 by DWinzit

[Koolblue13]

Imagine being awesome enough at what you do to have one of the only 32 jobs doing it and everyone thinks you're a loser. Poor Sammy Darnold.

[VirginiaVibes]

Quote

3.  Howell:  Really consistent as far as his accuracy.  He has a strong arm, i think Corral's is a hair stronger but Howell throws better IMO off his back foot.  Showcased good mobility at the combine. Tough. Baller.    Worried about pocket presence, peripheral vision.   There is nothing he does that blows me away but there is a lot he does that I like.  I tend to favor QBs with more personality than Howell -- I prefer extroverts at that spot (more of a Joey T guy on that front than Rypien) but its not a deal breaker -- see Justin Herbert for example.

 

This is one of my issues with Howell. Herbert was able to silence critics about his quiet demeanor and leadership because he had one of the greatest rookie seasons ever for a QB. I do not expect that from Howell. 

 

And for where this team is right now, I think the fanbase and the team really needs a QB that the fans can embrace and really want to rally around (look at how everyone has rallied around Burrow because he's such a likeable charismatic guy). I also think that if fans like a guy they are a lot more willing to be patient with him. 

[The Consigliere]

On 2/12/2022 at 9:54 AM, Zim489 said:

Anything other than one of the Wilson Watson Rodgers or First round pick will be a mistake. 

 

Jimmy G plus day 2 guy IMO proves to me that Ron and Co just dont understand the modern game and the position. 

They proved that when they avoided QB the previous two drafts.

[Burgold]

6 hours ago, Koolblue13 said:

Imagine being awesome enough at what you do to have one of the only 32 jobs doing it and everyone thinks you're a loser. Poor Sammy Darnold.

Same can be said for Heinike.

 

I still think Heinike is a bottom third starting QB and upper tier back up. We definitely want an upgrade, but I also think he proved he belongs in the league.