Rookie QB or Veteran QB for "Next Season"??? (I didn't bump this, but I ended up being wrong anyway....)

[RWJ]

Bucky Brooks 2021 Mock Draft.

 

Bucky Brooks 2021 NFL mock draft 1.0: Jets start new era at QB with Justin Fields

[Renegade7]

38 minutes ago, Wayne_Millner said:

I feel like the Texans sent that out deliberately towards Washington. They want to trade with the NFC. But, this is the beginning of the negotiation. Washington could come back and say, “No. two firsts. A second and two thirds and a fifth.”

 

Houston scoffs. Eventually, something in the middle is agreed upon. 
 

Maybe two firsts. A second. Two thirds and Payne. 
 

Honestly, it’s gonna be difficult retaining all these D-Linemen anyway as their rookie deals start coming to an end. 

 

Agreed, keeping the dline together with Matt jus seems greedy. And we will regret not getting a QB while they are all here if we don't get one.  Trade Ionnidas now so we don't have to lose Allen or Payne.

[kingdaddy]

8 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Bucky Brooks 2021 Mock Draft.

 

Bucky Brooks 2021 NFL mock draft 1.0: Jets start new era at QB with Justin Fields

Very interesting to see how far some of the bigger names (Micah Parsons, Devonta Smith) fall in this draft projection. Can't see the Eagles taking a TE over WR with their pick but who knows?

[Commander_N_Chief]

8 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Agreed, keeping the dline together with Matt jus seems greedy. And we will regret not getting a QB while they are all here if we don't get one.  Trade Ionnidas now so we don't have to lose Allen or Payne.

Texans wont want Ion coming off an injury, if you're going to trade one they will want either Payne or Allen(I'd assume Payne because he still has some time left on the rookie deal).  If we're not going to trade any of our DL for a qb, I'd love to see if we could get a 1st or 2nd out of Jon Allen before the draft.  He's a great player and leader, but we're not going to be able to keep the whole DL together...get value while you can.

[Renegade7]

6 minutes ago, thelongestbreath said:

Texans wont want Ion coming off an injury, if you're going to trade one they will want either Payne or Allen(I'd assume Payne because he still has some time left on the rookie deal).  If we're not going to trade any of our DL for a qb, I'd love to see if we could get a 1st or 2nd out of Jon Allen before the draft.  He's a great player and leader, but we're not going to be able to keep the whole DL together...get value while you can.

 

I'm not buying Texans position of power in this negotiation.   And wasn't this Matt's first time getting hurt like that?  It happens, beggers can't be choosers, Watson holds the cards here, not his front office.  At least try the offer, hes a pro bowl player, again, injuries happen.

[Koolblue13]

1 hour ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

What instances can you recall? Just curious because I don't remember him failing miserably. 

 

1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

I don't think Settle has ever started has he?

Settle comes in when Kerrigan comes in. The 3rd period is when they shine. It's such a weird part of the game and has no bearing on the final quarter. 

 

Settle never draws a double, gets pushed back constantly. Terrible against the run, but does get some sacks. He's definitely been a steal for a 6th rounder and probably should have been a 2nd. 

 

He isn't in the same class as Allen or Payne and it's really not close either.

22 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Agreed, keeping the dline together with Matt jus seems greedy. And we will regret not getting a QB while they are all here if we don't get one.  Trade Ionnidas now so we don't have to lose Allen or Payne.

It's not greedy. It's the entire premise that has us in this Ludacris win now grab a QB at all costs panic. Taking advantage of our glut at DL. You lose the DL depth and talent, this team has zero bright spots.

[Commander_N_Chief]

Just now, Renegade7 said:

 

I'm not buying Texans position of power in this negotiation.   And wasn't this Matt's first time getting hurt like that?  It happens, beggers can't be choosers, Watson holds the cards here, not his front office.  At least try the offer, hes a pro bowl player, again, injuries happen.

He won't sit, just like almost all players that claim they'll sit for a season ends up suiting up by the final week of preseason.  If it's not a deal you're happy with you fine him until either he plays or you find a deal you like.  Do I think they have all the cards, no.  Do I think they can sit and wait until the offer is to their liking, yes.  Injuries happen, but who knows if his power(which is a large part of his game) will be right back to where it was pre-injury.  You should also want to move an Allen or a Payne if you had to because Watson's contract will hurt our cap space.  With John coming off the books that saves you an additional 10m this year.  Once you cut Alex that saves you an additional 14m...it makes Watson's contract easier to digest as well as providing the opportunity to keep most of this DL intact and look a bit ahead to Scary Terry who will be up in a few years.

[Rufus T Firefly]

20 minutes ago, The Consigliere said:

 

This is yet another example of why I argue that NFL F.O.'s are lead by dinosaur morons to an astonishing degree. 

The 8th pick from Carolina is better value than the 3rd and two future 1sts. Especially when you consider the 1s are coming from a team with the league's best defense that's just added Stafford. That means the only way the deal makes sense, especially with the quick trigger they pulled on it, is that they view taking Goff and his contract as a positive. That is frankly mind-blowing for an NFL Front Office to come to that evaluation. 

 

He's not a top 20 QB. That's not even arguable a this point. If you were watching many of their games last year, you can just read McVay's expressions and know that he desperately wanted away from the guy. And to play him for two years, you have to pay him over $53 mil. 53! And 41 of it is guaranteed. How the hell can you look at that amount of money for that QB and think "yes, please"? In the days before the deal, there was some discussing what they would have to pay to get rid of that contract and guessing next year's 1st plus something this year, maybe the 2nd. And Detroit instead took it as a positive.

 

It's even worse in context. The justification for getting future draft capital rather than upfront is because they are supposedly accepting that they are in a multi-year rebuild. Well, that's smart. Except you wanted to get a QB who, at his upside could maybe, maybe (fingers crossed) win you a game or two and hurt your draft positions the next couple of years. How do those two halves work together?

 

Meanwhile, the level of "analysis" we get from writers and reporters these days means we have to keep hearing about the 'amazing haul' Detroit got. It's kind of hysterical. 

[Koolblue13]

I'm so glad this thread doesn't have "hot" tagged to it now. 

 

Let it go. I know we're all excited to not be a garbage team anymore, and we'll get there. 

[Rufus T Firefly]

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm so glad this thread doesn't have "hot" tagged to it now. 

Are you telling us we're not hot?

[Andre The Giant]

 

[Koolblue13]

1 minute ago, Andre The Giant said:

 

**** that ****

[Ball Security]

6 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

 

Red Rifle to the moon!!!🚀🚀🚀

[Rufus T Firefly]

I don't get why you take known mediocrity in Dalton at a cost, when you have mediocrity with at least a chance of upside in Heinicke and Allen. I can see bringing back Smith at a couple of mil or signing Fitzpatrick for the same to mentor a rookie since they both get praised for that role, but I don't get what Dalton does for us. 

[Conn]

That Dalton call came out of nowhere and he’s connected, that ****ing worries me. 

[Koolblue13]

6 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

That Dalton call came out of nowhere and he’s connected, that ****ing worries me. 

I'll take limpin Alex Smith over Dalton all day.

[JoggingGod]

Dalton is a god awful fit for Scot Turner. They're going after someone mobile.

[Burgundy Yoda]

I would love Dalton just for the reactions in this thread. 

[kingdaddy]

11 minutes ago, thelongestbreath said:

Texans wont want Ion coming off an injury, if you're going to trade one they will want either Payne or Allen(I'd assume Payne because he still has some time left on the rookie deal).  If we're not going to trade any of our DL for a qb, I'd love to see if we could get a 1st or 2nd out of Jon Allen before the draft.  He's a great player and leader, but we're not going to be able to keep the whole DL together...get value while you can.

 

3 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

I don't get why you take known mediocrity in Dalton at a cost, when you have mediocrity with at least a chance of upside in Heinicke and Allen. I can see bringing back Smith at a couple of mil or signing Fitzpatrick for the same to mentor a rookie since they both get praised for that role, but I don't get what Dalton does for us. 

If it's Dalton, then RR is bringing in a vet that he can go to if need be while still letting Allen and Heinicke or maybe even Montez have a shot at the job. I am convinced that RR is gonna bring in a league vet just as insurance if he can't find the answer he really wants in free agency, the draft or thru trade. Who knows, maybe we do draft a rookie and Dalton holds the place until the kid is ready, ala Fitzpatrick in Miami this year. Or maybe Dalton is signed as insurance in case we can't get Watson? After the year RR had with QB's, he is gonna need a vet to possibly lean on should things go south again. That's the only reason I see us signing a Dalton. RR needs competency at the QB position just to continue to evaluate the rest of the roster, assuming he can't do better through other ways. 

BTW, if we do go for Dalton early in the offseason, that should be seen as good news for the Heinicke supporters in my opinion. At least until draft day then who knows?

[max21]

Andy DALTON?!?

[Rufus T Firefly]

2 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

 

If it's Dalton, then RR is bringing in a vet that he can go to if need be while still letting Allen and Heinicke or maybe even Montez have a shot at the job. I am convinced that RR is gonna bring in a league vet just as insurance if he can't find the answer he really wants in free agency, the draft or thru trade. Who knows, maybe we do draft a rookie and Dalton holds the place until the kid is ready, ala Fitzpatrick in Miami this year. Or maybe Dalton is signed as insurance in case we can't get Watson? After the year RR had with QB's, he is gonna need a vet to possibly lean on should things go south again. That's the only reason I see us signing a Dalton. RR needs competency at the QB position just to continue to evaluate the rest of the roster, assuming he can't do better through other ways. 

BTW, if we do go for Dalton early in the offseason, that should be seen as good news for the Heinicke supporters in my opinion. At least until draft day then who knows?

We're not going to carry 4 QBs on the active roster, so Dalton precludes either a rookie or one of Allen or Heinicke being around next year. 

 

With their ages and amount of time Heinicke and Allen have played in the system, and the potential they've shown, spending cap space on a mediocre (at best) veteran stopgap to go with them is just a silly way to manage your roster. And if you're bringing in a rookie, I can't imagine why anyone thinks Dalton would be the top choice to be a mentor to him.

[redskinss]

Over under on number of new pages in this thread before we have a new quarterback is 200.

I'm taking the over.

[kingdaddy]

Just now, Rufus T Firefly said:

We're not going to carry 4 QBs on the active roster, so Dalton precludes either a rookie or one of Allen or Heinicke being around next year. 

 

With their ages and amount of time Heinicke and Allen have played in the system, and the potential they've shown, spending cap space on a mediocre (at best) veteran stopgap to go with them is just a silly way to manage your roster. And if you're bringing in a rookie, I can't imagine why anyone thinks Dalton would be the top choice to be a mentor to him.

I can't answer that, but I think RR knows he has a talented, growing roster and really values what Alex brought to the team this year with his experience and character. I am convinced RR will bring in a cheap veteran who can act as a game manager if he can't hit in free agency, draft or trade....it would also be the responsible thing to do. When you can't get the stud you have to cover all the bases and RR probly is hell bent on not having to go through musical QB's again next year.

Why wouldn't Dalton be a good mentor for a rookie? Do you know something about him that we don't? 

[Skinsinparadise]

3 hours ago, The Consigliere said:

Considering what happened with Haskins. It seems clear that Snyder will inevitably interfere with decision making in perpetuity unless he drops dead. He may come in and out of phases of interference and non-interference, but if that moronic half-wit could literally botch entire decades of decisions and still get his incompetent hands all over a 1st round draft pick as recently as 2019, it seems clear stupidity will always be just a change over in the FO away, if not even closer. 

 

He's never learned a damn thing. Not one. In 22 years of ownership. It's extraordinary. Takes a lot of work to be that thoroughly ignorant. 

 

Yep he's a moron and can't get out of his own way.  

[sportsnut]

1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I'm not buying Texans position of power in this negotiation.   And wasn't this Matt's first time getting hurt like that?  It happens, beggers can't be choosers, Watson holds the cards here, not his front office.  At least try the offer, hes a pro bowl player, again, injuries happen.

 

56 minutes ago, thelongestbreath said:

He won't sit, just like almost all players that claim they'll sit for a season ends up suiting up by the final week of preseason.  If it's not a deal you're happy with you fine him until either he plays or you find a deal you like.  Do I think they have all the cards, no.  Do I think they can sit and wait until the offer is to their liking, yes.  Injuries happen, but who knows if his power(which is a large part of his game) will be right back to where it was pre-injury.

I think he will sit.  Leveon and Trent paved the way on how to force a trade.

Edited February 2, 2021 by sportsnut